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RTS Starcraft 2, New Units with Video and Explanation.

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Cheesenium
post Apr 4 2008, 12:23 PM

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QUOTE(TheNameX @ Apr 4 2008, 09:50 AM)
Well... it's all about balance and advance. If you want new stuff, expect the game balance to be teetered away. If you keep the game old school, you had your balance, well, as long as the successor is built upon "balance" predecessor. We all know SC is the most balance RTS till date, so should Blizzard keep the SC system in tact, it should be a balance game. Look at Relic, I like Relic's products, each of new title bring surprise, but the game balance is totally broken, look at DoW, how broken is it (race balance) and it's near to impossible to balance out a 9 races RTS game. And I believe this happened in C&C3 as well.

So you want new stuff, then better dont whine if the game balance goes broken. Same goes if you want a balance game, dont expect the gameplay to have a 360 degrees changes.
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I dont mind if an RTS is broken in same way not until like DC's Death March or SS's SoB resource bug.

Frankly saying,i prefer a RTS with a proper balance between innovation and balance.SC2 is on the extreme end of balance which starts to put me off now.
StarGhazzer
post Apr 4 2008, 02:40 PM

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QUOTE(Cheesenium @ Apr 4 2008, 12:23 PM)
I dont mind if an RTS is broken in same way not until like DC's Death March or SS's SoB resource bug.

Frankly saying,i prefer a RTS with a proper balance between innovation and balance.SC2 is on the extreme end of balance which starts to put me off now.
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I agree with you on this part. In order to "balance" everything they are now taking away the unique identities of each race and nerfing too many innovative units.

Then again, it's not even in beta stage yet so there's still hope.
WilliamG
post Apr 4 2008, 04:09 PM

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Wahahahah!! I was at the wrong tab!!!! SRY GUYS!!!! blush.gif btw when is the release date ...i mean starcraft 2

This post has been edited by WilliamG: Apr 4 2008, 04:14 PM
TheNameX
post Apr 4 2008, 04:12 PM

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QUOTE(StarGhazzer @ Apr 4 2008, 02:40 PM)
I agree with you on this part. In order to "balance" everything they are now taking away the unique identities of each race and nerfing too many innovative units.

Then again, it's not even in beta stage yet so there's still hope.
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I aint sure about that part of taking away each race uniqueness though, what Blizzard is showing now is like new uniqueness for each race. But still, too early to tell.

QUOTE(WilliamG @ Apr 4 2008, 04:09 PM)
Anyone here noe where can i get those guide book on The Sims 2?Wish to hav one bout open business de....saw it at austrilia but no chance to get it....owes no stock but now im back to kuching alredi and i cant find things like that here =.="

Saw it on ebay oso but donno how to buy...any idea?
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Sim 2 ?? Wrong place la bro.
Soul-X
post Apr 4 2008, 04:43 PM

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Nomatter what, i still have confidence in blizzard, i think they will make it very good in the final "gua"
Cheesenium
post Apr 4 2008, 06:36 PM

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QUOTE(StarGhazzer @ Apr 4 2008, 02:40 PM)
I agree with you on this part. In order to "balance" everything they are now taking away the unique identities of each race and nerfing too many innovative units.

Then again, it's not even in beta stage yet so there's still hope.
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Yeah,there are several cool stuff like single Mothership,the old Thor(but i wonder how to carry it from one island to another),the old Viking(starts as robot,upgrade to plane),Cobra and a few others.

QUOTE(TheNameX @ Apr 4 2008, 04:12 PM)
I aint sure about that part of taking away each race uniqueness though, what Blizzard is showing now is like new uniqueness for each race. But still, too early to tell.
Sim 2 ?? Wrong place la bro.
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I dont think so.The current Terran is almost the same as SC1 terran like Thor is the new Goliath,Viking as the new Wraith,Banshee take Valyrie's place,Battlecruiser is still battlecruiser and others.Thats not what i call uniqueness. What am i trying to say is Terran in SC2 is almost the same as Terran as SC1.The new units feels like an old SC1 unit with new abilities.Terran used to be cool before they start nerfing.Same thing as Protoss.

Protoss is fine and Zerg rocks.Zerg's queen concept is great.If they take that,the flying jelly fish and roaches away,i can forget about SC2.

QUOTE(Soul-X @ Apr 4 2008, 04:43 PM)
Nomatter what, i still have confidence in blizzard, i think they will make it very good in the final "gua"
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Hope so but now the balancing is just bad.
StarGhazzer
post Apr 4 2008, 10:06 PM

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Like what Cheesenium said, the new nerfed units makes the Terran look like the old space cowboys with new names.

The Thor's original role of a slow but powerful siege unit was good, if not awesome. Yes, it might be slow, but with supporting units it can take out a base easily with it's barrage attacks. Now the current GtA role of the Thor is reminiscence of an oversized Goliath which appears even later than before. It's bulk will cause it to suffer against more agile air units, so how is it going to be an effective GtA unit?

