No it's not talking about this Gift of tongues in that needs to be interpreted as in 1 Corinthians 14:27

but this Gift which every Christians have. 1 Corinthians 14:2 - For anyone who speaks in a tongue does not speak to people but to God. Indeed, no one understands them; they utter mysteries by the Spirit.

As for being Slain in the spirit, I know this is a controversial subject not well accepted in certain denominations. But to say that every type of miracles must occurred in the Bible as an example before it to can be authenticated is not true either because John did mentioned this;


John 20:30 - Jesus performed many other signs in the presence of his disciples, which are not recorded in this book.


John 21:25 - Jesus did many other things as well. If every one of them were written down, I suppose that even the whole world would not have room for the books that would be written.

I believe we shouldn't restrict as to what the HS can do or cannot do.

Even Jesus himself mention this in

John 14:12 - Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father.

without specifically telling us what is that greater works or miracle.




This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Oct 28 2014, 05:45 PM

That's must be your spiritual journey that mold your understanding. It's fine... as long as you want to commune with GOD, GOD will definitely help you one way or another.

Actually the youtube earlier is not that complete, here is part 2.

Try to understand this youtube not using your mind. Try to understand using your heart. Pray first before watching this youtube. Be blessed

col 3:23 (but only half part lol )

Whatever you do, work at it with all your heart...

if u put full verse with " as working for the Lord", is it too sensitive for your business ?

Yes I know not everyone have to have or must have but the point is, anyone and everyone can speak in tongues if they want this gifting. That is the context, it didn't say only specific Christians. Because we all have the HS in us who enables that gifting. And the word of God is quite clear we should all also eagerly desire the gifting of the Holy Spirit. It is not just for fun the HS stated that word, (eagerly desire) unless it is of importance.

I did mentioned, this gifting is not for the purpose mentioned in 1 Corinthians 14:27. don't understand what's your purpose in telling me verse 26-28.

And also in the word of Paul if you see in verse 28 it didn't say to cut off totally but to continue speaking in tongues praying to God.
I need to be clear that this speaking in tongues is not of the devil nor demonic in nature, it is valid and is in the Bible.

If you feel that holy laughter, slaying and worship so excited until run round and round until fainted is unprecedented and weird, I would say the Bible has records of incidents that is unprecedented and weird.

Jesus spitting in the mud using that to heal blindness is unprecedented and weird. Peter's shadow healing the sick is unprecedented and weird. Handkerchiefs and aprons that had touched Paul were able to heal and cast our demons is unprecedented and weird.

The Bible left open the miracles of God because he doesn't want anyone to limit what God can do. Else it is rather pointless for Jesus to let us know that nothing is impossible for God the Father. Same thing with the works or miracles of the HS.

Don't understand why you missed out John 14:12? As I did mention that Jesus himself did not specify in detail, exactly WHAT is that greater works. Perhaps you have an answer and the explanation why?

This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Oct 28 2014, 08:29 PM

The Experience of Jacob

Jacob's Reaction

(1) Calling the Place the House of God

Now we come to Jacob's reaction. Firstly, after waking out of his sleep, he called that place the house of God (v. 17). Where did Jacob get the concept of the house of God? Abraham did not know of this. As we have pointed out, we do not find this term before Genesis 28. Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob all lived in tents. Why then did Jacob not say the tent of God but rather the house of God? Surely this is not only a dream but a revelation. Although Jacob did not actually see the house of God, he termed what he saw the house of God, saying, "This is the house of God." Certainly this came from divine revelation.

God has revealed His economy not only in clear words but also in the lives of human beings. Jacob, a man living altogether on the human level, had a dream. In that dream he saw something, and after he awoke he said, "This is the house of God." Undoubtedly, this concept of the house of God came from God Himself.

(2) Calling the Place the Gate of Heaven

Jacob also called the place where he met God the gate of heaven (v. 17). Whatever he saw there pointed to heaven. It was a place on earth, but it was joined to heaven. Hence, he called it the gate of heaven. Whenever we have a spiritual vision, we sense that we are at the gate of heaven. We are on earth, but we see and experience the things of heaven.

(3) Making the Pillow-stone a Pillar and Anointing It

Verse 18 says, "Jacob rose up early in the morning, and took the stone that he had made his pillow, and set it up for a pillar, and poured oil upon the top of it" (Heb.). How peculiar it was that Jacob set up the stone for a pillar. If I had been he, I would never have done that with the stone. What is the meaning of this? It certainly corresponds to the whole revelation of the Bible. The most striking thing here is the anointing of the stone with oil. It was sovereign that the oil was there. Where did Jacob get it? Did he, an escapee, bring it with him when he fled from home? I do not know.

According to my opinion, pouring oil upon the stone would only have caused a mess. But according to the Bible, this act is very significant. In the Bible, the stone undoubtedly signifies a transformed man, a lump of clay which has been transformed into a stone. In typology, the oil signifies the third Person of God reaching people. When God reaches you, He is the Spirit. Thus, the stone which was set up as a pillar and which had the oil poured upon it, is a symbol that the transformed man is one with the Triune God. Now the Triune God is not only in heaven but also on a transformed man and is one with this transformed man. This man is God's expression on earth. When you look at the stone, you see the oil. When you look at the transformed man standing on the earth, you see the expression of God. How did Jacob know to pour oil on the stone? Before chapter twenty-eight, there is no record of this type of action. Nevertheless, after waking up from his dream, Jacob did this.

