rac3r,

So what is your wise idea to detect whether a person is infected with HIV or not since you are rejecting the current method of HIV testing? - THERE IS NONE, DO YOU GET IT ? IF YOU SERIOUSLY READ THE SCIENTIFIC QUOTATION FROM THOSE WEBSITES, YOU WILL KNOW TO GO FOR THE TEST WILL DO MORE HARM THAN GOOD, until the HIV virus is really being isolated, then only there can be a true gold standard. That is why on the test kit, it is written, "at the moment this test kit is not used to diagnosed HIV", if im not mistaken Abbot Laboratories...why there is such statement, because companies dont want to get into trouble and they know something already, therefore they need to protect themselves first. You are responsible for your own lives.

you are very ignorant, im sorry to say that(but again it's not your fault). Yes, but what is the evidence that being HIV + has correlation with you body's health ? YOU are assuming. When a person is positive, believe me, the 1st thing to go wrong is the emotional part...you will be stress, you will worry, and have sleepless nights ( for something that is invisible and yet to proven ), do you know that IMPROPER SLEEP will make your immune system to go down ? This has been experimented and proven. As much as understanding your good intention to ensure you are in good health, HIV Testing is DEFINATELY not one of those things that will ensure you are in good health.

Im very sorry, but Malaysians are really lazy to do reading, and prefer to ask questions when the answer to their questions are all in the websites I provided.

This post has been edited by david_lynn: Jun 23 2009, 09:42 AM

Hi david_lynn,

So sorry yeah, for being a Malaysian. I did read all your scientific articles. Just that i am really against you saying getting tested for HIV do more harm than good. You can sing all your way through about how you disagree about HIV testing, how it is better not to get tested, how your facts back you up but people like you is just being ignorant about getting tested. If there are more people like you in Malaysia, I afraid that we will be like thailand or worse still, Asia's Africa.

You are saying a person should not get tested for HIV just because he will have a sleepless night, then from there immune system goes down then will die faster. No matter how tough it is to get tested and being a Positive, that person has to face it. Running away wont make you Negative. But being known about your HIV status can prevent from spreading to their love ones. Even if person is Positve, it does not mean that he will have to discontinue his daily life. All he need to do is being more cautious and try not to spread it. There are couples which one of them is negative and another is Positive. They still can have normal sex life by having protected sex. It does not mean once you are Positive, your life ends here.

Yes. You are right. When you go for HIV testing, the test is not 100% accurate due to Window Period, improper way to do the test and etc. But the doctors always advise the patients to do second testing after the Window Period.

It does not mean all the HIV test done in clinics and hospitals by using rapid test kits are faulty. The accuracy is not 50-50 whether you are postive or negative. The accuracy is 99.98%.

This post has been edited by david_lynn: Jun 23 2009, 10:35 AM

This is surely a no-ending argument with you. You have your own views and i have my own views. Both are standing so strong. And I am wondering why you keep accusing me of not reading the links and articles whenever i disagree with your views. Stop it k? I do not agree with you doesnt mean i did not read the articles.

From all your previous postings, i can 100% classify you as a True AIDS Denialist. You can go to google and type AIDS denialist and you will appear top in wikipedia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AIDS_denialism

Check this out david_lynn

rac3r,

as I said, you can read and digest all the information that fast ? common sense would tell me actually, even if you do read all of them, I doubt you really understand them ...i took 5 month to really digest all properly and really think is it what those scientists says are true ? Slowly, it started to make sense now. HIV=AIDS theory isnt strong, there are many people out there suing their doctors and hospitals...come on, please, dont be so ignorant.

what am i denying ? Im telling you the evidence that HIV doesnt equate with AIDS, but in return you call me "denialists" and choose to push away the facts that i told you as a theory As what the HIV test creator, Dr Rodney Richards says, going to HIV Test to test for HIV is just simply an "illusion" that many people, including the doctors arent aware of.

HIV=AIDS is a new religion now, especially to people like you who arent open minded. well, of course for those people out there who can see pass the dark, im sure their lives are happier and live more longer...after all, you can see deaths from people who eat too much drugs easily They choose to believe EVERYTHING that the doctors said.

HIV=AIDS is a new religion now, especially to people like you who arent open minded. well, of course for those people out there who can see pass the dark, im sure their lives are happier and live more longer...

This post has been edited by david_lynn: Jun 23 2009, 04:08 PM

Hi,

Now you are saying that i do not understand about what i have read.

