Why should vikingw2k be punished for something he is not wrong? are u stating that IF vikingw2k were to striped off his TE or ELITE and add in DISPUTE, TS is going to let this matter slide?

If this is the case, then the conclusion i can make is that TS is jealous of vikingw2k and trying ways to striped off his.

This is too much to bash the TS. Hello?! Can you have a little respect on others?
I've been following this thread since the first post. And, please brush up your English first before bashing up. Can't even get those words spelled correctly.
And, what is the purpose of questioning his profession as a teacher? Is there any relation with this case?
Stop spamming then.

Lol, RangerRed, it's Rule no.7 ler =.=""

Btw, I think he will not understand one as he will still insist ppl to "refer first page"

wow bro!! cool down ya~??...seem just u overeact don't u like TS lol~ ??? TS doesn't jelous of vikingw2k( what??are u a 2nd grade student?? ) it's the matter of profesionalisme ethics... and if i may ask??!! what is this propose of special tag given to forummer...there were like recognition about their behaviour thru this forum right?? so if one of them made a mistake they are also can be judge like somelese right?? same level like TS right ??? it's not becoz of jelous la bro~~aiyo

all the people's who are supporting the seller are real XXckers....i will say that. i m trying my best to help the buyer, but the entire community is in the way of protecting the seller..wht to do man ?

THE BUYER IS ENTITLED FOR FULL REFUND...

guys;

I have my own opinion, take it if you want to hear, otherwise, just leave it ok.

Here is the points.

If i'm a "good" seller, i will ensure my sell item is in good condition before i sell it. The way i do is just;

1) Give personal warranty like 1 day or 1 week, depends on item, so that the buyer can check my claimed. After that, it's no more my responsibility.

2) Provide the pictures in a best way as possible, so that buyer can know that the item i sell is in the claimed condition.

If we do this, i don't think the buyer will have an issues.


If i'm a buyer for the item;

1) I will inform the seller about the item has arrived, so that seller can start counting the warranty period.

2) I will check the item function and condition as well during the warranty period.

I understand that there is a risk of buying online item and also 2nd hand items, but for me, i support online selling, cause it gives me better value for my money.

Normally, if i gives my warranty, i will do this;

1) 1 week warranty if the item was in 100% function. Normally, we are not afraid to give this if we know the item is functioning.

2) 1 day warranty only if the item is less than 90% function, because i know, the item will give more problem later, as well as i don't want the buyer to do unnecessary claim later.

That's how i do business.

What i want to stress here is that we as a seller should provide more confidence to the buyer that buy our item.

If the buyer make claim on the condition of the item after purchased, i will only agree if the claim is during the 1st day of the warranty, cause condition is the 1st part that the buyer will notice when they receive the item.

That's all guys.

I support online selling, and i would like to see better way being implemented to help buyer outside there.

Cheers.

well, since u wan to say about professional ethics, which part does TS shows that he has professional ethics? instead of solving the issue, all he is saying is HE DEMANDS A FULL REFUND. PLZ REFER TO FIRST PAGE. Is that professional ethics? he is looking at this case based on his opinion only. he doesnt care about the seller also. what he is doing is just for his benefits.

Special tag is given because of their contribution to the forum. He earn it not because of this trading in Garage Sale but his contribution towards the good of the forum. So do you still think that he should be striped off his ELITE or TE?

Oh ya, i never intend to stoop as low as TS. If my post make u misunderstand anything, then i will say sorry first.

the next smart comment on this thread unless its from

1. the buyer
2. the seller

or is

3. constructive in nature to help solve the dispute

will result in an immediate suspension of your account.

Buyer/Seller, please try to come to an amicable solution to between yourselves, otherwise this case will be sent to arbitration and both seller and buyer will be given a dispute tag pending a decision.

Case so far :

Buyer - you are making life difficult by not trying to settle the dispute, but merely trying to get the seller blacklisted. While you may succeed in this, you will also receive a dispute tag for failing to settle a dispute. Second hand items are second hand items, and sometimes things like this do happen. A little bit of compromise would be in order in the spirit of the community. You might have been deceived, but you're not willing to compromise to reach a win win situation. Maybe you should just stick to retail purchases in the future to avoid this problems.

