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> New draft law will jail unlicensed IT professional, IT industry in Malaysia is finished. Serious Talk

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SUSsfx3000
post Dec 8 2011, 08:44 PM, updated 14y ago

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PIKOM and MNCC is main drive behind this bill.

https://plus.google.com/1160406568400156453...sts/1byMQhGvREn

"And yes, of course this didn't start from the government -- its factions like MNCC and PIKOM that have pushed it."


PIKOM list of council members.

http://www.pikom.org.my/cms/General.asp?wh...=22716&CatID=60

Hidden objectives of CPB2011

1. Rent seeking, make money from IT industry, teaming up with industry Trojans like PIKOM and MNCC.
2. Control dissent by restricting knowledge workers who participate in dissent as employees for opposition.
3. Rob the lucrative IT sector from the private industry and put them in the hands of cronies, aka Bumiputra-ism.
4. Form an elite gateway and eliminate competition from other IT competitors, mainly non-grads, work with govt to accomplish this. (point 1)

Foreign IT corporations and local Unis that are involved that provides training and against Opensource Software may have interests/hand in this.

It's time for IT corporations such as Microsoft, Sun/Oracle to come out with official statement.

http://uppercaise.wordpress.com/2011/12/13...nt-trojan-worm/

SlashDotted! http://yro.slashdot.org/story/11/12/09/233...of-tech-workers

http://www.themalaysianinsider.com/malaysi...s-alarm-online/


http://www.themalaysianinsider.com/malaysi...en-all-over-it/


Note: This law is prone to abuse, corruption and possibly 'quota'. Please inform everyone in IT field. You cannot run an IT company anymore without government approval.

New draft law restricts unregistered IT professional from providing IT services of ANY kind at all.

Fine = 20,000 ringgit or 6 months jail.


The license must be applied, but that means, the society can target recipient based on crony or race... especially Bumiputra.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/75107593/CPB2011-Draft

Page 46...



Restriction on employment of unregistered person to provide Computing Services

34. No CNII entities or person shall employ a person, sole proprietorship, partnership or body corporate, other than aRegistered Computing Practitioner or Registered Computing Professiona lor Registered Computing Services Provider practice, to perform Computing Services



Page 48..

General penalty

36. (1) Any person, sole proprietorship, partnership or body corporate who contravenes this Act or any regulations made there under shall be guilty of an offence and shall,where no penalty is expressly provided therefore, be liable, on conviction,to a fine not exceeding twenty thousand ringgit (RM20,000) or imprisonment not more than six months or both.





------------------------------------- Edited to include extra critical information -----------------------------------------







KEYWORD is CNII. They are not defined properly in the bill. Here's how it goes.

On page 7.

Critical National Information Infrastructure
(CNII)”refers to those assets, systems and functions that are vital to the nation that their incapacity or destruction would have a devastating impact on National economic strength or National image or National defense and security or Government capability to function or Public health and safety.

Sounds like only applies to government right? NO!!


Here's the FULL industry that is defined in the 2nd half !

http://cnii.cybersecurity.org.my/main/about.html


The CNII sectors are:

National Defence & Security
Banking & Finance
Information & Communications <---- All of you working in IT doing web/mobile apps/sites..
Energy
Transportation
Water
Health Services
Government <------------ This is the impression you get in the bill, but look at the rest of them besides this!
Emergency Services
Food & Agriculture



This basically covers ALL industries with major IT jobs and what you have here is a Communist style central governance.

Don't go believe those who keep saying CNII applies only to Government!

CNII definition in the bill is basically a


TROJAN HORSE BLANK CHEQUE where they can REDEFINE it outside the bill AS AND WHEN THEY WISH TO COVER ANY NEW INDUSTRIES.

This post has been edited by sfx3000: Dec 14 2011, 03:16 PM
malaysiao
post Dec 8 2011, 08:45 PM

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Habis LowYat will close..
Hexism
post Dec 8 2011, 08:46 PM

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sos draft mana ? scribds is not real sos.


y u wan lie here ? ini semua dakyah opposition untuk menjatuhkan kerajaan.
SUSKeith321
post Dec 8 2011, 08:46 PM

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signs of 2012 for bolehland
ichi_24
post Dec 8 2011, 08:47 PM

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confirm lowyat shutdown immediately
gs20
post Dec 8 2011, 08:48 PM

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Gooood!!
Now not any tom d*** harry can go in and offer RM 100 for a custom made application!
ichi_24
post Dec 8 2011, 08:48 PM

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ini macam CIDB

got kontraktor license, must apply MOF, must apply SSM, must apply this, must apply that

damn to many bureaucracy
SUSsfx3000
post Dec 8 2011, 08:49 PM

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reliable source from OSS participant who was there to view the draft. he is the one who uploaded it.


http://twitter.com/kaerumy

http://twitter.com/spoonfork
SUSsoundsyst64
post Dec 8 2011, 08:50 PM

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http://malaysiasaya.my/computing-professio...l-2011-malaysia
SUSsfx3000
post Dec 8 2011, 08:50 PM

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New link for draft you can comment.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1j1VC50E...?hl=en_US&pli=1
SUSsfx3000
post Dec 8 2011, 08:56 PM

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Anyone caught working as Software Developer, diploma or degree or not, without being licensed by government, will be fined 20k or jailed 6 months.


The key is, the criteria for licensing would be very vague and prone to abuse.


Malaysia is probably the other country to implement this law other than Nigeria (pariah country)


puppeto4
post Dec 8 2011, 08:59 PM

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....wow nvm I'll read this properly first before flying to rage

I see Rais got mentioned... hmm.gif

This post has been edited by puppeto4: Dec 8 2011, 09:02 PM
empire23
post Dec 8 2011, 08:59 PM

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I do not support this law.