I do understand what i have read just that i do not agree with it. Which is why i am telling you my views. I am strongly disagree with you when you are actually encouraging people not to go for HIV test. Do you know how much courage it takes for a person to go for HIV testing? and a person like you who never gone through that feeling just keep telling people how inaccurate the tests are and keep spreading your "Denialist" idealogy.

You might not realise it but if you really go and look through all your postings 1 by 1, you are a Denialist yourself.

But anyhow, there is 1 point that you mentioned that i do agree with you. Which is the medicine for HIV. I do believe that the medicine is very strong and it can help to prolong or shorten the patient's life. It is like the chemotherapy for cancer. It is actually using poison to fight the cancerous cell. The process can heal the patient or kill them. But for cancer, if you are tested early, then there might still be a chance of living but for AIDS, it is none. But getting tested early can save the lives of people around you.

O.o

---

Added on June 23, 2009, 4:27 pmThis post has been edited by david_lynn: Jun 23 2009, 04:37 PM

hey guys...cool it, cool it. It's good to have such debate i think, but i just want to comment 1 thing...rac3r, you are already very comfortable with the current paradigm, so it is very hard for you to accept what david has just said to you ( me too actually ), BUT the information and questions that David asked is very important, that from my understanding, I dont think it has ever been answered yet. It is still in grey area.

furthermore, yes, there are people who has misdiagnosed, was starting to take the drugs when suddenly they retest, suddenly came out negative. How would you feel ? If me, I would want to sue that doctor or hospital.

ADD ON : furthermore, I think david's intention is really sincere from the way he explain things. He dont force you, He just ask you to think critically.
( I think lah ) You know right, once you are diagnosed positive, the public will treat you with one kind. which i dont think is the
right way.

This post has been edited by shaquenator: Jun 23 2009, 04:53 PM

Yes, shaquenator. You are right. david_lynn is not forcing us to accept the facts he posted and i and not saying he is forcing me or anyone to accept it as well. I understand that this HIV debate things has been going on for years since still no cure for it. Because of that, there are "Denialist" like david_lynn. david_lynn intention might be good thinking he can keep spreading the bad side of getting tested which leads to people thinking that there is no point to get tested at all since the results is not true at all. Then why bother get tested? If everyone have that mentalily of not getting tested, sooner or later Malaysia will be like those african countries. Maybe he can advise all those NGO which has been working so hard to control HIV to go take a break since no one is going to test and no test is accurate enough for hiv testing. To david_lynn, hiv test = bad. Hope this world will be a better place with more people like him

rac3r,

i think you take it too personal already. as David stated, STDs are real but NOT HIV.


david_lynn intention might be good thinking he can keep spreading the bad side of getting tested which leads to people thinking that there is no point to get tested at all since the results is not true at all > im afraid I have to disagree with you. The reason is

1) he really do provide link that has some explanation to why the current paradigm is incorrect, with the studies attached
from what I can read, there's 2 study :

Padian study - a study that shows quite a lot of couples(1 positive and 1 negative ), they are practising unsafe sex and after 6
years following them, none sero-converted. This real study itself seem enough to make me rethink again about the sexual
transmission, because to be frank, I think david might be right, where is the evidence that HIV can be transmitted sexually ?

Concorde study - a study that shows HIV patients on AZT died earlier than those who didnt take it. It clearly shows the AIDS
medication in fact have a lot of side effects, some are like the AIDS illnesses. It is quite harmful, and I study the information
further in the TIG website that david gave, hhmmmm....I think something fishy is there(i dont know).

I think what david is doing is making other people look into the facts themselves, not asking you to believe at all. That is why he provided the links. Hhhmmmm, as compare to you, you keep saying to him that he is wrong and that he is a "denialist", but at least he provides links that really debate back why the current thinking might be a mistake. YOU DONT.

2)I also look at one of the survivor website, Maria - she has been diagnosed since 1984, she almost died because of the medication.
But, when she stop, all the illnesses just stop. I mean how can this be coincidental ? and there's only 1 possible reason for that.
Besides, when she requested her Greece government to prove that HIV can cause AIDS, it is shocking ( cant believe what I read )
the Greece government have not provide them almost 2 years now and they are still awaiting for the evidence.

