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 V2. Swiftlet Keeping Discussion, Home of Fuciphagus Domesticus

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hackwire
post Apr 29 2010, 09:02 AM

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very good write up cergau.
look at the penyu in terengganu . its a joke if tourist go there and see penyu behind the glass shield in Zoo Negara one day , i bet they will not shame themselves by doing that when natural habitat of this species was once a gift by mother earth. If jabatan perhilitan is successful in the conservation, than where are the penyu now?? Our govt always allow the one who think they are smart aleck and impose new rules and get away after that if anything turn out to be a failure. They were never responsible for anything they propose, suggest, manipulate, control, touch etc.... they are pirates since , do u think we can ask pirates to stop the treasure hunting.

Let's study back and how to stop this Pirates?

Pirates are Treasure Hunters , they will not give up hunting and robbing foods and golds . They will tax the village until they end up zero and will look somewhere else after that. But they not giving up on old villages, they will come back again when the food comes back.

first of all, nothing happen to the villagers yet in the bird nest world except the one in Mukah.
Villagers are very stupid one, they are coward and obviously they are not warriors. When pirates come, they will even leave the village leaving the wife and children behind. Fight or Flight !

The only law is the Pirate Law and there's not much you can do as they proclaimed that this land belong to them. The Village leader will prefer to submit and anyone who are a threat to the villagers like rebel will be purge. So all the villagers prefer to live in coward since its part of their life that their wife and daughter is a sex slave now.

The question is that How Low does these men want to go?? The women became tougher than the men now after their suffering. So the moral of the story is that those who read this, please for once speak up like Cergau, WW , Lukas, dunsun , tan or lau and a few other more who i think very prominent, sorry forget yor name ... united and fight these pirates until you reach their ship . burn it down and let them see ashes of their ship.


hackwire
post Apr 30 2010, 01:37 AM

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do u guys see the quite similar reaction when the IGP threatened to pull the police men out of the street due to the shooting of 15 years old.

all these patterns seem to be quite identical whether its in the bird nest industry, F&B , Entertainment, MACC, beer issue, pork issue, education etc...

I really see that our system is not heading towards but backward in everything. Is paying our taxes had make them so arrogance and unappreciated to the public who paid their housing loan, recreational facilties, holiday and retreat home , training, seminars, overseas trip and even their salary.

What makes them think we are not paying all these to them and can even make threat to us and want to even cut off the opportunity of others. sigh
hackwire
post May 4 2010, 01:05 AM

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Wow! Lukas, cergau and ww all building up for the Ultimate showdown soon.

This is what i think . You guys are doing the same job but marching in different tune. But that's ok we readers knew that. The one who orchestrated the different tune is the one that's not doing anything at all like Lukas and Cergau pointed out.
Recently , I finished watching American Gangster and i can sum all these story into one short one. Someone out there is doing a good job cutting out the middleman. He is so good in his work and consistently push the matter to the parliament.

Hey guys, this person who we don't know or some of u already know is a god damn soldier that deserve to be respect to shake all the bird farmers out of business. After all , i really salute people who work his way up to convince the parliament whether thru channel or whatsoever.
Who ever is really fighting hard against him better be somebody like Russel Crowe .

Do not get me wrong. I ain't support of anything that will jeopardize the bird safety . That's my priority first.
If the law manage to squeeze thru , i only hope the birds will not get kill for finding place to stay.

What can you say about this phantom? A few of them or one single soul?



My question is ..... What are the whole 100 associations in town doing ? busy counting their money ? I think many would probably thought that , let the leader do the work , members already endorse him , so it's his job to find out since nothing much we can do to help.

I mean if really the cabinet really approves it one day, can we blame the Wild life dept for not consulting the fed ass or people who were long enough to know about the growing economics ?

By the way, Where is GEM reps? I thought GEM is also an association who are very close to this matter? Nobody doing something to stop or conduct an immediate Emergency Forum to hunt down Frank ( First America Black to control Drug deals)

hackwire
post May 4 2010, 09:15 AM

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cergau, i am also sad and sleepless of what is happening to the people here. just look around , only few species left that really keep this thread running or else nothing is special about this thread anymore. buggers came in, suck information out and not willing to dip their hand into the political arena .

This is the culture already build here ... can i use the word Coward Operation. I have seen and heard a few things in my life. When Accident happen, people just want to look see. Nobody dare not or not able to help the victim. Than car passes by look see for drama even on the opposite lane when nothing happen on their side. Than some road bully attack someone on the street, every cars and motorcycle just stop watching the MMA in process like a Cock Fighting Show In Thailand.

