Usually the more experienced an architect is, he can command even higher fees. The 10% I mentioned was the minimum any architect charge for jobs worth RM500k below. You can do the choosing and use a template plan, design works is a very small part of the scope of work an architect do. Too much to list here so for more information, you can refer to the Architects Act 1967 (can be downloaded here). You'll be surprise how much work and how underpaid architects are in relation to all responsibilities they bear. Similar to a litigation lawyer, can you say because he has many winning court cases, so he has 0 lawyer work to do, and the fee be say RM200?

Yes, theoretically correct. If this is financially feasible why we do not see developers carry their business in this way?

I don't get it. Say I choose a template plan for a DSL house; the architect just have to put his signature on the plans and his job then ends, right ? Thereafter, the contractor take over to build the house.

Architects, at least in Malaysia, is responsible for the building which the plans he put signature on it. No matter how similar it is there are things you will need to adjust, review, recalculate. The plans which you submitted and approved by one local authority may not be approved by another authority. Similarly, with the ever-changing and updating acts and by-laws, the plans which you submitted 2 years ago may not be qualified for approval under current regulations.

The plans submitted for approval will typically be just enough to comply with all the legal requirements. So the information inside is very limited. The architect will then need to prepare a set of detailed construction/tender drawing to allow the quantities of building materials and cost of construction. He will specify each components of building materials in the construction drawing. Then an architect, or assisted by a quantity surveyor, will prepare the bill of quantities. The architect will need to study and understand each and every piece of building materials, how they function, look, feel, cost, whether they are certified by the CIDB/ISO/SIRIM/Bomba etc, as well as any new technologies applicable to make construction possible or faster.

When the bill of quantities is ready, the potential contractor will tender for the projects. Cost is important but not all, so the architect will have to evaluate which contractor is the best fit for the job, ensuring the contractor has good reputation, mobility, cash flow, etc to sustain the project over the contract period. So most of the time the job will not be awarded to the lowest bidder, because the architect understand the market to know that "the bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten", the architect will avoid this kind of shoddy contractors.

Once the project is awarded, the architect, usually with the assist of a QS, will prepare the documents required for contract binding, and although the building contract is between the owner and contractor, the architect plays an important role in the contract. The architect is the qualified person to administer the contract, issuing instruction, inspect the site and construction progress, ensuring the contractors is not cutting corners and building not according to the plans. The architect will based on the valuation of construction work done, issue to the owner a certificate of payment, telling the owner to pay such amount due to the contractor on a monthly basis. Inevitably, there are details which may not been fully resolved, so intermittently the architect will supply the contractor with additional information if and when required. And the contractor, for them to earn a even higher profit, will always counter-propose alternative building materials or methods, the architect has to go over each and every one and decides whether to approve or reject, subject to owner's decision. Also, owner being owner, they have the mindset of being the paymaster, it is very likely that they will have a change of mind anytime during the construction period. Maybe suddenly he wants to add another couple of rooms, maybe he wants to change the brick wall to glass wall. Capturing these information and properly documenting them is a time-consuming process.

When construction is finally done, the architect will inspect the building to identify any defects or deficiencies in workmanship, and instructing the contractor to rectify as such. When the architect is satisfied that the building has been constructed according to to approved plan, and safe and fit for its intended purposes, the architect will issue a certificate of completion and compliance (CCC) to the owner, with copies sent to the local authority and Lembaga Arkitek Malaysia. This certificate is basically a lifetime guarantee of the safety of the building. The architect will be liable and can be sued, if down the road, the building is defective as a result of design deficiencies (for example, he specified/approved a building material which does not prevent water leakage from the window; or another example, the metal staircase railing caught your young child's head and caused bodily injury; etc etc).

The scope of work for an architect is the longest and broadest in the construction industry. Your architect is there from the very beginning until the very end; it is not just put signature and stamp.

