QUOTE(unknown warrior @ Mar 4 2013, 12:37 AM)
I don't get you.
You asked me to show you scripture verse about beseeching my brothers in here for prayers and when I pull it out, you go show me Mark 11:24?
Aiya caramba (Mexican slang).
Isn't that truth enough?
To give you benefit of doubt,
I'm trying to find justification for praying to the saints in Heaven. There is none, brother. It's not there.
What's more you play a dangerous game saying
it's alright to assume anything outside of God's word.
Noble as it may sound, good as it may sound, it can run into Man's own reasoning rather than being a word of God.
Fact is We wont progress much. so Lets drop this! I dont want a heated argument! Peace out.
We are One Family in Christ in Heaven and on Earth. If your family is limited to on earth and only God, so be it. I believe in our righteous prayers, but I believe in perfect righteousness of our brothers and sisters in heaven.
We are not the absolute perfect perfect on earth no matter how much u want to say the blood of Christ is finished finished. Why cant me and u come to this agreement is because of another problem: u dont beileve in purgatory. For me Perfect holiness requires purification. Numbers 31:23, Job 23:10, Psalm 51:2, 7, Psalm 66:10-12, Proverbs 3:11, Proverbs 17:3, Proverbs 20:30, Ecclesiastes 12:14, Isaiah 1:25-26, Isaiah 4:4, Isaiah 48:10, Jeremiah 9:7, Jeremiah 30:11, Jeremiah 33:8. Heb. 12:14 - without holiness no one will see the Lord. We need final sanctification to attain true holiness before God, and this process occurs during our lives and, if not completed during our lives, in the transitional state of purgatory.
Heb. 12:23 - the spirits of just men who died in godliness are "made" perfect. They do not necessarily arrive perfect. They are made perfect after their death. But those in heaven are already perfect, and those in hell can no longer be made perfect. These spirits are in purgatory.
You will not accept it anyway. It will come to a point when u say purgatory is not in the bible and I will say Where is it in the bible that states there is no such place? Book and verse please. and because of this stupidness there is nothing much to progress altogether because you are bounded by your own 'law' : which is to refer to Scripture on every single detail. Trinity is not in the Bible. To believe in the Bible solely is NOT in the bible either. That is why I am dropping this. As it brings no fruit.
anyway in heaven I can be at full truth and u can be at full truth and we need not argue but show total love for each other.
Final stand: not mans reasoning, but Holy Spirit Revelation.
Since we are all linked together and all of us are loving.
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Eph. 3:14-15- we are all one family in heaven and on earth, united together, as children of the Father, through Jesus Christ. Our brothers and sisters who have gone to heaven before us are not a different family. We are one and the same family. This is why, in the Apostles Creed, we profess a belief in the "communion of saints." There cannot be a "communion" if there is no union. Loving beings, whether on earth or in heaven, are concerned for other beings, and this concern is reflected spiritually through prayers for one another.
Eph. 1:22-23; 5:23-32; Col. 1:18,24 - this family is in Jesus Christ, the head of the body, which is the Church.
1 Cor. 12:12,27; Rom. 12:5; Col. 3:15; Eph. 4:4 - we are the members of the one body of Christ, supernaturally linked together by our partaking of the Eucharist.
Rom. 8:35-39 - therefore, death does not separate the family of God and the love of Christ. We are still united with each other, even beyond death.
Matt. 17:3; Mark 9:4; Luke 9:30 - Jesus converses with "deceased" Moses and Elijah. They are more alive than the saints on earth.
Matt. 22:32; Mark 12:27; Luke 20:38 - God is the God of the living not the dead. The living on earth and in heaven are one family.
Luke 15:7,10 – if the angels and saints experience joy in heaven over our repentance, then they are still connected to us and are aware of our behavior.
John 15:1-6 - Jesus is the vine and we are the branches. The good branches are not cut off at death. They are alive in heaven.
1 Cor. 4:9 – because we can become a spectacle not only to men, but to angels as well, this indicates that angels are aware of our earthly activity. Those in heaven are connected to those on earth.
1 Cor. 12:26 - when one member suffers, all suffer. When one is honored, all rejoice. We are in this together as one family.
1 Cor 13:12; 1 John 3:2 - now we see in a mirror dimly, but in heaven we see face to face. The saints are more alive than we are!
Heb. 12:1: we are surrounded by a great glory cloud (shekinah) of witnesses. The “cloud of witnesses” refers to the saints who are not only watching us from above but cheering us on in our race to heaven.
1 Peter 2:9; Rev. 20:6 - we are a royal family of priests by virtue of baptism. We as priests intercede on behalf of each other.
2 Peter 1:4 - since God is the eternal family and we are His children, we are partakers of His divine nature as a united family.
1 Cor. 1:2; Rom. 1:7 - we are called to be saints. Saints refer to both those on earth and in heaven who are in Christ. Proof:
Acts 9:13,32,41; 26:10; 1 Cor. 6:1-2; 14:33; 2 Cor. 1:1; 8:4; 9:1-2; 13:13; Rom. 8:27; 12:23; 15:25,26, 31; 16:2,15; Eph. 1:1,15,18; 3:8; 5:3; 6:18; Phil. 1:1; 4:22; Col 1:2,4,26; 1 Tm 5:10; Philemon 1:5,7; Heb. 6:10; 13:24; Jude 1:3; Rev. 11:18; 13:7; 14:12; 16:6; 17:6;18:20,24; Rev 19:8; 20:9 - in these verses, we see that Christians still living on earth are called "saints."
Matt. 27:52; Eph. 2:19; 3:18; Col. 1:12; 2 Thess. 1:10; Rev. 5:8; 8:3-4; 11:18; 13:10 - in these verses, we also see that "saints" also refer to those in heaven who united with us.
Dan. 4:13,23; 8:23 – we also see that the angels in heaven are also called “saints.” The same Hebrew word “qaddiysh” (holy one) is applied to both humans and angels in heaven. Hence, there are angel saints in heaven and human saints in heaven and on earth. Loving beings (whether angels or saints) are concerned for other beings, and prayer is the spiritual way of expressing that love.
LYN Christian Fellowship V6 (Group), God Loves you. 
Mar 4 2013, 12:00 AM
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