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> MOE: Portuguese invading Melaka were Crusaders

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ALeUNe
post Jul 9 2015, 01:36 PM

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QUOTE(hippihippo @ Jul 9 2015, 01:34 PM)
Portuguese invading were Crusade, then these invasions were?

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desmond2020
post Jul 9 2015, 01:36 PM

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QUOTE(hippihippo @ Jul 9 2015, 01:34 PM)
Portuguese invading were Crusade, then these invasions were?

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Expansion of true light
Seager
post Jul 9 2015, 01:36 PM

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QUOTE(bananajoe @ Jul 9 2015, 01:24 PM)
yea, same goes to british by this logic. heck
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I remember during SPM my teacher said you tulis apa2 you nak, as long as its logic and during the time period.

Niamah F4 F5 I always fail history cause never study, but SPM got A1 because i wrote nicely, with proprt structure and a whole lot of plausible BS.
crapp0
post Jul 9 2015, 01:37 PM

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QUOTE(SweetPuff @ Jul 9 2015, 01:27 PM)
Why not blame LGE instead?
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Blame the baba and nyonya lol.
hotjake
post Jul 9 2015, 01:38 PM

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QUOTE(Einjahr @ Jul 9 2015, 01:34 PM)
Nope,Nothing mentioned there about Crusades.
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and the reference from that wiki itself quoted:
Mohd Fawzi bin Mohd Basri; Mohd Fo'ad bin Sakdan; Azami bin Man (2002). Kurikulum Bersepadu Sekolah Menengah Sejarah Tingkatan 1. Kuala Lumpur: Dewan Bahasa dan Pustaka. p. 95. ISBN 983-62-7410-3. biggrin.gif

This post has been edited by hotjake: Jul 9 2015, 01:38 PM
desmond2020
post Jul 9 2015, 01:38 PM

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QUOTE(crapp0 @ Jul 9 2015, 01:37 PM)
Blame the baba and nyonya lol.
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Didn't LGE and LKS was born in malacca?
TSohman
post Jul 9 2015, 01:38 PM

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QUOTE(ray123 @ Jul 9 2015, 01:22 PM)
They can't see the future, can't control the present and thus they are trying to reshape the past.
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Eh ini macam dari saya
ALeUNe
post Jul 9 2015, 01:38 PM

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QUOTE(aliesterfiend @ Jul 9 2015, 01:29 PM)
Crusades does not only involve the levant. The Teutonic crusades was directed at pagan Baltic states, while the Albigensian Crusade was conducted in France.

After the fall of the Ayyubid Egypt and the rise of the Mameluks which manage to defeat all existing Christian kingdoms in the Levant there's no more crusades sent to the Holy Land.

Melaka was part of the crusades against the Ottman Empire.
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aliesterfiend
post Jul 9 2015, 01:39 PM

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QUOTE(hippihippo @ Jul 9 2015, 01:34 PM)
Portuguese invading were Crusade, then these invasions were?

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From Medinah to the west started from Arab-Byzantine (Roman) wars.

From Medinah to the east started from Arab-Sassanid (Persian) wars.
desmond2020
post Jul 9 2015, 01:39 PM

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QUOTE(hotjake @ Jul 9 2015, 01:38 PM)
and the reference from that wiki itself quoted:
Mohd Fawzi bin Mohd Basri; Mohd Fo'ad bin Sakdan; Azami bin Man (2002). Kurikulum Bersepadu Sekolah Menengah Sejarah Tingkatan 1. Kuala Lumpur: Dewan Bahasa dan Pustaka. p. 95. ISBN 983-62-7410-3. biggrin.gif
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They are respected history scholar

What they write must be the truth
TreyLey
post Jul 9 2015, 01:40 PM

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It is undeniably motivated by the spirit of spreading Christianity and civilization to the east ( Which the King of Portugal told their Generals and Armies to boost their morale for incoming expedition )

But the main reason behind it was purely business and treasure which is to dominate the spice trade in the East. Everything was business,as if u never know.
aliesterfiend
post Jul 9 2015, 01:41 PM

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QUOTE(ALeUNe @ Jul 9 2015, 01:38 PM)
Don't make things complicated.
It ain't helping.

I no understand what cock you sing.
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You say Melaka is no Holy Land - true

You imply that crusades only involve holy land - false

I show you exmaples that crusades does not only involves wars in the Levant (another name of Holy Land).


oucheev
post Jul 9 2015, 01:42 PM

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To be fair, one of the reason why the Portuguese came is to spread Christianity but it's not part of Crusades which have ended. However, the main reason is still good old $$$. Spice is fetching high price in Europe and they don't want to depend on Arabs anymore. They are also looking for ways to trade with China. The statement to say their main purpose is to destroy Islamic government is totally wrong.
crapp0
post Jul 9 2015, 01:42 PM

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QUOTE(desmond2020 @ Jul 9 2015, 01:38 PM)
Didn't LGE and LKS was born in malacca?
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I have no idea, so they not penang ppl to begin with?

