Now, you don't have to get all worked up la. As initially suspected, this is going nowhere so I'll stop here.

I think what you believe in is alternative/complementary medicine?

yup, alternative/natural medicine...actually, did you know that the food you eat can either be your medicine or kill you ?

modern medical science always thinks they are right in most of the thing, but believe me, they see all the things wrong. They use FEAR to make people feel that there's no other choices, they will die quickly if they dont use modern medical science way and that after using it, patient can expect a partial or full recovery. They always advertise, through ministry of health or the authority that other treatment besides modern medical science are quackery, but they dont aware themselves, it is modern medical science that have lead many people to die(always providing excuses that they have save many lives)....and STILL, many people trust the modern medical science, with all it's SCIENTIFIC RESEARCH...and to declare a simple equation HIV=AIDS=DEATH is very immature of modern medical science.

Alternative medicine/naturopathic is all about holistic treatment, if you have an issue, it involves all your body, not just specific area. and these treatment is not dangerous for your body, because if your body suffers a lot, then your body will signal to you that it's time to end the pain and sufferings, especially when it gets more and more painful, then slowly you dont have energy, and when FEAR grabs you, your soul/spirit will have to leave your body. That is why the modern medical science is not in accordance to the Christian way of healing. It is a sin to torture the wonderful body created by God with chemicals that are dangerous by itself.

I tell you frankly, while many people are expecting a magic formula or bullet, you wont find it. It take years to develop cancer, and yet many expect to take the medication and be healed in 6 months time ?

all you need to do is change your lifestyle, while treating it with herbs(herbalogy) or nutrition, both are subset under naturopathic medical knowledge. of course there will be some party that decides to cheat people, and that is why herbs and nutritions are much fear off by the public because of this certain bad party experience.

How do I know I will be cured by consuming or applying those herbs? How do I know which herbs to use for which problem?

You can't make sweeping generalization that modern medical science is so-call "EVIL". There are researchers with genuine intention to solve the mystery of the human body. Granted that there are those who doesn't think that way but they are not the majority.

Again, no researcher/scientist/doctor in his right mind would say that alternative treatments are quackery. However, many alternative treatments do not have any good data to show that it works. Anybody can claim that taking Vitamin C 10,000mg a day can cure cancer but are you going to believe it? I can claim that 3 cancer patients took 10 watermelons a day for 1 year and they were cured. Or somebody know of a person who never had any chronic diseases because he took 1 gallon of honey everyday until he died. Where's the evidence? A few isolated "miracle" doesn't mean that method works. If there are convincingly reproducible evidence that alternative medicine works, do you think the scientific community will ignore it?

Can you give me a few examples of alternative medicine that works but largely ignored by modern medical science? Make sure it is backed by clear reproducible evidence and not heresay or isolated cases.

Again, I have no quarrel with changing your lifestyle and leading a healthy lifestyle.

mumiechan,

nobody ask you to be your own expert. There are people who are studying herbalogy, means they really study the functions of the herbs available, usually in china. There's also ayurvedic, the India's version of herbalogy. But bear in mind that the effects are very very slow, because usually herbs are healing slowly.

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Added on August 11, 2009, 2:57 pmi didnt say that everyone prqactising modern medical science is evil, it is your assumption.

Granted that there are those who doesn't think that way but they are not the majority. >>> if they follow the right way, Im sure their positions will need to be filled by another person

However, many alternative treatments do not have any good data to show that it works. Anybody can claim that taking Vitamin C 10,000mg a day can cure cancer but are you going to believe it? I can claim that 3 cancer patients took 10 watermelons a day for 1 year and they were cured. Or somebody know of a person who never had any chronic diseases because he took 1 gallon of honey everyday until he died. Where's the evidence? A few isolated "miracle" doesn't mean that method works. If there are convincingly reproducible evidence that alternative medicine works, do you think the scientific community will ignore it? >>> Im not going to spend more time with you on this anymore, the more I explain, the more excuses will come out. To me, the evidence is in the people who got healed, NOT THE STATISTIC THAT IS BEING SHOWN TO THE PUBLIC THAT SAYS MODERN MEDICAL SCIENCE HAS ACHIEVED ANOTHER MIRACLE DRUG. As I said over and over again, if you or your loved ones dont experience it, you will never understand what Im trying to tell you...because all my important points are inside all my past replies. At this point of time, I doubt you will ever understand it anymore. You, unfortunately have to understand it the hard way, many paid with their own lives.

