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 Fund Investment Corner v2, A to Z about Fund

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SUSPink Spider
post Jun 14 2012, 06:51 PM

Formerly known as Prince_Hamsap
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QUOTE(hafiez @ Jun 14 2012, 06:42 PM)
Hmm, what is ur investment method? [edit] this is for kaka [/edit]

Pink spider, china market now in cimb also not doing so well.

Im more in defensive mode now... Sukuk or bonds fund is my choice right now.

A few in balance funds. But most of my investment already moved to sukuk. Lepak sat.

Later when the fund price goes down, i will enter back. Can gain around 5%-7% more. God's willing...
*
Come come I share my "pie" with u tongue.gif

Aiyo kenot attach Excel file ka doh.gif

26.6% AmDynamic Bond
6.1% Eastspring Investments Global Emerging Markets Fund
6.5% Eastspring Investments Global Leaders MY Fund
13.9% OSK-UOB Emerging Markets Bond Fund
4.3% OSK-UOB Global Equity Yield Fund
13.4% Hwang Global Financial Institutions Fund
29.4% Hwang Select Income Fund

Now topping up on monthly basis...to maintain 60% in bonds 40% in equities icon_idea.gif

In b4 Pinky never likes Malaysian equity funds laugh.gif


Added on June 14, 2012, 6:55 pm
QUOTE(Kaka23 @ Jun 14 2012, 06:03 PM)
Haha... the funds all I choose myself, so got nobody to blame. I give myself 5 yrs in UT investment. If I can see good profit, I will continue investment.

I always like Energy and GOLD as I think it will go high and high in mid to long term. Only buy in for 1yr ++, so seeing RED is ok with me la.

I also like consumer staple fund.. but didnt buy any yet la. Waiting for very low just go buy lah...

REITS maybe? Since many ppl say is good coz giving dividends always...

What do you think?
*
REITs? hmm.gif

Maybe Eastspring Investments Equity Income Fund would be good for u...as it invests in high-yielding equities...it also got quite high REIT exposure nod.gif

This post has been edited by Pink Spider: Jun 14 2012, 06:55 PM
Kaka23
post Jun 14 2012, 09:14 PM

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QUOTE(hafiez @ Jun 14 2012, 07:42 PM)
Hmm, what is ur investment method? [edit] this is for kaka [/edit]

Pink spider, china market now in cimb also not doing so well.

Im more in defensive mode now... Sukuk or bonds fund is my choice right now.

A few in balance funds. But most of my investment already moved to sukuk. Lepak sat.

Later when the fund price goes down, i will enter back. Can gain around 5%-7% more. God's willing...
*
Don't know what strategy it called bro.. I just got 1 fund in PM doing DDI monthly. This will let me know how will be the returns in say 5 years.

Rest of the fund I will top up once the NAV drops more than 8% from my ave buying in NAV. Will top up bigger amount when drop more and more. But sometimes hand itchy, the funds which is already in Black I also go top up.. But small amount la.

Once each funds got more than 10% return, will shift to money market.. But hv not reach this stage la.

Any comment on my method?


Added on June 14, 2012, 9:19 pm
QUOTE(Pink Spider @ Jun 14 2012, 07:51 PM)
Come come I share my "pie" with u tongue.gif

Aiyo kenot attach Excel file ka doh.gif

26.6% AmDynamic Bond
6.1% Eastspring Investments Global Emerging Markets Fund
6.5% Eastspring Investments Global Leaders MY Fund
13.9% OSK-UOB Emerging Markets Bond Fund
4.3% OSK-UOB Global Equity Yield Fund
13.4% Hwang Global Financial Institutions Fund
29.4% Hwang Select Income Fund

Now topping up on monthly basis...to maintain 60% in bonds 40% in equities icon_idea.gif

In b4 Pinky never likes Malaysian equity funds laugh.gif


Added on June 14, 2012, 6:55 pm

REITs? hmm.gif

Maybe Eastspring Investments Equity Income Fund would be good for u...as it invests in high-yielding equities...it also got quite high REIT exposure nod.gif
*
Can intro anything from osk or am investment ar? Coz switching is confirm no charge hi load to low/high load for osk. Am because already got bond, so one or two equity from them will be ok. Can shift between them or to am income fund which is money market.