It would put IT goons on par with engineers with legal registration and powers to commit to public projects.
SUSrandyhow
post Dec 8 2011, 08:59 PM

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inb4 ini fitnah PR...
ichi_24
post Dec 8 2011, 09:01 PM

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QUOTE(empire23 @ Dec 8 2011, 08:59 PM)
I do not support this law.

It would put IT goons on par with engineers with legal registration and powers to commit to public projects.
*
agreed 100%


harriss
post Dec 8 2011, 09:02 PM

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QUOTE(sfx3000 @ Dec 8 2011, 08:56 PM)
Anyone caught working as Software Developer, diploma or degree or not, without being licensed by government, will be fined 20k or jailed 6 months.
The key is, the criteria for licensing would be very vague and prone to abuse.
Malaysia is probably the other country to implement this law other than Nigeria (pariah country)
*
no more dev for hobby
ichi_24
post Dec 8 2011, 09:05 PM

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must be rais yatim job, he must be senile to consider this!!!
BzBody100
post Dec 8 2011, 09:07 PM

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Get ready to go back to stone age. Siao law. IT is the fastest moving subject and they want to have this law? Bodoh! It is already hard to get GOOD IT people, u want to impose this law. Better be a snatch thief.
cend
post Dec 8 2011, 09:08 PM

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so that's mean indie developers will go jail too?
cooly
post Dec 8 2011, 09:08 PM

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QUOTE(sfx3000 @ Dec 8 2011, 08:56 PM)
Anyone caught working as Software Developer, diploma or degree or not, without being licensed by government, will be fined 20k or jailed 6 months.
The key is, the criteria for licensing would be very vague and prone to abuse.
Malaysia is probably the other country to implement this law other than Nigeria (pariah country)
*
we are going to the pariah stage
BzBody100
post Dec 8 2011, 09:09 PM

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QUOTE(cend @ Dec 8 2011, 09:08 PM)
so that's mean indie developers will go jail too?
*
well, thats the only benefit I see from this law. laugh.gif

no more yes yes, and geleng geleng kepala. rolleyes.gif
puppeto4
post Dec 8 2011, 09:09 PM

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Alright, now I can consider gtfo from this soon to be shithole for IT people
X-PAD
post Dec 8 2011, 09:10 PM

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kenot work here mar go work overseas loh, this is what gomen want i think hmm.gif

got talented people around also dono how to appreciate doh.gif
BzBody100
post Dec 8 2011, 09:12 PM

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habis. Better teach children how to be snatch thief and robber.
ichi_24
post Dec 8 2011, 09:14 PM

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next = GNU/LINUX IS ILLEGAL

in b4, stallman sage
narf03
post Dec 8 2011, 09:15 PM

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How about we discuss on how to get the license ?
BzBody100
post Dec 8 2011, 09:16 PM

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IT is strongly fuelled by passion. Wow, just wow.
BzBody100
post Dec 8 2011, 09:16 PM

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QUOTE(narf03 @ Dec 8 2011, 09:15 PM)
How about we discuss on how to get the license ?
*
Ahli kuat UMNO?
ichi_24
post Dec 8 2011, 09:16 PM

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QUOTE(narf03 @ Dec 8 2011, 09:15 PM)
How about we discuss on how to get the license ?
*
more bureaucracy = more $$$$$$$
D-Frog
post Dec 8 2011, 09:17 PM

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Getting better?..Moving towards 2020?..wtf
Elgore
post Dec 8 2011, 09:18 PM

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mad.gif mad.gif mad.gif mad.gif mad.gif
BzBody100
post Dec 8 2011, 09:18 PM

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Good luck finding the necessary expertised, man. Lulz. Sorhai.
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post Dec 8 2011, 09:19 PM

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fakap la,habis bisnes reformat aku.
NAQD
post Dec 8 2011, 09:19 PM

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so if I have license can get more money is it?

or songlap more...
X-PAD
post Dec 8 2011, 09:19 PM

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this is like, lu tak suka lu kluar
SUSsoundsyst64
post Dec 8 2011, 09:20 PM

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Untuk kelulusan cepat dan tiada songeh, pemohon mesti bumiputera.
puppeto4
post Dec 8 2011, 09:20 PM

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Mana BN trooper, please tell me you're supporting this
ichi_24
post Dec 8 2011, 09:21 PM

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yeah after this, no more outsource coder doh.gif
potemkin
post Dec 8 2011, 09:21 PM

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Is this real life ?

The only way i see it is that Govt wants more Bumi..cough..Umno..cough .. quota, since they will be the ones approving

Stupid really.

Why the heck didn't i join my ex-boss when he offered me to work in Singapore sad.gif(
ichi_24
post Dec 8 2011, 09:22 PM

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QUOTE(soundsyst64 @ Dec 8 2011, 09:20 PM)
Untuk kelulusan cepat dan tiada songeh, pemohon mesti bumiputera.
*
ah bumiputera pun dianak-tiri

melainkan kroni
TOROBO
post Dec 8 2011, 09:22 PM

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and I just thought of going open source :V
Elgore
post Dec 8 2011, 09:22 PM

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QUOTE(NAQD @ Dec 8 2011, 09:19 PM)
so if I have license can get more money is it?

or songlap more...
*
neither but instead u have to pay or maybe even bribe those in charge of it for a license
ichi_24
post Dec 8 2011, 09:22 PM

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QUOTE(NAQD @ Dec 8 2011, 09:19 PM)
so if I have license can get more money is it?

or songlap more...
*
imagine if the license per head is like 5K

confirm you gaji 1k next time
cend
post Dec 8 2011, 09:24 PM

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File sharing site alredi blocked. mabe after this govt. gonna block to all opensource program (GIMP, blender etc..)

Welp, we just have to rely our friend Anonymous again...

