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Photography The Sony Alpha Thread V60, From A to E mount!

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Valentino46
post Sep 19 2014, 02:26 PM

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solution found,post deleted,tq all (no thanks to some)

This post has been edited by Valentino46: Sep 20 2014, 12:05 AM
Eiraku
post Sep 19 2014, 02:35 PM

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QUOTE(Valentino46 @ Sep 19 2014, 01:09 PM)
play with my a6000 with 16-70z for few weeks now
i don't know if anybody share my frustration but i felt sony a6000 were not designed by photographer but bunch of idiot engineers who knows nothing about photography and whose goals were just to crammed as much features into the camera as possible without really know how to use them

i'm no pro-photographer(nor wannabe).i'm jpeg shooters (no,don't suggest raw to me),and here's my quirks about a6000 that i hope fellow forumers can help me with

1) lock on focus (not tracking) work like shit, the camera doesn't respect your "lock-on" area,rather the lock square just resize,expand,contract and run away from your selected area according to its own mind,focus on off center subject is a pain in the arse with this camera. my 3 years old xz-1 has muuuuch better lock on focus than this shit

2) face detection feature will overwrite your chosen metering mode and switch to centre/spot weighted metering whenever it detect a face. you'll always end up with overexpose image if background is brighter than subject, auto exposure also become very erratic under this situation. none of my other old camera does this shit

3) soft skin features doesn't work with burst mode,happy pressing on shutter button and missing shots.my xz-1 does this with burst mode. it also doesn't work without face detection turn on,so happy overexpose and missing shots.

4) face detection lock on face 50% of the time if i'm lucky. camera phone does this better

5)flexible spot focus missing the lock on focus,unless u go in function menu to reactivate everytime u want to lock on something

6) power saving mode doesn't work with remote control turn on,why? can't i just set to longer sleep time if the concern is remote can't wake the camera up?

7) camera menu messy as cow shit

i don't understand sony has so many restriction on all their features
this is just part of my complain,has dozens more but i can't recall them all,wonder if anybody has any work around on this
*
Seriously, you should've tried the NEX6. Or the original NEX5. You would have been *delighted* with the "features".

Yep Sony cams were designed by committee, but compared to the old Nexes, it's actually much better now. That said you seem to be more used to Olys so yeah, Sony does things a lot differently - and things are usually more mass consumer oriented than it is for enthusiasts.

Which often leads to funky crap. Like face detection spot metering - "normal" people don't really care about exposure, they just want people face clear clear bright bright. Give them a properly exposed picture (like the one with the sun in it) and they'll say "why lah the face so dark wan?".

But really, it's a mirrorless camera - a particularly affordable one too. Not a pro DSLR (it's not even an entry level DSLR lol). People (and unfortunately even Sony) tend to forget this.

Anyhows, from the sound of things you might be better served with a Fuji cam, maybe the X-T1. Complaining to Fuji about features also works better than complaining to Sony because Fuji *actually* does something about it in firmware updates.

Sony... well... comes up with new models to rectify *inadequacies*.

Not that I have issues with the A6000 myself, besides the saddening APS-C lens lineup. I don't even use much of the lock-on, face-, smile-, fart- detect features myself because... well... focus recompose? Just couldn't be bothered to try the whatever detection.

This post has been edited by Eiraku: Sep 19 2014, 02:42 PM
yok70
post Sep 19 2014, 02:36 PM

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QUOTE(Valentino46 @ Sep 19 2014, 02:26 PM)
let me give a few examples of a6000 erratic exposure and face recognition

user posted image
this is when camera can't find the face,perfect exposure,but no soft skin

user posted image
once the camera detect faces,camera apply soft skin,but exposure hancur

user posted image
camera can't find faces again,perfect exposure again,but no soft skin

user posted image
found face,crap exposure

user posted image
no face found,ok

user posted image
no face found

user posted image
face found

user posted image
no face found

user posted image
face found

that said,when everything bang on,the detail is just STUNNING
*
thanks for sharing. Now we know the exposure works kind of stupidly on face detection mode.
i never use face detection, just try it but never really use it. I always use DMF, I find it the best and most flexible/reliable way to shoot a photo. I always want to determine my focus point of my photo. biggrin.gif


yok70
post Sep 19 2014, 02:40 PM

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QUOTE(redlyfs @ Sep 19 2014, 09:15 AM)
Shitty place. Bought twice from them.
On the 1st order, they listed an item as in stock but 3 days after payment still no word from then so I called. No one answered. I wrote email, spam their FB and still no one replied until 3 days later which is 6 days after payment. The guy told me item is not in stock and ask me to wait another week. Parcel only arrived 14 days later. Delivery from date of payment : 3+3+14 = 20days.

