Hi all,

i am new to this forum and also new to gold investment
I have a question regarding selling physical gold in Malaysia. To whom do you guys sell your physical gold to? I mean a safe and reputable buyer/ institution e.g banks...
The reason i am asking this question is because i am holding some PAMP Suisse 100g bars, looking to let it go at a good price. I have seen the price list on OUB and they do sell and buy PAMP bars, but do they only buy back from those bought from them? I am sure there are plenty of trusted institutions out there that are ready to buy gold from the member of public.
Hope someone with knowledge on this matter could shed some lights.

Thank you and happy investing

Someone who invest in some thiing without fundamentals is called an A$$$.....tulips?

Value is money like USDXXXX? Is that YOUR rule?
An oz of gold is an oz of VALUE.
Otherwise when bad times come and your 'money' is no longer trusted why do humans
ALWAYS fall back to the valuable GOLD? Is that not perpetual VALUE?
Is not fiat just noisy 'value'?
There is NO question of IF gold cannot be converted.
IT does NOT even need conversion. You could easily exchange gold for goods....its universal money
since time began. So no, ther is no question of IF............

Perception fo a moment? OR is it called peception when this relic called GOLD has been accepted
a store of VALUE since time and tested since time? Is that a PERCEPTION?
i suggest that value perception is found in FIAT, not GOLD....thatsis the REASON
when fiat fails, humans fall back to GOLD.

Price is what you pay and value is what you get. Do not confuse yourself with either one. If value and price (USD) is not interchangeable then there will not be a pricing and trading of gold. You may 'value' your gold highly but others may 'price' it higher or lower. So gold is not a store of value, but a perception of value based on what the market 'price' it. If the market decides to 'price' it lower, do you still get your 'value'?

Gold has been recently drum up as hedge against 'fiat' money, but even as USD strengthen no longer have any effect on gold, 'fiat' money is theoretically will be devalued constantly. Also the 'inflation' hedge argument, is also not so apparent anymore. If an item is truly a hedge, it should not be correlated to equities at all. The rise and fall of commodities is usually due to supply and demand, but it no longer correlated much with gold.

Gold nowadays is more like a trading instrument, where it performs more or less like the stock market, if stock falls, it falls, if it goes up, gold goes up. The 'hedging' is no longer there as the 'beta' of gold is correlated to the world stock market. Gold is looking more and more like the 'tulip' mania like you so casually mention, as then a 'tulip bulb' is perceived to hold a 'value' equivalent to the price of a house, and many is willing to pay the 'price' for it, until someone realized that a 'tulip bulb' does not feed you, gives you any constant returns or have any economical use. Then guess what happened?

If lets say you decided strongly that 'fiat' money should fails, do you rather own gold or farmland? If you want to eat or feed your family, how much gold are you willing to trade for a sack of rice? The if your gold is only trade able for food, then where is the perceived value? The person with the farmland can constantly produce and since he might not need so much gold (which is a chunk of metal to him), wouldn't he rather get something else in return (like meat?)?

Gold is only useful as part of diversification of your total portfolio, where you are trading to earn from the 'pricing' (mispricing? ) of the gold, otherwise it is just another lump of metal, which does not feed you, gives you any constant returns or have any economical use. Sounds familiar?

This post has been edited by gark: Nov 30 2011, 11:00 AM

Please join Gold Lot Shop in facebook..you can see there people are selling above maybank selling price because of hard to find nowadays...


Again..you can offer your bar at Gold Lot Shop..if there are willing buyer, no harm to sell to them

Guys, gold as a metal has it own value and usage,

beside jewelries, there is alot usage for gold in industry, cosmetic, even in F&B.

We do not think gold is valuable just because it is scarce, it because it is scarce and useful. And why we often use gold-replacement material in industry becoz it is too expensive to use gold, thus we the 2nd best material.

Yes!! i see some hope of gold rising...

