Well, what can you do then? Are you a lawmaker or something?

If you can't change anything, learn to live with it. If you really can't, then move somewhere else. Complaining non-stop here won't change anything.

BTW, mod deleted your one symbol reply, therefore you have clearly violated the rules of the forum. It's ok when you have done something wrong. Just admit it.

This post has been edited by hypermax: Mar 5 2009, 01:45 AM

if everybody is like that!

that explains why this country is in this condition........fortunately, there are enough people around who feels motivated and concerned enough to want to effect change.......

Concerned? Hmm, so shooting and bash people whom you deem are unqualified for medicine is concerned? People are going to pursue their dreams anyway, no matter you like it or not.

people are going to rempit and snatch people's handbag whether you like it or not.......so we should all stop talking about it and accept it........right.....excellent attitude.......

That's of two different issues. Rempiting is a crime, whereas entering medicine with low results (less than 90th percentile according to your standard) is not a crime. It doesn't take a genius to know this.

same principles, it's about caring for things around you.....but like i said, exercise in futility, i leave it to readers to judge for themselves.......

So in your logic, entering med school with less than TER90 is a crime, equivalent to that of rempiting?

This post has been edited by hypermax: Mar 5 2009, 09:21 AM

u mean TER 99...

by the above statements, getting < TER90 is a crime, because that would mean more Dr Death in hospitals...

but then again, the government do send bumi students with poor/mediocre results into public med universities, and what difference would that make? why don't you argue about that...since bumis entering public universities should be in a larger scale, ie even more Dr Deaths from there...

so what do you get bashing some chinese or indian med students in an online forum? where your message won't really reach out anyways...

he talked abt both the non-bumis in IPTS and the bumis in IPTA

As i have mentioned before, bashing or not the particular student is entering medical course whether he likes it or not. So why not make this forum a more peaceful place by shutting his mouth instead of attacking others?

csrulez ask u something about ptptn loan.For medic,if the course is offered will that mean sure can get the loan RM150k?

Yup, if the application is complete you'll get the full amount (150k) for sure.

Things happen so quickly around here ... but I believe that more than the entrance examination or grades; it is the final outcome: the product of five years of teaching should be considered. Anyone with reasonable skill can be polished to excellence. At least that is what education is supposed to be, not a purely discriminatory discipline of who gets to learn and who not.

The discriminatory practice is due to the limited resources but private education has seen in a level of increased opportunities. At least that is what I choose to see; rather than the money, time and deceit people claim. Unless you have positive statistics to say that private medical students are generally less skilled than government doctors, one shouldn't start a Never-Ending-War. A piece of my two cents.

I agree with the highlight part!hypermax and limeuu both of you should stop fight again.Two of you are knowledgible and resourceful senior here,the responsibilities is to provide more and more relevant and useful info about medic.Please,don't always ague and argue no advantages at all just make other feel fear to ask especially mr doctor limeuu.Thanks,Im not spamming but just giving my opinion.

This post has been edited by MBBS siang: Mar 7 2009, 07:54 AM

one can justify anything, if one is convinced one is right.......even murderers may believe they have done the world good, in their misguided minds........

i have explained the mess of msian education, which i think all are aware of.......the racial discrimination in ipta, the financial discrimination in ipts........and we are all aware the situation in ipts exist as a counterweight to ipta......

but 2 wrongs DO NOT make a right........

i have made my stance clear.......and i do not agree with the self gratifying justification above.......i am obviously NOT alone in this........countries like uk, oz, usa, spore all practice strict vetting of potential doctors entering training........

if i am wrong, i guess these developed countries are also wrong.....well.....their education policy must be more messed up than msia's.......but strangely, msian who can afford it, all seem to prefer to go to these countries.........

so who is right and wrong?

i accept, under the circumstances in msia, it is impossible to change to a more coherent education masterplan, so things will continue to evolve along uneven lines.......that doesn't mean we should NOT strive to improve the situation.......

yes, of course the end product is important...there will be many good doctors trained, together with some bad ones.....but if toyota can implement a 'zero defect' policy in their assembly lines, should we not also strive to have a zero-defect policy in doctor training?........

if so, then tell me what can be done to attempt a zero-defect production.......?....toyota uses a strict zero defect acceptance of parts as one of the measures.........

the final key word here is QUALITY.......justification that everybody should be given a chance is not QUALITY......it's MEDIOCRITY of the lowest common denominator, which is what msia education is both ipta and ipts, unfortunately......

