Another major reason why there should be licensed processing plants is that it will probably mean the beginning of the end of fake and adulterated birds' nest.

Currently, the manufacture of fake/adulterated nests is far more lucrative than having a successful birdhouse. Without laws, these fake/adulterated nest manufacturers are laughing all the way to the bank, free to do as they please.

Tuckfook, I think I need to say that your statement is correct if spoken many years ago but it is no longer practical today. No sensible and experienced wholesale traders would want to trade in fake/adulterated nests to put their reputation at stake. In this trade, credibility and reputation is of utmost important for genuine businessman if long term business relationship is to be sustained. The setting up capital for a reasonable cleaning centre is not cheap. The unscrupulous manufacturer can only cheat once, and only once. Once caught, which is amounting to cheating, the news shoot across the market like lighting. Reputation is gone permanently as most in the market are very well connected with only one phone away. There gone his days in this circle. Gone are the days where raw nests were limited and scarce and suppliers limited and the end consumers were ignorant. The infamous few who did that and ever laughed all the way to the bank many years ago whom we knew of, are no longer be seen in the market anymore. Today, the knowledge of the majority new consumers is not any lesser than the traders. They are no longer fool. It is even impossible to find a piece of adulterated nest for the sake to show it as an example or sample now.

Why do we want to keep on talking of this law, that law, this license, that license? How about that do we need to have a license too for our maid to do cleaning of nest for our family? Do we need to have HACCP and GMP to do that also?

Processed EBN should be able to be sold in local market without any hindrance but for export some sort of regulations as to the quality of the product is deemed necessary having a similar Malaysian CE marking.

Quote#Although CE marking is self compliance to the conformity of the product, CE marking is a mandatory European marking for certain product groups to indicate conformity with the essential requirements set out in European Directives. In order to use the CE mark on a product the manufacturer must draw up a Declaration of Conformity (DoC) in which the manufacturer attests conformity with all relevant New Approach Directives (NADs) and takes sole legal responsibility. In some instances an NAD may require a Notified Body to issue a Certificate of Conformity in order to verify performance of the product or constancy of the production process (Factory Production Control) for example.

The DoC must include: manufacturer's details (name and address etc); essential characteristics the product complies; any European standards and performance data; if relevant the identification number of the Notified Body; and a legally binding signature on behalf of the organization.#

So, what Malaysia Government need to do is the similar sets of conformity, all interested in exporting EBN can export but must complies to some form of standards in self declaration and if the exported EBN does not conform with the requirements as stated, the exporter will have to pay heavy penalties or fine and added to it, the exporter will be black listed.

This is to safeguard the quality of Malaysian EBN or otherwise because of one Black Malaysian, all Malaysian EBN become Black in Chinese eyes.

Lucas 1 , Don't you sleep ? or is your computer clock stuck at 3.15am ? Wah such dedication to the industry.

As is the case with many laws for the protection of our exports, of course anything for personal use, it would not be applicable. Anything for sale would come under it's controls.

Your maid would be quite welcome to clean some of my nests and I'll offer her 30% by weight F.O.C. my maid flatly refuses to do a good job.

If Malaysian Birds' Nest processing factories achieve ISO Standards then our product would be trusted and we would be above the products from our neighbours. If at anytime from now, our neighbours achieve ISO standards certification, we would lose out in very many ways.

Yes you are absolutely right in that nobody in their right mind would want to risk their reputation by selling fake and or adulterated nests. Unfortunately, there will always be many in there for a quick buck.

At a meeting with many experienced BH owners, we were shown 2 processed nests, one was fake but nobody could tell which. We of course were not able to cook these as we could probably tell by then.

Adulteration even by a modest 10% would increase profits tremendously.(cash wise)

There is a person who buys raw nests at the best current prices and within 24 hrs sell the nests slightly cheaper than what was paid! How is it done ?

Most adulterated nests are sold directly to consumers at markets, medicinal halls, birds' nests tea houses etc. where the consumers are not knowledgable and rely on "trust". A good salesman can sell anything. This practice is not confined to Malaysia alone. Most Humans are always looking for a good deal and that is where they get conned.

Locally produced Fake nests are currently available at less than Rm 1 K per kg. I'm told, selling like hot cakes. ( Don't ask me ! )

Without being able to trace the processing plants of Birds' nest, we will forever be plagued by the unscrupulous adulterers (reminds me of an MP).

Hi all,

I am newly register member, also quite new in swiftlet farming...just started my own farm this year

Well i can say this thread is fun to read, good job to all!



This post has been edited by waletjohor: May 19 2010, 01:53 PM

No amount of regulation will deter the crooks.
Any new regulation will merely slowly the crooks awhile till a workaround is found or the technology overcome.

The point on the CE is valid if the product is absolutely a 'completed product'. For low priced commodity, CE is viable as it does not make commercial sense to adulterate a low cost item. Adulterations in this case add cost to an already low cost item.
EBN is a high cost item which makes adulteration commercially viable.
ISO certification is a myth. It certifies consistency and NOT a certification for quality.
This is 1 of many reasons previously certified organisation drop the re-certification.
Only useful for initial break thru to new markets.
Once broken thru, acceptance is by reputation, not certification.

