You quoted me but you don't understand. Tell me, the word of God is inspired from God or from Man? Are you trying to tell people that the mind of God in Heavan is jewish in nature? that Father in Heaven is a Jew? Do you even understand this point? Do you understand what is the meaning "at the core"? Yes I can understand the meaning that God uses jewish settings and I never deny that but do you understand that God is a spirit being his origin is never a jew? Do you understand the meaning of God's word has to be understood base on Who God is, based on his Kingdom which is not Earthly or culturally jewish. Do you understand this?

I did mention there are things that can be understood through Jewish perspective, ie their linguistic definitions but the core understanding what God is saying must be intepreted by what God is trying to say not what a jew would want to say. Do you even understand this difference?

For example, the phrase Christ died for the ungodly (Roman 5:6), that is not a jewish perspective, no culture on earth can understand the way how God thinks.

If you cannot "understand" the point I'm trying to make then the problem lies with your comprehension of what Ive just said above.

Ive already gave you the conclusion on Grace, you have reading problem:

On the matter of Grace I've repeated told you before ......................the Law was until the prophet John

Luke 16:16 (NIV) - "The Law and the Prophets were proclaimed until John. Since that time, the good news of the kingdom of God is being preached, and everyone is forcing their way into it.

This word "The" is there, refering to the Old Covenant Law. But prior to the 10 commandments, before the law was given, The Israelites were given "Grace" in their journey to Mount Sinai. None of them died even though sin against God. Abraham too live before the Law was given.

You cannot use Hebrews 11 to lump everything and conclude, Grace is the dispensation in the OT, because if you read the very last time, it tells you why. They didn't have what we have now, a new covenant that completes God's plan of Salvation.





If you can concur that health and wealth is not a sin then don't contradict yourself with your own statement.

I will clarify that 1st of all, ABSOLUTELY nothing wrong with health, it is NEVER a sin and God wants us to be healthy rather than to be sick. That is a given. This doctrine that is ANTI Health or ANTI against preaching that God wants you to be healthy is something..if you think carefully is what the devil wants. The devil hates you, all humanity, wants all of us to be dead, to suffer. That is what it means the thief came to kill, steal and destroy.

If you say that God wants you to suffer ie to be sick then there is something seriously wrong with your understanding of God. Look at Christ, did He will anyone sick under the dispensation of his Grace? Understand the difference
that under the OT, the dispensation of the Law, it's covenant based on the performance of Man. Why God send curses and judgement because it's valid under Law.

In the Gospel, Jesus healed everyone that came to him, none was left out. They were healed of whatever condition they were in. Bible tells us, to understand fully who God is, see His Son, what He did. This tells me, healing is God's will. Now whether one gets healed or wasn't heal is not the point of contention. Just because no healing was given does not mean God wants the person to be sick. That is an wrong conclusion to make.

In the Gospel, the word of God tells us there is provision. God also allow bountifullness and it's not a sin. I don't use the word wealth because it upsets people like you but point is, God promise to take care of us and allow bountiful even if we are able to believe what He says.


2 Corinthians 9:11 (KJV) - Being enriched in every thing to all bountifulness, which causeth through us thanksgiving to God.

2 Corinthians 9:11 is really material provision, go read it if you don't believe me.

2 Corinthians 9:6-15 (Berean)
6 Remember this: Whoever sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and whoever sows generously will also reap generously. 7Each one should give what he has decided in his heart to give, not out of regret or compulsion. For God loves a cheerful giver.a 8 And God is able to make all grace abound to you, so that in all things, at all times, having all that you need, you will abound in every good work. 9 As it is written:

“He has scattered abroad His gifts to the poor;

His righteousness endures forever.”

10 Now He who supplies seed to the sower and bread for food will supply and multiply your store of seed and will increase the harvest of your righteousness. 11 You will be enriched in every way to be generous on every occasion, and your giving through us will produce thanksgiving to God. 12 For this ministry of service is not only supplying the needs of the saints, but is also overflowing in many expressions of thanksgiving to God.

13 Because of the proof this ministry provides, the saints will glorify God for your obedient confession of the gospel of Christ, and for the generosity of your contribution to them and to all the others. 14 And their prayers for you will express their affection for you, because of the surpassing grace God has given you. 15 Thanks be to God for His indescribable gift!


verse 8 the phrase having all that you need means something given to you. You cannot give out of magic or nothing, you must have something to given. If you want to have such a negative mindset thinking that it means it is something meagre in nature or that it is something you only have then consider this verse:


2 Corinthians 8:12 (NIV) - For if the willingness is there, the gift is acceptable according to what one has, not according to what one does not have.

This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Apr 29 2020, 12:28 PM

Because there are always new readers in here.

