Using your reason of argument, it wouldn't sound right either to refer Father God as Father of God.

This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Apr 10 2020, 01:53 PM

You're still using worldly standard as your defense.

The scripture verses that you showed are irrelevant to your context. The phrase offend there refers to those who didn't understand of the term eating Christ Flesh and drinking his Blood.

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This does not prove you are a practicing Christian. For all we know, you could be an East Malaysian ex-Muslim interested in Christianity.

Just tell us, which Christian denomination do you adhere to, if you have one.? Proper Christian Fellowship requires the participants to be upfront and honest about their "brand" of Christianity, so that others know where they are coming from wrt their doctrinal beliefs.

The different Christian denominations should practice the following and not kill each other or condemn/judge each other over non-essential matters, ie only the essential unifying salvation by faith in Jesus Christ matters.(= not by the works of keeping the Law or other beliefs)
....... So what if a Christian chooses to commit sins leading to death or not leading to death or to go and commit sins no more.? To each his/her own wrt the judgment of God/Christ in this life and in the afterlife, as per listed in the Bible or Word of God. ......

In Essentials Unity. In Non-essentials Liberty. In All Things the Love of Christ.

Always Keep the Faith.
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This post has been edited by lurkingaround: Apr 10 2020, 10:28 PM

Why we need to look away from the law for justification before God


Good Day fellow believers of Christ. Hope you doing well.

I am for God's law but for the purpose what God designed the law for.

We cannot call the law what it is not. As we know the law cannot save us. There is nothing wrong with the Law,It is Holy and Righteous because it's God' own commandment. The law is like a mirror, if it shows you to be ugly or handosme, then you cannot blame the mirror. However with that being said, we need to understand why God gave the law and what's it's function and what has happen to it under the light of the new covenant.

The Law is weak and useless

Hebrews 7:18 (KJV) - For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof

Romans 8:3 (KJV) - For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh,

The Law cannot impart Righteousness or Life

Galatians 3:21 (NIV) - Is the law, therefore, opposed to the promises of God? Absolutely not! For if a law had been given that could impart life, then righteousness would certainly have come by the law.

The Law is a ministry of death
2 Corinthians 3:7 (NIV) - Now if the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone, came with glory, so that the Israelites could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of its glory, transitory though it was,

The Law is not the reality

Hebrews 10:1 (NIV) - The law is only a shadow of the good things that are coming--not the realities themselves. For this reason it can never, by the same sacrifices repeated endlessly year after year, make perfect those who draw near to worship.

The Old Covenant is obselete, there is a change

Hebrews 7:12 (NIV) - For when the priesthood is changed, the law must be changed also.

Hebrews 7:11 (NIV) - If perfection could have been attained through the Levitical priesthood--and indeed the law given to the people established that priesthood--why was there still need for another priest to come, one in the order of Melchizedek, not in the order of Aaron?

Hebrews 8:13 (NIV) - By calling this covenant "new," he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear

The purpose of God's law is to trigger sin.
Romans 5:20 (NIV) - The law was brought in so that the trespass might increase. But where sin increased, grace increased all the more,

1 Corinthians 15:56 (NIV) - The sting of death is sin, and the power of sin is the law.


Why then did God gave the Law?

Galatians 3:19 (NLT) - Why, then, was the law given at all? It was added because of transgressions until the Seed to whom the promise referred had come. The law was given through angels and entrusted to a mediator.


The Law was design to cause man to acknowledge sin. This is the meaning in Galatians 3:19...The Law was added because of trasngression. There is NO OTHER reason other than this. Well besides to trigger sin, but that is part and parcel of God's Law.

The law was never design to save man, neither impart righteousness. It is to bring Man to the end of himself. To give up trying saving himself by own performance ie through obediance to the Law. I use this as the strongest emphasize to easily understand.

Where then is the Hope?

Well as how the Bible says it. Thanks be to God for Jesus Christ. THERE is your hope, there is your Salvation.

With all that's being said, look away from the Law, Look to Jesus Christ

God Bless

https://www.ddtonline.com/news/temple-bapti...d.Ds5cnuqj.dpbs - Temple Baptist Church members issued $500 tickets for parking lot service - By JON ALVERSON - Thu, 04/09/2020

Social distancing includes the stay-at-home order issued by President Trump/Federal government to contain the Wuhan virus/Covid-19 outbreak. Christians are not supposed to leave their homes to attend drive-in or in-person Church services.

