Maybe out of topic but would like to ask if anyone has the same experience could advise before I engage contractor...

My alpha s18e I think, is suddenly off after shower a while and then on back, it seems like it rebooted itself (like handphone I guess). What could be the problem?? But, it is not every time shower also it will reboot itself, sometimes only ...temperature set to middle or 60% ...

How old is the unit already? Does it happen at all when low heat?

3 yrs, not all the time. Low heat didn’t try, but suspect not la...

Hi guys, wanted to ask, is this wiring OK if i want to install instant water heater?
This wiring was installed by previous tenant but never install the water heater
I called contractor come to check & he said this point is shared between a plug point+aircond+water heater point..
So he suggest to make a new 1 dedicated to water heater direct from DB.. cost RM450..
Is it advisable to do so or this existing point is ok already? Sked kena cut by contractor

Follow the contractor advise.

This point look dangerous and no earth wire.

It is better to direct the wire into the heater instead a wall socket. With a switch outside the bathroom.

Not OK.

No earth wire like ozak said. So any good WH will not operate because if there is a short or leakage, the current cannot flow to earth but it just goes through the path of least resistance (the poor guy or gal taking bath).

Then the aftermath will come out in the newspapers https://www.nst.com.my/news/nation/2020/08/...e-electrocution

----

So to prevent that from happening, a full 3 wire dedicated LNE from DB box is the right solution. And a 10mA RCD or RCBO must be fitted in. Its not that expensive for a decent one from Schneider - https://www.lazada.com.my/products/easy9-rc...APtevD&search=1 - about RM128 or so. ABB and Hager are good too but costs more.

Cable used should be mega kabel or caramay cable - min 2.5mm for all three. There are a lot of fake cable selling for half the price but they present a fire risk as one water heater is easily two and a half aircond units' consumption. Aircon 1hp only use 6A.. water heater anywhere from 14A-16A depends on wattage so one cannot skimp on good cables.

That 15A round pin plug socket is also running very close to redline for a 3300W heater and should NOT be used for a 3600W heater.

This is typical load amps for a 3300W heater:


Result of undersized cable + joinery that should NOT be there (ie. run a full direct cable from DB into WH with zero joinery in between):






This post has been edited by ceo684: Sep 21 2020, 02:05 PM

Thank you for the detailed & insightful advice, I really appreciate it.
Looks like Water Heater really do have very specific requirement as it is an electrical equipment which runs in a room exposed with water everywhere..
New wiring coming up, hopefully everything is fine..the contractor said he’s gonna use 4mm wires

This post has been edited by kapalterbang_737: Sep 22 2020, 04:15 PM

For anyone looking at this post. Main problem is not because of grounding, but because wrong/sub-quality electric wires are used. Water heater is rated ~3kW so, think of it like an 4hp AIRCON. Use at least 2.5mm solid core wire cables from a good brand. Unknown brand x2. Sadly most electricians do not use them, but use thinner/cheaper cables.

Yeah a lot cut corner because 4mm price is roughly 40pc more than 2.5mm (136 vs 90 per 1 roll 100m) but WH circuit is not the place to cut corners.

Get Joven, nuff said.

Referencing from SIRIM & Suruhanjaya Tenaga's guidelines, make sure that your water heater installer:
- DO NOT USE under-spec cables | usage of cables thinner than 2.5mm diameter is strictly prohibited & might burn / catch fire (Suruhanjaya Tenaga's stated guideline is 4mm diameter), and
- DO NOT USE plug + socket to connect your water heater to the power source | they are not water proof and increase your risk of getting electrocution.

I suggest u to get CENTON SplashProof Water Heater Connector (available via Shopee / Lazada), it's water proof, meant for instant water heater, and comes with a 1 meter 4mm diameter cable (what's more its from Fajar cable, damn good cable brand in Malaysia). It is designed to replaced these houses with plug + socket, so it will fit perfectly with your junction box.

There are also few other brands in the market, some comes without cable as well (cheaper but might as well get the one with proper cable). Just make sure it is SIRIM approved, such as CENTON and STEC.