But I am open to options la.. Need to study eastsprings bond, money market as well. And their switching charges among them..

This post has been edited by Kaka23: Jun 14 2012, 09:19 PM
Manufacture
post Jun 14 2012, 10:19 PM


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From: o( *゚ー゚)┘ Ipoh


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thanks i think im starting to get better understanding on this. for now the fund which I have bought is ING income fund which i think it should be the one you guys said income distribution. my agent recommended that before election other funds seem to be unstable. so temporarily place it inside income fund first. after election will be switching to other funds which is deem suitable. anyway its only very small amount. sweat.gif
SUSPink Spider
post Jun 14 2012, 10:52 PM

Formerly known as Prince_Hamsap
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Joined: Jun 2011


QUOTE(Kaka23 @ Jun 14 2012, 09:14 PM)

Added on June 14, 2012, 9:19 pm

Can intro anything from osk or am investment ar? Coz switching is confirm no charge hi load to low/high load for osk. Am because already got bond, so one or two equity from them will be ok. Can shift between them or to am income fund which is money market.

But I am open to options la.. Need to study eastsprings bond, money market as well. And their switching charges among them..
*
My favourite Money Market Fund (though FSM classify it as Fixed Income) - AmIncome Plus
Its benchmark is Maybank 1-Month FD, though in the past few years it has consistently beaten 12-Months FD thumbup.gif

AmInvestment is not well known for its equity funds...the last time I study FSM funds, not even one from AmInvestment managed to get into my shortlist. tongue.gif

Don't need to switch AmDynamic Bond lar...when u feel that bond is peaking/equities are very attractive, stop topping up and divert all your ammo to equity funds lor...this is my approach icon_idea.gif

OSK-UOB...plenty of good choices:
50% MYR 50% Asia Ex-Japan - Equity Trust
100% MYR (Dividend) - Malaysia Dividend Fund
100% MYR (Growth) - Smart Treasure (last time award winner...but recently not so good. Maybe due to its relatively heavy weighting on small cap stocks hmm.gif )
Emerging Markets Bond Fund flex.gif
Global Equity Yield (yea its track record is not superb, but I believe in diversification icon_rolleyes.gif )
kparam77
post Jun 15 2012, 10:45 AM

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QUOTE(Manufacture @ Jun 14 2012, 10:19 PM)
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» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «


thanks i think im starting to get better understanding on this. for now the fund which I have bought is ING income fund which i think it should be the one you guys said income distribution. my agent recommended that before election other funds seem to be unstable. so temporarily place it inside income fund first. after election will be switching to other funds which is deem suitable. anyway its only very small amount.  sweat.gif
*
normaly income funds will give income annualy. the distribution policy shud be annual income. and it will be low risk too for this fund profile.

waht is ur agent doing is lock the profit and switch to tis funds and swith back to equity fund later. i think u can trust ur agent. she is doing well. but not sure abt 15% returns as u mention before.
MoKMaQ
post Jun 15 2012, 08:29 PM

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QUOTE(hafiez @ Jun 14 2012, 06:42 PM)
Hmm, what is ur investment method? [edit] this is for kaka [/edit]

Pink spider, china market now in cimb also not doing so well.

Im more in defensive mode now... Sukuk or bonds fund is my choice right now.

A few in balance funds. But most of my investment already moved to sukuk. Lepak sat.

Later when the fund price goes down, i will enter back. Can gain around 5%-7% more. God's willing...
*
bond is climbing up while waiting for equity to grow back..
good strategy bro...
lepak2 sat but still make money... icon_idea.gif rclxm9.gif rclxms.gif
KonKam
post Jun 16 2012, 08:05 AM

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Guys,
i am using my EPF to invest in Public Mutual Fund.