Seller - your position as a TE and an elite member would require you to maintain a high level of ethics when dealing with members and from the evidence so far, it would seem you have failed to be transparent in your sales. While this would be normal business practice by sellers in general, the fact that you're a trade enforcer/elite member would mislead members to believe you were above these tactics (and hence make them more likely to purchase from you than a normal member). Your reputation as well as your position has come under question all for a mere PDA phone and your unwillingness to compromise and come to a speedy solution might cause you more harm than you bargained for.

Dispute tags will be handed out within the next 24 hours if an amicable solution isn't reached.

thanks mod, i would like to ask seller for full refund, this may not happen if seller transparent of what he is selling, telling the truth is more important, i dont get mad if u admit ur doing wrong, realize ur mistake is the first priority, of course we need one bad example to tell the others for not to be like him, it is the way i teach my pupils same as in here..i still give him a chance, take back ur PDA and sell it in proper ethical way of selling....sorry for my bad english

from my point of view,

as viking has been a good and honest seller even earn to be TE, should you ruin your reputation because of this.

as a seller have ever heard of "customer alway right"? if you are a buyer, what happen to your product which you buy 1 days and spoil...what will you do..i sure u will request for exchange right...did you wait for claiming which take up a weeks or more...it just like the buyer..

probably if refund you might hard to sell in this forum due to every1 has know this PDA condition. but what can you do, ur picture is hiding the fact ( real or not who know)

i remember my case, i got 1 buyer claim my product is dmg...but the product only reach to my hand after 1 week...and i even refund to him even i never know what he did to my product in a week before reach my hand...maybe before that is ok but after few day onli dmg then claim from me...what to do...cos i still need this forum to sell my stuff...i need a good reputation..for me reputation is more important than u defend your case and deny it...what other will think on you in future...how u going to sell ur thing which you claim 95%...will ppl still believe in you..do they still have faith in you....

to those who read this tread..i think you all as buyer alway say this to your seller also "WE CUSTOMER ALWAY RIGHT"


(p/s: viking dont tell me that you cannot survive because of RM1.2K)

I've proposed earlier on, to send the phone to replace a brand new original casing from Authorized Asus Service Centre (so that the warranty is still valid) and both of us share the cost by 50/50 and stop pointing each other about the extra damage on the pdaphone. I've come up with my evidence to show that the item is in good condition before I sent it out and you claimed that you have some witnesses when you open the parcel. I wouldn't want to accuse whether you are making it up or not. I just wanted to solve this dispute asap as dragging further won't do you any good, might as well settle it asap instead of keeping the damaged phone for quite some time.

I wondered did you really go through everything I've posted or you just opt to shoot me blindly?

To you and to those who are still asking me the same old question and accuse me of hiding the condition,

I said that, when i got the phone back. They were some minor scratches on the top, side(the buttons) and a few more slight ones around.That's the reason i claim my phone is 95% when i posted my thread. If they is a big damage on the top like what the TS picture showed, don't you think I'm a bit silly for posting it at 95% and let my buyers COD with me so that they can call off the deal when they see they big damage on the top?

forummer leeyuleong has came earlier before TS has sealed his deal with me. He (leeyuleong) offered me a higher and better price for my phone via sms and arranged a meet up. He came all the way from Cheras stating that he wanted to look at the condition first. Once he reached my place, we have a small chat and he start looking at the minor tear and wear on my phone. but in the end he still call off the deal cause the main thing that caught his eyes was just the minor tear and wear on the left side button. He's buying the phone for his friend and he afraid that his friend wouldn't like it hence he called off the deal politely before going back and i thank him for coming all the way to view it.

All the while the phone is in 95% condition, which means the top part was just some minor scratches due to the drop by the previous seller(fullbl4d3 too claimed that it was just a minor scratches) and there are some minor tear and wear on maybe the edges. Right after I saw the picture uploaded by you, of course I was stunned as I myself don't recall any bad damage like that before. Well, I decided to take some time to investigate this matter with the previous people who seen it before I've sent the phone to you which is why I didn't reply much (because IF all the person who've seen the phone said that they too saw that there's a big damage on the top, I would have admit it was my fault and just full refund you for misleading you. BUT IF all the person DENIED that they've seen that damage, then I will have explain in this thread just like what I did few days after that). Also I didn't accuse you blindly for making that damage when you first uploaded the picture and please I too hope that you can be more rational by not simply accusing me of doing that too. I've done my part to show that I'm clean. You too. I've never question your witnesses and just accept it as neither You or Me can proof that who is right and wrong.

