All the 5 oils above are properly certified/claimed Heavy Duty Engine Oil HDEO diesel (CI4,CJ4, CK4, ACEA E7 ,E9 ) with various truck OEMs' approvals whose detergency/dispersancy properties requirements are very much higher that of a properly certified/claimed ACEA A3B4 PCMO meant for Light Duty Truck.


May I know what is the Euro spec of current 'normal' diesel fuel here other than the Euro 5 diesel on offer?
Euro 4 of 50 ppm sulphur ??

I used to hear horror stories of later model diesel truck engines having very pricy fuel injectors being damaged by Euro 2 (?) diesel fuels then.

Not sure if current diesel engines and its injectors are totally fine with current 'normal' Euro 3-4 diesel fuel.

Is it a waste of money for current later model trucks using Euro 5 diesel, which is supposed to be friendly providing good cleaning to fuel injectors ? Or it makes no difference, in practice ?


At 5000 km oil change interval, any of the above mentioned mineral HDEO 15W40s would be good for 10,000-15,000 km usage no sweat. If I were you, I would ignore any semi-syn or full-syn HDEO for any oil change interval below that of 10,000 km.


Speaking of Fuel Economy, I think you should seriously consider this Caltex Delo 400 MGX 15W-40 API CJ-4 (Mineral) whose UOA from @e-lite above displays tonnes of friction-reducing additives like Moly and Boron.
Not sure whether the other semi-syn or full-syn HDEOs would contain Moly and Boron too.


At 5000-10000 km oil change interval, I would give them a miss as it is not value for money.


I would agree with your position and Bitog's (where I used similar username) that your Hilux Revo diesel engine is good with the ACEA B spec'ed PCMO oils.

Your continuous usage of the current Helix Protect 0W30 A3B4 at much higher mileage of say, 8000-12000 km would be interesting suggesting a B oil is fine.....

However, at this preliminary stage of full-syn Helix Protect blotter, I'm unimpressed really with its blotter 'performance' thus far vis-a-vis that of a properly spec'ed HDEO CI4,CJ4 (E7,E9) mineral oils.

The used oil at 4810 km looks good on the dipstick.

Question: Are the diesel soot particles and combustion contaminants having agglomerated into larger/heavier size lumps , and getting stucked/sticked onto internal engine components and its surfaces while NOT being adequately cleaned off by detergents with a view of aggressively dispersing the suspended soot/contaminants around the body of lubricants?
Hence, the dipstick used oils looks 'clean'?

This post has been edited by zeng: Apr 30 2021, 01:01 PM

https://www.theedgemarkets.com/article/euro...uro-2m-tomorrow

No need to debate on Euro 2 or Euro 5 diesel anymore. All diesel at all pumps are now Euro 5 already. Now difference is whether there is 7% of palm oil, 10% of palm oil or even 20% of palm oil in the near future.

This post has been edited by e-lite: Apr 30 2021, 04:34 PM

If you want to open another can of worms, you can consider doing egr block/delete to reduce soot. But that is another debate on its own and I won't do it on my own car because it ruins fuel economy. If it is an off-road car + soot particles problem in my oil + outside of warranty + ecu retuned properly for partial throttle applications, then I may consider doing it.

But I have seen diesel cars done the simple egr block with just a metal plate and their engine oil goes from black to completely clean.

This post has been edited by e-lite: Apr 30 2021, 04:47 PM

Thanks for the latest update, always have been thinking we had moved away from Euro 2M some time ago to 3-4 .....

Euro 2 was bad for (Mitsu Storm) commonrail injectors.

Thanks bro zeng for detailed suggestions. I'm kinda on the fence right now, whether to use back HDEO at 5k km or continue to extend current oil & observe it's performance. I've done some research on other 4wd model oil recomendations, ACEA B3&B4 or C3 for Mitubishi Triton, Ford Ranger, & Chevrolet Colorado, API CI-4 for previous Isuzu D-Max, no idea on the new 1.9 model.

Starting with the end in mind, I strongly recommend HDEO E9/E7, CI4/CJ4 for all Light Duty Diesel trucks like Hilux, Triton, Ford Ranger, Chevrolet or Isuzu etc either in mineral (for 5000-10000 km), semisyn (for 8000-12000 km) of fullsyn HDEO (for 10000-15000 km or more depending on your comfort zone).

ACEA B3, B4 or C3 would be fine with the Light Duty Diesel trucks though it's efficacies is imho no match against an E9/E7 HDEOs .

Having said this, as a social service for lowyat forum, I would urge you to continue with your A3B4 Helix Protect 0W30 beyond 5000 km up to say 6000-8000 km whichever you are comfortable with, evaluate its blotter spot performance against future blotter spots of HDEO's with E9/E7 CI4/CJ4 ......
eventually make up your own mind or judgement as to the path you wish to walk down the road, equipped with appropriate comparisons, just my humble suggestion.