The architect U describe is for those who work for a housing project, but should not apply for renovation of a DSL house which the contractor ask for a RM100K quote, e.g. to extend the kitchen and back room and widen the porch so can park 2 cars side by side, right ? I don't think the architect will come supervise the type of materials the contract uses, right ? These reno contractors will ask for 30% payment when they start work, and 50% payment when masonary work is completed, then another 15% B4 fan n light installation, and the final 5% on completion of the reno. Dielah is need to get the architect to come make regular visits if the contractor wants to get his installments of say 10%, 20%, 20%, 20%, etc. U think the contractor and the architect got so much time to waste meeting to decide when is the next progressive payments ?

I think for a small RM100K reno work, it's daylight robbery if the architect demand a 10% fee or RM10K just to put his signature of some templete plans since I'm sure he will not go check on the contractor to instruct him what materials he has to use, mix sand and cement on the right ratio, how thick the iron rod need to use, etc, etc right ? The contractor has full control of the reno work and not have to take instructions from the architect, right ?

This post has been edited by topearn: Dec 30 2017, 11:37 AM

At the outset the discussion was about building a new house, now suddenly it become renovation. A sensible architect will not leave everything up to the contractor, because you see, the architect is the one person who will be responsible on the buildings which the plans he put signature on. If for some reason, the contractor decided to change the foundation to tin kosong, or use inferior rebars, which eventually caused the building to collapse and hurt the occupants, apart from the fact that the contractor is liable, the architect (or engineer) is also liable for failure to supervise the project which he submitted. The liability I'm saying here is suspension or revoke of license (or practicing certificate), hefty fine or serious cases may involve jail time.

Daylight robbery or not is subject to agreement. If you think an architect is expensive then there is no deal. Simple as that. If you can find RM200 architects then there's no problem with me. I doubt any architect is willing to charge such low fee when charging low fee is actually an offense under the Architects Act 1967 and Architects (Scale of Minimum Fees) Rules 2010, where the penalty outweighs the low fee.

Now many contractors offer design and build, including contractors who do renovation and includes submission of plan for approval. Whether you like it or not, you will still need an architect's services in plan submission and issuing certificates. However, because the contractor quoted the owner a lump sum which includes the architect's fee, most owners do not see how much the professional fee is. Chances are that the contractors payment encompassing everything is so inflated that it is more expensive than engaging an architect and contractor separately, because the architect is working for the interest of contractor more than the owner's interest in this case. Most of the time you see the contractors are richer than the architect, so you can go figure who is actually doing daylight robbery.

On payment parts, it is entirely up to the owner and contractor whether they want to use a building contract, or only verbal agreement which is easily subject to dispute. That is also why you see so many upset homeowners complaining about shoddy contractors in the reno & ID forum. If the owner choose not to use a building contract, and prefers to deal with contractor directly, then yes, the architect is not responsible as a stakeholder in payment disputes. However, he is still legally obliged to ensure the construction works is done according to the approved plans.

On the other hand, since you suddenly drift into the renovation like kitchen extension or widen porch, most local authority in KV has a template plan (not for DBKL). These template plan do not require architect input or endorsement. You can just go to the building department of the respective Majlis and ask for it, pay a fee, and get your permit along with payment for a roro bin, then you can start work. Every other plans which require the architect's input, is bespoke works.

Sorry for jumping from building house to renovation; actually I'm helping a friend with her house renovation but she wants to extend not just kitchen but also the guest room and master bedroom, so she has engaged a architect to draw up the plans. So once the plans are drawn, she just need to find a contractor to do the reno ? will the architect come regularly to check on the contractor to make sure he is foillowing the plans ? If not, once the reno is completed, will the architect come check ? Will he has to issue a cert to say the reno is done according to the plan ?

Sorry, back to building a house again. I'm interested to know if there are also templete plans for a complete bsngalow lot ? If yes, then no need to engage a architect and then can save a ton of cash, right ?

This post has been edited by topearn: Dec 30 2017, 08:33 PM

If you have engaged an architect, for sure he will have a letter of acceptance outlining his scope, fees, payment, etc. Check if the agreement includes regular site visits or not. You can choose to use the architect's services for project management and regular inspection, or you want to supervise yourself if you are capable of doing so. Even if the architect is not engaged to do this, he should have a final inspection after work is done before CCC is issued.