anyway, since you are in Malaysia, attached is one of websites about alternative medicine :

http://www.natural-health.com.my/content.php?cat=34

remember, this is a real person. after you have read the website, try to screen through all that Ive said..and even then, you might not understand what Ive said....but if you do, that would be the most precious realization you will ever have.

This post has been edited by david_lynn: Aug 11 2009, 03:56 PM

I see. Could you recommend some books or websites dealing with herbalogy, ayurvedic and others, esp regarding STDs since this is what this thread's all about.

since you said it is websites, gooogle for them.

It is not a matter of whether I understand or not. What matters is, how can people realize that alternative medicine is good IF it CANNOT reproduce the results of a treatment convincingly? Like I said, isolated cases of "cure" doesn't proof anything. It could have been a random event that happened even without treatment. And if clear reproducible evidence can't be shown, how do you know which treatment is effective and which is not?

Furthermore, your argument that the evidence is in the people who got healed is also "weak". Reason? Modern medicine also had many patients who got healed by modern medical drugs. Do you think if 100 cancer patients were treated with modern medicine, all 100 will die? Of course not. There will be those who survived after treatment. So, if the results are based on patients who got healed, then how do you differentiate and compare alternative medicine to modern medicine in terms of results?

Here's a quote from the website you provided:
I whole-heartedly agree with the statement. Note the word "studied and compared". Tell me how a healing method should be studied and how can it be compared to other treatments? How? Definitely not on hearsay, isolated stories of "cure" and unproven claims!

Don't get me wrong. I have nothing against alternative medicine. In fact, it would be great news if alternative medicine can help human kind. Before that can happen, like what the quote say, all healing sciences should be studied and compared and the best and safest method should be incorporated.

This post has been edited by kmarc: Aug 11 2009, 06:15 PM

What matters is, how can people realize that alternative medicine is good IF it CANNOT reproduce the results of a treatment convincingly? >>> hpw you know it cant reproduce results ? HAVE YOU USED IT BEFORE ?

Like I said, isolated cases of "cure" doesn't proof anything >>> why should it be proven to you when you arent ready to believe it ? The proof is in the pudding(provided the medication is by an expert who really knows this treatment), there's no point to proof because if there's 1 point you miss, that is everyone has a different body composition, therefore every solution needs to be one to one basis, unlike allopathic. allopathic is also trial and error, it's just doctors dont say this to you. Usually they will prescribe a drug to you, until at a point of time, it stops working. Then, a more stronger drugs will be prescribed. No matter how much I explain, you still dont get it, that drugs cant cure you, they supress your symptoms so that you dont "see" or "feel" which makes you think everything is ok, but deep down the body, it is starting to grow worst.

Furthermore, your argument that the evidence is in the people who got healed is also "weak". Reason? Modern medicine also had many patients who got healed by modern medical drugs. Do you think if 100 cancer patients were treated with modern medicine, all 100 will die? Of course not. There will be those who survived after treatment. So, if the results are based on patients who got healed, then how do you differentiate and compare alternative medicine to modern medicine in terms of results? >>> How can you do such comparison ? Your comparison is silly, it's like comparing apple with orange. Those that survive usually is because they arent given the high dosage, besides the cancer WILL COME BACK and not to mention all the sufferings a person have to go through. THEY ARE NOT HEALED. Enuff, I dont want to debate with you anymore, as I said before, if you arent aware that many people who believe the chemotherapies died eventually, then Im afraid you are blind. You are the type that are so ignorant that only by showing you CLEARLY in front of you before and after and also documented statistics then will you be convince...but I tell you, just like modern medical science, you dont have common sense. There are so many factors involved in this war on medicine, it is not a straight explanation to you. The public has been covered FEAR until common sense is uncommon anymore...

