After my morning workout, especially after a bout of deadlifts, I'm quite finished. Instead of nursing my frayed CNS at home, I have a 10-hour project management job ahead of me. I can't even think at work anymore, such is the fatigue. Ideas?

My back day, after I finished my dinner then after 2 hours I'll go ZzZzzzzzzz. Sleep at 9pm, lol!

Deadlift used up all the bloody strength. And my back getting weak and of course pain. Better to rest early.

This post has been edited by zeist: May 30 2009, 08:38 PM

Change your workout time.

Evening workouts mean half an Atarax tablet to put me to sleep. It makes me groggy the next day.

My productivity at work has really gone down ever since working out. Also, the restricted carb diet I'm on doesn't help with clear thiking, IMO.

is your nutrition good?
what do you have pre and post workout in the mornings?

kotmj,
you're overtraining. rests are important too.

sounds like over train, but coffee did boost my focus at least in the morning and take another one in the afternoon, and it last until 7pm then go home take a shower, dinner, relax and sleep.

may be u can try to deload for a week, taking light weight same reps and sets.

I take a drink consisting of a glass of water + 2 TbS of ON Amino 2222 + 2 Tbs of glucolin, pre (1 glass) and during workouts (another glass). That's about 20 g of protein cumulatively. Post-workout I take half a serving (30 g protein) of ON Pro Complex with water. So altogether 50 grams before even going to work. At work I drink 1 liter of full cream milk plus another half serving on Pro Complex (spread throughout the day) on top of nasi lemak (with 2 extra eggs), Big Mac w/o fries, and meat + vegetables (no rice) for dinner. And another 0.5 liter milk before bed.
I might try the coffee. I used to drink two mugs of filter coffee at work a day due to sleep deprivation, but since working out I am fanatical about getting at least 7 hours a day and so have found no need for coffee at all.

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Added on May 31, 2009, 8:48 pmAnother thing: Deloading is not part of the program I'm doing. It's PR at every lift at every workout, 3X a week. Phuck. Now I know what's the problem.

This post has been edited by kotmj: May 31 2009, 08:48 PM

I think ur "during" workout meal can cut out the glucolin and leave it for postworkout.

hehe, i sleep 8hrs a day, but still i m quite dependent on caffeine, as currenlty i m taking White flood, the caffeine i think is pretty strong it last me whole day for that 1 1/2 scoop of serving. hehe.

yes, agree with jamis. Glucolin for post workout. It's to restore your energy. High GI carb. Pre workout, low to mid GI carb.

This post has been edited by kurtkob78: May 31 2009, 11:08 PM

my preworkout i mix both hi gi and low gi together, coz tats like half and hour before i hit the gym, cant have much solid food, not intime to boost my energy.

Deloading is a part of every workout.

If you have the balls to train hard, have the balls to rest.

Can mix like that ? If not mistaken, if mix different value of GI, the result will be the average of the 2 .

mofonyx: Hey I went to Rizz yesterday. Trying them out.

I need the glucose pre and during workout because, 1. "Scrawny to Brawny" by Berardi et al. recommends it and 2. I workout right after waking up when energy levels are low.

This whole fatigue thing will only last a couple more months. Once I graduate to the Texas Method (Starr, Madcow, 5X5, etc), there will only be one PR day in the week, which I can place on a Saturday.

I'm just a lil curious why you're on a low-carb method when you're quite small. There's a very unorthodox method that strongmen use which you could try applying.

Take your bodyweight in LBS x 20. Get that amount. That's the amount of calories you ought to be taking in a day. Then divide that amount of calories into 60% carbs/ 30% pro/ 10% fat. My case I need about 4000 cals a day, so about 2400 cals are from carbs. I've not done it, but I've seen it working for these guys. I intend to try it after my trip overseas.

They train twice a day usually, with very heavy weights most of the time. Morning when they get up, and then evening. They are still able to get much bigger and stronger. You could give it a shot if you'd like.

Macam Jay Cutler trains the morning/Noon. Balik makan damn alot. then train again at night.

Gempak!

he got the help from the good ol roids .

I just read in Details magazine that Michael Phelps takes 8,000-10,000 kcal a day. Many elite athletes apparently take 5 Mcal a day. And I read this link someone posted around here (you?) about Berardi's G-flux.