This post has been edited by Selene Yeo: Aug 21 2023, 09:47 PM

I extracted this from Suruhanjaya Tenaga's guidebook. Hope this helps u all.



1.5mm diameter is definitely a no (those are meant for maybe lightings), while most older houses in Malaysia are still using 2.5mm diameter (if I am not mistaken for 4kW instant water heater and below long time ago Suruhanjaya Tenaga mentioned 2.5mm diameter is sufficient enough, but then upgraded their recommendation to 4.0mm diameter just to be extra safe).




Here is also the CENTON SplashProof Connector for Instant Water Heater I am talking about, extracted from CENTON's FB page. Also comes with a 1 meter 4mm diameter Fajar cable. I highly recommend this, especially for those who is still using 3-pin plugs in their bathrooms and risking their lives

Got this info from hearsaid , latest recommendation from authority is power cable from Storage Water Heater not allow to plug into wall plug ( power socket ),

the cable need to be laid directly from the respective DB to the Heater to avoid short circuit or burn.

I might be wrong..

- When heating element short circuit due to insufficient water in the tank while power is ON, it is referred to ' Dry burnt '
- to avoid this, some of the brands they installed dry burnt protector, or dry burnt fuse to protect the
heating element when there is insufficient water in the tank. ( temperature sensitive )
- normal storage water heater dont come with circuit board, only electronic components.

Help my friend to install Joven with Pump, forgot the model ;(

Not bad with the rain shower..

Nowadays storage WH also 3000W i.e. 13.043A which exceed a 13A socket and is running close to the limit on 15A plug. The plug/socket is not a good idea as loose connections cause fires. Hence that is one of the basis why ST regulation says to use direct DB connection to the water heater instead as this is a high load appliance.

If I would like to install storage water heater, what are the items that I should check with the installer to make sure he is using the safest materials?

Basically it's outlined here - https://www.st.gov.my/en/contents/publicati...r%20Systems.pdf

The mandatory item:
1. A 10mA RCD [dedicated for WH circuit only] must be installed.
1.1 Failure to install 10mA RCD and fault condition occur = results in ending up on the news https://www.malaymail.com/news/malaysia/202...c-shock/1896447

2. Pull direct 4mm LNE cable from DB box to WH
2.1 Use good cable with mfg name, spec (4.0mmsq) and with MS2112-3 SIRIM certified printed on it.
Many elcheapo cable either no name, undersized, or for car use (low voltage PVC Auto).
Good cable come from Mega Kabel, Caramay, or any of the cartel here http://www.mcma.org.my/member.htm will be OK.

3. Insulation of the hot copper pipes is recommended for heating efficiency (not mandatory).
Superlon foam tube very cheap 2m only RM2 or so only.
Superlon can stand up to 85-105C. More than enough for WH hot pipe. See https://www.superlon.com.my/wp-content/uplo...alogue-2019.pdf

4. For the water piping connection at the WH can use a short flexihose (Hokah recommended) to connect them to permanent piping so easier to remove the unit if there is a need to service it or replace it next time (as compared to hardcoded permanent installation).
4.1 Can also install a service valve so you can off the water inlet (input) to WH in case it leak or other malfunction.

This post has been edited by ceo684: Mar 31 2021, 12:55 AM

thank you very much for sharing

Also make sure that the storage water heater is being installed with:
a. 2 Isolation Barriers (at water inlet and outlet) - to prevent electrocution
b. Pressure Relief Valve (at water inlet) - to prevent storage tank from being over-pressured (which might cause it to rupture / leak), and to facilitate water drainage during servicing

If I am not mistaken, this will be a compulsory requirement set by SIRIM and Suruhanjaya Tenaga for all SIRIM-approved brands to be pre-installed with these 2 items soon.

By far, storage water heaters market leaders like CENTON and JOVEN already followed this ruling. But just double check during your installation and make sure these 2 items are being fitted, just in case the brand u have bought doesn't have them.