Don't get me wrong. I have nothing against alternative medicine. In fact, it would be great news if alternative medicine can help human kind. Before that can happen, like what the quote say, all healing sciences should be studied and compared and the best and safest method should be incorporated. >>> Whether what your opinion on alternative medicine is none of my business, life is yours anyway. If all the human are like you, study and study and study and do human trial, which takes ages (if you really realized ) then many would have died. China and India people wouldnt survived for thousands and thousand of years if it's not because of the herbs, is there modern medical science their time ? and even with the modern medical science, human lifespan keeps getting shorter. And as stated in the website, when there is a greed in the system, I doubt the system is a good system.

no wonder there are certain people who keep messaging me dont bother with people in here who shoot me down, dont waste my time to keep replying them. Not to be arrogant, but after seeing people with chronic illnesses, and comparing with the results that people being treated in modern medical science, there's no doubt moderrn medical science is a junk science.

kmarc, if you cant rationalize it, you just cant see it, you just cant. The modern medical science is so influential, they have all the money in this world to change your views, to cover failed cases, to cover fatality cases, to create new definition to make people continue to believe what seems to be right, to continue instill fear in people, causing people to discriminate those who are "infected" by the "test" or diagnosis. I know of a doctor(oncologists, cancer expert), she is the best doctor in UK, earning several PHDs, everyone seeks her advise, even UK government. In the end, she quit, burns all her certs...she herself admit that modern medical science CANT cure cancer, they just can only see the patients sufferings, slowly suffering, hair fall down, inject a lot of morphine for the unbearable pain, all the organs slowly start to fail....yet, all she can do is just watch and prescribe drugs...she's a christian by the way. Modern medical science is always give bad news, always without a doubt. and when doctors fail to treat a cancer patient, they start to avoid patient, or either give up hope...

you know kmarc, sometimes I wonder with all the questions you ask, have you really see how a cancer patient treated with chemotherapies look like or suffer ? It seems to me, your world is like a very simple sicentific technologies with evidence-based that can help human kind...stop watching hollywood movies...

Before that can happen, like what the quote say, all healing sciences should be studied and compared and the best and safest method should be incorporated. >>> you think modern medical science care about this ? Dont be a fool, if this happens, those who have cancer wont be given chemotherapies or radiation, and those who are "HIV+" wont be given AZT or Nevirapine. It's ironic that this sentence comes out after what you have debated with me...


This post has been edited by david_lynn: Aug 12 2009, 11:54 AM

David_lynn,

First of all, you seem to misunderstand everything I write.

Secondly, where in my reply did I ever shoot you down or discredit alternative medicine? Where?

Thirdly, this is getting nowhere. I was interested in your views on alternative/complementary medicine but the way you reply is sometimes defensive and filled with emotion, hatred and accusations.

Fourthly, with regards to your question on whether I have seen cancer patients treated with chemotherapies, I can tell you that I see cancer patients almost everyday for the past >10 years. Many die but many are still alive (and well!), even after 10 over years. And no, I'm no oncologist.

Lastly, thx for labelling me blind, ignorant, narrow minded and irrational (notice that I didn't ever do that to you, I think) . What does that say?

Hmm~~ i saw david lynn here ~~ no point puttin comment here~~

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Added on August 12, 2009, 8:58 pmthen why bother to put this comment ?

