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 [UPDATE]Opportunity to work in UK, I got the job! but disappointing offer.

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ZeneticX
post May 27 2023, 12:46 PM

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QUOTE(Kakistok @ May 27 2023, 12:34 PM)
I'm okay with the timing, it isn't so bad.
This is an RnD role, and though I work more on the software/numerical side, I still need to be there for prototype testing which is in-house (for component level) or in Germany/Portugal for full-product testing. Again if it's needed.

Good for you man.  brows.gif
*
Offshore / remote working while earning a foreign income is always the better option for me unless you really want to migrate and settle down in a different country

The cherry on top is the opportunity to travel few times a year for those important meetings. Long haul travel with flight and accommodation sorted, what's not to like? Though this perk is getting rarer now in the post-covid era. Companies rather do virtual meetings for cost efficiency
rooney723
post May 27 2023, 12:50 PM

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QUOTE(Kakistok @ May 27 2023, 12:34 PM)
I'm okay with the timing, it isn't so bad.
This is an RnD role, and though I work more on the software/numerical side, I still need to be there for prototype testing which is in-house (for component level) or in Germany/Portugal for full-product testing. Again if it's needed.

Good for you man.  brows.gif
*
so u are in IT or software role? wow not bad almost myr 12k salary in malaysia thumbup.gif , but the UK offer is abit low la tbh
TSKakistok
post May 27 2023, 12:55 PM

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QUOTE(AfraidIGotBan @ May 27 2023, 06:16 AM)
Ugh... Based on my experience lah bro, your utilities is on the lower side liao. I think you're coming over with wife and kids right? (Correct me if im wrong) the utilities and council might not be as light as 200 quid.

Unless you got that 70k annual offer, I think stay Malaysia better (IMHO. If you come alone, even the middle one is good but the offer really jialat)

But I feel weird weird... Why you accounted 400 malaysia travel as monthly expenses? (From my early assumption, its like you're planning to save 400x12= 4800quid for while family ticket back Malaysia yearly)

PS: If you really did, then that's really stressing yourself liao. I advise you to reconsider. Although Balik is important, opportunity is equally important too. Unless the balik is more essential than staying or alternating it to two year balik one time, then its really a stress.
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I have parents at home, and I want them to see their grandkid. My mom retired just so she can take care of my kid but my new job brought me to JB (KL Hometown), and now she is taking care of her bedridden mother-in-law.
Coming back only once a year not an option. Yes, the opportunity is great but I also have to skills and experience to demand. They cant find talent in the UK hence why they are open for candidates outside of the UK. I'm even more surprised that they can't find anyone from Europe. Either they pay lower than what the local wants or UK/EU really don't have enough talents for that role, which would be bizarre, when they have some of the best Uni's and Companies there. And some of the smartest people I've met in my 11-12 years are British guys.

Not sure if it's a low offer just because Im currently based in Malaysia. I need to push them to see how high can they go.
koja6049
post May 27 2023, 01:00 PM

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QUOTE(Kakistok @ May 27 2023, 12:37 AM)
Recall from previous post
https://forum.lowyat.net/topic/5377658

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «


I had 2nd stage interview and later was told Im the 1st choice for the job. I was given an unofficial offer (later HR will call and provide the official offer) by the hiring manager, the offer was quite disappointing, to say the least.
If this was 10 years ago, I would have accepted it in a heartbeat. A dream company to work for, but now I'm not so sure anymore.
Glassdoor stated 5200pcm, but they offered only 4500pcm. Below I attached a calculation I did to compare if it even makes sense to take the offer, and what would be the ideal salary to go for (20-30% increase in purchasing power)

user posted image

Thanks to those who have given feedback and advice, especially the ones living in the UK.
*
To sum up from your pics, You want to quit your T20 job in malaysia to become B40 in UK. Very very strange decision IMHO biggrin.gif
TSKakistok
post May 27 2023, 01:00 PM

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QUOTE(rooney723 @ May 27 2023, 12:50 PM)
so u are in IT or software role? wow not bad almost myr 12k salary in malaysia  thumbup.gif , but the UK offer is abit low la tbh
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No not IT. Mechanical engineering. but I use software to carry out my engineering work, that is what I meant.