Note:Your Helix Protect 0W30 should be good upto 8000-10000 km . Any sticking/stuck of soot contaminants in the proposed extended oil change interval may be cleaned off or removed by subsequent usage of high detergent E9/E7 HDEO at whatever oil change interval you are comfortable with later on.
Hence, you are not quite killing a 2 yo diesel engine imo.

This post has been edited by zeng: Apr 30 2021, 10:12 PM

Your Hilux Revo specs very basic diesel oils like API CF4 and ACEA Bx and they should be fine .

However, my preliminary hunch is this 4810 km blotter spot of Helix Protect 0W30 B4 appears weakly imho, not that all other B4's would fare equally 'weak'.

I had seen an ACEA C3 blotter spot with 10,000 km usage in a Toyota diesel perform far far superior than this Helix Protect 0W30 at a lowly 4810 km ......
hence my caution of very very close monitoring of its blotter spot tests.

You may not need it, but a properly spec'ed HDEO , be it mineral or semi/fully synthetics, of CI4/CJ4 or ACEA E9/E7 has properties far superior than this Helix Protect imho, I have no quantitative facts and numbers to back up my position though.

As regards 'extended interval' which I highlighted above earlier on and I wish to repeat, a CI4/CJ4/E9/E7 HDEOs' in mineral is good for 5000-10000 km oci, semisyn for 8000-12000 km (or more) and fully syn (such as this Total diesel 5W30) would probably good for 15000 km upwards, if you are comfortable.

This post has been edited by zeng: May 1 2021, 11:01 PM

I'm inclined to agree with your suggestion that the Helix Protect 0W30 A3B4 may not be doing its job in terms of detergency and dispersancy properties.

'Seeing particles' in the HDEO CI4 by Gin87 may mean the 'dirty' mechanical conditions of the 2019 Hilux Revo diesel engine, however I would like to assume this 2 year old Hilux engine is not 'dirty' per se but in very clean condition , what more its previous oil change intervals of 5000 km is too short and 'premature' imho.

Hence, I would speculate 'particles' as seen or felt by Gin87 inside the CI4 HDEO used oil sample is a strong indication of the excellent and top form detergency and dispersancy properties of HDEO CI4 vis-a-vis this Hilux Protect 0W30 A3B4.

Thank you for sharing a 10,000 km UOA of a HDEO in Chevron Delo Sports 10W30 in a Ford Ranger 2.2L diesel.
This UOA performance is fantastic but, its top up volume of 7.6L may have distorted the complete picture, no?

Btw, I wish you don't mind me sharing this Delo 10W30 CI4 UOA in Post #1 of this thread?

This post has been edited by zeng: May 2 2021, 11:49 AM

The picture doesn't belong to me though. You can use at your own discretion.

Most diesel pickup trucks have about 7-8L oil change capacity. The 7.6L figure should be oil change capacity.

Thank you very much.

Yeah, It doesn't quite make sense for a 10,000 km usage requires a top-up volume of upto 7.6L . Furthermore this WXM xxxx Ranger should be quite a new car at 201x(??) and the ppm for wear metal is reasonable without fresh top-up in general.

Looking at the low'ish wear metal ppm at 10,000 km travel, imho one could easily go further say, up to 20,000 km without breaching the laboratory wear limit, never mind this Chevron Delo Diesel 10W30 CI4 is a semi-synthetic oil.

This post has been edited by zeng: May 3 2021, 12:46 PM

A typical engine flush like the said Liqui Moly Pro-Line Engine Flush prior to an oil change would have helped cleaning out or dislodging carbon dirt contaminants previously stucked on the engine component surface, hence this is supposed to 'lessen' the workload of the detergency part (not dispersancy part) of the new replacement oil in this Helix Protect.

With 'increased' amount of loosened carbon dirt particles within the new replacement oil, the new Helix Protect should have been able to dispersed the carbon dirt contaminant, which I think it did.

However it seems to me from the 4810 km blotter spot test performance of this Helix Protect, whereby the centre zone AND aureole zone/perimeter ring are generally darkened but the diffusion zone remains very light and transparent leading me to speculate that the Dispersancy part of this Helix Protect may be struggling very hard to dispersed off or spread out the 'added' load of carbon contaminants further 'outwards' towards external zones like Diffusion zone.

This post has been edited by zeng: May 3 2021, 01:24 PM

After searching around, I've found these 2 oil in my local workshop that sells 'high end' brands like Motul, Morris, & Liqui Moly. Penrite HPR Diesel 5 5W-40 & HPR Diesel 10 10W-40, both semi synthetic & satifies both ACEA A3/B4 & API CI-4. A little bit thicker in viscosity but I think it's a good candidate for next oil change.


https://www.penriteoil.com.au/assets/pis_pd...emi%20Syn.).pdf


https://www.penriteoil.com.au/assets/pis_pd...emi%20Syn.).pdf

For me in East Malaysia still no Euro 5 B10, pumps are continuing with Euro 2M B10 😬 alongside newly introduced B7 Euro 5.