I am active on Online Switching but eversince they introduce the 0.75% fees.
Always 1k ++ plus deduction charges per switching.

Can anyone tell me which other Mutual Fund that charges much lower feess ,i want to exit Public Mutual funds?

thanks
SUSPink Spider
post Jun 16 2012, 09:22 AM

Formerly known as Prince_Hamsap
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16,872 posts

Joined: Jun 2011


QUOTE(KonKam @ Jun 16 2012, 08:05 AM)
Guys,
i am using my EPF to invest in Public Mutual Fund.

I am active on Online Switching but eversince they introduce the 0.75% fees.
Always 1k ++ plus deduction charges per switching.

Can anyone tell me which other Mutual Fund that charges much lower feess ,i want to exit Public Mutual funds?

thanks
*
I know it's a cliche...but still... rolleyes.gif

Try fundsupermart.com laugh.gif
MoKMaQ
post Jun 16 2012, 08:27 PM

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QUOTE(KonKam @ Jun 16 2012, 08:05 AM)
Guys,
i am using my EPF to invest in Public Mutual Fund.

I am active on Online Switching but eversince they introduce the 0.75% fees.
Always 1k ++ plus deduction charges per switching.

Can anyone tell me which other Mutual Fund that charges much lower feess ,i want to exit Public Mutual funds?

thanks
*
at CIMB Wealth Advisors Bhd CWA switching is free of charge FOC 4 times / year....
www.cwealthadvisors.com.my


Added on June 16, 2012, 8:43 pm
QUOTE(MoKMaQ @ Jun 16 2012, 08:27 PM)
at CIMB Wealth Advisors Bhd CWA switching is free of charge FOC 4 times / year....
www.cwealthadvisors.com.my
*
search here for more info...
http://www.cimb-principal.com.my/cimbFunds...rowth_Fund.aspx

This post has been edited by MoKMaQ: Jun 16 2012, 08:43 PM
izzudrecoba
post Jun 17 2012, 11:45 AM

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From: Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia


High fees dampener for unit trust

By DALJIT DHESI
daljit@thestar.com.my



Unit trusts are gaining popularity among investors as an important source of investment and retirement savings. But are investors getting a fair deal from the high charges being imposed by the industry and will lower charges really mean better returns for investors?

THERE is nothing that really fazes a seasoned investor. They are used to losing and making money on the stock market. They understand the game.

But if there's one thing that irks veteran investor Jason Yap, who has been a unit trust investor for a decade, is that he already starts losing money before he has a chance to make a profit.

What irritates Yap, who is a retiree, is the high upfront fee he has to endure, and that has a profound impact on the return on his investment.


The upfront fee of between 5% and 7% is rather high and should be lowered for us to enjoy better returns. The upfront charge one has to pay when buying into a fund will impact the returns received from the fund. It is pointless to invest in something that at the end of the day will bite into' the returns or monies received from the particular investment.

“Many of us have taken out monies from our savings to invest in unit trusts. For unit trust to be effective in boosting retirement savings, the charges should be lowered or even abolished,” he adds.

That argument is as old as the industry itself. Since establishing its roots in 1959, the unit trust industry in Malaysia has grown steadily over the years and has really blossomed since the various periods of market turbulence, especially the Asian financial crisis in 1997/98.


Foo says a dichotomy exists in Malaysia where different rates are being charged to different entities.
One of the major qualms among investors for some time now is its high sales charges.

The main grouse has been the upfront charges, which is money people have to pay when they buy into a fund. Then there is the exit charges, which are money paid when they cash out of a fund, and the annual management fee, which is a charge imposed by the fund to manage people's money.

The current upfront fee ranges from 5% to 6.5% on the invested amount, except for money from Employees Provident Fund (EPF) to invest in funds (under the EPF Members Investment Scheme) which is capped to 3% since Jan 1, 2008.