Anyway, rm12k I still feel underpaid la for my role , but I understand this is the best I can get in Malaysia biggrin.gif used to earn $USD11k for this same role in the US

Below is kind of what I do

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YEFVnmFqyJs...=BETACAESystems
dwks
post May 27 2023, 01:24 PM

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QUOTE(Kakistok @ May 27 2023, 12:55 PM)
I have parents at home, and I want them to see their grandkid. My mom retired just so she can take care of my kid but my new job brought me to JB (KL Hometown), and now she is taking care of her bedridden mother-in-law.
Coming back only once a year not an option. Yes, the opportunity is great but I also have to skills and experience to demand. They cant find talent in the UK hence why they are open for candidates outside of the UK. I'm even more surprised that they can't find anyone from Europe.  Either they pay lower than what the local wants or UK/EU really don't have enough talents for that role, which would be bizarre, when they have some of the best Uni's and Companies there. And some of the smartest people I've met in my 11-12 years are British guys.

Not sure if it's a low offer just because Im currently based in Malaysia. I need to push them to see how high can they go.
*
Interesting, they vote to halau immigrants from country but now can’t pay what local want for salary. You sure working for such kedekut company is good idea?
keelim
post May 27 2023, 01:31 PM

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Mid - 20s, is a go. Mid to late 30s, too much baggage. From the sound of it, the household need a son to shoulder and perform filial piety.


TSKakistok
post May 27 2023, 01:40 PM

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QUOTE(koja6049 @ May 27 2023, 01:00 PM)
To sum up from your pics, You want to quit your T20 job in malaysia to become B40 in UK. Very very strange decision IMHO  biggrin.gif
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55k is still T20 I think

user posted image

it doesn't matter how much you make, is how much you can keep (or spend)
TSKakistok
post May 27 2023, 01:41 PM

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QUOTE(keelim @ May 27 2023, 01:31 PM)
Mid - 20s, is a go. Mid to late 30s, too much baggage. From the sound of it, the household need a son to shoulder and perform filial piety.
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my mum raised me well tongue.gif
TSKakistok
post May 27 2023, 01:45 PM

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QUOTE(dwks @ May 27 2023, 01:24 PM)
Interesting, they vote to halau immigrants from country but now can’t pay what local want for salary. You sure working for such kedekut company is good idea?
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So in the team currently consist of 7 guys, they have only 1 UK guy. Others are immigrants; Spanish, Italian, Indian, Korean, Brazillian

Every company is kedekut la, which is just how much % they spend on employees versus how much they make. brows.gif
koja6049
post May 27 2023, 01:59 PM

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QUOTE(Kakistok @ May 27 2023, 01:40 PM)
55k is still T20 I think

user posted image

it doesn't matter how much you make, is how much you can keep (or spend)
*
i can assure you that your life in UK will be miserable with that kind of salary smile.gif
Tikietic
post May 27 2023, 02:01 PM

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Hi,
perhaps you can really "test out" your friendship with your angmo boss and sincerely see how it pans out.
it's kind weird though as how you put it.. an elite/rolex class company, but somewhere lacking in compensation. This may reflect in 2 possibilities:

1. your prospective boss is just trying to milk you as much as possible.
2. industry is not doing well moving forward and thus hiring budget reflect this brutal honesty.

for #1, you can leverage your relationship and really see if these so called "pole position", your skillsets, how well you're needed, etc are true.. else, it's just a facade to rope you in.. if you're really what they claimed you are... stand your ground(this is not re-negotation.. but negotiation.. you don't have to give those pathetic although justifiable reasons about living expenses.. just justify based on merits alone would suffice)

for #2.. pandai pandai la.. if things are going south, everything is off the table, so to speak and nothing will be certain, regardless rolex or otherwise.
mystalyzer
post May 27 2023, 02:20 PM

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Simple answer:

If you want to live and migrate in another country, then go
If you want to earn more, just stay in Malaysia