This post has been edited by cend: Dec 8 2011, 09:25 PM
NAQD
post Dec 8 2011, 09:25 PM

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QUOTE(ichi_24 @ Dec 8 2011, 09:22 PM)
imagine if the license per head is like 5K

confirm you gaji 50k next time
*
fixed
puppeto4
post Dec 8 2011, 09:25 PM

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Hmm... this one apply to tech blogger also or not?
rock_world
post Dec 8 2011, 09:25 PM

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this mean..who want to work at lowyat computer shop must have license? rclxub.gif rclxub.gif
Elgore
post Dec 8 2011, 09:26 PM

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QUOTE(cend @ Dec 8 2011, 09:24 PM)
File sharing site alredi blocked. mabe after this govt. gonna block to all opensource program (GIMP, blender etc..)

Welp, we just have to rely our friend Anonymous again...
*
fuq them if they ever block open source programs
wohoo
post Dec 8 2011, 09:26 PM

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Malaysia gonna further behind the IT for another century...for GOD sake..whose idea is this?
X-PAD
post Dec 8 2011, 09:26 PM

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QUOTE(cend @ Dec 8 2011, 09:24 PM)
File sharing site alredi blocked. mabe after this govt. gonna block to all opensource program (GIMP, blender etc..)

Welp, we just have to rely our friend Anonymous again...
*
they can't help, infact will boost them even stronger, degil ni
samftrmd
post Dec 8 2011, 09:30 PM

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Snice need lisen, buy PC RM900, pasang PC fee RM1000 due to need to hire fully certified tech and pay lisen.
blackamikaze
post Dec 8 2011, 09:32 PM

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this is their real intention, to create another job position for crony

QUOTE


Allowances.

The President and themembers of the Board shall bepaid such allowances as the Minister may determine.
This post has been edited by blackamikaze: Dec 8 2011, 09:33 PM
cend
post Dec 8 2011, 09:32 PM

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QUOTE(samftrmd @ Dec 8 2011, 09:30 PM)
Snice need lisen, buy PC RM900, pasang PC fee RM1000 due to need to hire fully certified tech and pay lisen.
*
+9001
anangryorc
post Dec 8 2011, 09:38 PM

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more songlap
SUSsoundsyst64
post Dec 8 2011, 09:38 PM

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QUOTE(cend @ Dec 8 2011, 09:32 PM)
+9001
*
we might not be able to buy hard disk/mobo/proc/ram based on international market price lo once this bill approved sad.gif
narf03
post Dec 8 2011, 09:40 PM

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I remember there is something to reduce tax for those IT ppl who registered to PM or something, maybe that is somehow related ?
Dr Jan Itor
post Dec 8 2011, 09:55 PM

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Satu lagi projek BN?
ynot
post Dec 8 2011, 10:00 PM

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on the bright side ... qualified IT professional will be treated as a respectable IT professional with a much more reasonable wages.
FLampard
post Dec 8 2011, 10:00 PM

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is this even real? im rubbing my eyes
narf03
post Dec 8 2011, 10:02 PM

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QUOTE(ynot @ Dec 8 2011, 10:00 PM)
on the bright side ... qualified IT professional will be treated as a respectable IT professional with a much more reasonable wages.
*
on the dark side, the empire control all the licenses, they decide who can apply and who cant, may the force be with you.
ynot
post Dec 8 2011, 10:05 PM

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QUOTE(narf03 @ Dec 8 2011, 10:02 PM)
on the dark side, the empire control all the licenses, they decide who can apply and who cant, may the force be with you.
*
well, if it is done in a proper manner.... ?
SUSsfx3000
post Dec 8 2011, 10:10 PM

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QUOTE(ynot @ Dec 8 2011, 10:05 PM)
well, if it is done in a proper manner.... ?
*
Which crap by the govt has ever been done in a proper manner?

annoymous1234
post Dec 8 2011, 10:10 PM

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thank goodness i move away from IT industry 2 years ago..
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post Dec 8 2011, 10:12 PM

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zzzz , good new crap thing from our beloved gov , habis side income
SUSryanliew87
post Dec 8 2011, 10:13 PM

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lowyat kena serah kpd bumiputra
pandera999
post Dec 8 2011, 10:13 PM

모든 것​에는 정해진 때​가 있으니
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wtf... doh.gif
ashyxt
post Dec 8 2011, 10:14 PM

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so, se7en, how?
annoymous1234
post Dec 8 2011, 10:16 PM

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QUOTE(ryanliew87 @ Dec 8 2011, 10:13 PM)
lowyat kena serah kpd bumiputra
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salah! serah kat bangla. "i help u, u help me"
choyster
post Dec 8 2011, 10:17 PM

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wow is this serious? so much for the future of Malaysia, I've just graduated in this field and now this news has seriously made me reconsider my option of coming back to Malaysia. 1 lagi Project Barisan National. This is probably done so that they can control the INTERNET too. Wow just wow just when i though the government couldn't be anymore stupid.


This post has been edited by choyster: Dec 8 2011, 10:29 PM
RoyMcAvoy
post Dec 8 2011, 10:26 PM

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I don't see this brings benefits to the IT professional.

We might have to pay to get certified in the future
choyster
post Dec 8 2011, 10:29 PM

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Goodbye Malaysia IT industry
Avex
post Dec 8 2011, 10:33 PM

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another bodohland great
blackamikaze
post Dec 8 2011, 10:34 PM

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its time to throw out BN before more shits hit the fan..
SUSsfx3000
post Dec 8 2011, 10:42 PM

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This is a way they consolidate and steal industries from private companies to give to their own cronies.
RoyMcAvoy
post Dec 8 2011, 10:43 PM

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BN must go down in the next GE.