Bring back the old mighty Thor. Even though it might have some overlap with the siege tank, it's still much more formidable as it has shit loads of HP to soak up pressure unlike the Tank which is relatively easily destroyed.

Marauders seem really redundant. It's as if they took the concussion attack from the Vulture and stuck it onto an infantry unit. Again as I've mentioned before, I rather have a high speed, agile unit than a normal speed infantry. Plus it has mines too.

Banshee without the splash damage is essentially a Guardian that cloaks. Detectors will be quite accessible by the time Banshees can be made, so the cloaking ability is less important.

And I want my Vikings to remain as Goliath replacements with the air mode as a mobility advantage; rather than an uncloakable wraith with fancy legs. If Vikings are treated as air assault units, why do they need legs anyway? dry.gif

Ghost... blah... apart from the Nukes and Pods it seems that Blizzard is forcing people to use them as main infantry units besides Marines. Snipe is good for taking out templars, but it might take quite a lot of micro. I have no idea why they want to make the ghost so heavily armed with abilities.

Spell casting = Diablo/Dota... RTS should be more focused on macro with minimal ability casting.

Yeah, I'm complaining a lot about the Terrans coz I think they are nerfed too much. Protoss seems much more complete, and now they even seem overpowered with so many spells. Bah... space Egyptian Ninjas.

This post has been edited by StarGhazzer: Apr 4 2008, 10:09 PM
Cheesenium
post Apr 4 2008, 10:34 PM

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QUOTE(StarGhazzer @ Apr 4 2008, 10:06 PM)
Like what Cheesenium said, the new nerfed units makes the Terran look like the old space cowboys with new names.

The Thor's original role of a slow but powerful siege unit was good, if not awesome. Yes, it might be slow, but with supporting units it can take out a base easily with it's barrage attacks. Now the current GtA role of the Thor is reminiscence of an oversized Goliath which appears even later than before. It's bulk will cause it to suffer against more agile air units, so how is it going to be an effective GtA unit?

Bring back the old mighty Thor. Even though it might have some overlap with the siege tank, it's still much more formidable as it has shit loads of HP to soak up pressure unlike the Tank which is relatively easily destroyed.

Marauders seem really redundant. It's as if they took the concussion attack from the Vulture and stuck it onto an infantry unit. Again as I've mentioned before, I rather have a high speed, agile unit than a normal speed infantry. Plus it has mines too.

Banshee without the splash damage is essentially a Guardian that cloaks. Detectors will be quite accessible by the time Banshees can be made, so the cloaking ability is less important.

And I want my Vikings to remain as Goliath replacements with the air mode as a mobility advantage; rather than an uncloakable wraith with fancy legs. If Vikings are treated as air assault units, why do they need legs anyway? dry.gif

Ghost... blah... apart from the Nukes and Pods it seems that Blizzard is forcing people to use them as main infantry units besides Marines. Snipe is good for taking out templars, but it might take quite a lot of micro. I have no idea why they want to make the ghost so heavily armed with abilities.

Spell casting = Diablo/Dota... RTS should be more focused on macro with minimal ability casting.

Yeah, I'm complaining a lot about the Terrans coz I think they are nerfed too much. Protoss seems much more complete, and now they even seem overpowered with so many spells. Bah... space Egyptian Ninjas.
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What i would prefer is that Siege Tank is remove from the game,let Thor to be the main siege unit like CoH's Brit arty that can fire into fow.I do agree that the original Thor's role overlap with Siege tank's role.

Viking as Goliath replacement with weak air attack.Just like the way it is when Terran first announced.

Marauders is not too bad for me but Jackal must be out of the game.It's probably one of the ugliest unit i ever seen.Besides,it's Vulture with wheels.

Bring back Cobra.At least it feels like upgraded version of Vulture.

Im fine with Banshee but hope to see Predator back with the ability to destroy incoming projectiles.Predator is cool.

Ghost,just not too many spells.It's a bloody spell caster now.This is Starcraft,not Warcraft in space.

Medic must be in the game,not the stupid Medicvac.

The drop pods feels like another rip off from Warhammer 40k.

Protoss,i would prefer them not to have the Egyptian look.SC1's Protoss is cool but SC2's Protoss feels like some WC3 units in space.Besides,psi blades and khaydarin crystals should be blue for gawd sakes.We are not blind,and we can differentiate colours.

Thats pretty much my complains but no one would care anyway.Pretty much a rant.

It feels like SC2 is just made for the pros,not average joe gamers like me.It just seems like the old SC1 feeling is not there anymore.It's Warcraft in space!

