sorry to hear of your problem, but if you guys are chinese then I agree it is your responsibility on the wedding bill, if you want the girls side to pay then marry a eurasian

Dowry 3k considered cheap

Photoshoot 2k considered cheap

wedding dinner 5k also considered cheap, and as mention you can ROI on this the same night, if lucky you may even make money

Conclusion, dont complaint, your future wife considered very very kind to you.

Your quote

"2. I am simply complaining cause its gonna burn an entire years worth of savings on an event of only 1 day. I can see much better use for the cash."

A woman's life time ambition is to get married and start planning from the age of 5, the way you put it like it's a waste, You said I can see much better use for the cash, are you telling me your wedding on her is a waste?? Only money minded people talk like that, other occasion you talk like that I don't mind but TS, it's your wedding!! The way you answered you have the money but it's a waste, 12k is a waste and you agree it will cost way way more. You say it will all be spent in a day, Funeral also costs RM30k-40k in a few days, guess that is a waste too?? Registering for marriage also in a day but lifetime commitment, but signing it is just in a day. So what if it's in a day only??

      support ~~ TS must be young and ...... emm ..  

Mr Liar Liar ...are you trying to lie your way out from your own trap?
You said woman sit and wait for food!!!

now read this plucked from wiki
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hunter-gatherer

Pls eat your word and not lie your way out, if you're wrong admit your mistake and we can continue the debate about marriage, be a man once in your life would you?

A very good article I found, very good, must read.

http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/topics/Hunter-gatherer

A quote from the article

"A vast amount of ethnographic and archaeological evidence demonstrates that the sexual division of labor in which men hunt and women gather wild fruits and vegetables is an extremely common phenomenon among hunter-gatherers worldwide"

If that person is my daughter he marrying, I terus reject the guy, I tell him, you can keep the money to yourself and I have back my daughter, too expensive, all lost in a day,  hope that RM12k will last you a long long time, since it's too expensive don't bother. My daughter can marry someone else who will love and care for her.

Wow. 1 day and there's 12 pages worth of comments already. >.<
Let me clarify some points since there are some questions directed at me.
1. I love this woman and really want to make her my wife. I just didn't expect it to cost so much.
2. I am simply complaining cause its gonna burn an entire years worth of savings on an event of only 1 day. I can see much better use for the cash.
3. Bear in mind that its only a rough estimate of what it costs so it can come up to much much more.
4. For those who think you can make more out of the "ang pow" from the wedding, its only true if your relatives are rich. Sadly my relatives are from medium to low income bracket and they have many many children (meaning more seats needed, less angpow)

You'll excuse me if I honestly do not envy the man who married the women who got them to pay exorbitant prices for a 1 maybe 2 day event. I feel it is wasteful and there is plenty you can do with the money that will see you through better times. Sadly we chinese haven't learn to throw away our damn "face" so we cannot just have simple weddings like in the western countries. Me and my fiancee want a simple wedding. However, my dad has voiced strong objection to it and he will go so far as to say he will not give his blessing if we don't give the wedding its dues.

I know some of you will say "forget bout your dad, its your life" well sorry to say I'm not a heartless ******* who will forget about the man who raised me, fed me and paid my way through life.

It sickens me that there are still people out there who can forget about their parents so easily.

Let's take a look at the postulations in greater details before you embark on false accusations, shall we?

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/20...sex-humans.html

Now according to National Geographic sources, prehistoric men (I should say Neanderthals to be more precise, hence I apologize for failing to be more specific by differentiating Neanderthal and Cro-Magnon) did not have a division of labour between the genders and preyed almost exclusively on game by largely depending on the physically more powerful male gender of this branch of homo sapiens (some might argue neanderthals were a seperate branch of humans altogether i.e. Homo neanderthalensis).  This is WHAT I pointed out in my earlier posting i.e. the male species played a more dominant role in hunting and gathering (not much gathering to be precise). 