3)Then I go into Janine's website, Fear Of The Invisible...it seems that there are 2 discoverer of HIV - Robert Gallo and Montagnier.
Robert Gallo, shockingly was told to get out of NIH quietly due to scientific misconduct. On the other hand, Montagnier, dont believe
HIV has been isolated OR HIV itself isnt enough to cause AIDS. It is quite shocking when we really go inside and read it. By the
way, Janine's website really do have evidence that Robert Gallo has committed a fraud.

hhhmmm, really, it gives me a lesson that, sometimes, if we dont really read with an open-minded thinking and choose to be close-minded, it is indeed not to your advantage. Nobody ask you to believe it totally without seeing the evidence as what David already said to you. He ask you not to trust what he said, look at the website.

---

Added on June 24, 2009, 1:48 pmADD ON : bad news is many asians arent willing to be open minded and ask questions =) Yup, I agree fear already blinded people's thinking, as what David says...

This post has been edited by shaquenator: Jun 25 2009, 09:05 AM

thanks shaquenator.

unfortunately, many are being lied into this deception because the campaign is based on FEAR MONGERING, DISEASE MONGERING and they control the media to make sure everyone feel this is "real". The problem is many people are so filled with the FEAR MONGERING tactics, they just fail to see the logic behind the failure of this theory. Their brain already brain-washed...and just look at how rac3r debate with me...oh my goodness, he just keeps on using FEAR to make me feel intimidated, but I use "EVIDENCE" back to make it clear to him, and still he just cant see my rational.

Another scam that you guys need to be aware of is the HPV for woman...that is said to become cancer. if you buy into the FEAR, then when your daughters take GARDASIL, that's it ! Your daughter's health is done, Im not going to feed you guys this time. You will need to do research yourself, because I dont have any benefit to gain anyway. Im just being kind enough to help you all who seem confuse to see thorough it, JUST DONT DISCRIMINATE THOSE PEOPLE. It isnt right.

The medical is the one that we need to be sceptical about ! I QUESTION MEDICAL AND AIDS ORTHODOX.

---

Added on June 25, 2009, 4:36 pmanother thing, YOU CANT POSSIBLY TO LISTEN TO CDC, NIH, FDA....they have VESTED INTEREST and your lives are their $$$$

---

Added on June 25, 2009, 4:37 pmTELL A LIE LOUD ENOUGH AND LONG ENOUGH AND PEOPLE WILL BELIEVE IT - Adolph Hitler

---

Added on June 26, 2009, 9:48 amHi all,

again I want to share with you about the "claims" that the government that currently is active promoting. This link will self explain that the promotion, the vaccines, the "test", are all part of their strategy to convince you to buy the "drugs". So, who is in "denial" then ?

remember, people like rac3r, when you campaign and promote so agrresively to take "test", but when those "infected" take those drugs, and find out the truth, who's going to be responsible ? You think your government is there for them ? inside this link also, please do watch out how they use the media to create sense of fear at the end of the show.

http://www.dailymotion.com/relevance/searc...opaganda_webcam

This post has been edited by david_lynn: Jun 26 2009, 10:05 AM

walao... great topic ya... read till my eyes terbalik already. haha

garasesell, just go to the website I provide...read for yourself, dont trust what I have posted, read the main source. if people dont start questioning, more and more lives will be dead based on an UNPROVEN HYPOTHESIS and DEADLY TREATMENT.

Can make it short and sweet?? medical student here~~

hehe,

Davidlynn, I'm so gonna pick one of ur most interesting twisted article/journal to be used in my coming critical appraisal Gotta read from the start sometimes later. Let's see what's the lecturer gonna comment about the articles/research papers you posted.

you think Im scared ?

and even worst you are asking your lecturer whose knowledge is also based on modern medical science ? (im not sure, maybe he might know something about natural health, that is fine...then he has the story to both side, which should be the way)

as for you, it's ok, you can laugh, comment or write anything you want, cause it is useless to discuss these things with you. Sometimes, you have to EXPERIENCE it, then ONLY you know what Im talking about. This kind of things arent that straight forward as you might think, and Im not saying this to protect myself, but it is indeed the truth. The modern medical science has managed to confuse a lot of people, and blame or equate the natural/alternative healings as a scam or hoax. The first condition to treat s sick/ill person is do not harm the body, yet modern medical science has violated that condition long time ago, this is very obvious in cancer, yet people(without using their brain) keep debating(without seeing the other side's opinion) as if they are preaching the gospel, UNKNOWN that many have died because they DECIDED to go to modern medical science for treatment

again, there's no point to argue with you(or the others), because I know where you are because I used to think like the majority. I really thank God that He opens my eyes of the evil people in this world who are so good at manipulating and lying, masking the marketing plan as the solution of scientific medicine for their own profits. Please, dont go on joking saying this is a conspiracy...LOL, when you cant see it, you just cant. Bear in mind, health is yours not mine, so if anyone of the people sort of threaten me that if there's no evidence, they wont believe...which is fine to me LOL.