Both the Penrite diesel oils does not claim OEM approvals but merely claim 'Product Performance Levels' which in a way are two differrent things altogether.

Penrite HPR Diesel 5 5W-40


Penrite HPR Diesel 10 10W-40


Moreover, an API CI-4 oil pairs with ACEA E7 compliance, not ACEA A3B4 typically.

Assuming both of these two oils are appropriately self-certified with API CI-4 and ACEA E7 specification, they are of the high Zinc high Phosphorous formulations which can be bad for an oil consuming engine with 3 way catalytic converters and/or DPF.

However, it may be and should be fine with your new Hilux engine IF there isn't any engine oil consumption issues and its detergency/dispersancy additive package should be stronger than that of the Helix Protect 0W30 imho, a blotter spot test may be able to 'tell'.

This post has been edited by zeng: May 5 2021, 11:12 AM

Hi Gin87,

Attached below a 10,000 km blotter spot test of a Liqui Moly Top Tec 4100 5W40 ACEA C3 oil in a Russian Toyota Avensis 2.2L Diesel engine for comparison, i.e presence and absence of darkened Aureole zone/ perimeter ring between samples, not that they are conclusive though.




This post has been edited by zeng: May 19 2021, 01:55 PM

Hi Zeng, im not sure if i do this right but here you go

Campro IAFM 6 years old age. Mileage now at 134k km.

Sample taken after 40 minutes engine running, after 5 months after the last service at 130k km

Petronas Syntium 3000 5W30 Fully Synthetic. If possible want to drag the next servoce to 9 months. Thanks in advance bro.



This post has been edited by clockpulses: Jun 6 2021, 12:17 PM

Hi bro,

You did right with sample taken after 40 minutes engine running, exceeding my rule of thumb of minimum 20 minutes of engine operation.

With hot oil sample being taken, it would point to strictly fuel dilution phenomenon should the upcoming 48 or 72 hour blotter spot test develops translucent halo at the outermost zone ....
ruling out effects of cold blotter sampling method.

Please keep viewing/observing the 'ever changing' blotter sample images (for self education) until say, 48 or 72 hours post sampling till such time it sort of 'matures' and then upload the mature 48/72 hour blotter spot test image for more meaningful comparative assessments/interpretations vis-a-vis all the other 48/72 hour blotter spot tests in this thread.

Btw, you have here a rather high quality/spec engine oil in this local Petronas Syntium 3000 5W30 SN+.
It is a mid-SaPS engine oil of 0.8% weight Sulphated Ash (Hence I expect its superb performance, never mind the fact this Syntium is not ACEA spec'ed).
Don't worry about its seemingly low'ish TBN of 8.0 , my dear friend.


This post has been edited by zeng: Jun 4 2021, 08:34 PM

Between the Shell HX8 X 5W-30 vs the Petronas Syntium 3000 5W-30, which one is actually better?

I have bought these 2 engine oil before.. The Shell was used in a Myvi. Noted it's clear colour engine oil which looks really clean and pure.

Syntium on the other hand was used in a Honda. Looks like your regular gold dyed engine oil,

Hmmm.... thousand apologies ...
Syntium 3000 5W30 SN+ is NOT 'better' than Shell Helix HX8 X 5W30 imho.

Shell Helix HX8 X 5W30 SN+ has 'extras' in meeting additional specification requirements in ACEA A3B4 and other European OEM approvals which Syntium 3000 5W30 SN+ does NOT have, never mind Syntium is a mid-SaPS engine oil.

I should have been more precise in previously suggesting mid-SaPS Syntium 3000 5W30 SN+ as being of 'rather high quality/spec' strictly in the context of relative comparison among similarly spec'ed SN+ class of engine oils.

However, it is interesting to note that both of these two engine oils seem to possess a certain level of D1G2 Dexos1 Gen2 protection against LSPI (Low Speed Pre-ignition) phenomenon, though without appropriate GM D1G2 approvals.



This post has been edited by zeng: Jun 5 2021, 01:06 PM

Hi Zeng, below is the 48 hours blotter. The odo now is 133k not 134k as i previously mentioned. And its been 5 months and 1 week simce my last service at 130k km. Curious to know if i can still use it until 140k km or at least can drag to 9 or 12 months. Im not sure what is the black dots on the oil spot but this paper is not a new paper, it is a used paper and already printed



With a bit light at background


This post has been edited by clockpulses: Jun 6 2021, 12:15 PM