2nd time, a year later. Forgotten how shitty their service is. Ordered something, arrived 3weeks later. This time they didn't bother replying anything. Calls, emails, FB. No I didn't order during holidays and no the order tracking wasn't updated on their website

Just go check their FB to see how poor their service is. I know for sure they delete a lot of negative feedback. They used to have a review section but took it down after streaking countless negative reviews. The review is still listed on my own FB, if anyone wants proof just let me know.

One case where they delete comment is when someone bought a Xiaomi powerbank and claimed it was fake. He backed it with photos. IPMart rep had the balls to tell him that they never stated that it was branded "Xiaomi", the guy proceed to provide an invoice that clearly showed it is stated as Xiaomi. Then IPMart proceed to blame it on the vendor, which was weird since the way they claim that they never said it was branded Xiaomi insinuated that they themselves had control of their own product descriptions. I also have screenshots of this comments prior to deletion.

Later when I saw people had complaints unattended, I provided information and contact details for complaint center; IPMart blocked me off on FB. Seriously. Don't give them business. I'm just thankful I didn't receive fake product but shitty ass follow up and late delivery.

On another note, since on the topic, here's some people who can help you regarding online commercial crime.

SKMM / MCMC Malaysian Communication and Multimedia Commission
http://www.skmm.gov.my/
1800 888 030

KPDNKK Ministry of Domestic Trade, Cooperatives and Consumerism
http://e-aduan.kpdnkk.gov.my/eaduan/aduanbaru.php?lang=2
1800 886 800
PDRM Royal Malaysia Police department for Commercial Crime Investigation
http://www.ccid.my/
603-20319999 / 603-22663333
Screenshots of IPMart fake Xiaomi powerbank comment
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

EDIT : Wow, they also disabled Posts by Others.
*
Thanks for sharing. Now I need to be careful if buying from them. Only buy cheap stuff I guess, if they have good price and I don't mind waiting.
Xiaomi has a lot of fake products in the market. So I hope they don't sell fake product other than Xiaomi! sweat.gif

Any experience on other camera online shops? I had a friend who bought some cameras and lenses from Shashinki, when the stock arrived, they delivered fast (ie. lens). That was a GH4 that she waited for month+ but I understand entire Malaysia has no stock during that period of time for GH4. However, need to check price before buying from Shashinki as some products at good price but some are ridiculously overpriced.

This post has been edited by yok70: Sep 19 2014, 02:41 PM
yok70
post Sep 19 2014, 02:42 PM

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QUOTE(nixonyang @ Sep 19 2014, 03:20 AM)
ya, bought non-camera related things. Fast and reliable.
*
Thanks for sharing.
Eiraku
post Sep 19 2014, 02:53 PM

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Btw, yes they already have the Nissin i40 for Sony locally. KLPF got offer summore.

user posted image

And no... I haven't bought mine yet unfortunately. The Sammie 2/16 first. I really dig the i40 though, maybe next time.

This post has been edited by Eiraku: Sep 19 2014, 02:54 PM
vincentlee90
post Sep 19 2014, 02:54 PM

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QUOTE(Valentino46 @ Sep 19 2014, 02:26 PM)
let me give a few examples of a6000 erratic exposure and face recognition

user posted image
this is when camera can't find the face,perfect exposure,but no soft skin

user posted image
once the camera detect faces,camera apply soft skin,but exposure hancur

user posted image
camera can't find faces again,perfect exposure again,but no soft skin

user posted image
found face,crap exposure

user posted image
no face found,ok

user posted image
no face found

user posted image
face found

user posted image
no face found

user posted image
face found

that said,when everything bang on,the detail is just STUNNING
*
for ur info, for sony mirrorless camera, if u set the the exposure mode with other than M mode, when u activate the face detection mode and face had detected, the camera will automatically adjust the exposure which balance with face's exposure, regardless the position where the face detected. so, when the face detected with underexposed, camera will automatically adjusted it with either maximize the aperture, shutter speed slower, or pushed up the iso sensitivity. at the same time, if the background is correctly exposure at the 1st stage before face had detected, the background will be overexposed.
that's how sony mirrorless camera's face detection works. so, if u really think the exposure issue is big matter for u, set ur camera exposure mode to M mode