The best of all motharfarkar malaysian is when some oranges or things fell off from the lorry, you will see a lot of good guys came and help to steal and put in their motor cycle basket and even drivers stop to collect like a Reality show for Winners who pick the most .

So, i wouldn't be so heartache anymore if coming to this sort of nonsense created by the very own people of ours. I think DL or whoever that gave up on social services already seen it and he is saying history repeating itself and when the things get tough, the tough not going ,an opposite of Billy Ocean song.

The non illiterate ah pek will not bother until enforcement takes a warrant and begin to ask them to pack just like Kg Buah Pala issue. 50 years opportunity to settle with BN but only wake up when DAP takeover.

This will never end brothers. I wish i can do to help but many just don't want to be help when tides are good and water not muddy yet ( which is since muddy already-lah, pure water never seen before mah.)

Than last night i thought of one thing, if all the grouses are made in this thread, there's only a few bunch of us and some more can you imagine how many people visit this IT site. And this swiftlet thread actually embedded deep into this Financial and Properties???? Are we sending the signal out correctly. Where is the ring?

How many of you belong to an association of bird nest, will you please state your association name . u dont have to give us your name. I bet not more than 10 are here.

1) fill nick - fill association.
2)
3)

if there's not even 100 in whole malaysia... than wait till what will happen in June.



hackwire
post May 4 2010, 04:35 PM

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QUOTE(Cergau @ May 4 2010, 10:02 AM)
If everyone decide NOT to tolerate what's bad around us and stand up to stop the abuse, we will not be in this situation will we?
Everyone have their threshold.
What's sad is most have very high threshold and can only be tipped over past the point of no return.
So folks like these have nothing but regrets to share with their children.
The least some of us can say is.....we tried...
Wish them luck when they have to explain if they have left this earth a better place to their grand children.
Democracy-lah, I respect their right to be less than smart.

What's more important is... what do you do with the realisation you have often shared here?

As to yr lament of apeks not knowing better. Watch this short clip below.
Worst things happen to our bros in East M'sia and see how folks (illiterate but better informed than apeks) do.
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x4gqci_penusah-tana
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Basically, even if i know i can't do anything cergau, unless the tipping point is reach. I share your sentiment and what some of you are doing is noble even some don't even have interest in the industry but been following this topic. im one of them, i don't own a bird house but i feel that people who were suppose to fight for their rights were not even there or contribute in form of monetary . if they can't help than at least donate to support the leaders to fight the cause.

How do you fight over something that is in the bloody roots of the culture.

Eg. Very obvious and typical malaysia culture.

Attending a Chinese Wedding Dinner. Time stated 7.30 pm but ceremony begins at 9pm. Can we disrupt the ceremony ? We can't do that. Now everybody making friend through the string. Those who has no string attach like some of you here may not even able to rally. Where's the rally point? The real Rally rendezvouz is actually in the association place but unfortunately it didn't exist.

Same thing in this , people will not act even though many attempts are made to scare people through the rumours and facts of 1GP but they still not reacting to this situation. They will only renounce and protest when their place got shut down.

I recall this situation once before, a lamp post was about to fall but it only tilt at 30 degrees which is not as bad as seem in the eye of authority. But mishap can happen and fell on somebody if small hurricane or windy weather occurs. So in order to get the authority to pull this pole out, we make it tilt to 60 degree downwards and the danger level had increase and next day, it was remove.

So where is the tipping point before the whole members start to realize " This is It"....I think they still do not believe that these guys cannot be bribe.


hackwire
post May 4 2010, 10:29 PM

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Very few good and brave people actually still very positive of the fight , you know who , need i mention more? I would suggest some of you guys really look into this film as the scenario is similar but not close to it yet. The way dolphin were killed every year about 23,000 per year is a big issue as compare to here .

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Cove_(film)
The documentary won the U.S. Audience Award at the 25th annual Sundance Film Festival in January 2009. It was selected out of the 879 submissions in the category.[3][8] On March 7, 2010 The Cove won the Academy Award for Best Documentary Film at the 82nd Academy Awards.[9]

What really change this person life to pursue his goal in releasing the dolphin in captivity is when...read this.

QUOTE
The movie follows former dolphin trainer Ric O'Barry's quest to document the dolphin hunting operations in Taiji, Wakayama, Japan. In the 1960s, O'Barry captured and trained the five wild dolphins who would play the role of "Flipper" in the hit television series of the same name. This pop-culture phenomenon fueled widespread public adoration of dolphins. It was when one of the dolphins committed a form of suicide in his arms, closing her blowhole voluntarily in order to suffocate, that O'Barry came to see it as a curse not a blessing. Days later, he found himself being arrested off the island of Bimini, attempting to cut a hole in the sea pen in order to set free a captured dolphin.[10] Since then O'Barry has worked tirelessly as an advocate on behalf of dolphins around the world
.