This post has been edited by david_lynn: Aug 12 2009, 09:00 PM

so much to digest before indulging in multiple sex partners...hahahaha

hhhmmm, multiple sexual partners, isnt a good practise either, unless you are sure they are clean from STDs, which is now renamed to STIs, because it is no longer a disease, but just an infection. to be frank with you, i doubt condom can really prevent STIs, as it's the same as a skin disease, but in a more private area(which is only exposed when there are intimate actions)...it's more of a damp skin disease. But, if we are shy to talk about STI just like any other diseases, then Im afraid this wont solve the issue, instead it would bring the issue to an "underground" stage, due to fear of discrimination....being narrow-minded among the people wont really do the community good, seriously. and promoting HIV as if it is a death sentence is one of those stupidity that people can do to fasten the death of those people somehow infected...

This post has been edited by david_lynn: Aug 15 2009, 09:26 PM

prevent better den cure dear

digest it full full..

well, sex is a something we need. It's just some people dont do it that often, others just have a more higher need. that's all.

Dat simple? Hey u frm mmu?

does he sound that young ?

This post has been edited by shaquenator: Aug 19 2009, 12:12 PM

simple ? it's more complicated than you think...

yeah, everyone need sex seriously, of course after teenage age please. Sex is something good for us, though doing it at an alarming rate might not be good for men because overuse of energy. Sex is actually an exercise, though many love to joke about it.

it's more like this(yin and yang concept), in a ideal world, men is more into physical while women is more into emotional, though men and women of course have attraction into physical and emotional things as well, but lesser attention. So, that's why men tend to think of sex more. Nothing is wrong with that to be frank, since sex is the one that produces offspring.

But in reality, things dont go that smoothly. In reality, since we are organic matters, there will tend to have lots of variations in life. In reality also, we cant expect every men will love women or vice versa. Human consists of physical body, mind and your soul. That is why some men who are born "physically" men but he got woman's soul/mind, that's why he feels he need to go for sex change operation or dress like a woman and of course choose to live with the same gender, same goes to the woman as well(bear in mind, this is not a life that one person chooses, but it comes as a package in them). That is why gay people are usually sexually active(men are into physical), though not all are like that because there are variations in life. But remember, nobody can see that except God and that person himself/herself. But, we live in a judgemental world. Everyone in this world lives in a world where they think whatever that is "different" from the norm is wrong, and needs to be condemn or punish. Human like to "label" people, discriminate people and "portray" that whatever that is different will be punish by God. BUT, have we ever heard anything from the mouth of God saying that is what He meant ? (not any religious books) Yes, it's true, even before God can judge a person when that person dies, human(out of busybodiness) already start to judge and punish, this including "religious" people....everywhere you go, it's the same. Even better, the modern medical science love to associate diseases with sex. example ? Dont worry, you wont miss it...they are actively promoting how that virus can kill your immune system, when all they do is use FEAR to lead people to believe, and the evidence ?

But of course, those who abuses sexual activites also must be controlled(since a person dont know the status of the body health of that person he/she chooses to mix with). But more importantly, it must be controlled in a positive manner, not through rejection and discrimination. Discrimination and rejection is like "sweeping the dirt under the carpet". That's why there are cases where after married for years, suddenly the husband revealed his true self...religion definately cant change that person, only guide him to follow the good route and live with someone he/she is really happy with, not fake make-up just to please the judgemental people.

that is why when our soul is hurt or live in fearful condition, our physical body cant accept any healings, no matter how good that medicine is. It is even worst, when our body needs time to heal, suddenly doctors inject poison into the body. HOW CAN THE BODY HEAL ? Yes, because of FEAR, human suddenly lost the common sense. To be healed, human need to allign the physical body, with their mind and soul...and all the positive things will come eventually.

that is why, when a person chooses not to be open minded, the worst nightmare will definately come. Living in a judgemental world is indeed a very hard thing to do not just for those who are "different" but also "normal" people.

MMU ? Im not that young...

This seems like PHD paper presentation man!!

Someone there, please do not copy and paste the article from somewhere else and claim yours.

Write with summary and info link that feel suitable.
If not this tread is dead of boring