This bill shall not pass!
razorboy
post Dec 8 2011, 10:44 PM

#winning
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If BN wins next GE, that pretty much sums up our future. All of our future. Bleak
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post Dec 8 2011, 10:44 PM

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Hi dupe.scared to use ur own account and suddenly flame bumiputera?
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post Dec 8 2011, 10:47 PM

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no more freelance... hohoho... this is crazy~
love.beginner
post Dec 8 2011, 10:50 PM

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good, time to change field..or move to oversea
SUSryanliew87
post Dec 8 2011, 10:53 PM

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kesian low yat salesman
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post Dec 8 2011, 10:55 PM

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just a few days ago

ICT Penting Untuk Capai Matlamat Negara Berpendapatan Tinggi - Rais Yatim
gundamsp01
post Dec 8 2011, 10:55 PM

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oh well, take mba next year then...then move to singapore
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post Dec 8 2011, 10:57 PM

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wht the f*** ...this must be done by that stupid rais....how can he try to implement such law for IT? he want to get as much money as he could before he go dying...to many procedure will make the services gone higher and IT product might be price up...
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post Dec 8 2011, 10:57 PM

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QUOTE(Keith321 @ Dec 8 2011, 10:55 PM)
just a few days ago

ICT Penting Untuk Capai Matlamat Negara Berpendapatan Tinggi - Rais Yatim
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damn now i see what he means to convey
NameTaken
post Dec 8 2011, 10:58 PM

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lowyat.net sdn bhd
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post Dec 8 2011, 11:02 PM

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Malaysia bought a one way ticket to longkang
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post Dec 8 2011, 11:03 PM

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so salary will increase?
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post Dec 8 2011, 11:04 PM

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yay now IT guys can hav IR title ..
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post Dec 8 2011, 11:07 PM

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2012 - anak-anak dato yang kerja jadi salesman lowyat
SUSKeith321
post Dec 8 2011, 11:07 PM

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QUOTE(StarFalls~* @ Dec 8 2011, 11:03 PM)
so salary will increase?
*
IT pros are forced to flock to krony it compenies which will pay peanuts in return due to high supply. foreign and local clients see cronyputra compenies and gtfo fast,
find solutions from other countries. hardly any projects for cronyputra compenies except for goberman projects.



This post has been edited by Keith321: Dec 8 2011, 11:08 PM
wordtalks
post Dec 8 2011, 11:09 PM

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RAGE!!! Change government
puppeto4
post Dec 8 2011, 11:09 PM

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I wonder how company like Intel will react to this..need to gali the grave deeper for maximum effect
SUSrandyhow
post Dec 8 2011, 11:10 PM

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those do freelance will kena jail also?...

kesian... no more side income..
narf03
post Dec 8 2011, 11:10 PM

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soon, whoever going toilet or pee in the pants without license will have to go to jail.
StarFalls~*
post Dec 8 2011, 11:12 PM

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QUOTE(Keith321 @ Dec 8 2011, 11:07 PM)
IT pros are forced to flock to krony it compenies which will pay peanuts in return due to high supply. foreign and local clients see cronyputra compenies and gtfo fast,
find solutions from other countries. hardly any projects for cronyputra compenies except for goberman projects.
*
so cyberjaya and tpm can close down d hmm.gif
wh0cares
post Dec 8 2011, 11:12 PM

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Microsoft already certified me as a professional. Still need license ahh?
SUSrandyhow
post Dec 8 2011, 11:14 PM

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help my friend reformat PC will get jail or not?
narf03
post Dec 8 2011, 11:14 PM

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QUOTE(wh0cares @ Dec 8 2011, 11:12 PM)
Microsoft already certified me as a professional. Still need license ahh?
*
me also got la, MCP ma, Microsoft Cheapo Professional
petirbuas
post Dec 8 2011, 11:16 PM

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QUOTE(randyhow @ Dec 8 2011, 11:14 PM)
help my friend reformat PC will get jail or not?
*
u got license?
if not GTFIn jail
SUSrandyhow
post Dec 8 2011, 11:21 PM

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QUOTE(petirbuas @ Dec 8 2011, 11:16 PM)
u got license?
if not GTFIn jail
*
OMG... i'm a fugitive now...
polarzbearz
post Dec 8 2011, 11:22 PM

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Thank you government.. whose "GENIUS" idea is this? License to develop software? This is worse than Apple's Software Developer License.. doh.gif
annoymous1234
post Dec 8 2011, 11:24 PM

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QUOTE(randyhow @ Dec 8 2011, 11:10 PM)
those do freelance will kena jail also?...

kesian... no more side income..
*
this is memang to screw up those freelance

QUOTE(randyhow @ Dec 8 2011, 11:14 PM)
help my friend reformat PC will get jail or not?
*
SOON.. the time will come
HoNeYdEwBoY
post Dec 8 2011, 11:25 PM

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QUOTE(StarFalls~* @ Dec 9 2011, 01:12 AM)
so cyberjaya and tpm can close down d  hmm.gif
*
UCTI can hancur edi.. since they is building new campus D:
annas473
post Dec 8 2011, 11:25 PM

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Rais yatim and IT... not sure is it true or false but it seem like Rafidah and AP
polarzbearz
post Dec 8 2011, 11:27 PM

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QUOTE(HoNeYdEwBoY @ Dec 8 2011, 11:25 PM)
UCTI can hancur edi.. since they is building new campus D:
*
Not only UCTI, the entire IT field will progress.. but backwards.... doh.gif
rock_world
post Dec 8 2011, 11:30 PM

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this will affect me as GURU ICT in skoll...i dowan to be guru ict anymoarrrr
Currylaksa
post Dec 8 2011, 11:30 PM

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QUOTE(randyhow @ Dec 8 2011, 11:21 PM)
OMG... i'm a fugitive now...
*
time for us to migrate sad.gif
HoNeYdEwBoY
post Dec 8 2011, 11:31 PM

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QUOTE(polarzbearz @ Dec 9 2011, 01:27 AM)
Not only UCTI, the entire IT field will progress.. but backwards.... doh.gif
*
so we go back iceage ?
polarzbearz
post Dec 8 2011, 11:34 PM