As usual, one of my relatives recently just take a shot for the H1N1, and (why am I not surprised ) he was sick, vomit, fever and feel painful. Again, this doesnt happens to everyone, but this clearly indicates to me, something inside the vaccines(which we dont know) is trying to hijack our body system, yet our body is fighting against it, until I gave him Vit C(from natural resources such as beta carotene, ascorbic acid)...then was his condition getting better. He thinks Im losing my mind...but after that incident, now he starts to dig deep into reading unbiased studies, natural food, PH status. As I said over and over in this forum, when people choose not to be open, you just cant see it, all you can think of is scam, hoax, lies....

Oh by the way, do post what your lectucturer says ( not that Im going to change my mind because of your lecturer, because in my life, I have even see an "expert"/"specialist" who says, IM SORRY, I DONT KNOW WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOUR PARENT. I SUGGEST YOU GO TO CONSULT OTHER DOCTOR" ) - you ? nah, you dont have to say what you have seen or study, not worth to mention

This post has been edited by david_lynn: Aug 9 2009, 10:58 AM

David_lynn,

From what I can conclude, you do know much about HIV and AIDS. However, your idea that modern medical science is a joke and should not be trusted is somewhat appalling. That's what I understand after reading your posts anyway. If you belief that modern science is fake, what methods are you going to use to refute the evidence.... modern science? And if you don't belief in modern science, what do you belief in??? It is your right to belief what you want but I just want to understand this fundamental issue first before we go into any debate.

Modern medical science is not exact science. It is not as simple as black and white or 1,2,3 but unfortunately includes shades of grey. The reason? Man has progress far in terms of medical science but unfortunately, there are still A LOT of things man do not understand.

And I just don't understand your example of H1N1 vaccination and vitamin C..... most laymen are aware about vitamin C and infection. What's your point?

hey kmarc,

no problem man, let me just explain our gaps, but i dont assume myself as have a great knowledge BUT everyday is a constant learning process. remember to be always open minded...

However, your idea that modern medical science is a joke and should not be trusted is somewhat appalling >>> if it is for acute or emergency illnesses like fever, cut/burns, labour, it is of course hospitals are the best place to treat such conditions which is very obvious to the eyes. If untreated, it will do more harm than good in SUCH SITUATION.

However, in terms of chronic illnesses, like cancer(there's actually various types of cancers, lymphoma, sarcoma...), heart problems, organ dysfuntion, it is best to understand that such conditions happens after years and years of human consumption of unwanted processed foods which contains chemicals we dont even know, and drugs(although have certain functions but it is still chemicals for borh recreational and medicinal), negative human emotions, poor environment and unhealthy lifestyle. So, it is very wrong for people to assume that drugs can be the solution, because drugs intention is to kill the cancer cells BUT it comes with a price, because drugs are artificial things, and our bodies are natural organs, that has biological functions. Therefore there will be side effects. That is why majority of people who goes to ONLY chemotherapies either die or if they survive, the cancer comes back. WHY ? because the drugs dont solve the ROOT CAUSE. It delays the symptoms. However, if one decided to change the lifestyle to eating natural or raw foods(let food be your medicine) and stop all the FEAR MONGERING things, I sincerely believe the cancer cant survive any longer because we have created an unsuitable environment for the cancer cells, and therefore, the cancer cells have to shrink to very very small percentage called as undetectable in the cancer marker test, everyone has cancer cells. Our public's negativity has bring the fall of our own. We need to be as positive as ever...