The reason I'm on a low carb diet is because I'm accumulating fat around the waistline. Out of the 8 or so pants in active duty, only 2 fit me now. I wish it was due to the muscles! One of those balanced but high calorie diets is OK for professional athletes whoose job it is to eat and practise (imagine munching through 10,000 kcal), instead of attending meetings and telephoning, but for someone who works in an office, 1. it's impossible to eat that much if you're to keep up appearances and productivity and 2. the fat keeps piling on.

Rippetoe says forget about the fat. Muscles are difficult to gain, fat easy to lose. But I'm afraid of the memory effect of adipose tissue: once you've gotten fat once, it becomes much easier to become fat again.

despite being funny,

time to toss away that silly magazine.

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Added on June 1, 2009, 3:57 pmHow did you like Rizz? great attention to detail huh

This post has been edited by mofonyx: Jun 1 2009, 03:57 PM

Here's the problem I think with you.

It could be because you're attempting to achieve two different goals at the same time. You want to grow bigger and lose fat (or at least make sure your fat gain is minimal) However, in order to grow bigger, you need excess calories for hypertrophy. You are afraid of fat gain because you're afraid that you can't keep the fat off in future. Yet you aren't very clear how your body works, how sensitive it is to carbs and how much protein you need in order to grow.

Your high stress training requires you to increase your nutrient intake, yet maybe you aren't sure what nutrients are they.Thus I've a strong feeling you don't feed your body enough of the right carbs and nutrients, for it to sustain the energy levels after your workout. (I could be wrong)

For myself, I know that my body isn't fussy about food. It can take just about anything and somehow or rather find ways to make it into energy for me. I'm lucky in that aspect, but my body also has a small but significant issue. It also decides to burn my protein during the process of synthesis. So in order for me to grow, I need about 200GMS of protein, a day and above. The others aren't so significant. I up my protein, I drop bodyfat.

I can't tell what's it for you. That's why I'd recommend you take the 60/30/10 rule and apply that for yourself. Then as you understand yourself better, adjust the amount of nutrients that you need. If you notice a good increase in muscle but also some fat, try reducing your carb levels. If that plunges your energy levels, adjust your timing of carb intake. If that doesn't work either, increase your fat intake before sleep to promote recovery. If everything works well, increase protein intake and see if that helps build even more muscle and better recovery.

Also if you think you're gaining too much fat but want to stick to the diet, add 1 conditioning circuit a week. If that works, add one more circuit (about 15 mins a circuit) per week and see how that affects you. I wouldn't go more than 2 circuits though with your current weight training already.

I could be wrong, everything I said could be just nonsense, but that's what I think. And don't worry, you're not overtraining. Many people think overtraining is something that can happen if you constantly deadlift and squat heavy. So many people think they're working heavy...but it actually ain't that heavy

This post has been edited by pizzaboy: Jun 1 2009, 04:08 PM

Good post, something to think about. I'm currently going on high carbs, moderate protein and fat diet. Trying to see how my body takes it in gaining weight. Fat is easy to lose don't worry kotmj. We take years to gain muscle, but losing a lot of bodyfat can be done in less than half a year depending on your diet. Get big first

That vid can't be played? "This video is not available in your country or domain."

Rizz (5 is what you'd expect in a normal saloon)
Ambience 3
Likeability 7
Workmanship 9
Fashion 5
Confidence boosting factor 6

Yeah, it can only be about the mix. Because I DO have a caloric excess, as my waist will bear witness. It's probably not nutrients either (vits and mins) because Pro Complex has 15 of them? (Maybe I should try a small bottle of ZMA and see.)


John, when you run out of pants to wear and love handles start appearing, you'll know why it's easy to worry!

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Added on June 2, 2009, 10:21 amIt's quarter past 10, made PRs at 7:30-8:30 a.m. in all lifts (squat, overhead press, deadlift, chinup) it's post breakfast and I'm feeling like shit. Can't even walk with my normal posture. Tired, tired, tired. I'm getting that coffee.

This post has been edited by kotmj: Jun 2 2009, 10:21 AM

ok, I think i'm on to something.
Exactly how many muscle groups are you working out a day man? Doing squats and deadlifts on the same day? Adding chinups and overhead presses on top of that?
That's pretty intense stuff and it wouldn't be a surprised if you feel completely drained for the rest of the day.