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QUOTE(Currylaksa @ Dec 8 2011, 11:30 PM)
time for us to migrate sad.gif
*
+1.. if all the IT expertise in Malaysia migrates.. I wonder what will happen laugh.gif
SUSsfx3000
post Dec 8 2011, 11:41 PM

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We all should band together and get some maids from Indonesia as gifts to him so he'll leave us alone.
Break Prick
post Dec 8 2011, 11:45 PM

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Walao wehh... seriously u need licence ? sleep.gif" apa punya country ni !!!
daft
post Dec 8 2011, 11:49 PM

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wheee were going down the gutter congratz
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post Dec 8 2011, 11:49 PM

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next time i know, rais yatim head is on pike for public to see
lulusantos
post Dec 8 2011, 11:51 PM

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Benefits of Licensing to Both the Licensor and Licensee

QUOTE
Licensor or Brand Owner

    Builds and strengthens the brand image beyond traditional boundaries and builds brand value
    Increases awareness of the brand and its core products amongst consumers who otherwise might not be brand    aware.
    Helps to reinforce brand message and position in the marketplace.
    Attracts new customers to the brand name
    Allows consumers to acquire authorized rather than illegal or unauthorized products using the brand name, marks and logo.
    Enhances the importance of the brand name to existing customers
    Allows entry to additional or new trade channels
    Protects trademarks by broadening the trade use of marks
    Generates revenue beyond the normal revenue and profit stream of the brand owner



QUOTE
Licensee or Manufacturer

    Grows market share by associating it products with a brand name and image that transcend the intrinsic retail value of the product manufactured
    Builds competitive advantages over competitors with weaker or no brand awareness
    Generates greater revenue without the start up costs associated with brand development and promotion


QUOTE
Licensees or Manufacturers

    Increases market share of core products through brand acceptance
    Opens new retail channels by channeling channel appropriate brands to their proper niches.
    Gains shelf space at retail by offering multiple valid alternative profit solutions to the retailer
    Increases awareness of product offerings
    Attracts new customers to existing products
    Builds competitive advantage over companies who compete only on price
    Increases sales through a wider assortment of products, giving reasons for additional space
    Lends credibility to their products through brand association
    Generates incremental revenues through the sale of licensed product over and above core non-branded products.



puppeto4
post Dec 8 2011, 11:52 PM

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QUOTE(ichi_24 @ Dec 8 2011, 11:49 PM)
next time i know, rais yatim head is on pike for public to see
*
Whoever responsible for that, I'll name my child after him
akisendro
post Dec 8 2011, 11:53 PM

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hmm sorry if someone have brought this before ... but is any company in Silicon valley does need such license to run/startup the company ...

i dont recall any scene on the social network where mark zuckenberg have to register his comp with the big boss there .............. this is suicidal move for me for IT future ..

a lot of comp have to beg for the G for the license ... and those so called incubator will filled with filthy cronies there ............ i rest the case
elblink
post Dec 8 2011, 11:56 PM

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This is MADNESSSSS!!

Anyone had started a Facebook page on this?

1,000,000 Malaysians against this bill be passed.
annoymous1234
post Dec 8 2011, 11:58 PM

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QUOTE(elblink @ Dec 8 2011, 11:56 PM)
This is MADNESSSSS!!

Anyone had started a Facebook page on this?

1,000,000 Malaysians against this bill be passed.
*
the last time someone started 1,000,000 Malaysians wants najib to resign, nothing happens
ichi_24
post Dec 8 2011, 11:59 PM

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QUOTE(akisendro @ Dec 8 2011, 11:53 PM)
hmm sorry if someone have brought this before ... but is any company in Silicon valley does need such license to run/startup the company ...

i dont recall any scene on the social network where mark zuckenberg have to register his comp with the big boss there .............. this is suicidal move for me for IT future ..

a lot of comp have to beg for the G for the license ... and those so called incubator will filled with filthy cronies there ............ i rest the case
*
the gomen want to suck people blood till dry before upcoming GE

and before that happen we need to screw them first

bloody crony and rais yatim, you pay for it mad.gif
VengenZ
post Dec 9 2011, 12:01 AM

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cant even make software using VB?

This post has been edited by VengenZ: Dec 9 2011, 12:02 AM
quackpack
post Dec 9 2011, 12:03 AM

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good for IT people now, being recognize and a board to fight for our rights

pay raise in the horizon!
bai1101
post Dec 9 2011, 12:05 AM

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i don't understand this ?

Mean if write program like POS need license to develop it?

Computer part retailing?
ichi_24
post Dec 9 2011, 12:05 AM

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QUOTE(quackpack @ Dec 9 2011, 12:03 AM)
good for IT people now, being recognize and a board to fight for our rights

pay raise in the horizon!
*
your missing the bigger picture
elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 12:06 AM

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QUOTE(annoymous1234 @ Dec 8 2011, 11:58 PM)
the last time someone started 1,000,000 Malaysians wants najib to resign, nothing happens
*
Wouldn't that be aiming a bit too high asking him to resign with no proven reasons/leverage?

I didn't know about the existence of that FB page until you mentioned.

1,000,000 out of 27,000,000 people may not not significant enough to get a PM to resign, maybe?

But 1,000,000 people to stop this bill being passed might at least make some noise.

Inb4 we can't get even 1,000 FB fans.

Inb4 someone already send this out to the opposition.

flagged
post Dec 9 2011, 12:07 AM

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The gov taking something so beautiful, creative and borderless and making it SHIT.

Most prolly the whole crux of the matter is to shut down bloggers and sites like malaysiakini.
annoymous1234
post Dec 9 2011, 12:09 AM

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QUOTE(elblink @ Dec 9 2011, 12:06 AM)
Wouldn't that be aiming a bit too high asking him to resign with no proven reasons/leverage?

I didn't know about the existence of that FB page until you mentioned.