for HIV=AIDS case, I believe you can actually study my questions that I have posed on another forum, and more importantly, watch the movie(if it is available in Malaysia, which I doubt) called House of Numbers. Then you tell me which part of the science has progress I find it very hard to swallow some things that the modern medical science have decided to CURSE the people diagnosed as positive, and of course the people, out of ignorant, choose to discriminate those people. Each and every year, what profesor Duesberg has said in the 80s has come true...and how the world ridicule what Africa's President Mbeki said, also has come true. The evidence how HIV can cause the fall of the immune system is not being documented. Just go and ponder on the questions I ask, because if you said that THERE ARE STILL MANY THINGS THAT THE HUMAN DONT KNOW, how come the modern medical science can know if THE HIV+ people dont take the medication, they can die in 10 years time ???? there are obviously people who reject the medication lives up to 20 years and still living. WHY DOES THE DEFINITION OF ILLNESSES(for AIDS) KEEPS INCREASING ??? I find it very uncommon for a "virus" can create more illnesses as times progresses. It seems like anything that is unsolved, the modern medical science like to dump it as a "virus" issue.

if i were to choose between cancer and HIV=AIDS, cancer is still more dangerous than HIV=AIDS. But more importantly, the drugs is not your saviour. We are only being told by "doctors" that those drugs are the ONLY solution, is it the truth ?

That's what I understand after reading your posts anyway. If you belief that modern science is fake, what methods are you going to use to refute the evidence.... modern science? >>> I dont have to refute at all. This whole mess is "introduce" by your modern medical science, it is them who needs to realize that they are wrong. BUT, I dont see any such sign so far. If this happens, the pharmaceutical companies will have to go bankrupt, and they will do anything to make sure anyone who can affect theor profits be eliminated. Sad, shocking, but you dont see it


And if you don't belief in modern science, what do you belief in??? >>> it's in my postings, you will find it. I dont believe in drugs.

Modern medical science is not exact science. It is not as simple as black and white or 1,2,3 but unfortunately includes shades of grey. >>> I agree with you. BUT it is the grey area that they propose to the community DRUGS is the only solution, and claiming how people will die in such period of time. Come to think of it, dont you think they make themselves as God ?

And I just don't understand your example of H1N1 vaccination and vitamin C..... most laymen are aware about vitamin C and infection. What's your point? >>> sorry, the sentence might confuse you. What I meant is the we dont really know how far these vaccinations can protect us, however, injecting something foreign to our body isnt a good choice because we dont even know the ingredients used in those vaccines. Sometimes, they may contain mercury, lead or other dangerous things which we dont know, OR even certain types of "virus" that really has been created, we dont know. Vit C is a natural detoxifier, it can neutralize certain dangerous things that is not of benefit to our body. But the Vit C must be taken from natural resources, usually fruits and not chemicals ( yes, it can be easily bought from the pharmacy ) Herbs can also be beneficial to us as well....my point is anything that is from nature they are good for us.

no, I dont want to debate, because it's just no use at all. My friend, go to all the website I have posted and read them, and if you really are interested in vaccinations, HIV, you NEED to read the work of Janine Roberts, in the book Fear Of The Invisible...the investigation she started in 1994, and YES, inside the book there are concrete evidence the person who introduces HIV as the cause of AIDS, might be a big mistake afterall....after 25 years and growing.

That would be a contradiction, wouldn't it? Both acute medicine, chronic medicine or whatever branch of medicine goes hand in hand - all have progressed a long way to become what is known as modern medical science. You just can't separately say that acute illnesses are effectively treated by modern science while other illnesses are not! Most treatment options nowadays are based on the same research/study methodology and statistical analysis.



I fully agree with you that a healthy lifestyle does reduce illnesses. Here's the example that you gave:
1) Human consumption of unwanted processed foods which contains unknown chemicals
2) Eating natural or raw food

You have to realize that most food nowadays are either processed or treated. How can an average working man find the food that you describe - natural or raw, unprocessed and untreated? Even the vegetables that you eat everyday has chemicals sprayed on them. Unless, of course, you're talking about organic food, which is not readily available and cost more than an average man can afford!!!

3) Negative human emotions

Again, I have no doubt that negative human emotions can be detrimental. However, nobody can 100% control their emotions to make sure they are 100% positive!!! Well, maybe if you're a vulcan.......

4) Poor environment

Malaysia is now shrouded in thick haze. How to avoid?

In the end, what I'm trying to say is that maintaining a healthy lifestyle is crucial for health but there are factors that are unavoidable, however hard you try to avoid it.

As for cancer, know that modern scientist and researchers have not yet fully understood the nature of cancer!!! However, they have come a long way in TRYING to understand it! If cancer was fully understood, then you would have a cure. When something is not well understood, naturally, the drugs or treatment options used to treat the illness would not be very effective.