The exit fee may be 1% or higher but much depends on the structure of the fund. The annual management fee ranges from 1% to 1.5% and the trustee fees is from 0.5% to 1%.

A call to review sales charges

Is there a need for the industry to review its charges to make the unit trust industry more appealing to investors? Some industry observers think so.

Malaysian Financial Planners and Advisors Association (MFPAA) deputy president Robert Foo thinks front-end fees should be reduced or completely removed so that investors can enjoy higher returns.

The other purpose of such a radical but common practice in matured markets is that the whole industry can then move from a sales push culture to that of a professional advisory culture where investors can work with licensed and professional financial advisors if they so wish.

“It should be noted that in developed countries like Britain and Australia, there is a regulatory push for such financial products to be delivered on a fee for service basis rather than on a high push environment with upfront sales commissions. In Britain, the government has legislated that by Jan 1, 2013, all financial products are not allowed to have commissions attached.

“Agents or financial advisors are required to charge investors directly for services provided, therefore ensuring that their interest aligns with that of the investors,” he adds.

Foo, who is also the managing director of licensed financial planning company MyFP Services Sdn Bhd, says a dichotomy exists in Malaysia where different rates are being charged to different entities.

For money withdrawn from the EPF, people pay 3% to buy into a unit trust, but for walk-in customers, they are charged 6%.

“Does it mean that your EPF money is more valuable than your hard cash?” he asks.

I think the upfront fee is too high and eats into the returns of investors. The average compounded rate of return of equity unit trusts in Malaysia over the last 10 years is only about 7.5% per annum, and losing 6% upfront is too high a cost for investors,” Foo says.


An industry observer says the Securities Commission should consider compelling unit trust companies to waive the upfront charges, similar to funds under Fidelity Investment, which is one of the largest mutual fund companies in the world with over US$1.46 trillion in assets under management.

Foo says it is cheaper to buy funds through the Internet, for example through www.fundsupermart.com.my or eunittrust.com.my, which imposes an upfront charge of 1% to 2%. thumbup.gif thumbup.gif thumbup.gif

Much higher than regional peers

Licensed financial planner Jeremy Tan of Standard Financial Planner Sdn Bhd says the upfront fee is considered high compared with countries like Singapore and Hong Kong.

Tan says that depending on the sophistication of the product, the unfront fee in Singapore ranges from 3% to 5%, but adds that there is an alternative platform for investing in unit trusts, with upfront fees ranging from 0.75% to 2%, depending on the amount invested. In this latest alternative, there is a wrap fee of up to 1% per annum.

He says the alternative is also available in Malaysia, where the upfront fee is lower than what is currently charged by investing directly through the fund house.

He expects the industry to eventually lower the charges in line with other Asian countries such as Singapore and Hong Kong.

Foo says that due to the open nature of the Hong Kong and Singapore markets, where local funds have to compete with global fund houses at the retail and wholesale market sector, the fund companies can reduce the upfront charges to even zero. Also, there is no tied agency structure in these countries unlike Malaysia.

Lower charges, better returns?

Those arguing for lower charges will undoubtedly look at the average return of 7.5% per annum over the past decade by unit trust firms and say a lower fee will bump up returns.

Tan, however, believes lowering the sales charges will not necessary provide better returns to investor. It depends on the performance of the fund manager or the fund house in relation to the funds invested among others.

Pacific Mutual Fund Bhd executive director and CEO Gary Gan concurs. He says the performance of a fund and its relevance to investors is key rather than merely looking at charges.

At the end of the day, the basic rule of investing is making an informed decision. This means investors need to have sufficient information and knowledge of the product they are investing in, he notes.

MAAKL Mutual Bhd CEO Wong Boon Choy says any attempt to restructure the front-end and back-end charges will require very careful study and strong will on the part of the authorities to make tough changes to the rules and regulations on existing distribution channels which is dominated by a tied-agency system.