1,000,000 out of 27,000,000 people may not not significant enough to get a PM to resign, maybe?

But 1,000,000 people to stop this bill being passed might at least make some noise.

Inb4 we can't get even 1,000 FB fans.

Inb4 someone already send this out to the opposition.
*
lol. as long as this bill get 2/3 majority pass, it will be implemented. now is the time to make sure that they don't get that 2/3 sits
elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 12:10 AM

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QUOTE(quackpack @ Dec 9 2011, 12:03 AM)
good for IT people now, being recognize and a board to fight for our rights

pay raise in the horizon!
*
IT development will cost more & clients will pay more because of the so-called license.

Is there anything wrong with the IT services right now?

This does not benefit the rakyat at all, except a few people's coffers who are pulling the strings from upstairs.
akisendro
post Dec 9 2011, 12:10 AM

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i believe this is some sort of controlling the freedom in cyberworld ... they ady have the cyber law ... MCMC .... and now they're inventing another new rules ....

with current G is having more IT related project (i.e HSBB .... etc etc) such move looks like for me are more related in identifying which company are supporting the G ....

the project will be awarded not because of the credible bidders ..... but how close u r with <INSERT whatever u want> ......

inb4 ... just wonder what happen to those open bidding systems ......


elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 12:14 AM

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QUOTE(annoymous1234 @ Dec 9 2011, 12:09 AM)
lol. as long as this bill get 2/3 majority pass, it will be implemented. now is the time to make sure that they don't get that 2/3 sits
*
How do we achieve that?

Give money/incentive to any MP, he/she can just jump ship and be a Yes man.

SUSterrance511
post Dec 9 2011, 12:14 AM

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arrrgh shit ! im so young til i cant analyse, will this become real ? wtf ?? it's only rumor ? or wtf happen
tuo850
post Dec 9 2011, 12:28 AM

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so now you cannot build wordpress site, if u dun have license? cant reformat pc, if u dun have license? so does the person who proposed this law knew what IT is? Does he has IT qualification/license?? does he even has smartphone? can he type? i lol
gallantdestroyer
post Dec 9 2011, 12:33 AM

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I almost graduate and i get this news... wahlao.. force me to migrate meh???
cx2531
post Dec 9 2011, 12:33 AM

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QUOTE(gallantdestroyer @ Dec 9 2011, 12:33 AM)
I almost graduate and i get this news... wahlao.. force me to migrate meh???
*
haha.. at least u graduatee.. i still on the way =.=
JonSpark
post Dec 9 2011, 12:40 AM

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ayam on the way to graduate from IT also T_T
BaboonZ
post Dec 9 2011, 12:43 AM

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QUOTE(sfx3000 @ Dec 8 2011, 08:56 PM)
Anyone caught working as Software Developer, diploma or degree or not, without being licensed by government, will be fined 20k or jailed 6 months.
The key is, the criteria for licensing would be very vague and prone to abuse.
Malaysia is probably the other country to implement this law other than Nigeria (pariah country)
*
Dulu amalkan dasar pandang Timur. Skarang dasar pandang Afrika pulak? doh.gif
elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 12:43 AM

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Open day on reviewing the bill Next Tuesday

http://malaysiasaya.my/computing-professio...l-2011-malaysia
petirbuas
post Dec 9 2011, 12:45 AM

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QUOTE(tuo850 @ Dec 9 2011, 12:28 AM)
so now you cannot build wordpress site, if u dun have license? cant reformat pc, if u dun have license?...
*
for personal use its OK but for commercial its not

QUOTE(tuo850 @ Dec 9 2011, 12:28 AM)
... so does the person who proposed this law knew what IT is? Does he has IT qualification/license?? does he even has smartphone? can he type? i lol
*
of course 'he' knew, if not how can he proposed such a beautiful yet cunning law to benefit certain organisation

this is mindfucukingly genius
blackamikaze
post Dec 9 2011, 12:45 AM

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why an IT graduate should be worry?.. u just need take the license like engineer do and u probably has better chance to find a job now since not everyone can jump to IT like before.. so after this, like it or not, people can only depend on IT graduate to do IT job..
SUSYameteOniichan
post Dec 9 2011, 12:49 AM

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QUOTE
Is there anything wrong with the IT services right now?


Everything is wrong about IT services ni Malaysia.
petirbuas
post Dec 9 2011, 12:50 AM

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QUOTE(YameteOniichan @ Dec 9 2011, 12:49 AM)
Everything is wrong about IT services in Malaysia.
*
fix'd
elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 12:51 AM

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QUOTE(blackamikaze @ Dec 9 2011, 12:45 AM)
why an IT graduate should be worry?.. u just need take the license like engineer do and u probably has better chance to find a job now since not everyone can jump to IT like before.. so after this, like it or not, people can only depend on IT graduate to do IT job..
*
Not all IT graduates can repair pc, do networking, do SEO, programming, design a website or create a flash introduction page.

Not all non IT graduates can't do that, and some can do it better than IT grads.

I have personally hired someone who is not an IT Grad to do programming because that person can delivery.

By the way, Thanks the Mod/Staff/Admin for having this thread pinned.

This post has been edited by elblink: Dec 9 2011, 12:51 AM
NasiLemakMan
post Dec 9 2011, 12:51 AM

oh hai! wan naslemak?
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QUOTE(annoymous1234 @ Dec 9 2011, 12:09 AM)
lol. as long as this bill get 2/3 majority pass, it will be implemented. now is the time to make sure that they don't get that 2/3 sits
*
don't you people familiar with the drill already by now?

Later will come out in the news draft pulled out due to many opposition from rakyat. This shows the G cares for rakyat.