Another example is the drugs used to treat your common hypertension (high blood pressure). Do you realize that the multitude of drugs used to treat the blood pressure that is high and not address the root cause? The drugs mainly act in reducing the blood pressure. Why so? Because nobody has identified the root cause of the disease!!! If so, does that mean that hypertensive patients don't take their medication?

Regarding HIV/AIDS, do you know that there are still no cure for a viral infection? Why do you have antibiotics for bacterial infection but no effective drug for viral infection? Again, it is because medical science has not progressed that far to understand and combat viral infections.

Again, I ask you. If you do not believe in modern medical science, what do you belief in? I do hope that what you belief in has concrete evidence from whatever research methodology that it came from.

Drugs are NOT the solution. It is one of the available methods to treat a condition based on how much researchers understand it! Again, just to stress that there are many things still NOT understood!

So, does that mean that there no means to confirm or refute modern science? You state yourself that "This whole mess is "introduced" by your modern medical science, it is them who needs to realize that they are wrong". In order to realize that something is wrong, there has to be "evidence" to show that it is wrong! Nobody would challenge something if it is proven wrong. Classic example, all humans previously thought that the sun revolves around our earth, only to be proved wrong later on that it was earth that revolves around the sun.

In conclusion, what I'm trying to say is that we have come a long way in terms of medical sciences. However, there are still a lot of research to be done before we can fully understand the human body. Scientist do not fully understand the human body and as such, do not have effective drugs to cure many diseases. Modern science has come to a stage where the MANIFESTATION of diseases can be treated but NOT the ROOT CAUSE of diseases. As time goes by, another medical breakthrough occurs, to progress medical science further and better. Who knows, it may take another 1000 years before humans can fully understand their own body. In the meantime, we can only make do with what we have, as we understand it.

P/s : Humans are not that gullible. Show clear reproducible evidence to proof something wrong and everybody will believe it.

This post has been edited by kmarc: Aug 9 2009, 07:48 PM

firstly, Im not going to start a debate with you, but somehow I think you misinterpret some of my points.

That would be a contradiction, wouldn't it? >>>NO.

Both acute medicine, chronic medicine or whatever branch of medicine goes hand in hand - all have progressed a long way to become what is known as modern medical science. >>> the medicine, though is from the same technology or concept, but the LEVEL OF TOXICITY is different. Why not you try giving a person who has heart problems nevirapine and a cancer person a drug called vioxx. It might sound silly, but that's what you have explained. If you dont know, unlike allopathic, the treatment is a holistic treatment, which means everything is connected, however in modern medical science, they drugs are intended to action to ONLY specific issues.

You have to realize that most food nowadays are either processed or treated. >>> that depends on where you live, either urban or rural area.

How can an average working man find the food that you describe - natural or raw, unprocessed and untreated?>> Why not ? example, drinking carrot juice ? Hello ????

Even the vegetables that you eat everyday has chemicals sprayed on them. Unless, of course, you're talking about organic food, which is not readily available and cost more than an average man can afford!!! >>> yes, unfortunately. Organic food is more costly, but that doesnt mean you cant wash away the pesticides ???? come on, you need to do your research, seriously you cant be expecting me to give you more information and debate more with you, right ?

However, nobody can 100% control their emotions to make sure they are 100% positive!!! Well, maybe if you're a vulcan.......>>> well, I didnt say 100%, but at least you can change the environment. You know that people cant change, why not YOU change ? as easy as that...nobody says it's easy, definately not me. But if you dont change and keep thinking in negative like the majority of public who likes to live in FEAR, you know your immune system will go down. There's always hope...

Malaysia is now shrouded in thick haze. How to avoid? >>> of course this is something seasonal or happen over a period of time, you cant take such issues and take it as an excuse to say to yourself it's better to die than to live, looking at such ad-hoc situation. anyway, our world is getting sicker and sicker because of pollution and yes, the modern medical science prefers to push it to "virus". and you will also notice, if you live in a thick haze area, suddenly you will have symptoms like "H1N1", as your lungs is really actively detoxifying the particles.

In the end, what I'm trying to say is that maintaining a healthy lifestyle is crucial for health but there are factors that are unavoidable, however hard you try to avoid it. >>> by practising healthy lifestyle, your sustainability is much better. how many factors are you talking about then ?


