I just want to know what's so important about the Actuary professional paper like SOA?
like example ACCA/CPA is important due to Accountant need to have the qualification to sign the account, if they dont have the qualification of ACCA/CPA they will not be able to sign the account.
CFA which is just a sign to people that the holder has the investment and finance knowledge but no certain post of job/career which stated down CFA is a must. Which CFA migh just give u higher chance for applying certain post.
In these two case we know the different between CFA and ACCA/CPA, to be a accountant ACCA is a must.
So I would like to know SOA is more like CFA? or ACCA? in term of the importance.

Second, I'm 28 years old now I was graduated from Bsc Econ (which degree has exemption for the SOA VEE exam) and lately I wanted to be a actuary and I took SOA exam p and passed it then I started to look for some actuary related job but sadly...not much for entry level, Is that anyone can tell me that am I too old to get into this field? or I should pass few more paper only it will be higher chance for me to get in this field?

Why ACCA is most recognised qualification ?

First you need to work 3 years in related field to qualify.
not qualify to take but qualified as an account

Now you jump the gun..

you have papers with no qualification.
28 is not too old. the thing is ,could you accept a fresh grad pay?

Then you are in cross road.

1. I have other experience and education . they should take me

Why this thinking is wrong ?

You have experience in what ppl need and just basic education. Hiring a fresh grad is cheaper and more secure investment.

2. I won't take a pay cut.

Some ppl get lucky .. some ppl don't .. normal you jump industry you reset experience

3. If you are 28 and have no working experience. you better have a master in hand. otherwise there is not explanation why you are so late graduating.

To be honest if i can get into this field I dont mind pay cut but u remind me maybe i should adjust the expected salary to lower level
I have working experience I used to be econ analyst and currently Im working as a research and credit analyst But still I rarely see opening for actuarial entry level...

This post has been edited by veger_leong: Feb 14 2011, 02:46 PM

Are you just looking at job sites for openings? Companies seldom update their website regarding careers. Take initiative to cold call the HR of the company you're intending to work for. Send in your resume and try to apply even if there are no openings.

I love to calculate probability.

I often calculate the probability of many different things in life (useful or not).

How could I get a "taste" of what is actuarial science?

loving probability is just the start, and barely enough.
Of course, instead of dealing with Numbers. the way we learn sorts of probability theory will be through
matrices, algebra and alot of Set theories, using A,B,C,D to learn the underlying logic.
Financial math must be your love, as what you learn in math, will be substituted with Interest rate and numbers with high S.F.
and subsequent financial modelling. This comprise a very tough time handling sorts of weird cash flows.

when Probability meets these Cash flows, u get financial uncertainty, which explains risk, arising studies in investment strategy,
going through Continuous time finance, which have sh*t loads of stochastics in it, which can be said a "probability sample space" at its worst.

Survival model give u taste of what traditional actuaries do, scrolling through life mortality tables, and make insurance decisions, upon payoff, and project further evaluations.

that would be the very brief taste of AS. if you cant handle Mathematic theories ( doing proves, explaining theories, instead of just advanced calculations),
dont take it.
probability is just too hard to describe, as probability is the root in high level statistics, try looking through advanced statistics, and decide whether probability is really ur cup of tea, if not you will really really really have a very bad time in it.

Finance is perhaps where Actuarial Studies is highly applied on in Australia (IAA), not sure with the emphasis in other boards. It requires an interest in learning stocks, shares, markets, Interest rate calculations, and invesment strategies. If you find those boring, AS might be a very boring subject for you. Do think carefully.


Do go online and do more research upon deciding whether AS is suitable for you. Ask if in doubt

Hi All,
Just looking for some advice from "sifus" here......

I am a fully qualified accountant (ACCA UK) and is looking for sort of like a career change from accounting to finance field. If, and say if, I choose to do actuarial science, is it advisable to attempt a "teaser" paper first rather than diving in like a Rambo and get myself killed for nothing?

The Institute of Actuaries (UK) allow the public to do CT1 without the commitment of being a member. I believe it maybe a good idea to attempt paper CT1 Financial Mathematics just to test the water.

What if I pass the paper and seem to like it? Is it any indicators that I should proceed and do CT2 to CT8? Or just passing CT1 is too early to tell?

By the way, I am just planning to do self study and via correspondence course with BPP (Actuarial Science Training provider company). Experience wise... sadly, I am working for an MNC (manufacturing) in Penang and therefore is devoid of finance exposure.

Or maybe I am being too naive? That it is better for me to do CFA Level 1 instead? And what is the difference between CFA versus the actuarial exams? Noted that alot of actuarial graduates (actuaries wannabe) end up doing CFA instead.

Thanks in advance...Any feedback, no matter how crude is always welcome.

Your queries regarding CT1 has been answered in another thread; Actuarial Professional papers.
However I will answer further from here, explaining which CT you might want to take to have a taste of the Actuarial Field.