Comes out with another stupid draft/proposal, rinse and repeat Government cares for rakyat a thousand times.
shinnyx
post Dec 9 2011, 12:51 AM

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it's like u have to be a business graduated in order to start up a business
flagged
post Dec 9 2011, 12:51 AM

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https://www.facebook.com/pages/Malaysians-A...7811647?sk=wall
SUSterrance511
post Dec 9 2011, 12:52 AM

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me IT graduate, doing freelance thing, should i worry ?
BaLs
post Dec 9 2011, 12:54 AM

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QUOTE(narf03 @ Dec 8 2011, 08:15 AM)
How about we discuss on how to get the license ?
*
We are against the bill. vmad.gif


If BN going to implement this I'm sure hackers group gonna attack most of the gov servers rclxms.gif
elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 12:54 AM

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QUOTE(NasiLemakMan @ Dec 9 2011, 12:51 AM)
don't you people familiar with the drill already by now?

Later will come out in the news draft pulled out due to many opposition from rakyat. This shows the G cares for rakyat.

Comes out with another stupid draft/proposal, rinse and repeat Government cares for rakyat a thousand times.
*
If they passed the bill, the current G is committing suicide before election.

So if they pulled out the bill.....means the rakyat will love them more???

They think we still live in caves, use stone as tools and swing from trees.

This is the internet social media age, my dear G.

This post has been edited by elblink: Dec 9 2011, 12:55 AM
KVReninem
post Dec 9 2011, 12:56 AM

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QUOTE(ichi_24 @ Dec 8 2011, 11:48 PM)
ini macam CIDB

got kontraktor license, must apply MOF, must apply SSM, must apply this, must apply that

damn to many bureaucracy
*
yeah; agree with you man..CIDB not even properly license. The work also very shoddy there.

kamfoo
post Dec 9 2011, 12:56 AM

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what the purpose of this rubbish law, is it to control information?
FrozerLaxegon
post Dec 9 2011, 12:57 AM

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QUOTE(flagged @ Dec 9 2011, 12:51 AM)
liked & shared smile.gif
FrozerLaxegon
post Dec 9 2011, 12:57 AM

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QUOTE(kamfoo @ Dec 9 2011, 12:56 AM)
what the purpose of this rubbish law, is it to control information?
*
I have a vision this will be like V for Vendetta, gahmen controls everything
elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 12:58 AM

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QUOTE(flagged @ Dec 9 2011, 12:51 AM)
Liked + Shared.
Thanks!


QUOTE(terrance511 @ Dec 9 2011, 12:52 AM)
me IT graduate, doing freelance thing, should i worry ?
*
As long as you receive money/incentive in return, yes.

I'm not sure in the case of if your cousin asked you to fixed his pc and buy you a meal though.

This post has been edited by elblink: Dec 9 2011, 01:00 AM
blackamikaze
post Dec 9 2011, 12:58 AM

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QUOTE(elblink @ Dec 9 2011, 12:51 AM)
Not all IT graduates can repair pc, do networking, do SEO, programming, design a website or create a flash introduction page.

Not all non IT graduates can't do that, and some can do it better than IT grads.

I have personally hired someone who is not an IT Grad to do programming because that person can delivery.

By the way, Thanks the Mod/Staff/Admin for having this thread pinned.
*
of course not all it graduates are good, im just saying this new bill not gonna affect IT graduate in a bad way..

it only gonna affect freelancer and company since company can only hired people who has licensed which also gonna cost them more compare to hiring IT literate worker with just SPM laugh.gif
KVReninem
post Dec 9 2011, 12:59 AM

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QUOTE(quackpack @ Dec 9 2011, 03:03 AM)
good for IT people now, being recognize and a board to fight for our rights

pay raise in the horizon!
*
means I`ll be paying idiots in IT that only design stuffs like MYemail. icon_idea.gif That is so badly collectives move by govt.
elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 01:01 AM

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QUOTE(blackamikaze @ Dec 9 2011, 12:58 AM)
of course not all it graduates are good, im just saying this new bill not gonna affect IT graduate in a bad way..

it only gonna affect freelancer and company since company can only hired people who has licensed which also gonna cost them more compare to hiring IT literate worker with just SPM laugh.gif
*
Yes so it seems to be heading that way.

Good thing my staff are mostly overseas.
blackamikaze
post Dec 9 2011, 01:01 AM

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QUOTE(KVReninem @ Dec 9 2011, 12:59 AM)
means I`ll be paying idiots in IT that only design stuffs like MYemail. icon_idea.gif That is so badly collectives move by govt.
*
yes laugh.gif
FrozerLaxegon
post Dec 9 2011, 01:03 AM

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malaysia towards future underground information exchange.
akisendro
post Dec 9 2011, 01:03 AM

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they want to implement such thing like what in ausie .... they have one body controlling the IT pro over there .. its called australian computer society (ACS)

but the thing is ... in ausie .. it was form by the professional there .. the move was not started by the G ... and i believe the G dont give a heck about it ... and later ..... because of the strong move by the society ...
ACS has become a professional body ...

how come such body to control this so called professional is mooted by the G ... (got udang i think) .... lets the professional choose for themselves la

im just afraid .. this kind of thing will lead into something BS .... just like what happened to other professional body which controlled by the G ..

This post has been edited by akisendro: Dec 9 2011, 01:05 AM
soujiro_seta
post Dec 9 2011, 01:20 AM

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QUOTE(akisendro @ Dec 9 2011, 01:03 AM)
they want to implement such thing like what in ausie .... they have one body controlling the IT pro over there .. its called australian computer society (ACS)

but the thing is ... in ausie .. it was form by the professional there .. the move was not started by the G ... and i believe the G dont give a heck about it ... and later ..... because of the strong move by the society ...
ACS has become a professional body ...

how come such body to control this so called professional is mooted by the G ... (got udang i think) .... lets the professional choose for themselves la

im just afraid .. this kind of thing will lead into something BS .... just like what happened to other professional body which controlled by the G ..
*
which professional body controlled by the G? hmm.gif
LiMi
post Dec 9 2011, 01:20 AM

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If salary still same, why have it at the first place.....?

akisendro
post Dec 9 2011, 01:35 AM

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QUOTE(soujiro_seta @ Dec 9 2011, 02:20 AM)
which professional body controlled by the G?  hmm.gif
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not directly by the G ... but the act which control it ... lawyers ... surveyors .. engineers ..... i dont know all .... except for the BAR council .. most this body are now a place for the cronies to hv their influence .. and some of the boards elected with the influence he have.......
BaLs
post Dec 9 2011, 01:37 AM

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QUOTE(quackpack @ Dec 8 2011, 11:03 AM)
good for IT people now, being recognize and a board to fight for our rights

pay raise in the horizon!
*
WTH ??