Who says the value of gold has to be priced by your perceived method of fiat?
It does not necessarily need fiat to price gold. Ask the Zimbaweans. Ask the boat people of Vietnam.
Theres always value on gold because it has for eons being the value storer in good or moreso
nowadays in bad times- thereby humans returning to it, and NOT tulips in bad times.
Funny i dont see humans ever using tulips for trading or exchanging that with goods? Do you?

What you see in trading is fiat gold, not physical gold.
You are right about the mispricing/under pricing.
Is gold REALLY corelated to world stock mkt in the way that you described?
Shorter reaction perhaps due to emotions...but longer term?



i am not here to debate gold vs farmland but that gold is value.
What you are doing is speculating whareas history has shown that gold has been used to purchase farmlands.
This is the real precption that you mentioned- GOLD is MONEY/valuable.

Sounds familair but it is value and has always been even when i started recently in 2002.
As far as gold not giving me constant returns, valued in fiat ringgit, gold has returned me 19% p annum since 2002
when i exchange for ringgit. 24% p.a when i exchange in for fiat uSD...... Sounds unfamiliar......
An oz of gold is an oz of gold.....

This post has been edited by prophetjul: Nov 30 2011, 01:52 PM

I don't see I can buy a bowl of mee with gold, nor I can buy a house with 1kg of gold, or buy a car with 1/2kg of gold. They do not accept it as payment, do they?

Correlated or not, I don't know, but I only know stock market beat gold "value", at least from Dow Jones perspective in longer term perspective.
That's why Warren Buffett become the richest man in the world.
If using 2000-2011, surely gold beat stock market, but for the 20 or 25 years period, stock market still beat gold.
Because 1999-2000 we had tech bubble in stock market.

Can we purchase farmland using gold right now?
Do seller accept gold as payment?
I don't know, may be there is, but so far I never see people use gold to pay off car purchase, house purchase or land purchase.
If can without converting to fiat money for valuation, then may be we have a case.
Like I want to sell a land at 1kg of gold like that, disregard how much the gold price is.

When you use fiat ringgit or USD, then gold is valued at fiat face already, the value is depended on fiat money already.
The gold value is 1oz, and never will give you more than 1oz.
If you use fiat as benchmark for return, then it is investment, and benchmark valuation is fiat money.

This post has been edited by cherroy: Nov 30 2011, 02:29 PM

Yes gold is used in jewelry, but only less than 50%, the rest is hoarded by 'investors' mostly by ETF's. Jewelry is a discretionary consumption, it is not a must have. If gold suddenly fully mined out overnight, will the gears of economy stop? It is not essential in the economy because it has no economic value, and whatever commercial functions it serve is replaceable by other materials.

On the other hand, other minerals like phosphate, oil, copper will definitely impact the economy if it runs out. BTW we have only about 50 years of reserve for phosphate. If it runs out, fertilizer production will stop, and currently there is no replacement as it is an 'element' as in phosphorus. The world should be much much more afraid of that rather than 'fiat' money & gold scarcity.

Please study stock cycle vs commodity cycle...now we are in commodity cycle because stock will not rising until 2016

If you say the trading of gold is fiat gold, then why is your physical gold 'value' follow the 'price' of fiat (traded) gold? Try selling your gold to it's true 'value' (whatever you perceive it to be) without following the traded price, see anyone want to buy from you or not?

The graph is nothing new, as price of gold exceed the rise in equities, it is natural the price of single equity is worth less than the traded gold. It still brings to the argument that price is what you pay, value is what you get. Still you say you have earn so much and much, isn't that also follow the 'price' of traded (fiat?) gold? Correlation is based on beta, and not a comparison graph. Beta means if no1 goes up, no 2 also goes up and vice versa.

Oh yeah, they do trade tulips for land, food, etc during the tulip mania...

This post has been edited by gark: Nov 30 2011, 02:40 PM

Corelated or not? DJ beat becos of Warren Buffet?
i suppose everyone is Warren and all are billionire as long as they are invested in Dow Jones?
Warreb Buffet sold his 130mil ozs of silver at $7 per oz in 2006....hes real smart.....