Please make a donation to save the dolphin in this website and do promote this weblink to help these team.


https://opsociety.worldsecuresystems.com/securedonation.htm

all of you dont want this to happen one day to swiftlet either.


Added on May 4, 2010, 11:08 pm
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002PLMJ7...ASIN=B002PLMJ74


http://www.thecovemovie.com/home.htm


We are their BIGGEST THREAT and their only hope!

This post has been edited by hackwire: May 4 2010, 11:09 PM
hackwire
post May 5 2010, 06:26 PM

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QUOTE(aeiou228 @ May 5 2010, 10:18 AM)
I think this is the info hackwire needed.  rclxms.gif
*
Yes sir after so many pages . time to write in....no lah! still don't have bird house yet.
but i think when time comes many will rally under this umbrella . i presume they will get letters first from any dept who found them .
I been wondering if the shoplot were suspected of housing swiftlet, can the authority issue warrant from court to go into private property? but i guess they can and as always you cannot as they will have their reason.

This post has been edited by hackwire: May 5 2010, 06:55 PM
hackwire
post May 6 2010, 08:53 AM

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QUOTE(Cergau @ May 5 2010, 08:43 PM)
I believe we have previously touched on the point of Perhilitan's authority on search, seizure and arrest with and w/o warrant.
Their authority is quite similar to our PDRM in both new and old Act.

But with the new Act they are similar to PDRM. (if passed, they are now armed)
see the clause below in the Wild Life Conservation Bill 2010
Carrying and use of arms
8. Subject to the administrative orders of the Director General,
an officer may carry and use arms in the exercise of the powers
and duties under this Act
.


Ensure you dun hire anyone with the name Aminulrasyid.
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thank u cergau, you don't seem to be lack in everything, you should be the committee for the Malaysia association which office is in Kedah, i still disturbed that how can a Federal association office bear an address in Kedah .

lukas, i guess you have a checklist and numbers to call already when encounter such problem. notworthy.gif

I think that's good to have a checlist or 101 Survivor guide book for all . Call it The Red Code book.

Sample:

Code Orange

1) Receive letter
2) Prepare Documents and licenses if have
3) Start Calling Lawyers, Associations, Buddies, NGO , Adun etc.

Code REd
1) Receive Warning Letter
2) Appeal for longer time frame to rescue baby birds.
3) Accept the consequences due to new law but fight for compensation due to lack of understanding in the past and no such law was produced in the past .


Is this a wake up call to some already?

hackwire
post May 7 2010, 11:26 AM

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QUOTE(West Wing @ May 6 2010, 10:14 AM)
Good question and suggestion........... as far as I was told is that before the office is in KL and since  the Executive Secretary is from Kedah and he has 2 of his staffs attending to the swiftlets matter for the Association, it is best in the interest of the Association to move there. If more answers are needed, it's best that you get them from the Executive Secretary or Mr. President himself, I presume i.e from the horse's mouth. The above reason is what I get from the AGM held recently. I wonder if any of the Committee members of the Fed is with us for at least, he can answer all the question pertaining the Association and swiftlets matter here and then, everyone can have a good night sleep. 

Hackwire, Why till now you haven't got a BH and if you have done so, you will surely and truly be one of us, a Swiftlets Sanctuary Protector and you will be  like Cergau cos until you are one of us and truly feel like us, I really don't know where you are standing...........pardon me for being frank.

Do go, buy or build one and you will understand our true feelings, sentiments and love for the lovable swiftlets....otherwise, I really don't believe you truly understand what we are all about........if only we, human being can be like the swiftlets, giving without asking for any return, then the world will surely and really be a better place to live in and only paradise can only be a comparison.
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thank you west wing. i don't have network much on the industry and only people i met are a few forumers here . we had discussion before and some of us still don't own any bh yet and i think i myself cannot speak on behalf of those who already in the struggle for so many years but if they had done so or not, today is the results of what happened in the past . It is not now.

When i saw hills got cut , limestone in perak and cameron highlands, sabah and sarawak, peat fires in selangor and other states of the country.... i wish i could have done something but to the extent i cannot be everywhere at one time and only those who lives nearby can initate it. I had even been invited to be with the NGO who fought for open burning once in Selangor and also met up with Elizabeth Wong before. Initially they are very understanding and later they fade of , the environment director of the Jabatan also see us but her promise is all fake . In the end, we move on because we can't rally enough of people because many of them said that the problem cannot be solve because of the land ownership by many BN warlords there.