As Christians seek after God above all else, never wealth, don't chase after it.

When you have God, you have everything.

But I will not accept the lie that scripture never promise to provide provision or even make record of the phrase abudance, it's there. To deny it is to deny it's truth.

But the thing is, even though the provision is there, it's not for everyone. Why? Because not every believer is able to believe on it.

Don't feel offended if you are not able to, we all grow differently in different phases of our faith. Perhaps one day you will be given insight on this.

But until then we cannot deny scripture truth.

Just because we don't have some of the promise does not mean it is not true.

We cannot dictate the lack of receiving from God (whatever it is, be healing, deliverance, etc) ... make that as the truth in theology.

God is never at fault, most of time we are the one missing something and it's up to us to find out where. I always pin point it to having a wrong revelation of God.

This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Apr 29 2020, 01:31 PM

Here you go again. A condescending tone again and again.
Putting words where the reply has not. Who said that God was Jewish? Who? The one who started to mention that was YOU.
Your reasoning has no grounds at all.
Did God use Hebrew to reveal His message? Yes or NO? If No, please tell me what spiritual/earthly language did He use?
Do you understand that to get to understanding who God is, someone tried very hard to translate the Hebrew message to English for YOU to comprehend who God is.

Do you understand that Jesus used JEWISH parables to show how God's kingdom is like? 2nd time of typing this.

If the translators did not translate the HEBREW texts into English, you would not understand what God is trying to tell you!
Trying to lead you through this like a 7 year old: God used Jewish prophets to write in Hebrew all His inspired revelations. Its not verbatim. So its all TAINTED with the JEWISH culture whether you like it or not. So to get to what God is saying, you have to interpret it through the JEWISH culture, not ENGLISH culture. Kapish?
The only other question to you would be:
DO YOU ACCEPT THE SCRIPTURES WRITTEN IN HEBREW TO BE INSPIRED BY GOD?
If Yes, then you have to accept the Hebraic nature. If not then you are in trouble.

i cannot understand you because your write up is rather all over the place with unnecessary diversions and inconclusive thoughts.

Using one verse as you seem to like to do to create a doctrine is highly dangerous as many here has pointed out.
You stated one verse and forget about the next.



Whats in the next verse?

In Matthew 5
Is the Law and prophets passed?

The English translation of Luke 16:16 is very poor.
The word 'were' is not found in the Greek texts. The sentence should be written as

The Law and the prophets till John; from that time the kingdom of God is proclaimed .............

OTOH the Law is not contra to grace.So according to you:

Abraham and Isralites were given grace till Mt Sinai. ( Yet they were killed for worshipping the calf)
At the giving of the Law, grace is suddenly withdrawn and they lived under the Law, justified by the Law? (How are they justified?)
David received grace under the Law? HMmmmmmmm Law and grace all mixed up here.

Come John, Grace appears again! YEAHHHH!

Sorry. You are worshipping a chameleon God. If grace was so much better as you seem to indicate, God withdrew a better covenant with Abraham and put in a shoddy covenant with the Israelites!

Your theology is very flawed as well as your hermeneutics.

For me, God is very consistent because God showed grace throughout the ages. The reason is very simple: Grace demonstrates His character of Love. That attribute of God does not change with time.
Similarly the Law demonstrates God's holiness and righteousness. Those attributes of God do not change either.
The Law is still in operation. It is not done away with.
However, now its written on our hearts instead of the tablets of stones.

Unnecesary diversion and inconclusive thoughts? Calling me 7 years old?

I don't agree everything has to be through jewish culture, some granted yes but not everything.

If you disagree then, Let us just pick one sample to prove you wrong.

The idea behind Romans 5:6-7....

Romans 5:6-7 (KJV) - For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly. For scarcely for a righteous man will one die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die.

Which part of the verse is jewish culture? ie we need to understand jewish culture to understand the meaning of the verse above.

Don't divert and don't change topic, stick to it. WHICH part of it, we need to understand jewish culture to understand Romans 5:6-7?

Go AHEAD, the ball is in your hand.

This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Apr 29 2020, 11:26 PM

I think I've repeated told you, King David lived under the Law. I never once said King David live under the dispensation of grace. lol. You're the one who seems to be stucked up on this. Seems what you accuse me, really is more of you really.

How were the Israelites judged? Read what happened after the Law was given. They murmured against God and were judged, but during their journey to mount sinai, nobody died. This is just one example.

The Law and the prophet till John. So how is the phrase "till" difficult for you to understand? That still explains the dispensation of the Law. Sorry but your argument is flawed here, using the excuse poor translation does not cut it.

What about the next verse? Read it carefully.

Verse 17
17 It is easier for heaven and earth to disappear than for the least stroke of a pen to drop out of the Law.