CT2 will be quite easy for you, because the coverage is basically for Actuaries to get a hold of some Corporate Governance issues and Financial reporting, of which an accountant is more than familiar within every details of it. But, do revise the CT2 sylabus for any changes.

CT3 will be the start of an everyday concept that an actuary will have to deal with in his career. probability and Statistics, again learning things from
mathematical concepts up to solving complicated problems, all advancement of Stochastics, Contingency studies, Survival models and Credibility calculations starts from the concepts you learn in CT3. Hence, this is a very good paper to start with.

CT4- After CT3, expansion of studies in Samples Space, Stochastic approach, and introducing you to calculations related to pricing based on mortality rates.

CT5 - Advanced, best do it after majority paper is completed. the emphasis of Actuarial techniques in CFs and projections.

CT6 - Advanced, The component with the most Eff-ed up theories, and hard to understand theories. covering sufficiently on Credibility of data and various approaches in Risk. and their calculations.

CT7 - basically for the aim of giving Actuaries the required knowledge in intermediate economics, which might fall into the equation on decisions or pricing decisions which is Supply and Demand driven, or have other MAcro factors involved in it. Can be taken at a preliminary level.

CT8 - No joke, do it last.

CT9 - Business and Ethic module, nothing much surprising, just do tonnes of reading on Professional ethics, code of conduct blabla ( in IAAus, this is done under a Bridging course after Part II papers)

The UK sylabus and Aus sylabus fall within similar coverage on part I. Further on, its still similar just that IAA might cover certain things earlier while IoA UK prefer to put certain papers first before the other and vice versa.

We use to have inner jokes when classmates failed units, then we annoy them to take CFA instead! hahaha, and the ridiculous acronym
CFA = Council of Failed Actuaries haha. but how hard it is, I have no experience to judge. Since Part I and II of CFA is purely MCQ.
10000% lot more easier than clearing Actuarial CTs. The coverage of CFA sylabus put an emphasis on basic Finance ( if you do CT1, this is nothing),
portfolio valuation and construction, Investment studies, and some theoretical Corporate FInance issues.

Questions in the exam will be more direct as told by one of my friend, alot of Plug and Play questions.
but it is understandable for CFA to be more "exam-friendly" as the CFA body is not concentrated to the development of one career (no requirement for financial analyst to be a fellow of CFA) , unlike IAA, IAA will oversee and reflect the standard of qualified Actuaries practising worldwide, which perhaps explain the difficulty and complication of its admission processes.


Ask if in doubt. Thanks

I am nw currently waiting SPM result,

And I have a few questions, hope u all can answer it.

1) Is there any company that provide AS grad scholarship?

2) What subject should I choose for A-level?

If you dont mind, go through page 7 to page 10 in this post. the answer u seek is somewhere inside. lol

I have go throught all of the pages but still nt yet get the answer I want.

Can someone help me?? T.T

Quite obvious, isn't it? No offence, but at A Level there are hardly enough subjects pertinent to Actuarial Science for you to be at odds when trying to choose 3/4 appropriate subjects.

the Scholarship enquiry perhaps those JPA threads can give u the answer, or easier "ask there" lol

A little add-on, mostly companies wont fund ur Actuarial degree, but there will be more companies that fund you
study fees and costs for your professional examinations once you complete ur degree and start a career in a insurance/actuarial firm.


Regarding suitable subject for a-level. I am not quite sure what u want.
Lightningfist can probably give u insight bout the difficulty of these a-level subjects accordingly.

But if you would want better answers, ask better questions.
e.g. tell us what subject u decided/want to take in A-levels

then we may advise you whether its appropriate for ur pursue in Actuarial Science.

Cheers.

This post has been edited by RyukA: Mar 29 2011, 08:24 PM

Pass SOA exam P with grade 8 enter uni can be exempted from Probability and Statistics I and II or not?

This post has been edited by macamtakada: Apr 2 2011, 01:58 PM

I can help you.

For no.1, do more research yourself. Some kind Malaysians have already prepared alot and I mean ALOT of easy to find summarized resources about scholarships for all levels of education. It's out there, somewhere, I found it myself easily with no one to guide me back then and I think it's 10 time easier now.

No 2. Math Further Math and Economics.

I just graduated SPM examination and am an ART student (only taken general mathematic, Perdagangan, economy but not Add Math) well, as a student not being exposed to add math. Does it affect the ability learning to become an actuary?

My friend wanted to study locally for actuarial science in UTAR; I was wondering would it affect his chance of working oversea since his study a local U?

I just found out about courses looks similar to actuary. Like Financial engineering and mathematical financial. Are these courses similar to actuary?

