thanks dunsun, as usual this guy are always here to share and give. appreciated.
In the old day, i remember my uncle use to burn tractor tyres or any rubber to create a stinking glue on the ranch and the bird will stick on the glue trap. wonder if it is safe and work.

hope we have a better idea rather than killing the owl as they are also survivor.

State govt should have a positive guideline which will create a winning game for all. What they forgot is that there are very powerful people around that will also determine their faith in their next election and also their well being.

now starting in this from freshman year, i can only try to study the location and also the bird .
how can one know this is the right bird if the bird is flying so high? do u see the flight path or pattern?

dunsun, i suggest a better idea for u so that you don't get neck pain. Put a big mirror on the ground and look into it. i think it helps.

yeah, been looking for the right seminar to go to. Saw the GEM website and the information is very scattered and not much information provided except for their title.

Seminar hunters:
1) Ahchard
2)Raymondetc
3)hackwire...

who else?

---

Added on February 8, 2010, 1:47 pmdid anyone watch anything on NTV7 or TV8 last weekend supposedly a talk on swiftlet. what is it about?



This post has been edited by hackwire: Feb 8 2010, 01:47 PM

birds dont have brakes i guess... but think of yourself as the bird on what you could do to slow down the speed.

i suggest u take it down for the safety of your swiftlet. can u put the photos for everyone to see so that we can learn and also share ideas.

thanks

hi dunsun,

do u mean Negeri Sembilan now cannot have a swiftlet farm house at this moment? how many states have halted the licensing?

check out here , so many people got conned.
http://www.mfa.org.my/?classified:pelabura...est:16777-FRM-4

This post has been edited by hackwire: Feb 12 2010, 12:15 AM

what precaution did you all takes to protect your bird house from the Organized and Professional Robbers who will do anything to rob the nest and also beating up your security guards at night?
I assume most of the bird houses located outskirts are vulnerable to lack of security.

But seremban authority should be neutral right because Pro BH owner also the tax payer right. cannot just favour one group only.

if any of you guys looking for extra supports and group supports in forum or talks , do let me know so that i can put logic into some of the anti bird groups.

its not the matter of urban or agricultural land.

If bird's have the right to speak, than human should be staying away from their natural habitat too. Birds used to live with human together in the primitive time . I don't see birds were the troublemakers but the people themselves.

So if we have more and more honest bird house farmers who follow the law, i don't see any problem.

What if the owner don't use sound. I saw some of the BH in Sekinchan also not not many birds even though you have loud speaker.

I don't think many bird houses located outskirt also successful . If good bird nest house , this bird house will be targeted by robbers. So if bird houses located deep into agricultural land, what type of security can be use since robbers have gun and parang.

Alarm and Network CCTV sure cannot help in this.

So did the guidelines and laws look into the aspect of losses and security when imposing gazetted areas to the bird house owners. Any bird houses located farther away from town will not even have police respond if robbers attack the place.

The guideline must not be a hindrance to those who have the eye or instinct to locate the sanctuary home for the birds.

Last night, I saw NTV 7 even put up the poll for the tv viewers to vote . I mean can anybody who are clueless about the bird nest knowledge can determine the outcome and decision to draw such guideline?

Are our nation full of numb and dumber these days?

Can we have more people in this forum who can rather make more sense than a public voting or any ministry who had never even gone into the field before.
Dunsun seems to be one of the victim that obviously shared the Reality TV scenario or UNcut Version. Director's Chair View of the situation right now. i wonder how many believe sitting on the fence is the right true solution?

---

Added on February 19, 2010, 9:09 pmi see Dead People.
http://swiflet.blogspot.com/2010/02/borneo...t-eco-park.html

I got this feeling that these powerful dark force is in the work to monopolize the swiftlet industry and uses the law to close down sundry shops.

This post has been edited by hackwire: Feb 19 2010, 09:09 PM

I been reading this and as a newbie who hardly know about the history can simply summarize the bird nest scenarios in Malaysia.

1) Political Dato involvement in the Bird Nest Industry using the government mechanism to cripple the newcomers, expansion by current bird nest farmers, talented farmers and new consultants, small business investor (shoplots buyer)

2) Same herd of people protecting each other interest and do not allow or accept views of people that one to see growth using their skills, talent and same time to compete in the world market.

3) Dominion of soverign and territories of successful farm.

4) Disguised as good and honourable figures to lead and to help to boost the industry. ( It's like an old man on the bamboo crutch that also keeping a hidden dagger ) . Always remeber that what one perceived the shape as a pretty lady can also be identified as old lady.

....

Addition to all those...

5) people with lack of interest or knowledge in bird nest farming were given authorities to scrutinize and inspect the place. What more without proper gadgets and education to determine the results of the condition and hazardous farms. It will be more appropriate for agri or vets researchers to provide better knowledge or ideas to improve conditions rather than penalizing the bird house owners.