Matthew 5
17“Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18 For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.

Who is the one qualified to fufill the Law? You mean Christ did not complete the fufillment of the Law?

Acts 13:39 (KJV) - And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses.

Romans 10:4 (KJV) - For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

Christ has fufilled it, so now is the dispensation of Grace. Good that you mention on what is written in our heart. then by the same token, you also need to accept Christ has finished God's divine work else you contradict yourself.

Hebrews 10

17 Then He adds:
“Their sins and lawless acts
I will remember no more.”

18 And where these have been forgiven, an offering for sin is no longer needed.

Good then, it's inline with what I share.

I'm worshipping a Chameleon God? Be careful of what you are saying here. But I will submit to my God, the Lord Bless you.

This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Apr 29 2020, 11:03 PM

Christian using a degorative words and you have the gumption to label me?

Yankee is a degorative term.

So you're saying you hated so much of the American translation of the Bible, you call them as Yankee?

That's quite high and mighty of you.

=========================================================

https://www.quora.com/Is-it-offensive-to-ca...mericans-Yankee

Well english language class again. You realise there is a baseball team called Newyork yankee?


Dude, get some life

And I have to explain to you why it's degorative.

It depends on how you use it.

Picking out verses again? That's your skill, is it not?

Romans 9 to 11. As Jewish as you like.
Add in Chap 7 Paul refers back to?
If the translators did not translate the HEBREW texts into English, you would not understand what God is trying to tell you!
Trying to lead you through this like a 7 year old: God used Jewish prophets to write in Hebrew all His inspired revelations. Its not verbatim. So its all TAINTED with the JEWISH culture whether you like it or not. So to get to what God is saying, you have to interpret it through the JEWISH culture, not ENGLISH culture. Kapish?
The only other question to you would be:
DO YOU ACCEPT THE SCRIPTURES WRITTEN IN HEBREW TO BE INSPIRED BY GOD?
7 Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?
2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.
3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.
4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

All these were written in GREEK, not English. Even written in Greek, they contain Paul's Jewish worldview.




Look. If you are goung to pick out verses on its own, you can even make God to be your genie!

This post has been edited by prophetjul: Apr 30 2020, 10:47 AM

AND I SHOWED YOU DAVID WAS UNDER GRACE UMPTEEN TIMES!




See how you like to avoid the questions you cannot answer

AND FOR THE UMPTEEN TIME,

HOW WERE THE ISRAELITES AND THE REST OF THE SAGES JUSTIFIED UNDER YOUR "DSIPENSATION OF LAW"?




Reading in English again.

The Law and prophets till John, the kingdom of God is preached...……

Why are you reading as if the Law and the prophets is ended at with John? Because you read with 'were'.
Why should it even end when Jesus said Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Is all fulfilled yet? Are all the OT prophecies fulfilled yet?

And here is the thing about JEWISH understanding of what Jesus is saying about fulfilling of the Law. In Rabbinic understanding fulfilling of the Law is to teach the Law properly . To destroy the Law is to teach it incorrectly like the Pharisees.
That's the reason you see Jesus teaching about the Law in the following chapters. And I have shared this before. Obviosuly you aren't interested as you seem to deem English scriptures were the original texts!

Pickin out a verse to justify the end of the law is just poor hermeneutics as you have demonstrated again and again.
The Law is written in our hearts, no longer on stones.

Heb 8: 10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

And yes, the God you are describing changes His attributes along the way like a chameleon changes colours.
The God described in scriptures does not change His character and attributes.
Grace is the demonstration of HIs Love, compassion and the Law is the demonstration of His holiness and righteousness.

This post has been edited by prophetjul: Apr 30 2020, 10:51 AM

TS, I suggest to close this thread
no point....K has too many trolls.

No. See how you are always misinterpreting?
I was going on about the HERETIC Word faith, health and wealth gospel and suddenly you changed this to connection with American translations of the Bible?

You are something else.

And YES, I will be derogatory about the Yankee Word faith heresy.





This post has been edited by prophetjul: Apr 30 2020, 10:43 AM

I appreciate everyone's teaching and guidance thus far in this thread.

And I see senses on both sides. Can we do fellowshipping for once?

We have to acknowledge any medium of communication has its limit email, calls, and here a thread...

Here we speak of God's grace. What about our own grace (rather attending to one's ego)?

It just proves again and again that different Protestant groups have different interpretations of the Bible. Unfortunately that comment was deleted by UW even though it's a fact.

Romans also have their different interpretations, not just Protestants. Remember protestants came out from you.

You Romans are just so pagan. At least our differences are not major differences most times.
Whereas you Romans have a different gospel and a different godlike Mary.

This post has been edited by prophetjul: Apr 30 2020, 11:06 AM