“Agent commissions have already been compressed when the EPF capped the maximum service charge to 3%. This translates to more than 50% reduction in the normal service charge. The front-end service charge is the primary means of compensating the agents for the service they provide to investors,” he explains.

Wong, who is also the president of the Financial Planning Association of Malaysia (FPAM), estimates the tied agency force to be over 60,000 at the end of last year.

Meanwhile, Areca Capital Sdn Bhd CEO Danny Wong feels the market should determine the fee structure as ultimately good performance and achievingthe investor's objective are more important.


Tan says the upfront fees are considered high compared with Singapore and Hong Kong.
He says there are funds with upfront fees distributed by banks or unit trust companies as well as those with almost no front-end fees being solddirectly by niche fund managers or via online portals. He points out that there is no evidence of superiority of either practice as the choice of investment is left to the investors.

Lowering or abolishing sales charges, says Steve Lim, chief product officer of HwangDBS Investment Management Bhd, will provide investors a quicker path to garnering returns on their investment, but at the same time, might encourage many to make regular withdrawals.

From the perspective of unit trust management companies, the lowering of sales charge to 3% has helped change investors' mindset and allowed them to realise that unit trust is a viable investment and pension planning instrument, Lim adds.

CIMB-Principal Asset Management Bhd CEO Campbell Tupling says the industry fee structure in Malaysia is primarily on the front-end as the back-end fees are not significant.

Alternatives

“Investors know what they are paying for. Fees are transparent and clearly stated. Investors are free to choose how they wish to be serviced. There are other means of investing at a lower cost, for example exchange traded funds (ETFs). However, investors have yet to embrace ETFs in a meaningful way,” he adds.

With high sales charges of unit trust funds, which generally are open ended funds, will it make more sense for investors to switch their investments into close-end funds or other instruments like ETFs?

iCapital.biz Bhd managing director Tan Teng Boo does not think so. Unless the fund manager has an excellent track record, he says it is hard to promote and list a close-end fund like icapital.biz Bhd on Bursa Malaysia.

Tan says any such fund has to go through an initial public offering process and is not so profitable for fund management companies to promote and list close-end funds as there are no entry fees or front-end loadings or commissions, he adds. At the same time, he says investors in Malaysia are not familiar with closed-end funds.

icapital.biz Bhd is the only listed closed-end fund in the country.

From the company's records, icapital.biz Bhd's cumulative returns for the five-year period (between Oct 19, 2005 and Dec 30, 2010) stood at 109%. (Note: the fund was not traded on Dec 31, 2010).

The top half of the Equity Malaysia Funds (equity unit trust funds) returns range from 84% to 196% during the five-year period (Dec 31, 2005 to Dec 31, 2010).

Wong says that in general, unit trust funds are more popular than closed-end funds. With the so-called guaranteed buy-back feature, investors can be assured that the unit trust management company will buy back their units in the event the investors need to make a redemption or liquidation.

“Unlike unit trust funds, the trading price of the closed-end fund is dictated by market force and investor sentiment. In the event the investors of the closed-end funds want to liquidate their holdings, they can only liquidate or sell through the brokers on the stock exchange where the units are subject to the market forces of supply and demand.


“Therefore, the prices can be volatile in the secondary market where investors may sell their units at a discount or premium. In this case, liquidity is one of the major concerns for investors of closed-end funds,” he says.

Foo feels investing in closed-end funds or open-end funds has its pros and cons, but much depends on the skill and capability of the investment manager to deliver the returns by taking advantage of the inherent features of the two structures.

Tan of Standard Financial Planner says more research and analysis on close-end funds is required before investing, compared with unit trust investment where the fund's objectives of distribution policies, inherent risks, minimum investment period are clearly spelt out in its prospectus.

Every investor wants to preserve capital invested and a return corresponding with the risk taken, he explains.

Currently, there are over 580 unit trust funds in the market compared with only five listed ETFs on Bursa, namely CIMB FTSE Asean40, CIMB FTSE China 25, FTSE Bursa Malaysia KLCI ETF, MyETF Dow Jones Islamic Market Malaysia Titans 25 and ABF Malaysia Bond Index Fund.