What are you workouts like?
I suggest focusing on 1 muscle group a day, and do a complete cycle. Lets say your working out 3 days a week, and you have a 5 day split routine like this:

Mon - Chest
Wed - Back
Fri - Arms

(following week)
Mon - Shoulders
Wed - Legs
Fri - Chest

x repeat

Finish the cycle on all muscle groups, dont worry about your muscles getting lazy or anything if your resting them too long.
Chest day will cause indirect stimulation of triceps, back day will cause indirect stimulation of biceps.. etc

You would be giving you muscles time to grow and recover, and you could add in some cardio on your off weight days to shed some bf.

Try it, this cycle really helped me with waking up early and not feeling completely drained for classes after workout days..

This post has been edited by tineagle: Jun 2 2009, 12:11 PM

Lots of people seem to have great success doing 5 day splits. But the program I'm doing is about building up strength, and only peripherally about hypertrophy. It's very specific, and two books have been written about it. It's extremely taxing, but I'll stick to it for as long as I can.

The coffee really helped, and post-lunch I felt much better. I'm still deeply fatigued, but functional, as opposed to this morning when I wasn't.

Why not squat and deadlift in the same day? They contribute to ur legs. I do that. Splitting your workouts 1 muscle group every 2 weeks, thats pretty relaxed...

ic, but if this program of yours is interfering with your job and life I would consider a 5day split if i were you.

good luck then.

john, ppl normally split deadlift and squat to different days coz it is just too taxing.
doing squats itself will make u half dead if u do properly with intensity.
u will barely have energy to do deadlifts.

Because people usually go heavy on squats and deadlifts. So, as Jon said, it can be quite taxing to do them on the same day.

Well, in case any of you are interested, here is The Most Tairing Program in the Wurld (apart from pizzaboy's own lethal concoctions) a.k.a. Rippetoe's Starting Strength:

You workout 3X a week, alternating between Workout A and B.

Workout A
Squat 5 reps X 3 sets
Overhead press 5X3
Deadlift 5X1
Chinup 3 X failure

Workout B
Squat 5X3
Bench press 5X3
Power clean/Pendlay row 5 or 8 or 10 X3
Weighted situps

At EACH workout, increase weight in all lifts. The program also entails GOMAD (gallon of milk a day), which, if I followed, would have made me obese by now.

Apparently, you'll only start seeing muscle growth well into the 2nd-3rd month even though your weights all go up because the initial gains are due to neuromuscular efficiency increases + other shit.

Coach Rippetoe disagrees with you

"
....but then again, those who argue against squatting and deadlifting on the same day may just be pussies.
"

http://ripquoteoftheday.blogspot.com/2009/...ay-6th-may.html

Not that I DL and Squat on the same day

I don't squat and deadlift on the same day. So I'm one of those pussies right? How? And Rippetoe isn't a bodybuilder. He doesn't look like a bodybuilder. His specialty is strength training for beginners.
Let's see, I'll compile a list of those people you called pussies:-

Terry Gallyot.
Mohd Zethry
Wong Hong
Quite a lot of IFBB pros.

So you're more hardcore than them? Damn. I think you need to chill a bit on the hardcore mentality mate.

This post has been edited by darklight79: Jun 2 2009, 11:58 PM

oh gosh... here goes...
i am speechless...
go ahead and quote more then. =.=

LOL

You guys gotta learn to take a joke man.

Pants too tight ar? Hahahaha I just thought it was funny.

No, because the OP needs serious advice. He might take you seriously especially if he misconstrues your post. He's on the verge of a CNS burnout. And he's trying to get lean by both cutting calories and increasing caloric expenditure (cardio). Doing both are not recommended. He's gotta pick one.

No problem. He should know that the post was meant to be funny.

Light hearted posts all round, it's summer!

He is doing Starting Strength which advocates doing both monster lifts on the same day (but only 1 set of a heavy dead). Can't go on forever on that workout! ~ 3 - 6 months is a good time frame for Starting Strength.

ROAR!! I hate summer. Screw you. It's already hot and humid here and I'm getting heat rashes between my butt cheeks and balls.

I'm leavin' in a fortnight so don't be hatin'.

The upside is all sunshine and sexy ladies showing off more than they should. Downside is that it gets really warm during the daytime without air conditioning. Sunshine starts at 5am so it disturbs sleep patterns quite a bit!

Nonetheless, it is enjoyable to see hawt babes.

Summer's strange. You feel super alive, yet with nothing significant to do with all that aliveness and daytime.