On the matter of farmland i presume gark is refering to badtimes as in TSHTF. Pls read the context.
Dont just shoot off yer hip.

i guess you have not seen Zimbawe or Utah accepting gold as payment. Hell, even Trump Donald accept
gold for payment of his properties!

---

Added on November 30, 2011, 2:48 pmYou said when mkt falls, gold falls......dont detract from that. i showed you it depneds on the timeline.

Beta is reaction.....i am showing you a trend which rebutts your saying



Show me evidence where they traded using tulips.....during the tulip mania. Thanks

Link pls?

Did tulips ever return as an asset for exchange? Did gold?

This post has been edited by prophetjul: Nov 30 2011, 02:50 PM

Come come.. i show you pretty pictures... the first is gold vs SP, the second is beta S&P vs GOLD for the past 10 years. The correlation is 0.12.. which is 'highly correlated'.





For the full story of tulip trading for food and land please read the book 'Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds', published in 1841 by Charles Mackay or you can just search wiki for tulip mania.

Yep Warren Buffett did sell off all his silver, but is was a derivative contract (fiat metal?) and he did not hold any physicals. Here is what he says on gold...



And you say W. Buffett is smart to sell of his silver at $7 an ounce, now according to traded 'fiat metal' it is about $30 an ounce. Why don't he wants to speculate anymore now as the price is surging? Maybe be cause he did not see 'value' at such 'prices'?

This post has been edited by gark: Nov 30 2011, 03:18 PM

may I know where is selling the perth 1/10oz dragon gold? what is the price now?

just open MGIA..
hoping for a good investment down the year xD

You showed me two years, i showed you long term...does it look the same?



Did tulip become an asset fro exchange again like gold?

Maybe Warren is not as smart as one thinks?
Maybe he doesnt understand precious metals?

He bought physical silver and was widely specualted that he sold to the SLV startups..

i am not argiung why is he not in silver now. Why did he sell at $7?
After he sold, went to $12.........must be real smart.

He must be real smart that he cant beat me at investing in the last 10 years.......

+1.
J.P Morgan also accept physical gold as collateral.
However, J.P Morgan did not accept any paper gold even from it`s own product.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142405...2457252596.html

Aiyah.. I am showing you the correlation or beta, not the actual worth, look at the graph carefully. The correlation graph is from 2000 to 2010, which is when gold start to gain popularity. Warren intuition of 'value' in stocks, bonds or metals has been unmatched for more than 40 years, so he sold out metals during the rise of the bubble as he perceives the value is no longer there.

If you think you are better than Warren Buffet, then good luck and please don't forget to come visit LYN forum when you are a billionaire.

This post has been edited by gark: Nov 30 2011, 05:44 PM

Aiyah i am trying to show you that your correlation is only for shorterm volatility..............

In fact in the last 10 years as shown by my graph, S&P500 index has been falling vs gold. Hows that the samw characteristics as you claimed?

i have no qualms about Warren B in stock picks but metals? Think again.......

selling at the rise of the silver bubble? What bubble at $7???

10 years correlation chart is short term volatility? Like I say correlation does not mean it has the same value, it measures the correlation between up and down.

W. Buffett does not earn the title as the worlds' best investor for nothing, in fact he does not favor metals very much at all, hence he unloaded all his silver into ETF holdings and made comments on the 'value' of gold. He is a value investor, if he does not see value even as the price is rising fasts he will not touch it. In fact during 1995-2001 when dot.com stocks is going sky high, he said the same thing and did not touch tech stocks even though thousands upon thousands of people got fabulously rich overnight. That time even a magazine declared the end of Warren Buffett's investment style and he is 'behind times' and does not understand the 'new wave'.

Anyway just enjoy the ride while it last, but please diversify properly and not put everything in one basket. Also falling in love with an investment is a no no. In fact I do diversify into gold via Newcrest Mining, but it is just a small percentage