For example, returns to date (Jan 1 to Oct 31) of FTSE Bursa Malaysia KLCI ETF stands at -0.16%. The FTSE Bursa Malaysia KLCI was down 2.71% during the same period.

Lim says ETFs can be a good choice for investors who have knowledge of the stock market and have the expertise to make investment decisions on their own. For the normal saver, however, unit trusts tend to be more appropriate as the investments are managed by professionals who have the skill sets to make complex investment decisions.

Gan, however, feels investors should consider other factors rather than solely relying on returns data. Factors like volatility of the instrument and fund size are equally important when investing in a particular fund.

Growth momentum and key challenges

With the current uncertainties in the global economy coupled by the eurozone debt crisis, is the unit trust industry able to ride out the global economic slowdown to continue its growth path?

Industry players generally think the industry will continue to grow albeit at a slower phase. CIMB-Principal's Tupling projects a low single-digit growth for the rest of the year and anticipates the industry's asset under management to grow about 5% to RM104bil this year.

In terms of net asset value (NAV), the investments in unit trust funds held by 14 million account holders stood at RM240bil last year compared with RM44bil in 2000, an increase of about 45% per annum.


Wong feels the market should determine the fee structure as good performance and achieving objectives are vital.
He says that new investment in equity funds has slowed but it is not a significant drop, adding that redemptions are also lower than expected.

The growing risk aversion, he says, will result in higher demand for more defensive and conservative asset classes like dividend-yielding equities and fixed income securities.

Lim of HwangDBS expects single-digit growth this year due to poor market sentiment and high risk aversion in view of the uncertainties in the global economy.

He says the main challenges faced by the industry is the need to address the question on how growth momentum can be maintained as well as to promote unit trust fund as a staple in building long-term wealth. He says there is also a need to change the short-term investor mindset.

Gan says while the current gloomy outlook may have impacted equity funds, not all can be lumped in the same boat. Funds like Islamic and money market are thriving and the factors that will ultimately attribute to industry growth is how well funds perform and deliver products that meet investor needs.

Areca Capital's Wong expects the industry to continue growing at a double-digit rate. With investment markets getting more volatile, he says investors may find it harder to grow their investments resulting in migration of more funds into the fund management industry.

Competition from international players is the other main challenge for local players, he notes. To face the challenges, Wong adds innovativeness and excellent service standard is needed.

It is therefore important to allow different types of business models and strategies to combat that threat, especially when facing the establishedgiant international players, so that each player will continue its role and find its niche within the industry, he says.

http://biz.thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?f...usiness/9729858

This post has been edited by izzudrecoba: Jun 19 2012, 11:40 AM
kparam77
post Jun 17 2012, 06:49 PM

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QUOTE(izzudrecoba @ Jun 17 2012, 11:45 AM)
High fees dampener for unit trust

By DALJIT DHESI
daljit@thestar.com.my
Unit trusts are gaining popularity among investors as an important source of investment and retirement savings. But are investors getting a fair deal from the high charges being imposed by the industry and will lower charges really mean better returns for investors?


http://biz.thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?f...usiness/9729858
*
unit trust still not popular in malaysia. tis is due to no enuf education abt tis industry. ppls dont want to invest not because of high SC, its because the risk.

as an agent i hv many experiance ppls saying that, i dont know abt UT, even UT in malaysia since 1959.

yes, i agree with high SC, but who going to distribute the unit trust if SC abolise? if so, sure UTMC biz will effected. and many agent income will effect too.

cherroy
post Jun 17 2012, 09:52 PM

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QUOTE(kparam77 @ Jun 17 2012, 06:49 PM)
unit trust still not popular in malaysia. tis is due to no enuf education abt tis industry. ppls dont want to invest not because of high SC, its because the risk.

as an agent i hv many experiance ppls saying that, i dont know abt UT, even UT in malaysia since 1959.

yes, i agree with high SC, but who going to distribute the unit trust if SC abolise? if so, sure UTMC biz will effected. and many agent income will effect too.
*
Nobody insist no SC.
But to a more fairer system or more competitive rate.
Stock broker can survive and earn profit with earning less than 1% commission, while UT industry need >5% SC + 1~1.5 annual management fee?