Christians should obey their local or national governments or Caesar, especially generally-good governments, as long as they are not required to deny their faith in Jesus Christ/God = lose salvation - MATT.22:21, ROMANS.13:1-9.
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Alas, a time is coming soon when the powerful governments of the world will require by law everyone to receive the "mark of the beast"(= likely to be computer chip implants), in order to be able to continue to buy or sell stuffs - REV.13:11-18 & 14:9-11. Christians have been commanded by Jesus Christ/God to refuse this mark, otherwise they will lose their salvation. The governments will be prosecuting/persecuting all those who refuse to receive the mark or computer chip implants, or leave them alone to starve to death.
....... Here, Christians can see how faith in Jesus Christ will include the faith in obeying His commandment/law to reject the "mark of the beast", in order to remain saved from hell even if they are martyred by their powerful government.

Today, if foolish or misguided Christians go and commit intentional or willful sins/law-breaking, as per GAL.5:19-21 and 1COR.6:9-11, they too may end up like those who will deny Christ by accepting the "mark of the beast", in order to save their lives from death through starvation or from being prosecuted/persecuted by their worldly government. Why.? = because Jesus Christ is also the Law/Word of God - JOHN.1:1 & 14 & 6:63. Faith in Him for salvation = faith in His Word/Law to remain saved from hell.

For Gentile Christians, God has graciously exempted them from the burdensome parts of His Law/Word - ACTS.15:19-29 - and given them time to grow from babes-in-Christ(= just born-again of the Holy Spirit of God) to adults-in-Christ by gradually feeding on the Law/Word of God = spiritual milk to spiritual solid food = the bread of life = eat His flesh and drink His blood - JOHN.6:54.
....... This reasonable given-time is not unlimited, eg after 30 or 40 years as a Gentile Christian but he/she still remains a babe-in-Christ, often walking in the flesh = committing intentional or willful sins/law-breaking.(= will likely be spat out by God/Jesus from His kingdom.?) Ideally, such a long-time Gentile Christian should already be walking fully in the Spirit = showing the inner fruit of the Spirit and easily keeping His Law outwardly by the power of the Holy Spirit of God through the Word/Law implanted by God in their hearts and minds.

HEB.6:1-8 states the Peril of Not Progressing in spiritual growth for Christians, eg those Gentile Christians who are stuck in the elementary principles of Christ of the 16th-century teaching by Martin Luther about salvation by faith in Jesus Christ alone, and not by the works of the Law or other beliefs, eg they are little aware of the end times, the coming of the lawless one and his "mark of the beast", and then the Coming of the Day of the Lord Jesus who will 'consume' the lawless one - eg 2THESS.2:1-13, 2TIM.3:1-4, etc. .......

MATT.24: (NKJV) = 42 Watch therefore, for you do not know what hour your Lord is coming. 43 But know this, that if the master of the house had known what hour the thief would come, he would have watched and not allowed his house to be broken into. 44 Therefore you also be ready, for the Son of Man is coming at an hour you do not expect.

The Faithful Servant and the Evil Servant

45 “Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his master made ruler over his household, to give them food in due season? 46 Blessed is that servant whom his master, when he comes, will find so doing. 47 Assuredly, I say to you that he will make him ruler over all his goods. 48 But if that evil servant says in his heart, ‘My master is delaying his coming,’ 49 and begins to beat his fellow servants, and to eat and drink with the drunkards, 50 the master of that servant will come on a day when he is not looking for him and at an hour that he is not aware of, 51 and will cut him in two and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites. There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
(see JOHN.21:15)
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This post has been edited by lurkingaround: Apr 11 2020, 05:27 PM

That's why it's not used that way. Jesus is God the Son incarnate on earth, eternally begotten of the Father. The Spirit eternally proceeds from both the Father and the Son.

This post has been edited by yeeck: Apr 11 2020, 03:41 PM

Coz I don't know him until you mentioned that name

Nope. I don't claim the Bible is inconsistent. Please read properly again. It is the Muslim belief that the Bible as we have it today is corrupted, yet if Muslims claim it is corrupted, why do their apologists like ZN (or firdaus wong or whoever you like) keep quoting from the Bible?

This post has been edited by yeeck: Apr 11 2020, 03:47 PM

That is not the issue. The issue is that you're nitpicking on a non issue.