I would like to see my own bird house soon but even people like Lukas had sold off his BH due to the uncertainty of this cancer. I feel the right time is when the law is more clearer. The problem in malaysia is that legality and illegal is pretty identical or not much a different. Im also in the DVD and Blu Ray Business and i see the similar problem almost identical in every dept. Malaysia Original DVD is not really an original and many buyers don't know that. Only certain company are legally licensed to provide quality disc.

Moreover, Cergau had highlighted the rights of authorities to conduct legal raid into the premises . they love that . It gave them the sense of power and authority to show off to the public but they don't get the same glamour if they Close Down those 24 hours mamak shop for unhygene food preparation and staff dirtiness.

I think so far, the birds are doing so great and it doesn't really need my help yet. I think Dolphin in Taiji needs our help before this Sept where another killing seasons.




hackwire
post May 7 2010, 08:24 PM

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QUOTE
No reason to ban swiftlet farming
[U]
I REFER to the letter “Ban all swiftlet farming activities” (The Star May 5).

The writer’s concern for the welfare of the birds and his call to allow them to live in their natural habitat are laudable. However, I do not think swiftlet farming is cruel to the birds.

It is true that swiftlet farmers set up houses to lure the swiftlets to nest inside. But it must be remembered that if the house does not meet the swiftlet’s “taste”, it will not stay. That’s why the success rate of swiftlet farming is low at only about 30%.

Now, if the swiftlet stays, it means as far as that swiftlet is concerned, it is its natural habitat. We must not forget that the swiftlets migrated here from Indonesia because their natural habitat was affected by open burning.

A farmer cannot compel the swiftlet to come, neither can he compel the swiftlet to stay. All he does is to get ready a place and hope the swiftlets like it. The swiftlets come and go as they like; they leave in the morning to hunt for food, and come back in the evening – if they want to.

Personally, I think swiftlet farming is more humane than chicken farming. The chicken layers are kept in cages with the sole purpose of laying eggs for human consumption, without once seeing any of the eggs hatch. And when their job is done, they are sent to the factories to be processed for meat!

As far as harvesting of nests is concerned, the farmer knows that his long-term profit depends on the multiplication of the birds. It is suicidal to harvest the nests before the fledglings are mature. Of course, there are some dumb ones but they are the exception rather than the rule.

As for the noise from the speakers, I would rather listen to the chirping of the birds than the deafening music from some shops and the roaring traffic.

What about hygiene? A knowledgeable writer to this column had earlier explained that these birds have very clean habits – they only do their “business” inside the house. So one does not need to worry that they will drop anything on one’s head. Also, they do not hang around food outlets, unlike crows.

I am not a swiftlet farmer. But I know of a small town where, for generations, many of the town people made a living by operating small provision shops. Then the town was invaded by supermarkets which sold items below the cost price of the small traders. Within a short time, some of them were reduced to poverty level. Swiftlet farming threw them a life line.

It is for this reason that I think the call to ban all swiftlet farming activities is inconsiderate. Most of the nests are exported, earning the nation valuable foreign exchange. Swiftlet farming helps both the farmers and the nation. I appeal to the Government to do all it can to help the farmers.

HUMANE,
Klang.
rclxms.gif rclxms.gif rclxms.gif rclxms.gif rclxms.gif rclxms.gif rclxms.gif rclxms.gif rclxms.gif


Added on May 7, 2010, 8:32 pm
QUOTE(West Wing @ May 7 2010, 08:45 AM)
Did called up the Fed. Swiftlet Boss yesterday and I think he doesn't know about the Wildlife Act bill being tabled @ Parliament except what he has read in the newspaper. All the while he was taking are about GP at the AGM.

Thanks for the infos here and I did email him the websiteas requested by him  and will check up with him later and if any news will be posted for all concerned.
*
I think he is probably in the dark or was not informed. But let's cross our finger that he will use his power to get everything right now.

This post has been edited by hackwire: May 7 2010, 08:32 PM
hackwire
post May 8 2010, 12:40 AM

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i assume AF is Aerodamus deciphagus , the correct species for swiflet.

so you mean the swiftlet is too general ? correct me if im wrong. It's good to be more specific as i saw the same case happen to the dolphin documentary lately that Japanese does not recognize dolphin fish as one of the species in the whale category thus it was exempted and legal to be kill by the japanese govt but according to scientist dolphin is in the family tree.





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