How are 'certification' displayed for customer assurance? A label? Isnt that easily duplicated?

In the case of DVS proposal, the RFID IC/Chip. That has it's own weaknesses too.
They now have rice grain size RFIDs....embed them into each piece of EBN?
This brings along it own set of problem and consumer education and accidental consumption.
Sandwiched within the packaging material? Contents can be switched-lah, Another still born.
We have not even started with the implementation costs and how much it will inflate the base EBN cost.

Product purity assurance ---YES, but how and where from in the supply chain.
I am for at the tail end. Regulatory sampling should be conducted regularly.

Better and faster adulteration detection methods should be researched on and commercialised.
(this begs the Qs on how 'developmental' funds have been spent on dishing out to god-know-who to build BHs in direct competition to the very industry it i supposed to 'develop')
If severe regulations are put in place cos' of these crooks. It will result in the GOOD being punished by the additional regulation but the crooks only need to bypass them and make more money than the ones who are in compliance.
DOES IT HELP IN REDUCING OR ELIMINATING ADULTERATION despite the additional cost and penalty?

We have no means of knowing where our EBN will be after export! It can be adulterated in any degree and not necessary within Malaysia.
By degree I mean, it could be with an inferior grade or blatant partial switching with fake EBN.

EBN can be 'dismantled and reassembled' at any point in the supply chain!
(IMO this realisation alone will render all DVS proposals impotent as it;s focus is 'at source')
Which by default shd make the processing plant licensing moot.

This post has been edited by Cergau: May 19 2010, 03:39 PM

Swiftlet industry guideline involves four ministries
The reporter misquoted Human Resources ...the correct ministry ought to be Natural Resources and Environment
We seem to have missed this KEY report in March 2010
extract.............
"Veterinary Services Department director-general Datuk Dr Abdul Aziz Jamaluddin had said 1GP would address all problems associated with the swiftlet industry.
He said it would provide the framework to regulate the industry in a holistic manner including the licensing, sampling, producing and exporting of swiftlet bird's nest."
NOW I understand why we have been permitted to see so little....
The framework is to REGULATE ....NOT DEVELOP...
I am so so pissing MAD

All it means is
EVERYTHING COMING OUT FROM ANY OF THESE MINISTRIES ARE MEANT TO REGULATE and REGULATE ONLY
1)1GP is meant to regulate
2)GAHP is meant to regulate
3)Wild Life Conservation Bill 2010 is meant to regulate
4)so 1 piece is missing the MOH guidelines to regulate


YOU GUYS DESERVE THE FEDS.....
I'm out of here!!!!!

This post has been edited by Cergau: May 19 2010, 07:42 PM

Capitalism Sucks. Communism Sucks. What else do we have?

an email i got recently.

Anyone there can tell me which external sound is good and effective?

Cause currently i am adding up my external sound collection.

So far have collected a few include tongkat ali (harry), tiger(dr. arief budiman) and kcs (dr. christropher)...

Anybody interested to exchange can pm me!

Why don't you upload all your collections here for us to listen, think many here would be able to tell you which are good and which are bullshits.......

good suggestion


but realy bullshits.......share market drop like shits..


good thing no free................free thing no good....................

waletjohor , if u dun mind share the song in here, i think all sifu also will follow share their good song here....

This post has been edited by sosos: May 21 2010, 09:58 AM

Haha....good suggestion....

When we have good thing, must share with others ma...

As chinese say ''eat alone difficult to be fat" !!

Sharing will enable us to get more ext sound without dompet burnt by buying from sifus.....

Black cloud n duress are good?

Duress use to check how many bird in an area be4 we invest is quite good i can say...

But i have no idea if compare to stress sound which is better?

i thought duress=stress sound?? no?

i found this blog have a lot of sound to exchange. you can try to exchange the sound here. i just exchange a few sounf from this blog.... bc, tongkat ali, lacur ,...

http://swiftletsong.blogspot.com

This post has been edited by northen: May 22 2010, 12:30 PM

Aiya this blog i send them invitation to exchange together with sample attached they also didn replay for long long time liao...

h

mayb can try again, because i just exchange last week.
or you want exchange with me??

All, there is another round of sneak attack by that favourite Png citizen following the SAM article.

05/May/2010 The Star
Ban all swiftlet farming activities (This 1 we noted already and someone frm P Klg replied)

08/May/2010 The Star (SMS from readers)
> Ban the birds
Calling all NGO, Nature lover society n Local Council. Follow Sahabat Alam Malaysia and call for the ban on swiftlet farming in urban area. - TWEETY
http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=...18758&sec=focus

20/May/2010 The Star (SMS your views)
> Swiflet guidelines
Swiftlet industry guidelines should be tabled in parliament asap. Give priority 2 human health. Move operations away from urban areas. - Tweety
http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=...96681&sec=focus