This post has been edited by Cheesenium: Apr 4 2008, 10:34 PM
StarGhazzer
post Apr 14 2008, 03:49 PM

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» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

http://www.battle.net/forums/thread.aspx?F...ThreadID=851269

More beef for the already overpowered Protoss. The carrier now comes with premade Interceptors, and as if it's not powerful enough it gets new toys.

No comments on the Zerg since it's still pretty much premature at this stage.

I'm still dumbfounded by the Medivac. The original purpose is for it to follow Reapers to heal them when they raid bases, but isn't the reaper supposed to be hit and run? Jump up a cliff, shoot/throw bombs, scram ASAP. And one could easily put a medic below the cliff awaiting the retreating Reapers just to heal them as they run back to the base. Bad move to scrap the medic, Blizzard... now marines are going to be cooked alive in early game before the Starport becomes available.

Dump the medivac, bring back the sweet medic. Medivacs are just too lategame to be useful.

If I had one wish for the Reaper, it'll be for them to be airborne like Red Alert 2's rocketeers. Maybe not full time air borne, but possibly an energy costing ability like the cloak. That'll make them useful in scouting + infantry killing (esp zealots + zerglings) plus they can still raid bases... think Tanya/Navy Seal.
Cheesenium
post Apr 14 2008, 08:24 PM

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I hate Medivac.It's one of the stupid units like Jackal or Statis Orb.

Reaper,on the other hand,im find with the way they are now.They are pretty good now.Maybe a DoW ASM style of jumping will be sweet too.
redeye84
post Apr 14 2008, 10:02 PM

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... Cant you all just wait for the actual game to comeout.. than to go around WTFing everything that announce...
hizperion
post Apr 15 2008, 10:23 AM

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but dead thread will be removed from track list sad.gif
StarGhazzer
post Apr 15 2008, 10:29 AM

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QUOTE(redeye84 @ Apr 14 2008, 10:02 PM)
... Cant you all just wait for the actual game to comeout.. than to go around WTFing everything that announce...
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Can't we all talk and moan about it? It's good to have an insight about how other LYN members feel about the various changes from SC1 to SC2... If we can't discuss and speculate then let the mods shut this thread down.

Good things we praise, bad things we condemn... simple as that.
hizperion
post Apr 15 2008, 10:45 AM

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yeah..can't expect people come in and say 'this game still alive!?' 'wah still remember i play starcraft 10 years ago' everytime. lol.
Cheesenium
post Apr 15 2008, 11:04 AM

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QUOTE(redeye84 @ Apr 14 2008, 10:02 PM)
... Cant you all just wait for the actual game to comeout.. than to go around WTFing everything that announce...
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Blizzard cares what we moan.It's still alpha and they still can change it for good if it's reasonable.
RtP|DEV
post Apr 15 2008, 12:44 PM

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Automine, autocast and multi building selection(MBS) is for noobs. Pls Blizzard, dont mess this game.
I dont care if this game have many spells as long they don't implement autocast like WC3.
Macroing from 14 gates is orgasm, pls no MBS blizzard.
3 base automine and MBS is doh.gif

I dont care if they release this game 2,3 years from now. The game must be perfect, worthy of its title.

Beast-Slayer
post Apr 15 2008, 01:03 PM

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cant wait... yet still no release date right?
Cheesenium
post Apr 15 2008, 04:10 PM

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QUOTE(RtP|DEV @ Apr 15 2008, 12:44 PM)
Automine, autocast and multi building selection(MBS) is for noobs. Pls Blizzard, dont mess this game.
I dont care if this game have many spells as long they don't implement autocast like WC3.
Macroing from 14 gates is orgasm, pls no MBS blizzard.
3 base automine and MBS is  doh.gif

I dont care if they release this game 2,3 years from now. The game must be perfect, worthy of its title.
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If every single thing is design for the pro,what about the average gamers?They dont have to play SC2 and play some other RTS?

Seriously,whats wrong with automine?It's a freaking common feature in any RTS now.It's just like Rally Point in any RTS.

The more i see SC2,the more i feel it's only for the pros.Everything is tailored for them.Even Khaydarin Crystals needs to be team coloured because of them. doh.gif
frags
post Apr 15 2008, 04:32 PM

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QUOTE(Cheesenium @ Apr 15 2008, 04:10 PM)
If every single thing is design for the pro,what about the average gamers?They dont have to play SC2 and play some other RTS?

Seriously,whats wrong with automine?It's a freaking common feature in any RTS now.It's just like Rally Point in any RTS.

The more i see SC2,the more i feel it's only for the pros.Everything is tailored for them.Even Khaydarin Crystals needs to be team coloured because of them. doh.gif
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Ahh the debate of building for the pros or the masses tongue.gif I think the final game should be one balanced between the two...it cant go to much into one side.
Cheesenium
post Apr 15 2008, 05:39 PM

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I hope so cause almost everything is made for them now.

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