As a seller, I will give you the benefit of doubt and just accept your claim which is why I proposed to have the casing replaced with a New Original one which actually solve this whole mess. (instead of blaming whose fault it is and making thread an endless novel in the end). After all this thread is created because of your dissatisfaction on the housing. So why don't we just peacefully solve the root of this problem instead of creating a normal forummer VS TE war, or start another Racist Thread, or Mods Are Always Right kinda thread here?

YES, I wouldn't mind it too if I've to fork out 100% of the phone casing replacement cost which I doubt many others will. Take a survey of replacing a New Original pda phone casing cost outside. They gonna cost you a bomb. Take for example Dopod phones casing replacement would simply cost you at least RM3xx and some might be more expensive.

stevenlee - enough, your scenario is entirely different from mine, also we are discussing on my issue. Don't relate this to other issue. We don't need to know how dumb a seller can be by 100% accepting "Buyer Always Right" kinda unstated rule. We are on the last lap of this thread where we are focusing on suggestion to solve this dispute fairly instead of pointing fingers blaming each other on the earlier pages. Accelerate a little bit more and go around all the pages, understand them clearly IF you plan to catch up with us. Thanks.

This post has been edited by vikingw2k: Jul 31 2007, 03:13 PM

viking i have been follow up this case from begining. did i miss anything??? did u close my tread or scold me be4... NO ...then did i comment on you due to ur last action did to my tread??? NO..... i just voice out my opinion..... since you cant take it is ok....is just like what happen to u where you cant explain your thumb closing the crack area ......you also cant take it as your fault....

since you i am a dumb seller cos i hold the principle of "Buyer Alway Right" i think most of business man also DUMB cos their principle when dealing with customer. I will never go to a shop which say Seller Alway Right and bully customer or consumer especially your shop...

Since so many ppl already voice out their dissatisfaction and you cant accept it , it is no use we continue giving you advise... i will end my opinion here add see what will you did and what admin will take action if this case is not settle...

MOD - sorry if i spam this tread

This post has been edited by stevenlee: Jul 31 2007, 03:48 PM

Let's not waste more time, let me emphasize my proposal to you again.

- You send the phone back to me(you bear the postage of course, you don't claim a company for your petrol charges when returning their products to them right?),

- I'll send it to Asus Service Centre to change a new housing, I will check whether they need to replace the whole thing or just the top part. If it's just the top part, I will fork out 100%, if it's the whole casing, I will fork out 50%(as I believe that you too should fork out some money as it involved changing the whole thing and you are only claiming the top part). Either way is benificial to you because If you were to count dead grass, the Top part scratches is 20% since earlier on you said it looks like 80% Like new, So by right I should only pay 20% of the whole housing and You pay 80% of the balance cost, still I'm generous enough to fork out 50% of the cost of changing the entire casing for you when by right I only need to pay the part that you claimed.

- I'll pickup the phone myself from Asus Service Centre( I'll bear my own transport cost)

- I'll then check the phone, test and make sure everything is ok , upload a few pictures of the top part which they've replaced for you to see clearly the condition of the top part,

- and finally You either send your courier to pickup from me or you bear my transportation + postage charges for me to send the item back to you (you don't ask a company to send back your claimed products at their cost don't you think so?)

In short,
- You only pay the postage tru and fro.
- I'll pay the 100% cost of changing the top part, and 50% if it involves changing the whole casing.

I guess this proposal is reasonable enough. The reasons supporting this
- You've accused me blindly for the damage on the top part . So the root of this problem is the Top part. Changing the housing will remove the cosmetic damage on the Top part.
- I too can accuse you to purposely did it and make this a huge mess to claim a Full Refund from me probably you needed the money so badly for other things after you've committed the deal or you found a better offer(but I didn't accused you blindly as I myself don't have evidence to prove it, but remember, neither did you have evidence that I caused that damage cause people might accuse either one of us could just bring in any grandmother or grandfather and claim to have witness the condition before sending out to you and after you've received.) However, I'll leave the benefits of doubt to you. You are claiming the Top part. So I'll just change the top part for you. I don't see any reason for full refund unless I've delivered a completely faulty item to you.

stevenlee - Sorry to say that you still failed horribly. Your last post still doesn't contribute on better ways or suggestion on how to solve this matter equally for both TS and I. However I would thank you greatly for the following post you've made.

Thanks for dropping by.

