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 [V32] Lowyat.Net Mechanical Keyboard Club

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niakulah
post Jun 28 2020, 09:36 AM

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QUOTE(horns @ Jun 28 2020, 01:21 AM)
if possible, use true 63/37. it's supposed to be much easier to suck it up. i use 350c, touch the joint with tinned soldering iron for a second or two, then release the primed desoldering pump. just did it just now to fix my backspace on this 60%.
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What defines a 'true' 63/37? I'm using this:
RM6.00 | 50G 100G 63/37 60/40 99.3 Soldering Lead Wire Solder Lead Free 0.3MM 0.8MM 1.0MM Rosin Core Flux Tin Copper Sn Pb Cu | https://s.lazada.com.my/s.bsdbi

I have my cheapo desoldering iron that I reviewed in the last thread. While it does get hot enough to melt my 63/37 joints, it can't suck it cleanly like it did the lead free solder. The pump action is also slow like somehow my solder/soldering technique created an air tight seal that the factory did not. Really don't know how to explain it better.

Edit: oh I'm also not using a soldering station, so no temp settings here. Still using my Hakko Presto with Hakko chisel tip.

This post has been edited by niakulah: Jun 28 2020, 09:39 AM
horns
post Jun 28 2020, 12:21 PM

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QUOTE(niakulah @ Jun 28 2020, 09:36 AM)
What defines a 'true' 63/37? I'm using this:
RM6.00  | 50G 100G 63/37 60/40 99.3 Soldering Lead Wire Solder Lead Free 0.3MM 0.8MM 1.0MM Rosin Core Flux Tin Copper Sn Pb Cu | https://s.lazada.com.my/s.bsdbi

I have my cheapo desoldering iron that I reviewed in the last thread. While it does get hot enough to melt my 63/37 joints, it can't suck it cleanly like it did the lead free solder. The pump action is also slow like somehow my solder/soldering technique created an air tight seal that the factory did not. Really don't know how to explain it better.

Edit: oh I'm also not using a soldering station, so no temp settings here. Still using my Hakko Presto with Hakko chisel tip.
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the true 63/37 solder is supposed to be relatively easier to solder and desolder, compared to 60/40, or lead free solder.

the problem is that some brands, like the one you're using, labelled everything as 63/37, but its actual content is determined by model number, especially the variant of the same model number. (model a, b-1, etc.) to avoid such confusions, just grab something like mechanic hx-t100. you can find it at shopee.

imo the slow pump action might mean it's cloaked. just clean up the desoldering pump regularly. soldering irons with temperature control are more like convenience. i don't think it's your issue.

edit:

for now i'm using kester (flux 245; core 58; 0.6mm). it flows very nicely. i learned to feed solder at a certain length for each joint to avoid overflowing.


This post has been edited by horns: Jun 28 2020, 12:57 PM
niakulah
post Jun 28 2020, 01:10 PM

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QUOTE(horns @ Jun 28 2020, 12:21 PM)
the true 63/37 solder is supposed to be relatively easier to solder and desolder, compared to 60/40, or lead free solder.

the problem is that some brands, like the one you're using, labelled everything as 63/37, but its actual content is determined by model number, especially the variant of the same model number. (model a, b-1, etc.) to avoid such confusions, just grab something like mechanic hx-t100. you can find it at shopee.

imo the slow pump action might mean it's cloaked. just clean up the desoldering pump regularly. soldering irons with temperature control are more like convenience. i don't think it's your issue.

edit:

for now i'm using kester (flux 245; core 58; 0.6mm). it flows very nicely. i learned to feed solder at a certain length for each joint to avoid overflowing.
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Pump is not clogged, it works fine in the air and also if I put the mouth flat on a clear piece of PCB (while cold). But put it in a 63/37 solder joint and melt it and it becomes slow. Did not happen with the lead free solder. I wish I had another prebuilt board with lead free solder joints to confirm this but I don't.
horns
post Jun 28 2020, 01:46 PM

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QUOTE(niakulah @ Jun 28 2020, 01:10 PM)
Pump is not clogged, it works fine in the air and also if I put the mouth flat on a clear piece of PCB (while cold). But put it in a 63/37 solder joint and melt it and it becomes slow. Did not happen with the lead free solder. I wish I had another prebuilt board with lead free solder joints to confirm this but I don't.
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maybe you should try out that mechanic 63/37 solder. it should help a lot imo. for much better maintenance in the future, it's better to spend on good quality solder wires, as suggested by veterans like GRexer and quovadis123

tbh i'm a noob in soldering and desoldering. however with the right tools, i can manage my builds now. basically they are just:

1. a soldering iron with functional temperature control, 3.2d chisel tip, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hA9ehTmEfvM (with copper mod, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wtgjhz5sLA8)
2. a hakko sppon 20g desoldering pump; and
3. a spool of kester solder.

i do have decent soldering stations, but most of the times i just use the above.

This post has been edited by horns: Jun 28 2020, 01:47 PM
ShadowFiendZXC
post Jun 28 2020, 03:35 PM

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how is everglide green bamboo compared to holy panda? I saw some reviews from grexer and others in fb mkb group, macam very good.

