you cannot enter with the minimum of bbb........the minimum is abb, if there are not so many applicants........many scholars have aab or even aaa.........

yes, you will be surprised........most of the scholars have a-levels.........and while they make up about a quarter of the students, often, more than half of failures are scholars......

i am not sure if your misconception is real or contrived........

but scholars here means jpa/mara scholarship students........

current a-levels results have been dumbed down (or students smarted up, depending on your point of view), and aaa means little, up to a quarter of students in any subject will get an a grade.....

which is why they came up with the a*, to sub stratify the big aaa band........

therefore, abb is quite mediocre results.........and will certainly NOT get you into any uk med school directly.......

and even if you were an a-level aaa student, you WILL fail in med school, if you don't keep up........especially in eos2 at imu, when they shrink down the class to fit the number of available places in the clinical schools........

it is logical to expect that the number of students with rich parents/sponsors is finite, and with the great increase in the actual number of medicine seats in ipts within the last 2-3 years, med schools will have to scrape lower at the bottom of the 'rich' barrel, and hence poorer quality students......

the irony is, there is a big barrel labeled 'poor' with many excellent students, which these ipts med schools are not bothered about........

finally, there is now STILL a problem with scholars.........which is ironic, as by definition, 'scholars' should be academically scholastic across the board........which begs the question how scholars are selected.......

msia will not reach tipping point..........the whole country is a case study on mediocrity......of running everything to the lowest common denominator.....

the selection and training of doctors is just par for the course..........

remember, meritocracy is a racist idea......according to some people.....

you are not making sense.........they have received your application fees, and you are asking if you need to pay first???.......

there is no such thing....

you wouldn't get in with ter85.....it varies from batch to batch, but normally the cut off is between 91 and 94.........

no they do not necessarily will call for interview......and the interview counts for very little, the most important question whey want answered is whether you have enough money or not.......

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Added on September 25, 2010, 7:55 amyou cannot get in with the minimum bbc anymore.....that could change, as more new med schools starts, and the number of rich students is finite........

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Added on September 25, 2010, 8:00 amplaces down south has been decreasing since 2 years ago, after melbourne went graduate entry, and nz scale down (they used to take not 10, but 20 students per batch).....it will shrink some more, when nz backs out, and uwa goes graduate entry.......but the graduate entry places has increased(stay back for 1 year bmedsc).......and places in uk is also up.......and they will always fail enough people at eos2 to shrink down to the correct size......


This post has been edited by limeuu: Sep 25 2010, 08:00 AM

if postgraduate training in these countries is the aim, one should go to uk instead of oz.....postgraduate training opportunities is notoriously difficult in australasia.........and under current 'new' immigration and labour laws, staying back and doing post graduate specialist training is again available for foreigners.....

as for smc recognition (looks like it is a bog issue for some people!), it's a matter of time before these new med schools is recognised......

warwick is actually an excellent uni.....and graduate entry btw.....and keele has a longstanding postgraduate medical programme, although the undergraduate med school is new....

one should familiarise oneself with the relevant immigration rules and laws, of the places one goes to study, so one knows exactly what is possible and what is not.....it matters not in russia, indonesia, india, as nobody stays back, but is important in the oecd countries.....

one is a foreigner there, and hence subject to whatever rules and laws governing foreigners......including ability to find employment, and for doctors, ability to find training jobs.....ALL countries place work restrictions on foreigners .........

eg, non citizens/residents are prohibited from entering surgical based specialist training in oz......

eu rules compel uk health authorities to have to employ british citizens or eu citizens, before they can employ foreigners.....and in 2008, some foreign doctors had to leave as they cannot get a visa to work.....

fortunately, it appears there is a loophole in the eu directive, and 'international home students' (ie foreigners who study and graduate from british unis) are now allowed to stay on and find jobs after fy1 and 2, including training jobs, if they meet certain guidelines......

on the other hand, oz is running out of even houseman jobs, and may impose that they did once in the 90's.....prohibit non citizens/residents from taking an intern job.........

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Added on September 26, 2010, 6:54 pmit is a known fact that different med schools have different policies in their selection criteria for new students......

some are VERY stringent, they select ONLY the best of the best......eg, try get into harvard, oxbridge, melbourne, and you will understand.....

on the other hand, there are many medical schools which operate as a business, and admit students based on ability to pay fees.....and there are MANY examples of very mediocre students being admitted......the newspapers are full of advertisements proudly proclaiming 'guaranteed places', 'spm 4 credits only needed', 'no entrance exams' etc........

msian is very generous in recognising foreign med schools, probably the country that recognises the MOST number of non-msian med schools.....even very poor quality one.....

therefore imagine those that msia does NOT recognise......how low down in the quality rank they are.....and these are exactly the ones who takes in very lousy students......

so yes, the fact is, many students and graduates from unrecognised med schools (and many recognised ones as well) are very weak, both in their intellect, and their training.......and they WILL have problems passing qualifying exams.....even the msian mmc exams, which is set at equivalent um year 4 level.......

hence it is a valid question.....can they pass the nus/smc exams.....?