There is nothing wrong in using Father God because He is God and also Father, hence Father God not Father of God. If the Holy Spirit gave us the revelation of just "Abba" then Father God does not violate who God is.

Why don't we use Son God or Spirit God then? Answer is Jesus is the begotten Son of God so we use the phrase Son of God, same with the Holy Spirit, Holy Spirit of God.

There's nothing more to this. If you want to continue to nit pick on how 2 children of God address their Heavenly Father, I'll just repeat this answer to you.





This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Apr 11 2020, 04:12 PM

This strange event is for a season


Matthew 24:37 (NIV) - As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man.


Blessed Easter Dear People of God.

Dear Friends.

I believe this strange event is unprecedented, it has caused life to be ...not normal. It may be quick, it may be long, ...we don't know.

What I know is this.

In Matthew 24:37, the reference of the days of Noah, there were people eating and drinking and there marriages, meaning there was no social distancing. The idea there is crowd. People live life as normal. The coming of Jesus Christ will be unexepected but God gave hint, it came upon a time where life is normal.

With that being said..I believe this strange event today is just a season, a phase. Let this encourage you, this strange season will not be forever.

Perhaps this season happened for a reason. Perhaps during normal life, there are some of you, too busy to have time for God. Perhaps some of you...have not been in communion with God for a long time.

I encourage that you take the time to read God's word and spend time with the Lord, knowing this season is a sign of God shaking heaven. (Hebrews 12:24-29). The shaking of heaven refers not to Heaven where God dwells but the place of spiritual forces, where principalities and the powers of darkness dwell.

If you have been playing, wasting time, I urge you to stop that and start taking God seriously. You'll never know the day of the Lord could be anytime.

I hope you'll ponder on this seriously.

God Bless

This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Apr 12 2020, 10:55 AM

Blessed Easter

LEV.17: (NKJV) = 10 ‘And whatever man of the house of Israel, or of the strangers who dwell among you, who eats any blood, I will set My face against that person who eats blood, and will cut him off from among his people.

11 For the life of the flesh is in the blood, and I have given it to you upon the altar to make atonement for your souls; for it is the blood that makes atonement for the soul.’

12 Therefore I said to the children of Israel, ‘No one among you shall eat blood, nor shall any stranger who dwells among you eat blood.’
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Today, Easter Sunday, commemorates the day the Lord/God Jesus Christ rose from the dead in victory over Satan after shedding His blood on Good Friday, to save the world from hell, which day has been commanded by Him to be remembered regularly by Christians through the Holy Communion of partaking the bread and wine.(= symbolically eating His flesh and drinking His blood).
....... "drinking His blood" to atone for their inherited(= unintentional) Adam's Original Sin - ROMANS.5:12 - is the only way for the life of Christ, the Word/Law(= by eating His flesh), to live in Christians by the power of the Holy Spirit of God = they bear the inner good fruit of the Spirit and easily keep the Law outwardly - cf; MATT.7:15-23. .......

GAL.2: = 20 I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me. 21 I do not set aside the grace of God; for if righteousness comes through the law, then Christ died in vain.”
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PS - It is likely against the Law of God for Christians to accept blood transfusion or organ transplant = eat blood.? Those who do, will suffer weird "foreign" emotions, habits, tendencies, etc, ie as if the life of the blood/organ donor has invaded their souls, for good or for evil/bad.
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This post has been edited by lurkingaround: Apr 12 2020, 02:28 PM

That PS .... er ..... no ... we have to remember this principle ... the OT is a type, a figure of Christ and its spiritual realities. We must interprete it typologically.

In chapter sixteen we have a type, a shadow, of God’s redemption, which, at the time this book was written, was still to come. According to God’s concept and in His divine economy, there is the need of redemption.

Because the Old Testament time was not the time for redemption to take place, a type, shadow, of the coming redemption was needed. This shadow is the propitiation in Leviticus 16. In this propitiation four of the five basic offerings presented in chapters one through seven are involved: the burnt offering, the meal offering, the sin offering, and the trespass offering. The one offering not involved yet is the peace offering. Later, particularly in chapter nineteen, we shall see that the propitiated people enjoyed the peace offering. Therefore, in chapter sixteen, the propitiation is fully applied, but the result of the four offerings-the peace offering-is not yet applied.