I wasn't even talking about this, like I said, don't get your point why you bring this up. Speaking in tongues is between you and God, not with Man, that should give the clue to what I'm trying to say here.

No, My point is, nobody is forcing with a gun that you must speak in tongues, neither did I mention if you don't speak in tongues you won't have other gifting as if it's dependent on that.
What my point escapes you obviously is that anyone and everyone can speak in tongues if He desires to have this gifting. It is not exclusive for the super spiritual or special Christians.
It does help in the dimension of prayer because the HS will help you interceded according to the will of God. That is like you praying perfect prayer. Much better than when we pray in our natural language. Now don't get me wrong saying Oh you mean to say we can't pray properly using normal language? Try to digest slowly what is said here before going off.


Of course you can say it's not weird and unprecedented now, anyone can say that because it has already happened. But if you were there for the first time seeing a person Name Jesus of Nazareth, spitting on dirty mud and put it on the eyes of someone, you would be thinking what is He trying to do, it's weird. Same thing with the handkerchief, New comers who have never seen such a thing like healing through Shadows???? might think it could be some form of sorcery in those day, as it was unprecedented.

Yes I agree we can be wary about it as what you say but my angst is, TODAY it has become to an unhealthy extreme where people are no longer believing in God about miracles due to the build up of skepticism out of fear. It is as bad as the other end of extreme what you just mentioned about David Koresh.





Don't judge lah, that's between Him and God. If he wants to fake it even, that is still between Him and God. You should practice what you told me just now about not offending the HS. I know what you're saying, bro, give me some credit, Is not that I've never encounter any of these before, I'v seen over and over and time after time.




No it's not, it's a very simple question.


John 14:12 (NIV) - Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father.


Question: What is this greater works that Jesus talks about?

This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Oct 29 2014, 12:57 PM

Allow me to answer partly

Let's see how city harvest KL handle this:
1. In City Harvest KL, when things like this happen a security and usher will escort the person to remote location and minister will be ready to handle that person. They have resources, they have people to minister. They have experiences. Ushers / Security has been trained, prepared, briefed before release into ministry field. The different between ushers and security, security wears black t-shirts with letter "security" but ushers dresses more friendly. Both ushers and security holds CB radios to communicate each others. City harvest at least has 500 to 1000 attendee for 10AM service. They need proper management in place in order to run the show.

2. Smaller churches, shop-lot size, 50 people congregation, don't have resources like city harvest. perhaps no room available, perhaps not trained usher, perhaps no security available. Many reasons. Then you know lah... cannot compare to big church like city harvest...

Let's see how i will handle this
In short, I can rebuke by saying like this: "I speak order in the name of Jesus !", provided that i am sure evil spirit manipulates this person to distract the preacher. Technically how ? I just speak / shout as loud as this person, unless HS instruct another detail. Any bible verse ? 1 Cor 14:33

That's why congregation must know spiritual warfare as well.

therefore we pray: In the Name of Jesus, anything that does not planted by our Heavenly Father we uprooted them and break them in the name of Jesus.

It's obvious that David Koresh was genuine in the beginning but get corrupted later on. Therefore that prayer above will guard a genuine good leader to stay good until GOD takes him home to receive his reward.

To be honest, the devil can raise another people like david koresh right ? therefore if congregation know how do spiritual warfare, how to pray to guard their leader. Many problems will be resolved naturally. Don't worry, GOD is in control.

How to put into practical work in malaysia today ?
1. You go to any church at your choosing.
2. You have peace and presence of GOD ? case closed, no need to go to no 3.
3. You don't have peace ? just say the pray above. Pray that first, think later, trust GOD the process.
4. Ask HS more what to do with that church, follow HS instruction.

Free Admission.

From 28-31 Oct 2014. 8PM-10PM.

Those who need healing, come.

Whatever your circumstances. Wheel Chair, Leg problem, Chest problem, whatever Health Issues, come.

http://www.worshipcentral.org/events/gathe...mpur-my-14nov14


This October and November Worship Central are heading out on the road around Malaysia for nights of worship, teaching and ministry.

The nights are for all worshippers to encounter God, be equipped and empowered. As ever, there will be loads of room for worship and ministry!

wc-team.png



LUKE & ANNA HELLEBRONTH

Luke and Anna Hellebronth are part of the Worship Central Team and are on staff at Holy Trinity Brompton, London, UK. Luke has written many songs including ‘Spirit Break Out’ and 'Ready for You'.



STEW MCILRATH

Stew is a part of the Worship Central Team and is the worship pastor at Holy Trinity Bukit Bintang, Kuala Lumpur.


WHEN?

Friday 14 November 2014

Timings: 8.00pm - 10.00pm



WHERE?