Btw, good post and thank you. ^^

Again, I want to ask the same question.
Do you know what an actuary does? Why would you want to become an actuary?
*this is to check whether you know what to do next*

Admath f5 is hardly anywhere close to the real concept of Mathematics, except exposing a person to some mathematic formula and learning how to apply.
I would suggest you try to take Math in any Pre-U that involve Calculus( differentiation, Integration, Rates) and Linear Algebra (which is a further study in the Matrix topic that u learn in f5). if you like it, and do well, then Actuarial Science may be still manageable for you.
To answer your question, unless you are a genius in Mathematics even without f5 addmath,
it is nearly impossible for you to understand any math concept (to catch up) that you will be learning in an actuarial degree.

If you havn't go through few pages back from this post, I reckon' you do that.
then you will understand that to fully qualify as an actuary, one have to further take a number of professional papers to pass these exams to obtain fellowship, which by then one can call him/herself a qualified actuary.
There are actuarial institutes around the world, few famous ones namely SoA, IAA, CSA,HKIA.
Try to read previous posts, I am sure we have written the same thing over and over again.

A part of an actuarial degree involves studies in Continuous time finance and stochastic processes, these are common topics of Actuarial science and Financial engineering.
Actuary does work in finance sectors although the traditional approach is on insurance and pension funds. this explains why both of these field look so much alike in the finance sector,
but what you learn in a Actuarial degree will be highly different from mathematical finance (which they go deeper into derivative pricing and stochastic model stock pricing) or financial engineering.

Do spend some time reading up previous posts, you may find them helpful.

I just read through all 12 pages in the hope of finding a rough figure for the starting salary of Actuarial Associates. No luck.

I'm an actuarial student at Drake University, Iowa. Don't listen to people who tell you that Drake is one of the lesser schools. Those are the people who go to places like Wisconsin-Madison & UPenn mostly because they are highly ranked. If what you really want to do is Act Sci, then you'd be hard pressed to do any better than Drake (except Waterloo, which I turned down). I've passed the first two papers of the SOA (P & FM), and I will be starting my summer internship with Maybank Etiqa in May. I'd like to share my experience with anyone who might be interested, and I hope that you benefit from it.

First off, if you can't speak perfect English, do yourself a favor and learn how to now. In the wonderful world of actuaries, we learn how to apply concepts that most people will never hear of in their lifetimes. However, you need to communicate these concepts to your manager, regulators, assistants, etc. That, and you will never be employed by an American company if people have problems with your grammar/accent. I missed the window to secure an internship in the US because of bad timing. But if I fail to secure one next summer, then I really need to reexamine my priorities.

Secondly, the coursework is rigorous. I got a headache reading through the Accounting vs. Actuary part of this thread, because it was an absolute waste of time. I'll clarify this now: Under the US system, actuaries learn basic accounting practices similar to the stuff you took for SPM. The reason we learn this is to be familiar with that aspect of the business, which every business graduate should be required to know. At Drake, the courses you take are designed to prepare you for the first 5 papers required to obtain your Associate in the Society of Actuaries (ASA). That means 5-6 advanced statistics courses, 4-5 advanced finance courses, and 1-2 advanced economics classes (think regression analysis). It also goes without saying that you will complete your VEE, unless you score lower than a B. Almost every serious actuarial science student I know has never scored lower than a B.

Thirdly, the emphasis on programming is there for a reason. Actuaries in traditional roles (life, health, pension, etc) will work extensively with Excel and other actuarial software. You may have heard that act sci graduates go to the office, punch a few buttons, let the software do all the work, and then call it a day. Sounds simple, but this is only possible because the actuary knows exactly what's going on, and has excellent programming skills (VBA recommended!). It's probably more complicated than that, but that's why I'm doing an internship this summer.

Finally, a word on supply & demand. There are almost 200 Malaysian students at Drake, the majority of which are actuarial science students. The average IQ is probably north of 120, with a few exceptions. Last year, there were about 50-60 act sci graduates. 5 got full-time offers. Multiply the number of students returning to Malaysia by the number of universities, and you're looking at a thousand smart kids fighting for several dozen positions. I'm not trying to scare anyone out of their ambition, but you should be aware of this.

I am not your typical Malaysian studying abroad. I am more white than I care to explain. I am an active member of a social fraternity, Sigma Chi, which to my knowledge is something that has never been done before at Drake by any Malaysian. I fully intend to secure a position here after I graduate with 4-5 papers. And it is my sincere hope that you think long and hard about studying Actuarial Science before you make the commitment I have.

This post has been edited by katana18: Apr 7 2011, 09:20 PM

Anyone know where can we learn about the prophet modelling ? or can we download the programme ?

Hello all
I am an IT associate in National stock exchange india. My work is to give technical support to clearing and settlement process.
I am confused whether i should go for actuaries or not as i have two years of work experience and i am not satisfied with the job.
I am good in maths and also in coding but my job is now almost non technical(coding) as it involves business analysis. What are the options available for me.If anyone can suggest i will be highly appreciate.

Thank you