At the end of chapter sixteen, everything is wonderful. In type, this chapter signifies that we have been propitiated and that we may now enjoy Christ as the burnt offering and live on Him as the meal offering. Furthermore, we have come out of the camp to follow Him, the suffering One, bearing His reproach. What else do we need? It seems that we are not in need of anything. Using New Testament terms, we have been redeemed and, to some extent, replaced. We are living Christ as the life that is absolute for God (burnt offering), we are enjoying Him as our daily life supply (meal offereing), and we are following Him outside the camp, bearing His reproach and living a godly life. With us, everything is fine, but the situation around us is still very complicated. For this reason, there is the need of chapter seventeen.

Leviticus 17 is a reminder and a warning regarding the abuse of the sacrifices. To abuse the sacrifices is to apply them wrongly, improperly.

To take care of the blood is to take care of and to treasure the blood of Christ.

Verse 11 signifies that the blood of the Lord Jesus was shed on the cross for our redemption.
Verse 12-13 is showing us different bloods typify different beliefs. Every kind of blood signifies a belief. And we should reject other bloods (beliefs) other than the Lord Jesus.

For example: in v15
a) blood of that which dies of itself signifies the blood of one who sacrifices himself for the good of others, which blood cannot redeem us from our sins.
b) blood of that which is torn by beasts signifies the blood of one who is martyred by wild people, who are like beasts, which blood also is unable to redeem us from our sins.

You will realized almost every religion is based on either on one who sacrificed himself for the good of others, or on one who was martyred. To form a religion on such a basis is to receive a different blood.

Yet, the primary problem remains: our inward sin nature and nothing can redeem it except the Lord's blood.

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ACTS.15: = 28 For it seemed good to the Holy Spirit, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things: 29 that you abstain from things offered to idols, from blood, from things strangled, and from sexual immorality. If you keep yourselves from these, you will do well.
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Wah brother, the irony of Acts 15 where James gave this word. Hah .... I wish I could go on .... but not all subscribed or have the same understanding as I have toward James. But that is ok ... .... sometimes, brother, I also felt lazy to clarify my position on this. LOL

I can only say, James is a person must is a mixture of God's New Testament economy with the Old.

He was not strong in the revelation of God’s New Testament economy in Christ, but was still under the influence of the background of the old Judaic religion—to worship God with ceremonies and live a life in the fear of God. This is proved by Acts 21:20-24 and James 2:2-11.

In verse 21 James gives the reason for his judgment concerning the matter: "For Moses from ancient generations has in every city those who proclaim him in the synagogues, being read every Sabbath." Here we have the basis for James’ fellowship. He tells us that in solving the problem caused by the heretical Judaizers we need to take care of the fact that the law of Moses is read in the synagogues every Sabbath. This is the reason James gives for charging the Gentiles to abstain from pollutions of idols, fornication, anything strangled, and blood.

Unfortunately, this solution could not have been satisfactory to Paul, who says in Galatians 2:19, “I through law have died to law that I might live to God.” In contrast to such a word, James’ fellowship causes the New Testament believers to return to considering the law. This indicates that the concluding word given by James was still under the influence of the Mosaic law, due to his heavy Judaic background. As we shall see, the influence of this background still remained even at the time Paul paid his last visit to Jerusalem (Acts 21:20-26).

At the end, whether one abstain from blood (which is biblical and consistent) or not, it is really irrevelant ... rather one lived to God and have the reality of God.

We tend to fall into this trap: that there are two different kinds of people: one kind does evil, and the other kind does good. According to good and evil, these two kinds of people are absolutely different. Yet in the matter of putting God aside and not giving God any place, they are absolutely the same. Just as those who do evil put God aside, so those who do good also put God aside. Just as those who do evil do not give God any room, so those who do good also do not give God any room. These two kinds of people behave differently-one does good and the other does evil; nevertheless, they have exactly the same kind of attitude toward God. Those who do evil give up the law, thereby rejecting God, and those who do good keep the law, thereby also rejecting God. The former forsake God by violating the law, while the latter forsake God by observing the law. Both groups of people have problems because of the law. The first group of people give up God because they have broken the law, whereas the second group forsake God because they consider that they have kept the law. Hence, we can see that both these conditions of rejecting God are related to the law.

Rather, God desire that man be filled with the God as his or her reality. Then the living out of this inward spiritual reality is "counted" in the eyes of God be in may in his or her action in abstaining from blood or not. For one could abstain yet inwardly be void of the reality of touching or gaining God. Then it is vanity!.