6) Lawmakers drafting up new laws based on 1-2 prominent consultant which claimed to be the pioneers and experts in the field. Law was suppose to improve the industry instead of protecting a few big players interest .

---

Added on February 21, 2010, 1:09 pmHi Cergau,

As a newbie in the industry, i summarize this problems to find out if any of it is true as what i read here. Assuming that this is true and I also read that there were others like DB( whos is he, what is DB ?) who had gone through the problems and gave up the cause in the end.

For the next course of action, we must first know what kind or who is in this thread ?

First we need the right people with previous knowledge, expert farmers and also new blood to jumpstart this .

In this thread, you will have all sort of people

1) Consultant
2) Expert ( more 10 bird houses)
2) Medium to Intermediate ( less than 5 houses)
3) Small ( 1-2 houses)
4) NEW but no BH yet, intent to go in but afraid.

I believe different people have different rolls to play as well.

First is to re address the 1GP guide line to see if they are practical and logic or not. The reason is because i notice that some expert believes that Swiftlet is not a carrier to avian flu because they don't land on the ground and always above the air. Then there were some who twisted the fact and even publicly address the bird disease as one of the problem.

If any of you want to help in this, you have to come out and meet . this will be the start that will work outside the framework of the association and represent all folks.

[

This post has been edited by hackwire: Feb 21 2010, 01:10 PM

hi guys, i have some request here. can someone post out the full meaning of the abbreviation or short form used. myself sometime trying to figure out these words like PBT, DB etc... . Because there are so many dept and posts refering in this industry, internet short form were used to simplify long sentences.

thanks

The contents in this forum can be use as a guideline as many experts had advise that can really be useful.

first of all, we need to collect the threads from this forum and specifically pin point the real solution.

this is an opportunity for everyone to form a case study group now. The only thing i know of is that if a group of people gathers, than an association must be form . What can we do ? A Special Task Force?

1GP Analysis Study

1) Statistic is only an estimation.
2) Statistic Chart was 10 years old .
3) how they derived this statistical figures.
4)2.1 Untuk memastik.an perkembangan industri sarang burung layang - layang
..di negarti ini ·terkawal serta mematuhi perundangan dan peraturan semua
agensikerajaan yang berkaitan dengan industri ini.

(to ensure the growth of swiftlet industry in this country is control and adhere to the rules and laws of all agencies concerned.)

What does this clause meant ? To control / restrict more swiftlet business in the industry . Its contradictory to what they had said in the public news and media. I dont like the word “Control”. So , even if a genuine hobbyist intent to start a small business , he cannot get the licensing because he don’t know the right people (dato , minister or right hand man officials) and they are controlling the numbers in the territories , isn’t this an opportunity for govt dept to corrupt? What and where is the guideline and limitation of this word “ Control”. This wasn’t specify in the 1GP draft and its too general and can be interpret at wish or desire by the unscrupulous authorities.

5. 2.2 Untuk memastikan aktiviti pengambilan sarang burung layang - layang
tidak akan menjejaskan populasi semulajadi burung layang - layang tersebut.:
2.3 Mengawal dan menyelaras pengambflan sarang burung layang - layang
agar ianya dijalankan secara lestari.

Where is the structure and guidelines for the BH owners to follow? Can it be done by just highlighting the record books? Again 2.2 AND 2.3 makes very similar clause and have no understanding of how it suppose to be done . Lack of depth and poor knowledge already been identified in these two clauses? Who were the responsible parties in these? Who drafted out the clause? We will see.

6. 3.1 Undan~ -undang Kedl Bangunan Seragam 1986 yang dipakai oleh Pihak
Berkuasa Tempatan akan dikuatkuasa bagi perkara - perkara melibatkan
pengubahsuaian bangunan sedia ada untuk tujuan industri burung layang
-Iayang

What was happening in 1986. I think of Penang Bridge and Proton Saga. Can we utilize an old buiilding law for the current BH which had improved over the years. Where is the latest studies on BH building plan guidelines under this draft. I think most renovated old BH shoplots is not a rocket science stuff but as long as they do not create dangerous extension to harm people. I would still love to see the Do’s and Don’t when designing the BH drafted out clearly .


to be continue...
pls input anything u wish to say... i wish i was wrong than right.im just a newbie but im not stupid. the draft looks like a scam to me.

---

Added on February 21, 2010, 10:00 pmPart 2

7. Kementerian Kesihatan mengguna pakai Akta Pemusnahan Serangga
Pembawa Penyakit 1975 (APSPP 1975 ) didalam mengawal serangga -
serangga pembawa penyakit supaya tidak mendatangkan masalah kepada
kesihatan awam. Dibawah Akta APSPP 75 yang dimaksudkan , burung
telah diistiharkan dalam jadual ( Ruj: RKPBV/6/5/1 LLD.IJ.PN. PU 297)
sebagai salah satu daripada ' serangga pembawa penyakit I I oleh itu
pengusaha sarang burung layang - layang hendaklah mematuhi keperluan
dan kehendak Akta Jabatan Kesihatan sebelum mendapatkan lesen
perusahaannya.