Talk to the architect and make sure the services including up to the issuance of CCC. Because issuance of CCC means the architect certify that the building has been done according to the plans. The CCC has to come with 21 forms known as Form G1-G21, and depending on the scope of construction, some may apply some may not. Some of the forms require the contractor to sign, so ensure you engage a contractor with CIDB license. Ask them to furnish you a copy of their license before engaging them.

If you look at the internet, there are people selling some template plans. You may even no need to buy because there are books, magazine, websites etc where architects publish their works, including photographs and plans. But whether or not the design suits to your own needs is another story. Note that the services provided by the architect is not merely design. So the value substance of an architect's service is much more than drawing plans. If you are not prepared to afford the services of an architect to design your house for you, it is more cost efficient to just buy a ready-made house to suit your taste. Trust me, it is much less hassle than having to manage a team of consultant and contractor.

Let me use an analogy of a suit. You can shop in any departmental store or clothing shops for your suit - they are still designed by someone, made using a fixed template, but even the best ready-made clothing from big brands like Hugo Boss or Armani may look perfect on a model or mannequin, but they may not fit the buyer best. A local tailor may made the suit to your size ensuring best fit.

Thanks for all the useful info rendered. If I were to supervise the reno myself, how am I supposed to check that the contractor follow the specs ? The reno involves extending the kitchen, guest room and toilet which are all on the back portion of the house. Also extend the master bedroom by about 100 sq feet. And widen the porch for 2 cars to park side by side. Since I'm just a layman, the contractor will not listen to what I tell if if I suspect he deviated from the plan. How am I supposed to know if the cement and sand mix is in the right proportion ? How would I know if the pillars to support the porch is strong enough ? Do I have to bring a tape measure to make sure the measurements is according to the plan ? The architect plans are just drawings, or they also include other stuff as well, like cement mix ratio, how thick the iron rods to be inbedded into the concrete, etc, etc ? And if I do not make regular site visits, who is there to warn me that I'm supposed to make site visits ?

When I go see houses under reno mode, I have never seen a architect come make site visits, so I guess most house owners engage architects which do not include project management.

Truth is, most people who do renovation doesn't actually need the service of an architect, unless it is a major one or complete remodel which require the design expertise of an architect. The only reason they have an architect in the picture is because the law authority says so. So if you do not know how to supervise project, it is wise to find someone who does. The architect's drawing typically does not include these information, and most architect wouldn't know because these are expertise of the engineer. Spend some time and read the Reno/ID forum and you can learn a lot, and it may be obvious, but reading the product manuals reveals a lot of things. Google is also at your disposal. Usually reno is only inspection by eye and by touch, and you should be arranging with the contractor. You can be visiting any time because it is your right.

By Reno/ID forum, U mean the lowyat forum here - https://forum.lowyat.net/HomeRenovationsandInteriorDesign ?

Yes, I've been reading it but don't find any info on how to supervise a reno. A reno project only involves architect and contractors - engineer does not come into the picture; the contractor should be the expert by working experience. What should I inspect if I pay a visit to the site ? Make sure he use the correct mix of concrete - sand, gravel and cement - but I suppose most contractors will differ a bit on the mix. As long as the contractor follows the plans e.g. for master bedroom extension, the plan will specify how thick the floor need to be, so just make sure he have the same thickness, then everything should be ok. Make sure the pillars are 100% vertical.

This post has been edited by topearn: Dec 31 2017, 08:40 PM

I have a bangalow lot in Alor Gajah of size 105ft x 105 feet. If I want to build a weekend house, what is the cheapest way ?

Say I want 5 rooms and 4 baths - master bedroom with attached bath, the other 4 rooms share bath (2 rooms share a bath), and another bath standalone for anyone to use. Also a store room and dinning and living halls. Is it cheaper to build single storey or double-storey ?
Single cheaper cost the pillars of the house can be smaller cos do not have to support the 1st floor, no need to build 1st floor concrete base, wiring and internal water piping less. But double storey cheaper cos need smaller roof.
So is it single storey cheaper to build ?