Mind that stock broker won't earn a single cent when there is no transaction done aka no buying (no buy will lead to no sell, as here short is prohibited), while UT industry still earn decent 1~1.5% annual management fee even there is no new investor invested in the UT.

I believe investors do not mind to pay high SC fee for an UT that can outperform the benchmark and give a double digit return.
But the problem is, we had seen even a fund the make the investors loss 30-50%, the fund still charging the same amount of SC and annual management fee. No different with an outperform fund.
j.passing.by
post Jun 17 2012, 10:17 PM

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QUOTE(cherroy @ Jun 17 2012, 09:52 PM)
Nobody insist no SC.
But to a more fairer system or more competitive rate.
Stock broker can survive and earn profit with earning less than 1% commission, while UT industry need >5% SC + 1~1.5 annual management fee?

Mind that stock broker won't earn a single cent when there is no transaction done aka no buying (no buy will lead to no sell, as here short is prohibited), while UT industry still earn decent 1~1.5% annual management fee even there is no new investor invested in the UT.

I believe investors do not mind to pay high SC fee for an UT that can outperform the benchmark and give a double digit return.
But the problem is, we had seen even a fund the make the investors loss 30-50%, the fund still charging the same amount of SC and annual management fee. No different with an outperform fund.
*
Another reason for lower SC is how come only savings from EPF get the lower 3%? Nobody to protect and speak on behalf of investors with normal savings? Is our money not good enough or is it that EPF-related funds are less expensive to manage?

I don't mind the annual management fee. If the fund is poorly managed (performing lower than its benchmark), we can pull out of the fund. That's the way market determines inefficiency. But how to pull out when you already sink in a big fee upfront?


SUSPink Spider
post Jun 17 2012, 10:20 PM

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QUOTE(cherroy @ Jun 17 2012, 09:52 PM)
Nobody insist no SC.
But to a more fairer system or more competitive rate.
Stock broker can survive and earn profit with earning less than 1% commission, while UT industry need >5% SC + 1~1.5 annual management fee?

Mind that stock broker won't earn a single cent when there is no transaction done aka no buying (no buy will lead to no sell, as here short is prohibited), while UT industry still earn decent 1~1.5% annual management fee even there is no new investor invested in the UT.

I believe investors do not mind to pay high SC fee for an UT that can outperform the benchmark and give a double digit return.
But the problem is, we had seen even a fund the make the investors loss 30-50%, the fund still charging the same amount of SC and annual management fee. No different with an outperform fund.
*
Agreed. Maybe a performance-driven management fee structure? icon_idea.gif
transit
post Jun 17 2012, 10:50 PM

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Just out of my curiosity to ask: What is the S.C% (upfront) do you think is fair to investor(s) for those UT Equity and Bond Fund ?

Equity Fund
Cash Investment: ____%
EPF Investment: ____%

Bond Fund
Cash Investment: ____%
EPF Investment: ____%

Please exclude those AMF & Trustee. Hope your answer could enlighten me.
j.passing.by
post Jun 17 2012, 10:54 PM

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QUOTE(Pink Spider @ Jun 17 2012, 10:20 PM)
Agreed. Maybe a performance-driven management fee structure? icon_idea.gif
*
Performance-driven is already there... a good fund with better returns will have more subscribers... the annual management fee is usually a minimal fee and then based on some percentage when the volume is higher than the minimal. Higher performance, higher volume, higher fee.

It is the high upfront SC that stuck investors to the poorer performing funds; and it leaves the market without a fair choice to vote with its feet.