---

Added on March 7, 2009, 8:35 amas a side note.....notice i did not mention about nz........

well, nz implements a policy of giving everybody a chance.....just like what some wants here......everybody with a pass in ncea (their pre-u) can enter health sciences 1st year.........so they take in some 1200 students in auckland u.......

there are however 250 places in medicine.........so the 1200 people fight to get into 250 places........

maybe we should try that system........fair or not?........everybody, no matter your pre-u results as long as you passed, have a fair go at it........

This post has been edited by limeuu: Mar 7 2009, 08:59 AM

MR doctor limeuu I get your point.But what I want to say is,you can use a softer way to judge others.Don't always discriminate others base on their result and say"you are not fit to be a doctor".Ya...you are right,one wish to be a doctor should have a excellent academic performance(minimum requirement other than passion and so on).

But the things is everyone have their own ambitions and dreams,they are not wrong to say"I WANT TO BE A DOCTOR".I think giving a kind and soft advice is much much better than you bash them,then their pride will be hurt!They will not take your advice in heart,they will feel angry and try to act in rebel way.They will not think twice whether they are suitable to be a doctor or not(they will feel you look down on them and try to show they can do it) and this will only make the situation worser.If the NOt doctor material also act in this way,maybe it will produce more and more killer isn It?

In conclusion,everyone try to make our country better,complain and complain.demonstration also occur but the thing is all are beyond our control.So,you are fit the giving advices and tell others"you are not fit to be a doctor" but in other way round.softer please!!!!Im not here to teach you anything,but i just state the truth.Thanks!!!If my words offense you then,sorry about that.

This post has been edited by MBBS siang: Mar 7 2009, 09:12 AM

Limeuu,

Boy, that's really an emo statement.

You reminded me of the Singaporean movie "money no enough 2". In the movie, one of the actor stated that Singaporean always complain, complain and complain, but not actions are taken in real life.

Who are you to judge? This is a forum after all, where people gather around and share info, not bashing one another.

You are too biased and harsh in your comments, and when you do that , you provoked people and they tend to challenge you. In the end, nothing will be changed, except that anger and hatred are born.

This post has been edited by hypermax: Mar 7 2009, 09:39 AM

Thats right! I think I am the one who always learn from mistake.I have change the way of speak because I already know,this is an forum for us to discuss but not show off and bashing.I think MR limeuu is a wise man,he sure know what mistake he had made before lo....haha.....Mr hypermax! Future good doctor!haha.....

This post has been edited by MBBS siang: Mar 7 2009, 11:57 AM

I think we need to define quality as per se; normal schooling in any country for that matter does not prepare individuals for medicine because they are not supposed to. They offer what they are supposed to which is to train individuals into general competency to further their skills in higher levels according to their interests. Hence, such we see entrance exams and hence forth. Grades become important, for you need rationalizing, problem solving, synthetic skills and evaluation in medicine and grades reflect that but only so partially. Many of these competencies develop with age and maturity and most often than not in most parts of the world, freshmen are still very much in their teens.

Doing medicine is not about fighting to get a seat; that's not quality but a by-product of rat racing education.

My point is: grades are an important measure; a foremost objective measure but it is not a watertight tank, people with reasonable skill can be trained to be as what happens inside medical school matters more than what gets you there.

This post has been edited by rav063: Mar 8 2009, 03:42 AM

Hey, just a quick question, In dentistry in aimst right... The housemanship is included in the 5 years dental surgery right? so after the 5 years u straight come out and serve in the government hospital right?