This definition is very misleading. Are they talking about avian flu or any of the bird disease possible in the future, seems like their focus is on the disease or virus of the insect. I will be surprise if they can tell the difference between “burung” and “serangga” In this clause , they refer bird as “serangga pembawa penyakit”. If they can tell us that any of the insects that could cause disease or endanger any of the human lives than i would take best precaution of it. I would prefer to be educated on the disease of the serranga rather than happening to me. Who is more scare to contract the disease, of course the people working there everyday and the BH owner, common sense right.

8. 3.3 Spesies . burung layang-Iayang yang menghasilkan' sarang burung yang
boleh dimakan adalah· spesies yang diperlindungi dLbawah. Akta
Perlindungan Hjdupan Liar 1972, Akta 76. Status perlindungan in)
memerlukan segala aktiviti yang berkaitan dengari spesies ini tertakluk
kepada peraturan-peraturan yang terdapat dibawahAkta tersebut.


They consider this as a protected animal but i thought only extinct animals like turtle or tigers need protection. There are millions of these swiftlets now and if they want these birds to fall in the category of protected species than the authority and govt should be more concern on the air pollutions caused by illegal burning and factory waste burning that will cause the birds to migrate to other countries. If the Wildlife Dept so good in protecting the species, our turtles will not face extinction because of their lack of interest to cut down sea pollution . I would prefer the wildlife dept to fine the Department of Environment for not strong enough to prosecute arsonist that cause bush fire and haze in this country.

9. 3.4 Peraturan yang telah diwujud dibawah Akta Perlindungan Hidupan Liar
1972, Akta 76 , memperuntukkan agar fee dikenakan bagi menjalankan.
aktiviti pengambilan sarang burung layang - layang. Disamping itu I fee
juga dikenakan untuk tujuan import dan eksport.

I think most of you wouldn’t mind to pay these fees to them if they have done a good job to stop peat fires and illegal dumpsite that could pollute and endanger this species. Where’s the logic behind this fees? What kind of fees ? Are they interested in providing security to the BH ? I thought more incentives should be given to the BH owners for providing safe sanctuary for this ENDANGERED AND PROTECTED BIRDS. Can we claim from WWF or ask some of the Charities fund from WWF and I believe the govt will help the one who help the govt to protect their beloved National Treasure by building a cave like environment to increase the bird population.


This post has been edited by hackwire: Feb 21 2010, 10:00 PM

alright, lets find the right date for this gathering. It has to start with date , time and venue.

Friday , 8pm at ....?? venue... must be quite , tables and chairs, ample parking space...

let's start the milestone.

actually once the group is form, there is no more hiding behind the cloak . there's no Dr Jekyl and Mr Hide personality. of course the association is not to create any conflicts but to work with all problems facing BH owners.

those feels that its a tedious job or too much of time is lost shouldn't be in the committee as the passion is not there. I know some of you can even travel for many kilometres to find birds but what's the point if you don't built the foundation first and let the problem comes to you. Please discard whatever old habits thinking that your problem can be solve by bribes . Once you are caught red handed by imposters than there is no turning back . you could spent your rest of your money in jail.

by doing right things now is your journey to the first step in building your first bird house with "Peace of Mind" .

Now we could emphasize this to the Cabinet. Whoever have the connection , please repeat this to the govt whether they are in wildlife , PBT, Najib admin etc.

If Swiftlet is an Endangered Species ( how they regulate or determine a species falls under this category is yet to be known but i try to find out more soon) than all Swiftlet Farmers should have Bonus and Incentives by the Govt to protect this swiftlet population by us.

Wildlife Dept must now identify the macro problems that will cause the extinction of this Species.

1) Peat Fire
2) Air Pollution
3) Water Pollution

Anything that can kill or make these bird extinct. What factors are they taking to protect this species?

Malaysia always proud to be call as the First or No 1 in everything but the 1GP draft not even an updated one due to the 2000 and the word angaran. Then the draft is so thin and no details or studies made. Where are the reference or articles that brought them to this draft. Where is the evidence and on what basis they draft out this 1GP.

This post has been edited by hackwire: Feb 22 2010, 12:27 PM

MALAYSIA BIRD’S NEST MERCHANTS ASSOCIATION (MBNMA)

Is this association exist? Where's the Public Website for joining .
Where is the address? Do they represent Bird Nest Farmers of all states as i notice there are other association alike at state level?

Association that use the country name must represent Federal .

Where are their list of names?

Its a failure not to publish it out in the website if they have started this association so long ago.