The offer you get is low because experience working in other country doesn't count as much
A lot of people who migrate get low salary at the start, but once they get ILR + UK working experience can easily get significantly better packages

But maybe 5 years is too long to invest overseas. So you need to decide on your priorities
TSKakistok
post May 27 2023, 02:56 PM

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QUOTE(Tikietic @ May 27 2023, 02:01 PM)
Hi,
perhaps you can really "test out" your friendship with your angmo boss and sincerely see how it pans out.
it's kind weird though as how you put it.. an elite/rolex class company, but somewhere lacking in compensation. This may reflect in 2 possibilities:

1. your prospective boss is just trying to milk you as much as possible.
2. industry is not doing well moving forward and thus hiring budget reflect this brutal honesty.

for #1, you can leverage your relationship and really see if these so called "pole position", your skillsets, how well you're needed, etc are true.. else, it's just a facade to rope you in.. if you're really what they claimed you are... stand your ground(this is not re-negotation.. but negotiation.. you don't have to give those pathetic although justifiable reasons about living expenses.. just justify based on merits alone would suffice)

for #2.. pandai pandai la.. if things are going south, everything is off the table, so to speak and nothing will be certain, regardless rolex or otherwise.
*
It's a small but highly competitive industry. As a company, they are definitely up there as one of the best. They invest a lot in RnD, pioneers of new technology in the industry.
They have new investments hence they are restructuring and expanding, project-wise set for 7 years. Their words, which currently taken with a grain of salt.
As for salary offered, looking at the UK salary distribution and even some /k commented on the original thread that it's definitely in the higher income bracket. The blocker now is the living cost relative to my current situation.

I'm in no desperate position to leave my current work. The living cost justification is to show I have a better life in Malaysia (maybe even better than theirs) than what UK company can offer, so guys better step up your game if you want me in the team.


AfraidIGotBan
post May 27 2023, 03:01 PM

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QUOTE(Kakistok @ May 27 2023, 04:55 AM)
I have parents at home, and I want them to see their grandkid. My mom retired just so she can take care of my kid but my new job brought me to JB (KL Hometown), and now she is taking care of her bedridden mother-in-law.
Coming back only once a year not an option. Yes, the opportunity is great but I also have to skills and experience to demand. They cant find talent in the UK hence why they are open for candidates outside of the UK. I'm even more surprised that they can't find anyone from Europe.  Either they pay lower than what the local wants or UK/EU really don't have enough talents for that role, which would be bizarre, when they have some of the best Uni's and Companies there. And some of the smartest people I've met in my 11-12 years are British guys.

Not sure if it's a low offer just because Im currently based in Malaysia. I need to push them to see how high can they go.
*
Oh, no wonder that part there is preplanned. And I thought are you salah kira.

Still, as you said, if your talent is one that is hardly found, I believe it's good to keep hold on that and ask for your desired pay. Although I would say... A whole family coming here is still gonna be hard. 1.6k for a 2 bed is considered nice, but if you stretch it, try getting a better quote/places to stay after settling here. (my building im renting out is 4 x 3bed ensuite maisonnete building. Rental is 4400pcm, and after this year I'll pull it to 5200pcm for new tenants. And my target is also families)

And like mystalyzer said, the low offer is likely because they need your skills, but not your experience. They could be assuming you're freshie for now until it was proven otherwise. (I think I rmb you mentioned you worked in US or somewhere else before too but just guesses, not really sure) Again like he said, 5 year is a really long nowadays, plus you're not single. Back then, ten years wont be long as talents are much needed, but nowadays, the trend just falling down.

Even I hiring for kitchen sifu, I would give good price to them for starter, without telling that I'll cover their stay, their meal, transport, this and that. I will keep that as a bullet to take out and use later. Perhaps you can use this for your advantage, such as asking them if they can compromise you by adding in something else here n there?

Also like what Koja said. Your like will be miserable here with the highest pay bracket. There's so much to think and take care. Coming with family make it much harder. Perhaps, after a year or two of testing, your wife need to work as well to get additional income.
Tikietic
post May 27 2023, 03:04 PM

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Hi,
The other thing that was left out in the factoring equation is the retirement fund(EPF).. being a 5-figure pay, just the employer's contribution alone gives you a 5-figure annual EPF input with an additional healthy +5% returns per annum..