However, they have come a long way in TRYING to understand it! If cancer was fully understood, then you would have a cure >>> LOL, kmarc, if you think modern medical science offers you a cure, im afraid you are in a delusional state. Im going to say to you for one last time, there are people who take enough nutritions and raw foods and worry less who are cure from cancer stage 4. The modern medical science "promise" that the cure for cancer will be found in 10 years time, now, it has been 15 years ??? what happen ? I thought those are briliant scientists ?

But, how come those who takes natural food can be healed ? and the more relevant question is is the SCIENCE used in modern medical science THE CORRECT ONE ?

Another example is the drugs used to treat your common hypertension (high blood pressure). Do you realize that the multitude of drugs used to treat the blood pressure that is high and not address the root cause? The drugs mainly act in reducing the blood pressure. Why so? Because nobody has identified the root cause of the disease!!! >>> Why are you telling me these ? Tell this to the modern medical science. It's a surprise you know modern medical science dont treat the root cause, as what I have said in my past reply

Regarding HIV/AIDS, do you know that there are still no cure for a viral infection? >>> that is in the world of modern medical science. They reject other views and prohibit other views to be known to the public.
Why do you have antibiotics for bacterial infection but no effective drug for viral infection? Again, it is because medical science has not progressed that far to understand and combat viral infections. >>> Please, please, please, please, please, please, please....read Janine Robert's book called Fear Of The Invisible before you start the virus conversation, enuff! By the way, please read my last post about this topic...look for whatever evidence you want, BUT also think about the critical questions that are being asked.

Again, I ask you. If you do not believe in modern medical science, what do you belief in? I do hope that what you belief in has concrete evidence from whatever research methodology that it came from. >>> Dont you worry about that Modenr medical science can give you thousands and thousand of "statistical" success, but when it comes to reality, Im not sure how successful they are.

It is one of the available methods to treat a condition based on how much researchers understand it! >>> well, as I said it before, it depends on the person of that researcher is. again, this is also involves money as well. Imagine, if the company's researches (pharmaceutical )manage to find a cure, dont you think they will run out of business ? Instead, why not find something that doesnt cure BUT can supress the symptoms ? so that they can take it over and over again for the rest of the lives ? ( oh nvm, this part is very complicated to explain anyway)

So, does that mean that there no means to confirm or refute modern science? You state yourself that "This whole mess is "introduced" by your modern medical science, it is them who needs to realize that they are wrong". In order to realize that something is wrong, there has to be "evidence" to show that it is wrong! >>> Hello ? Did it ever incur to you how come some people who changes their lifestyle(as what I have said), and treat the body with optimal vitamins or herbs are cured while those who went to chemotherapies or radiation or whatever procedure from them died ? I encourage you to watch "Farrah's Story" sincerely from my heart. It is available online...observe what the procedure has done to her and her body.
Remember, the drugs killed her more faster than the cancer killed her, and at the end of the film, she asked a question(to her country's Health minister I believe), why does our country dont implement alternatives treatment which has been proven to be successful in other countries ? as I said, there's no point I argue with you here when you dont experience it yourself....really, there's no point.

Classic example, all humans previously thought that the sun revolves around our earth, only to be proved wrong later on that it was earth that revolves around the sun. >>> which is why everyone need to be open minded.

In conclusion, what I'm trying to say is that we have come a long way in terms of medical sciences. However, there are still a lot of research to be done before we can fully understand the human body. Scientist do not fully understand the human body and as such, do not have effective drugs to cure many diseases. Modern science has come to a stage where the MANIFESTATION of diseases can be treated but NOT the ROOT CAUSE of diseases. As time goes by, another medical breakthrough occurs, to progress medical science further and better. Who knows, it may take another 1000 years before humans can fully understand their own body. In the meantime, we can only make do with what we have, as we understand it. >>> maybe I think you dont understand, that's why you seem to be contradicting. When drugs are unable to solve the root cause, it doesnt cure a "disease". Besides, drugs are synthetic and our organs are natural/boilogical. Consuming drugs for a long period of time will cause organ failure, a classic example why drugs cant solve any of our body issues. It only cover symptoms.

P/s : Humans are not that gullible. Show clear reproducible evidence to proof something wrong and everybody will believe it. >>> just read my previous post to see what I mean by the icon at the beginning of this sentence.

This post has been edited by david_lynn: Aug 10 2009, 11:59 AM