This post has been edited by vincentlee90: Sep 19 2014, 02:58 PM
shootkk
post Sep 19 2014, 02:54 PM

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QUOTE(Valentino46 @ Sep 19 2014, 02:26 PM)
let me give a few examples of a6000 erratic exposure and face recognition
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

that said,when everything bang on,the detail is just STUNNING
*
I am not the least surprised by the camera's action when it comes to face detection and soft skin and whatever 'features' that it has. It's all marketing. The A6000 and the whole mirrorless APS-C cams are now targeted at the mass market. This means the target market are those who like to take selfies and have a cool cam to show off. The features are for this segment of the market. They are not for the pro or the semi-pro.

The camera correctly exposes the face when it finds one because the target market likes to see their faces in the pics. To hell with the other things in the frame.

Pro and semi-pro users can turn off these 'features' and let their own brain do the thinking. After the shot they can edit the pic to their heart's content using a photo editor software of their choice.

I don't know about you but when I use a camera, I like to choose my own focus point, use Aperture priority and do my own white balance tweaks. I don't like the camera to 'think' for me when it comes to those settings. Of course I am just using the dinosaur A850 and I don't use the auto focus point selection 'feature' that it has. Tried it once and turned it off and I have not missed it yet.
Valentino46
post Sep 19 2014, 03:11 PM

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QUOTE(shootkk @ Sep 19 2014, 02:54 PM)
I am not the least surprised by the camera's action when it comes to face detection and soft skin and whatever 'features' that it has. It's all marketing. The A6000 and the whole mirrorless APS-C cams are now targeted at the mass market. This means the target market are those who like to take selfies and have a cool cam to show off. The features are for this segment of the market. They are not for the pro or the semi-pro.

The camera correctly exposes the face when it finds one because the target market likes to see their faces in the pics. To hell with the other things in the frame.

Pro and semi-pro users can turn off these 'features' and let their own brain do the thinking. After the shot they can edit the pic to their heart's content using a photo editor software of their choice.

I don't know about you but when I use a camera, I like to choose my own focus point, use Aperture priority and do my own white balance tweaks. I don't like the camera to 'think' for me when it comes to those settings. Of course I am just using the dinosaur A850 and I don't use the auto focus point selection 'feature' that it has. Tried it once and turned it off and I have not missed it yet.
*
my 3 years old xz-1 and even my nex-3n does not do this,when i set matrix exposure mode,it should be that matrix regardless whether u detect faces or not

xz-1 especially,work very well with soft skin,and doesn't interfere with any other camera setting

i like taking people photo in their natural setting and movement,i need to set the focus point very fast,not up down left right or manual

with panasonic,olympus, u can half press the shutter,the camera will lock on to the object very reliably (after that the camera determine the focus),then u can recompose the picture anywhere u like,the camera will know where to focus.
hazril
post Sep 19 2014, 03:18 PM

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QUOTE(Valentino46 @ Sep 19 2014, 01:09 PM)
play with my a6000 with 16-70z for few weeks now
i don't know if anybody share my frustration but i felt sony a6000 were not designed by photographer but bunch of idiot engineers who knows nothing about photography and whose goals were just to crammed as much features into the camera as possible without really know how to use them

i'm no pro-photographer(nor wannabe).i'm jpeg shooters (no,don't suggest raw to me),and here's my quirks about a6000 that i hope fellow forumers can help me with

1) lock on focus (not tracking) work like shit, the camera doesn't respect your "lock-on" area,rather the lock square just resize,expand,contract and run away from your selected area according to its own mind,focus on off center subject is a pain in the arse with this camera. my 3 years old xz-1 has muuuuch better lock on focus than this shit

2) face detection feature will overwrite your chosen metering mode and switch to centre/spot weighted metering whenever it detect a face. you'll always end up with overexpose image if background is brighter than subject, auto exposure also become very erratic under this situation. none of my other old camera does this shit

3) soft skin features doesn't work with burst mode,happy pressing on shutter button and missing shots.my xz-1 does this with burst mode. it also doesn't work without face detection turn on,so happy overexpose and missing shots.

