it is good to see more n more discussion going on here...

I did read in a review that cars with longer wheelbase are easier to keep going in a straight line. They are not so easily disturbed, feel more planted. That's why I wouldn't be surprised if the longer wheelbase does make the car more stable...

At least when the car is already starting to spin it should be harder to keep the short wheelbase one under control. That's what I gathered from comments about the Renault Clio V6 and Renault 5 Turbo. Especially the latter always spun... (both mid engined, rear wheel drive, lots of power and a short wheelbase).

ESC/VSA/ESP are not just to counter oversteer / fishtail, it also helps keep understeer in check. In the case of a understeering FWD, I think length is irrelevant.

I just asked an engineer. He says short wheelbase is easier to spin, harder to keep goin in a straight line.

"Likewise, a car may oversteer or even "spin out" if there is too much force on the front tires and not enough on the rear tires. Also, when turning there is lateral torque placed upon the tires which imparts a turning force that depends upon the length of the tire distances from the CG. Thus, in a car with a short wheelbase, the short lever arm from the CG to the rear wheel will result in a greater lateral force on the rear tire which means greater acceleration and less time for the driver to adjust and prevent a spin out or worse."

This post has been edited by kadajawi: Apr 1 2013, 04:25 PM

They are more planted in a straight line ONLY. That is why tourers with long wheel based are meant for long distance touring. The long wheel base resist the change in direction giving you stability in a straight line. That is also the problem. To change direction, you need to overcome more forces and once that happens, the additional forces makes it less stable mid corner aka in the middle of a drift.

Short wheelbase cars are more nimble and that term is used because you can easily turn a shorter wheelbase car with less resistance. This does not mean it is bad as a more nimble car is actually easier to control while changing direction.


As for any mid-engine rear wheel drive car... the MR2 started what we call the '360 Club' as anybody who drives a mid-engine rear wheel drive MR2 would have experience at least one in a lift time... turning the car 360 degrees. That's pretty normal when you put the weight of the car in the middle between the front and rear axles.

well, my iswara is fishtail happy, so that's that.

Depends what u want, even wear (front) or avoiding rear slip(rear).
For fwd that is.

Going up a mountain drive like Genting in a short wheelbase car is much easier and safer than a long wheelbase. You would know that if you have experienced it yourself instead of asking an engineer. The more nimble vehicle takes less effort to turn and change direction (esp in those left into right corners)and there is no hint of spinning out of control when the driver is in control.

When taken to the extreme, the snap-oversteer in a short wheelbase can be scary (that was what your engineer was trying to explain) but that would be more on the fault of the driver than car. Most snap oversteers that I have seen were due to an over enthusiastic driver entering a corner way too fast and trying to brake too late into the corner and hence unloading the rear tyres.

Even if that is true, longer wheel base cars tend to have wider, grippier tyres.

Anyway, that means the car won't break loose as easily in a straight line, but if you are driving in a corner it is more likely to oversteer? That sounds more reasonable. But does it happen often?

The only way I got to oversteer was by using the handbrake. Understeer yes. Oversteer no, unless I really force it. But then again I rarely drive cars with a long wheelbase (i.e. D segment and above).

Yes, I can agree with your latest post.

This post has been edited by kadajawi: Apr 1 2013, 04:46 PM

that's pretty much what happened to me

short wheel base cars can have wider/grippyer tires too

if a myvi can install 17", that's more than enough width or even grip that wide variety of 15/17" performance tires can offer.

Yeah, I meant typically. Most small cars use skinnier tyres, while big ones often come with wide tyres as standard.

Maybe I should not use 'drifting' as an example otherwise everybody thinks that a longer wheelbase car is oversteering into every corner.

It's more about the feel of the car, something quite difficult to explain on the Internet. A longer wheelbase car is more resistant to turning. You feel that you have to work harder to make it turn and once it turns, it is more difficult to change to the opposite direction (for example if you are entering a left corner that goes into a right corner).

easy... just compare a car vs a truck in turning corner....

Ah yes, I'd agree with that, though the longest wheelbase car I drove (2850mm) wasn't that resistant to turning, despite weighting 1.8 tons. Usually I drive a car with 2540mm or 2605mm wheelbase, both at around 1.1 tons. So not very short either.

Ideally it should be all four tyres but if it's a budget issue...can change two first and quickly change the balance when budget permits..

that is ideally. but hard to do in real life.
I already feel heart-pain when forced to replace 2 tyres, when only 1 of them is in need of replacement.
so in the case when 1 of my tyre need replacement, and I replace all 4, I will go crazy.

I've driven both LWB & SWB Isuzu Trooper, I would say I have more confident in cornering, hairpin & U turns in SWB than I would in LWB. On the straight line however I could feel the inertia more than LWB when overtaking or changing lane.

personally I felt that longer WB cars have slightly better stability at corners.
or maybe it's just a gut feeling, and nothing more.

That's because the tires were already sliding/loosing grip, so the the more braking force you apply would actually makes it worse as they will slide even more and would not make the tires regain grip. By letting off the brake pressure, you'll let the tires roll a bit more and hance can regain grip so then you can turn. If you watch racing, you can see that everytime the cars start to lock/slide underbraking, the driver will release the brake to regain the grip allowing him to steer back into the corner. This is actually what ABS is also doing for normal cars.
This can also happen in the dry, just at much higher speeds when entering a corner.