Added on June 17, 2012, 11:01 pm
QUOTE(transit @ Jun 17 2012, 10:50 PM)
Just out of my curiosity to ask: What is the S.C% (upfront) do you think is fair to investor(s) for those UT Equity and Bond Fund ?

Equity Fund
Cash Investment: 5.5%
EPF Investment: 3.0%

Bond Fund
Cash Investment: 0.25%
EPF Investment: 0.25%

Please exclude those AMF & Trustee. Hope your answer could enlighten me.
*
The above applies to Public Mutual - the largest unit trust.

This post has been edited by j.passing.by: Jun 17 2012, 11:04 PM
kparam77
post Jun 18 2012, 12:36 AM

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QUOTE(cherroy @ Jun 17 2012, 09:52 PM)
Nobody insist no SC.
But to a more fairer system or more competitive rate.
Stock broker can survive and earn profit with earning less than 1% commission, while UT industry need >5% SC + 1~1.5 annual management fee?

Mind that stock broker won't earn a single cent when there is no transaction done aka no buying (no buy will lead to no sell, as here short is prohibited), while UT industry still earn decent 1~1.5% annual management fee even there is no new investor invested in the UT.

I believe investors do not mind to pay high SC fee for an UT that can outperform the benchmark and give a double digit return.
But the problem is, we had seen even a fund the make the investors loss 30-50%, the fund still charging the same amount of SC and annual management fee. No different with an outperform fund.
*
stock broker who managed funds still charge those fees. for direct retail and institutional sales, no those fees, brokerage good enuf profit already (buy and sales) even with 1% commision. even investor lost money need to pay the brokerage when sale back the share for lost..

is it fair for investors lost money and broker/remisiers/dealres made profits?brokerage?

if bursa malaysia daily trading volume min rm1bil. if 1 % com, how much brker made daily as brokerage? both buy and sales? is every investors take profits?

UT management fees not relate to investors. its related the fund value and UIC which hold by any investors. it not matter new or existing unit holders.

both stck and UT hs pros and cons.


izzudrecoba
post Jun 18 2012, 02:29 PM

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QUOTE(transit @ Jun 17 2012, 10:50 PM)
Just out of my curiosity to ask: What is the S.C% (upfront) do you think is fair to investor(s) for those UT Equity and Bond Fund ?

Equity Fund
Cash Investment: ____%
EPF Investment: ____%

Bond Fund
Cash Investment: ____%
EPF Investment: ____%

Please exclude those AMF & Trustee. Hope your answer could enlighten me.
*
Equity Fund
Cash Investment: 1.5 % (Fundsupermart sales charge is 2%)
EPF Investment: 1%

Bond Fund
Cash Investment: 0.5%
EPF Investment: 0.25%
SUSDavid83
post Jun 19 2012, 07:43 AM

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Public Bank to launch mixed asset fund on Tuesday

KUALA LUMPUR: Public Bank Bhd will launch a mixed asset fund, PB Dynamic Allocation Fund on Tuesday which will invest in equities and fixed income securities in local and foreign markets.

URL: http://biz.thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?f...31&sec=business
Party2DMax
post Jun 19 2012, 10:57 AM

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Actually on the topic of sales charge, I'd just like to share that Australia will start to ban commission in July 2012 under the Future Of Financial Advice reforms (FOFA), UK will also ban commission by end of 2012 under the Retail Distribution Review (RDR). During the recent Financial Advisory Industry Review (FAIR) in Singapore, the Monetary Authority of Singapore (MAS) felt that the commission caused by the multi-tier distribution structure of insurance products is unfair to investors. This is very similar to the issue of distribution costs on unit trusts in Malaysia.

The trend is do away with sales commission and survive on the recurring fees, which is much more aligned with investment performance and hence investors' interests. Malaysia still have some ways to go, but we can always make the best of whatever's available here la hehe.

On another note, is there anyone interested to win a bit of AmPrecious Metals? tongue.gif
Yes, I'm shamelessly plugging a contest.

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