4) face detection lock on face 50% of the time if i'm lucky. camera phone does this better

5)flexible spot focus missing the lock on focus,unless u go in function menu to reactivate everytime u want to lock on something

6) power saving mode doesn't work with remote control turn on,why? can't i just set to longer sleep time if the concern is remote can't wake the camera up?

7) camera menu messy as cow shit

i don't understand sony has so many restriction on all their features
this is just part of my complain,has dozens more but i can't recall them all,wonder if anybody has any work around on this
*
your a6000 is lemon copy...sell it off and buy a99 + cz50mm.... laugh.gif
Valentino46
post Sep 19 2014, 03:21 PM

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QUOTE(hazril @ Sep 19 2014, 03:18 PM)
your a6000 is lemon copy...sell it off and buy a99 + cz50mm....  laugh.gif
*
its not,it is common "features",i believe even a99 has it
try face recognition with backlit background,then you'll have the same lemon
hensky
post Sep 19 2014, 03:22 PM

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QUOTE(Eiraku @ Sep 19 2014, 02:53 PM)
Btw, yes they already have the Nissin i40 for Sony locally. KLPF got offer summore.

user posted image

And no... I haven't bought mine yet unfortunately. The Sammie 2/16 first. I really dig the i40 though, maybe next time.
*
how much they offer at KLPF?
Newbieeeeee
post Sep 19 2014, 03:26 PM

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QUOTE(Valentino46 @ Sep 19 2014, 02:26 PM)
let me give a few examples of a6000 erratic exposure and face recognition

user posted image
this is when camera can't find the face,perfect exposure,but no soft skin

user posted image
once the camera detect faces,camera apply soft skin,but exposure hancur

user posted image
camera can't find faces again,perfect exposure again,but no soft skin

user posted image
found face,crap exposure

user posted image
no face found,ok

user posted image
no face found

user posted image
face found

user posted image
no face found

user posted image
face found

that said,when everything bang on,the detail is just STUNNING
*
I don't think this is a fair comparison, due to back lighting. How about you try to pop your flash up and let the camera detect the face?
hazril
post Sep 19 2014, 03:34 PM

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QUOTE(Valentino46 @ Sep 19 2014, 03:21 PM)
its not,it is common "features",i believe even a99 has it
try face recognition with backlit background,then you'll have the same lemon
*
nope...i havent encountered such problem...im using a77 for wedding jobs and used the face recognition features....
vincentlee90
post Sep 19 2014, 03:57 PM

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QUOTE(Newbieeeeee @ Sep 19 2014, 03:26 PM)
I don't think this is a fair comparison, due to back lighting. How about you try to pop your flash up and let the camera detect the face?
*
he never used sony mirrorless camera and he refused to hear advice, what we can do?
yok70
post Sep 19 2014, 04:11 PM

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QUOTE(hazril @ Sep 19 2014, 03:34 PM)
nope...i havent encountered such problem...im using a77 for wedding jobs and used the face recognition features....
*
when you free, please do a backlit test for comparison. laugh.gif

hazril
post Sep 19 2014, 04:17 PM

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QUOTE(yok70 @ Sep 19 2014, 04:11 PM)
when you free, please do a backlit test for comparison.  laugh.gif
*
sure bro...tomorrow got job can try out la... nod.gif
leinnz
post Sep 19 2014, 04:28 PM

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Regarding exposure setup and shooting a person with landscape, Are we supposed to use Multi Mode metering?
I find it better using Multi mode instead of centre or spot for my Nex-5R

yok70
post Sep 19 2014, 04:45 PM

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QUOTE(hazril @ Sep 19 2014, 04:17 PM)
sure bro...tomorrow got job can try out la... nod.gif
*
thank you! icon_rolleyes.gif
yok70
post Sep 19 2014, 04:47 PM

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QUOTE(leinnz @ Sep 19 2014, 04:28 PM)
Regarding exposure setup and shooting a person with landscape, Are we supposed to use Multi Mode metering?
I find it better using Multi mode instead of centre or spot for my Nex-5R
*
i always use multi, i find it overall best for most situations on the Sony, except for critical or got lots of time preparing for the shot then may as well manual setting. laugh.gif

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