At least it makes sense since malacca have quite a number of great ppl.
ALeUNe
post Jul 9 2015, 01:43 PM

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QUOTE(aliesterfiend @ Jul 9 2015, 01:41 PM)
You say Melaka is no Holy Land - true

You imply that crusades only involve holy land - false

I show you exmaples that crusades does not only involves wars in the Levant (another name of Holy Land).
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Go check what is crusade and make it in one line.

Who ruled Levant before Crusaders came?
azrinrar
post Jul 9 2015, 01:44 PM

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QUOTE(hotjake @ Jul 9 2015, 01:38 PM)
and the reference from that wiki itself quoted:
Mohd Fawzi bin Mohd Basri; Mohd Fo'ad bin Sakdan; Azami bin Man (2002). Kurikulum Bersepadu Sekolah Menengah Sejarah Tingkatan 1. Kuala Lumpur: Dewan Bahasa dan Pustaka. p. 95. ISBN 983-62-7410-3. biggrin.gif
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QUOTE(desmond2020 @ Jul 9 2015, 01:39 PM)
They are respected history scholar

What they write must be the truth
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What are you talking about? The last sentence, "While Pires was imprisoned by the Chinese, he wrote that his cause was that of the Catholic religion's Crusade against Islam and it was worth dying at the hands of the Chinese for his cause" was quoted from Nigel Cliff (2011). Holy War: How Vasco da Gama's Epic Voyages Turned the Tide in a Centuries-Old Clash of Civilizations. HarperCollins. p. 368. ISBN 0062097105. Retrieved 18 July 2012.)
hotjake
post Jul 9 2015, 01:45 PM

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Gold, Gospel & Glory in essence are the same = for Money
Gospel & Glory were the means to an end = Money
Spreading Gospel keeps people obedient, pay tax = Money

what more u guys don't understand? laugh.gif
ray123
post Jul 9 2015, 01:48 PM

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QUOTE(ohman @ Jul 9 2015, 01:38 PM)
Eh ini macam dari saya
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Nice, I knew it was from /k but I don't remember which tered or who posted it.
nakal_mode
post Jul 9 2015, 01:48 PM

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QUOTE(azrinrar @ Jul 9 2015, 01:32 PM)
Chinese retaliation against Portugal

The Malay Malacca Sultanate was a tributary state and ally to Ming Dynasty China. When Portugal conquered Malacca in 1511, the Chinese responded with violence against the Portuguese when Portugal sent the diplomatic ambassador, Tomé Pires in 1516. After Pires reached Beijing in 1520 the Chinese decided to arrest the embassy. The deposed Malaccan Sultan Mahmud Shah sent another message to China, and this time, China responded by executing the Portuguese diplomatic embassy.

The Chinese Imperial Government imprisoned and executed multiple Portuguese diplomatic envoys after torturing them in Guangzhou. The Malaccan envoys had informed the Chinese of the Portuguese seizure of Malacca, to which the Chinese responded with hostility toward the Portuguese. The Malaccans told the Chinese of the deception the Portuguese used, disguising plans for conquering territory as mere trading activities, and told of all the deprivations they had passed at the hands of the Portuguese.

Due to the Malaccan Sultan lodging a complaint against the Portuguese invasion to the Chinese Emperor, the Portuguese were greeted with hostility from the Chinese when they arrived in China. The Malaccan Sultan, based in Bintan after fleeing Malacca, sent a message to the Chinese, which combined with Portuguese banditry and violent activity in China, led the Chinese authorities to execute 23 Portuguese and torture the rest of them in jails. After the Portuguese set up posts for trading in China and committed piratical activities and raids in China, the Chinese responded with the complete extermination of the Portuguese in Ningbo and Quanzhou. Pires, a Portuguese trade envoy, was among those who died in the Chinese dungeons. While Pires was imprisoned by the Chinese, he wrote that his cause was that of the Catholic religion's Crusade against Islam and it was worth dying at the hands of the Chinese for his cause.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capture_of_Ma...gainst_Portugal

Puas hati tak /k/ ?
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unknown warrior
post Jul 9 2015, 01:49 PM

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Partly true.

You don't have portuguese friend like I have.

I have one and he's a pastor too.

The portuguese came here on a conquest to expand their dominion but it also happened that they were already Christian and so thus together they did evangelize the gospel.

However the primary reason has always been about expansion of their kingdom.

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