And can I buy ready template of houses so do not have to pay the architect so much to design the house ? But he will still need to signoff the CCC - how how will the architect charge just to get signoff the CCC, in the case that I can get template free from some websites ?

This post has been edited by topearn: Jan 3 2018, 09:24 AM

Greetings to all the forum members here.
I'm keen to try my hands on building something to sell but do not have the courage yet.
I've been doing some feasibility studies (e.g. approaching relevant authorities on their by-laws, banker's for loan, etc)
Below is something I felt is 'doable' but as mentioned, no courage to try due to uncertainties. (whether can sell this product)
Not here to solicit for sales or any of that nonsense.
Wish to hear from members their constructive criticism and sharing of ideas/knowledge on the feasibility of this type of small scale project.

 DEVELOPMENT_PROPOSAL_FOR_DESA_AMAN_LOT_84__SEMI_D_.pdf ( 770.54k ) Number of downloads: 51


Basic info
1. Residential Land with individual title selling for RM1.5million, but possible to come down to RM1.3million.
2. DBKL allows 2 units of semi-D or a single bungalow unit. (amalgamation of land is needed)
3. Total expenses (fees, construction and land) = 3.8million
4. Total revenue (optimistic estimate) = 4.9 million
5. Profit before tax = RM 1.1million (29% of expenses)
6. Profit after taxes = RM860k (22.6% of expenses)
7. Bank valuation for land is RM1.52 million + RM3 million (for building 2 semi-d), however loan is up to 70% of combined figures.
8. Therefore cash up front is about RM600k for a return of RM860k over 2 years (assuming it can sell by then), if not, the bank interest will be RM100k per year.

What's yr thoughts?




This post has been edited by @tsw@: Jan 17 2018, 02:28 PM

Don't forget that you also need the architect to print and submit the plans. Those templates might save you some design time, but the architect still needs to prepare the plans (according to the design) for submission.

U cannot get the architect just to sign off the CCC.

hi guys its me again. not sure if its appropriate to post here. im into modern house design and came across one v minimalist house design. of course i would not be building something so big due to limited resource. but im keen on this design. any sifus out there can estimate how big is this house? im looking to have 2800 to 3000 sf. is this house bigger? cause my friend a contracotr tells me the cost fir the house will be 1m. excl land cost... but to me the structure of the house seems simple and not complex? enlighten me anyone...


btw if this house is urs and u want me to take it down. do pm me..

250-300 psf excluding furnishing for a nice detached house in KL/Selangor.

Yes the house looks minimal but it has to suit the family living in it. But not to my personal liking. It doesn't look very well thought-out. Things looked very big and give a sense of blunt. But I haven't see the plans and seen the inside, which may change my view.

Sometimes, where we want to make things look simple and minimal, it will involve a lot of non-standard details, which may or may not escalate the construction costs. Some people may not feel like 'home' when you have a box like this; on the other hand, some people hate the tropical pitched roof and prefer flat roof (a box).

For detached houses I design for my clients, if they have no preference at first I always design for the climate (pitched roof, deep verandah, louvres, cross ventilation, etc.) and then refine from there. Some liked it, some don't. Just the way of life.

This post has been edited by 2387581: Jan 25 2018, 12:33 AM

yes thanks for your input... i just thought the box structure could cost less. guess not really haha. my dreamed design would be something like the st thomas kuching bishop house - european design. not sure about the design prices. but i guess since i have limited budget, i would just the a smaller scale and get it done in the future as phase 2

You see that cantilever? It is quite substantial, and therefore may be a little bit expensive. You can have very small but very nicely designed and finishes at a high price; also you can have a very large dull box at a cheap price. There are so many different approaches to it, ultimately depending on what you can afford and what you want.

yes. know the structure a bit different from normal ones.. atm stil researching on home design.. that feels most like a cozy home n work around my budget... maybe will have phase 2 when i got the extra budget.hope u wont get annoyed with my rookie questions ya.. once i started my project wil update here

Hello, everyone. Does anyone here familiar with the temporary power supply on construction site? I have some questions to consult you: 1. What's the capacity of transformer normally in the residential project? 2. How to apply for the temporary power supply? 3.How much will it cost?