This post has been edited by vikingw2k: Jul 31 2007, 05:45 PM

that's the best solution we're looking and now it's up to u TS!!! ( my advice is just take it lar.... ) no need a long arguement that does lead no where~ i have highlighted the propose made by seller...!!! good job u doing there vikingw2k!! now i can trust that u're a good seller ( just maybe luck isn't in ur side but u manage to climb back )

*opss..sorry vikingw2k!! quote delete to coz NEW solution offer have been made..pretty good actualy!!

This post has been edited by budakdegilz: Jul 31 2007, 04:43 PM

my opinion -

where on earth a normal human will damage the things he bought??

susah payah trade then go bank in and wait the postman to come and feel not very 'love' the stuff then can simply damage it lar..it is more childish leh bro...for wat reason a buyer wan to do like tat when the power is on the buyer either to buy or not..

3cents



sorry admin but would like to comment about the quote by temptation1314..didnt realise your post..sorry

congratz for showing your profesional way in dealing this kind matter viking..

This post has been edited by lolz_5167: Jul 31 2007, 06:54 PM

TS, just accept the solution suggested by viking lar.. do 50/50 deal on new ori housing..

or just suggest viking to provide u a 95% NEW housing on his cost.. as he insist that pda is 95% NEW..

but still, the first solution is the easiest.. why not spend a few more bucks on a 100% NEW housing.. then ur pda will look NEW.. bling bling..

This post has been edited by wandzul: Jul 31 2007, 07:14 PM

thanks for all the comment, did you all know and realize, he has misleading me to buy his PDA by giving incorrect informations about the conditions, if he show the pictures earlier or inform me bout the scratch for sure i dun buy that unit, ok i juz emphasis on the top part where he deny it, how bout the bottom part and the 'hold' button that fade away??? is this not include in his '95% like new condition'???? i dont accept ur solution bro since u seller misleading buyer like me with ur pictures and words, RM1250 is not a worth buy and oso i need to share with u the cost of changing casing, haha, nice try..

vikingw2k.. so far i haven't seen any of your witnesses reply to this thread here, what we see is that they come to this thread and view the photos and sms/pm their comments? hard to convinced us right..

like i say for twice already, its not fair to the buyer as TRADE ENFORCER or SAFE TRADER can just go check 2nd hand phone which got serious CRACKS or SCRATCHES then take a perfect angle of PHOTO stated its in GOOD CONDITIONS 95% NEW, send to the outstation buyer (NOT COD), then buyer complain end up the need to pay for the postage fee for both send/return and split the cost of repairing to 50/50. SELLER probably just buy the phone at a much lower price due to the condition of the phone then after pay for the 50% repair fee, still earning good profit, of cause this is just my scenarios.

Buyer is asking for refund because he thinks that he's getting cheated. Buyer already asked regarding the scratch/crack part, SELLER knows that the BUYER is from OUTSTATION, he should at least take clear photo of the TOP PART and show the BUYER, not telling the BUYER to refer to the pictures you posted which doesn't show the part. Buyer may probably not going to buy the PDA or ask for bargain when he see those CRACK/SCRATCHES. If SELLER did show the BUYER that the crack/scratches is not that serious, BUYER bought it then and he accidentally drop it, he got nothing to argue anymore. Seller MISTAKE for not answering to the BUYER regarding the 5% bad part where he can take photo and show the buyer (but who knows probably the crack/scratches is there already to be hide)

If buyer is a TRADE ENFORCER/SAFE TRADER/MODERATORS, what will happen to the SELLER who just come LYN starting fresh business? Will he get to be treated the same? Can he just need to ask the buyer (with *tags*) to pay the postage fee and 50% of the repair fee? This is the question we need to ask ourselves.

Well thats the risk for outstation buyers. Thats why there's a SAFE TRADER tag given for us to trust but in this case you will never know whats going to happen. I know I had no right to advice/suggest the seller as he is an experienced businessman, LYN advices people to practices COD and you mention that there are other buyers also asking for the item, i think seller should consider COD than postage so same things wont happen next time.

This post has been edited by ingjoo: Jul 31 2007, 07:54 PM

then right now,

Seller
:Offer him to change the housing,buyer pay the shipping fee and seller will do everything for buyer.

Buyer:
Rejet the offer and still asking for refund.

the previous owner already admit he dropped the PDA and got scratch at the top, u need to ask him although the PDA with you at that time, what a ridiculous story u create there..i highlight here again, if u show me the pics and inform me about that scratch, to tell you the truth, ive got no interest of that PDA..you should told me at the first place, won't you?????