I bought some gateron browns from quadivos (already got them), but keyboard parts are still coming in and now i already think that i cant be satisfied with gateron browns.

i see drop got holy panda gb ongoing.

GG really rabbit hole

QUOTE(niakulah @ Jun 27 2020, 12:24 AM)
At long last my mods are (mostly) done.
[attachmentid=10524440]

All switches spring swapped to 67g, bag lubed with Krytox 105. Sliders lubed with Krytox 205. Filmed with TX films.
Foam layer between plate and PCB, foam inside bottom case underneath PCB, top case spray painted.
Stab housings lubed with Krytox 205, wires checked for straightness, lubed with superlube. Attached to plate with PTFE tape to eliminate wobble. PCB band aid modded with cloth band aid and lathered in Superlube.

It is a dream to type on. Sounds wonderful. But the keyboard gods decided to play a cruel joke....

Despite my care during desoldering and soldering, I even did a full tweezer test after desoldering...1 key is not working properly. Luckily it is about the only key(yes I have used Pause/Break before) I don't ever remember using, right alt.

Switch hitter registers one press and TWO ups.
[attachmentid=10524446]

Keyboard tester registers right alt as left ctrl, left alt, right alt, and right ctrl simultaneously.
[attachmentid=10524447]

Switch is fine. Desoldered and tested with multimeter. Same behaviour on both test software with switch removed and using tweezers. If anyone has any suggestions, I might consider fixing it, but for now I'm going to try not to lose my cool and just live with it.

Anyway...in case anyone is curious about the PTFE mod.
[attachmentid=10524451]

Hohoooo, I thought I was so clever. Never seen anyone else do this. Most people stick more band aid pieces in the gap. I tried that and was not satisfied with the stab wobble. I wrapped some PTFE tape around the housing and voila! No more wobble. I invented a new mod!

Not so fast...Side effect of the way I wrapped the tape is that the stabs don't properly latch onto the plate.... So whenever I pull out a stabilized key, the stabs have a tendency to pop up a bit.
[attachmentid=10524453]

Well you just pop them back in before putting the keycap back on.
[attachmentid=10524454]

No big deal. Highly unlikely to pop up during use since you are pressing down on it. Still trying to stay cool. I have a nicely tuned keyboard. Sounds awesome. Let's not dwell on the imperfections ok.

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

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cry.gif cry.gif cry.gif

This post has been edited by ShadowFiendZXC: Jun 28 2020, 03:39 PM
niakulah
post Jun 28 2020, 04:26 PM

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QUOTE(horns @ Jun 28 2020, 01:46 PM)
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «
Is this it?
Attached Image

Won't help me with what I've already built but if I do manage to get one of the few units of KBD19X going on sale tonight (and if my wallet doesn't chicken out), I'll invest in a spool of Kester and maybe even a soldering station. Not going to leave anything to chance on a more expensive board.

Anyway, have been practicing on my Cospad today. Desoldering iron still not working on my own soldered joints, but I've settled on a reasonable technique. 1 pump with normal desoldering pump to get the bulk of the solder out, followed by wick dipped in solder paste (I honestly don't know whether or not this is the same as flux, opinions on the net differ).
Attached Image

Not too bad. Clear holes but lots of flux staining.
Attached Image

horns
post Jun 28 2020, 04:41 PM

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QUOTE(niakulah @ Jun 28 2020, 04:26 PM)
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

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right, that's the one from mechanic. it's really better to invest on good solder wires like kester for expensive kits.

thanks a lot for sharing your technique with flux and wick. as long as it's practical to perform effective desoldering, it's really good enough.

to me, the one in your picture is flux. solder paste should be the type that is used for bga soldering, i.e., it has solder inside.


horns
post Jun 28 2020, 04:49 PM

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QUOTE(ShadowFiendZXC @ Jun 28 2020, 03:35 PM)
how is everglide green bamboo compared to holy panda? I saw some reviews from grexer and others in fb mkb group, macam very good.

I bought some gateron browns from quadivos (already got them), but keyboard parts are still coming in and now i already think that i cant be satisfied with gateron browns.

i see drop got holy panda gb ongoing.

GG really rabbit hole
cry.gif  cry.gif  cry.gif
*
just get what you want, according to your own pace.

Candlenie
post Jun 28 2020, 09:59 PM

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QUOTE(ShadowFiendZXC @ Jun 28 2020, 03:35 PM)
how is everglide green bamboo compared to holy panda? I saw some reviews from grexer and others in fb mkb group, macam very good.

I bought some gateron browns from quadivos (already got them), but keyboard parts are still coming in and now i already think that i cant be satisfied with gateron browns.

i see drop got holy panda gb ongoing.

GG really rabbit hole
cry.gif  cry.gif  cry.gif
*
Maybe you should try moyu black. Took me few hours to get used to it but it's awesome. It's very hard and very tactile
niakulah
post Jun 28 2020, 10:28 PM

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Attached Image
I just can't do it. Sorry. Chickened out.