Holy Trinity Bukit Bintang,

Rooftop, Level 8, Lot 10,

Bukit Bintang, Kuala Lumpur



HOW MUCH?

This event is free of charge

Brothers and sisters, my friend is out of danger now! thanks for all the prayers

orait... good to hear that

It is the person who hear all our prayers, that we should give thanks to.

Not us.

This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Oct 29 2014, 03:13 PM

I think we should not focus too much on 'speaking in tongue' in this thread which should be denomination neutral. we all know that speaking in tongue is denomination specific.

Hello new poster here! Never knew there was a CF in /k/


I'd like to point out that speaking in tongues *isn't* exactly denomination specific, because it's not just something one denomination adhere's to and it doesn't.
I personally think a friendly, loving debate/discussion is healthy for the faith because if you note the emphasis Paul places on keeping sound doctrine, we should always keep one another in check that we are doing what we do just because our pastors told us to, but because the Bible teaches it!

As for tongues, I came from a charismatic background, and I grew up in a charismatic background. I think the dude who brought up 1 Cor 14 is right: I think Paul explicitly says that we shouldn't speak in tongues when we gather as a whole unless there is an interpreter of the tongues, but why? His reasoning is consistent with one of the central arguments in his letter to the Corinthians: Because it isn't building up and edifying your brothers and sisters. Paul seems to be pointing out that Church is other-people centered! Note how he isn't saying that tongues is wrong, but he's talking about a public church situation. I think he even brings up the fact that it isn't helpful to outsiders who visit as well!

I mean, the Corinthians clearly had some unity issues and were arguing about gifts, but look at the famous 1 corinthians 13- it isn't talking about love between man and wife, it's talking about love within the congregation of believers. Paul tells them how the most "excellent" way is to love one another, and not just in some weird feeling-ish sorta way, but in a way clearly visible on the outside (i.e. patient with one another, kind to one another).

I brought that up (bold) because you brought up 1 Cor 14:26.

I think I did address them, perhaps you may want to slow down and read back what I wrote.
I did address point 1 & 2. Forcing and emphasizing the importance of it, are 2 different things. I don't think any Church elders would force.

3) Don't think so this happens to every Church. I'm sure majority of the Churches in this country emphasize on Bible study.

Well just in case if you do think like that. No I don't read your replies to others.

I said this:

No, My point is, nobody is forcing with a gun that you must speak in tongues, neither did I mention if you don't speak in tongues you won't have other gifting as if it's dependent on that. What my point escapes you obviously is that anyone and everyone can speak in tongues if He desires to have this gifting. It is not exclusive for the super spiritual or special Christians.

Which part I said you didn't say that?


The pharisees have problem accepting miracles due to hardening hearts. Jesus proved himself by his miracles and Jesus implored them to at least believe in the miracles even if they don't believe in Him. Do even see the growing trend that is happening in the Churches today? I do.

I don't want to happen to the body of Christ.

Because I'm teaching Christians not to have a fearful heart towards God or his workings. I'm seeing a trend and what Jesus says will really come to pass.

Luke 18:8. However, when the Son of Man comes, will he find faith on the earth?"

People in the last days are becoming like Atheist Christians who don't want anything other than Salvation. The same classic example when the Israelites refuse to go into the promise land flowing with milk and honey. Same thing. Most of them died due to a heart that doesn't believe, only 2 made it.

The trend is showing.

God never gave us a spirit of fear. Never! but of power love and of a sound mind. Serene mind. IF a Christian exhibits so much fear in life. Whatever the reason may be, it only means that, that person don't know God that well or his works and thus need to constantly refer to warning, dangers of what this person say or that person say. This is not the life of the spirit but the life of religion.

I believe in Balance emphasize of Quiet time with God, Prayers, Living the life of Faith, Bible study, Getting involved in the Kingdom, Seeing Miracles, etc. Proper balance of everything. I believe one of the reason why The Church is divided is because the traditions of Man have been mix into God's word, and the truth of God's word is not properly divided. One of the reason why I'm here is to persuade that away.



Bro, I teach the Bible, I'm a full time Church Staff.

No Bro, read the Bible carefully. The context of that verse is talking about all his miracles. The work of the Father. The evidence of it. The same thing Jesus told the Pharisees who did not believe in Him. (John 14:11). It's not referring to 1, 2 or 3. So my question to you is, what exactly are the greater works?

Good that you brought up the subject of Obedience and pursue of righteousness. I teach them too. You cannot emphasize these 2 without properly laying down the right foundation of what it means to be righteous and how obedience come.

This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Oct 29 2014, 10:02 PM

Speaking in tongues is a usually from charismatic church only i tot?

no lah bro , it's in the bible. Paul say he speaks in tongues more than you all 1 Cor 14:18

BTW, the Mods may pm me to close this thread any time because it has reached the number of page limit.

Please nominate or somebody pls Open ver8.

Version 8, Ya'll. We are really Alive.

Pls make sure whoever it is, copy back the 1st page content and improvise if you wish.

I nominate u lah UW... go go go .. cepat2x sikit...