This post has been edited by limeuu: Sep 26 2010, 06:54 PM

the fact that people are in imu means they either failed to enter nus, or did not bother to apply as they know they are not good enough to be serious contenders for entry......

one of the top students from the recently concluded phase 1 did apply, and in spite of getting near perfect ter score, did not get offered......

there are 2 components to the potential competency of a new med graduate.......

the first is the innate ability of the person, ie the intelligence, aptitude and attitude.......which can be roughly ascertained by his pre-u results, and the surrogate of being accepted into a competitive medical school.......

the second is the actual training the person receives....

spore takes the view that the clinical component of the training is the most important, and demand reassurance it is conducted adequately, at the awarding university itself.....

that is why imu-pms is recognised, but not pmc-irish ones.....

i don't make the policy.....that's spore's decision.....

like i said elsewhere, spore under-train doctors, they are short of 250 or so a year.........and they have been quite successfully luring msians to work there, after they have been educated by msian parents or taxpayers at much cost......the fact that we are talking about this show how popular working in spore is to many msian med students...........so they can pick and choose........

this may all be moot in a few years, once the new ntu-imperial med school comes on line, and they produce enough for their own needs......

official recognition of professional qualifications (including medical) is always a political decision by the individual countries......and often does not reflect on the quality or standard of other countries.....

eg, the usa does NOT recognise medical qualifications of any other country including other oecd countries.....

to the specifics of spore and imu, well it took them so long to recognise the 2 oldest medical schools in msia (um and ukm)......i don't see them recognising imu in the near future.....

finally, it's a very mixed bag of quality of students in imu (as with all ipts med schools), and this mixed bag extends to both the pms as well as the seremban stream......

it's difficult to accord full recognition to mixed bag unis and qualifications.....no?.....that's the reason lah.....

the difference is that the near pass student at the top med schools will be dean's list students at those in the other end of the spectrum.......

imu-pms students become students of their respective unis they are matched to......and graduate with the full degree with the rest of the cohort....they will be viewed the same as the full 5 year students.....

the immigration rules changed frequently.....currently it is based on what you earn prior to applying.......the amount has just increased......many jobs/professions do not meet this criteria......

you will have to find out for yourself what the prevalent rules are.....

it is possible to become a pr in uk and oz as a doctor....

yes, at one time in the 90's you can't because they actually minus points if your are a doctor....

but it is correct to say, applying and getting a pr are different things.....

note that with recent immigration rule changes, it has become more difficult to apply for pr to oz under skills migration....you have a better chance with employer sponsored migration, so getting a job is all important......

as to uk.....really, why would anyone want to migrate there?....

there are NO 'classes'..........you will need to stop thinking you are still in school.........

he is contradicting himself.....

crucial for any country is that it's medical graduates are trained in the way medical practices are run in that country.....you want to work in that country, jolly well get yourself familiar with and trained up to that country's medical system.....

that is why russian graduates have a lot of problems......

optiplex has a point which some have misunderstood.........

there are basically 2 types (or extremes) of scholarship, which by the word itself, means an excellent student receiving assistance in education....

on one extreme is merit scholarship, ie one based purely on principles of meritocracy........an example would be say getting a harvard university entrance and scholarship, or locally, the 'ivy-league' jpa scholarship where if you get accepted into oxbridge, jpa will give you a scholarship, even if the parents are millionaires.....

on the other extreme is needs based scholarship, ie based on the financial needs of the student.....in msia, the extreme example is the nep based gov scholarships like mara, where it is assumed that ALL malays are poor......

in real life, it usually a mixture of both principles being used to select scholars.....and individual scholarships will have their own criteria for selection........

afaik, the imu medical scholarship is a mixed type, they look for excellence, as well as needs.......and i suspect veering more towards needs.... so if that friend in taylors is indeed financial handicapped (and that is easy to fit in, considering the size of full fees!) and is excellent academically, say with a*a*a*, he will have a good chance.....

note that the imu medicine scholarship is for mbbs(imu) not pms.....

but optiplex's point of the real merit based scholarship stands.......in such a scholarship, it matters not how much money the parents have.....

imu have remove the differential between phase 1 and 2 fees..........phase 1 now is rm5k more and phase is 5k less..................