Just a few days ago I saw someone selling KBD19X built with Zilents on mechmarket for only USD350.

A brand new one, kit only, is costing me USD310? Naaa. Even though in my heart I know I'm buying to use and not to flip, it just doesn't feel good to me.

Edit. P.s. sale started at 10pm and there's like 23 units left, so if you are reading this shortly after I posted, you might still be able to get it.

This post has been edited by niakulah: Jun 28 2020, 10:31 PM
ShadowFiendZXC
post Jun 28 2020, 11:28 PM

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QUOTE(Candlenie @ Jun 28 2020, 09:59 PM)
Maybe you should try moyu black. Took me few hours to get used to it but it's awesome. It's very hard and very tactile
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but im using unlubed mx blues now i feel my fingers get fatigue from typing sometimes. So i want to opt for something a bit lighter. Moyu black and HP are both heavy too, maybe after lube will feel not-so-heavy cuz smoother (?)

Now i feels bad for not joining the moyu/bamboo GB.
ntw
post Jun 28 2020, 11:40 PM

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QUOTE(ShadowFiendZXC @ Jun 28 2020, 11:28 PM)
but im using unlubed mx blues now i feel my fingers get fatigue from typing sometimes. So i want to opt for something a bit lighter. Moyu black and HP are both heavy too, maybe after lube will feel not-so-heavy cuz smoother (?)

Now i feels bad for not joining the moyu/bamboo GB.
*
can get direct from taobao ma brows.gif
https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=589344443796

This post has been edited by ntw: Jun 28 2020, 11:47 PM
ShadowFiendZXC
post Jun 28 2020, 11:56 PM

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QUOTE(ntw @ Jun 28 2020, 11:40 PM)
can get direct from taobao ma  brows.gif
https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=589344443796
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GB was so much cheaper ......
SpikeTwo
post Jun 29 2020, 09:07 AM

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Cheap tecware tkl phantom ok ma?
niakulah
post Jun 29 2020, 09:25 AM

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QUOTE(SpikeTwo @ Jun 29 2020, 09:07 AM)
Cheap tecware tkl phantom ok ma?
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For an entry level board I heard it is quite good.

Why do you ask?
SpikeTwo
post Jun 29 2020, 09:58 AM

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QUOTE(niakulah @ Jun 29 2020, 09:25 AM)
For an entry level board I heard it is quite good.

Why do you ask?
*
Thinking to get one of course lol. My membrane G15 not very smooth lately.
horns
post Jun 29 2020, 10:04 AM

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QUOTE(niakulah @ Jun 28 2020, 10:28 PM)
Attached Image
I just can't do it. Sorry. Chickened out.

Just a few days ago I saw someone selling KBD19X built with Zilents on mechmarket for only USD350.

A brand new one, kit only, is costing me USD310? Naaa. Even though in my heart I know I'm buying to use and not to flip, it just doesn't feel good to me.

Edit. P.s. sale started at 10pm and there's like 23 units left, so if you are reading this shortly after I posted, you might still be able to get it.
*
uh? it's always fine to skip. there will always be the next best thing in the future smile.gif

QUOTE(SpikeTwo @ Jun 29 2020, 09:07 AM)
Cheap tecware tkl phantom ok ma?
*
it's ok. it's bad at stock configurations, but it has rooms for improvement to certain extent.
irsyadfy
post Jun 29 2020, 10:08 AM

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QUOTE(horns @ Jun 29 2020, 10:04 AM)
uh? it's always fine to skip. there will always be the next best thing in the future smile.gif
*
yea, every time i skipped or bought something, there will always be something else "better" after.
Candlenie
post Jun 29 2020, 10:55 AM

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QUOTE(ShadowFiendZXC @ Jun 28 2020, 11:28 PM)
but im using unlubed mx blues now i feel my fingers get fatigue from typing sometimes. So i want to opt for something a bit lighter. Moyu black and HP are both heavy too, maybe after lube will feel not-so-heavy cuz smoother (?)

Now i feels bad for not joining the moyu/bamboo GB.
*
heavy switch is good for fingers exercise. probably how taka kato trains.
niakulah
post Jun 29 2020, 11:34 AM

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QUOTE(horns @ Jun 29 2020, 10:04 AM)
uh? it's always fine to skip. there will always be the next best thing in the future smile.gif
*
1800 and mini USB, it's still a compromise for me. If it was a full size, USB C, alu in grey or blue, I wouldn't hesitate even at that price.

I balked at having to pay so much for a compromise. But it's not often there is a bigger custom board available so unless my holy grail board appears, I will always wonder if I'm going to regret not buying.


And an update on my modded IKBC F108:

First day working after finished rebuilding it, using it on my work MacBook...and keyboard tester is all OK...huh? Unplugged it and plugged it back in to my kid's Windows PC, still failing both keyboard tester and switch hitter. Since I only tested it on a Mac before, it's possible that it was actually DOA and not anything that I did.

I feel relieved and pissed off at the same time. rolleyes.gif

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