Modern humans (i.e. Cro-Magnons) which arrived 45,000 years ago organized their lives by defining roles for men, women and children and this may have been the tipping point in which the modern homo sapiens species dominated and eventually led to the extinction of the neanderthal sub-species of humanity.

A very poignant remark by an anthropologist:

The findings, he added, should not be taken as a justification for the separation of roles for men and women in contemporary society.

"We shouldn't look to the remote past for clues about how we ought to behave today," Kuhn said.

In short, DON'T use the past to justify present day behaviours.

The scientists point out in their study that gender roles were not always the same in early-human cultures, and there's nothing that predisposes either sex toward certain kinds of work.

"That women sometimes become successful hunters and men become gatherers means that the universal tendency to divide subsistence labor be gender is not solely the result of innate physical or psychological differences between the sexes; much of it has to be learned," the authors write.

"I've always been impressed by the observation that female Neandertal hand bones indicate that their hands were just as powerful as those of male Neandertals," he said.

"This indicates to me that female Neandertals were doing things with their hands that required significant physical force."

"Whether this fact means that female Neandertals were performing the same tasks as their male counterparts, or they were simply performing different tasks that required the same amount of force, is up for debate," he said.

"Nevertheless, this line of evidence does support an interpretation that the Neandertal sexual division of labor, or lack thereof, may have been fundamentally different from the division of labor in modern-human groups."

As in hunter-gatherer societies of the recent past, men likely hunted large animals while women gathered small game and plants, enabling a more efficient use of available food sources.

 

ya lo ~ i wonder how SAD the parent of his "wife" ..... must be very sad. they already propose 3k saja, yet still got ppl think they money minded.

oh my god you can actually put your own foot into your own mouth...do you even know how to read that article you provided?
It says :

The olden cave man
The modern cave man
Both caveman from 2 era shows and proves, man and woman put equal food on the table? how many book you said you read? you cant even understand a simple 2 page article and you telling me you read how many book again???  

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/20...sex-humans.html

ok good nite...until you admit you made a mistake then we'll proceed to your sponge question.

Now be a man...dun embarrassed yourself further

Wesley Niewoehner, an anthropologist at California State University in San Bernardino, has studied Neandertal hand mechanics.

"I've always been impressed by the observation that female Neandertal hand bones indicate that their hands were just as powerful as those of male Neandertals," he said.

"This indicates to me that female Neandertals were doing things with their hands that required significant physical force."

"Whether this fact means that female Neandertals were performing the same tasks as their male counterparts, or they were simply performing different tasks that required the same amount of force, is up for debate," he said.

Now where does that say Neanderthal women put "equal food" on the table?  I can treat it as a possibility but it is by no means a certainty as the bolded statement above indicates that the antropologist noted so.  One possibility in another article that I have read (but not available online I'm afraid) postulated that the women could have been primarily tool-makers. 

Note there was little GATHERING of pink and red fruits.

Obviously, this is all academic as even the anthropologists themselves are making intelligent guesses at times but let's not forget this has NO bearing on current marriage related behaviors of men and women in modern society.

Do you DARE to answer my question?

---

Added on May 12, 2009, 11:09 pm
Obviously I read and cpmprehend English a LOT better than you.

Re-read the National Geographic article and tell me where does it state Neanderthal women put an EQUAL amount of food on the table.

Be an honest woman and prove your statement!  The only red-faced one here is you.

Personally I am already lost, don't know what both of you are arguing about already.     

hahahaah lol call me jakun or whatever, but why does dowry still exist?

hahahaah lol call me jakun or whatever, but why does dowry still exist?

I a little lost too but the sources that SPS have attained are notable sources.

@TS, better think wisely before you make a decision. It's better to take some times and work out the problems before committing to a marriage. 

Personally I am already lost, don't know what both of you are arguing about already.     

Yeah lor, they argue like nearly two pages or maybe a little more and I am very confused already.

The gist of the debate is because SPS wants to know, "Why women should sponge of men when they can rely on themselves and earn their own living."