AfraidIGotBan
post May 27 2023, 03:05 PM

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QUOTE(dwks @ May 27 2023, 05:24 AM)
Interesting, they vote to halau immigrants from country but now can’t pay what local want for salary. You sure working for such kedekut company is good idea?
*
kedekut is 1 thing, but worked before always better than not.

Life is full of give and take.

Like my case, I would rather hire a chef that worked in several establishments also won't hire a chef with good record on one cuisine, if the work position is common. Because experience matters. He katak or not not my biggest worry. He can work or not is.
JimbeamofNRT
post May 27 2023, 04:11 PM

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QUOTE(AfraidIGotBan @ May 27 2023, 06:07 AM)
What to do? Nowadays its the happier you wanna live, the more debt you gotta get.

The more hutang you got, the happier you are. Don't bother bout houses, don't bother cooking, don't even bother working. Just leech everything.

In reply to your comment, yes crazily expensive, because accomodation, even covered, you're literally living on land where every inches is gold. A shit hotel room that's about a Malaysia Toilet would cost you around 50-80 normally, and now spring summer, the cost marked up to 100 to 180 average. So that's around 500 to 900 ringgit for a shit room.

Honestly, you won't be able to guess what kind of shit they got in their head. Let's simply assume that to them, freedom matters, hence they can work half year here in south, half year wales, half year in hertz, half year back south, continuously like it doesnt matter freedom first. But for each moving they did, new furnitures, new life, new expenses, new trips, new shits, but no new salary. Sometimes even got shittier.

Or, they'll be like the kind I love my fukken house so much that I'll get a monthly ticket from Outer London to Central London for 300-500 quid a month, yeeha! Im a fool, my salary is 3000 after tax, and I paid 1/6 just for travel tickets, and I not even count my expenses, drinks, foods, etc!

Anyway, food wise, the brits had shit taste. I can claim 100% that their bland food is to make way to their table salt and shit ground white n black pepper to be used. That's the sole reason they dun put the darn salt and pepper into your food, because you know, everyone's taste and palette is different. But slap them with a fukken Chinese food with MSG, they dun even know what that taste like. They say I allergy to MSG, but dunno hantam how many pack of crisp, salt and pepper shrimps and ribs, etc, and no allergy happen. But when eat cheap food for takeaway, "Argh my allergy! You put MSG in your damn food. How dare you!"

Still...

Shit failure country, but still 1 pound = lima ringgit lebih or lapan renminbi lebih. I would rather earn and save and convert them to other currency and become hundred million-aire at elsewhere. Dont forget that the more fools are there in a certain country, the easier to cari makan without repercussion.
*
call me crazy or anything, but I would like to live like this one fine day. away from civilization

user posted image



This post has been edited by JimbeamofNRT: May 27 2023, 04:11 PM
TSKakistok
post May 27 2023, 04:17 PM

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QUOTE(Tikietic @ May 27 2023, 03:04 PM)
Hi,
The other thing that was left out in the factoring equation is the retirement fund(EPF).. being a 5-figure pay, just the employer's contribution alone gives you a 5-figure annual EPF input with an additional healthy +5% returns per annum..
*
Yea, totally forgot about this one, will add this to the discussion too. thanks for bringing this up
miuk
post May 27 2023, 04:18 PM

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QUOTE(Kakistok @ May 27 2023, 01:00 PM)
No not IT. Mechanical engineering. but I use software to carry out my engineering work, that is what I meant.

Anyway, rm12k I still feel underpaid la for my role , but I understand this is the best I can get in Malaysia biggrin.gif  used to earn $USD11k for this same role in the US

Below is kind of what I do

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YEFVnmFqyJs...=BETACAESystems
*
Dude this kind of simulation ANSYS/SOLIDWORKS/CAD type work just try to come back to US to work if youre looking for money.
These days the $130K you quoted previously is like entry level pay in the tech industry.

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