The board is there not to fight for our rights but to rip our rights! vmad.gif

Seriously have you read the bill? Anywhere in it the board seems to fight for IT professional? doh.gif

This post has been edited by BaLs: Dec 9 2011, 01:43 AM
gallantdestroyer
post Dec 9 2011, 01:42 AM

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QUOTE(blackamikaze @ Dec 9 2011, 12:45 AM)
why an IT graduate should be worry?.. u just need take the license like engineer do and u probably has better chance to find a job now since not everyone can jump to IT like before.. so after this, like it or not, people can only depend on IT graduate to do IT job..
*
The problem is i have an business in mind... As an entrepreneur....
I do not dare to even think what will happen if this law enforce and all the step require to run a small basic business... aih...
bai1101
post Dec 9 2011, 01:45 AM

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even regular computer shop is effected?
TOROBO
post Dec 9 2011, 01:48 AM

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omg,it is pinned -__-
damn you government
SUSrandyhow
post Dec 9 2011, 01:48 AM

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QUOTE(annoymous1234 @ Dec 9 2011, 12:09 AM)
lol. as long as this bill get 2/3 majority pass, it will be implemented. now is the time to make sure that they don't get that 2/3 sits
*
sigh... a lot still ignorant on our system,... BN didn't get 2/3 on this terms Gov (1st time in history), but they can pass any bill with just simple majority,... 2/3 majority is needed only for Constitution amendment..
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post Dec 9 2011, 02:01 AM

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This post has been edited by earl-ku: Dec 9 2011, 02:02 AM
zaidi
post Dec 9 2011, 02:26 AM

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what are they thinking actually? a hacker hacked .gov.my web and left a you are owned, this is my cert number? or they are thinking that formatting a pc is life-threatening that you need to be registered to do that?

IT is now a major field, so large that the knowledge growth is uncontrollable. how would they classify and later charge the fee?
satnam182
post Dec 9 2011, 02:50 AM

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Screw this shit. You can't even think/sketch/build a prototype/discuss/or even email your friend about this new app idea you have if this bill goes live. If you're a developer and you love what you're doing. Then you should be at MOSTI's office on Tuesday to oppose this bill. This is about any political party or any political agenda. It's just that there some really idiot people in the goverment who thinks that they're right about everything.


Added on December 9, 2011, 2:53 amI'm a college dropout and I took up coding as a hobby and it's now my profession. If I had to go through our tertiary university studies to learn how to code, I'd be coding using .NET or Java right now. Those languages are bloody dead or are dying, we don't teach languages that people will use. I only see couple of students from Uni that actually took their own initiative to learn Rails or jQuery and they are the ones that normally gets hired by startups in other country or they are the ones that starts their own startup and become somebody that actually contributes to Malaysian's GDP.



This post has been edited by satnam182: Dec 9 2011, 02:53 AM
tuo850
post Dec 9 2011, 02:56 AM

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what are they trying to control actually? the contracts? the jobs? the industry? whom they are trying to protect? conman/scammers are everywhere and even these they fail to control.
lalalee
post Dec 9 2011, 03:09 AM

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if they implement this law. prestariang is the winnar.

@satnam182
i didn't know you are dropout.
satnam182
post Dec 9 2011, 03:20 AM

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http://www.facebook.com/events/205572512858664/

QUOTE(lalalee @ Dec 9 2011, 03:09 AM)
if they implement this law. prestariang is the winnar.

@satnam182
i didn't know you are dropout.
*
I did a Dip in Business Economics in KTAR. Took programming as a hobby to edit HTML/CSS for Friendster profiles and then moved to PHP. Dropped out the second year and never looked back.
lalalee
post Dec 9 2011, 03:36 AM

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QUOTE(satnam182 @ Dec 9 2011, 03:20 AM)
http://www.facebook.com/events/205572512858664/
I did a Dip in Business Economics in KTAR. Took programming as a hobby to edit HTML/CSS for Friendster profiles and then moved to PHP. Dropped out the second year and never looked back.
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hwkl no confirmation email ar?
odin88
post Dec 9 2011, 04:09 AM

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Hitler Angry towards Malaysian Computing Bill 2011
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CVVDNIJpDbM
Sau Seng La
post Dec 9 2011, 05:42 AM

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user posted image
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This post has been edited by Sau Seng La: May 17 2012, 03:49 AM
pufferfish
post Dec 9 2011, 06:18 AM

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post Dec 9 2011, 07:19 AM

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If this bill got passed into act, then I'll be screwed up upside down because I don't have tetiary education in IT.

My degree is environmental science.
azerak
post Dec 9 2011, 07:24 AM

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If u want to be a lawyer,u need a kind of license,u want to be an architect u need a kind of license.so whats wrong with this?at least we dont have any tom d*** and harry working as it personnel.

And this thread get pinned..owai...
kingkingyyk
post Dec 9 2011, 08:15 AM

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Ok, then I think I will be sued and fined+jailed soon.
Unlicensed IT support here.

This post has been edited by kingkingyyk: Dec 9 2011, 08:15 AM
NameTaken
post Dec 9 2011, 08:15 AM

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QUOTE(azerak @ Dec 9 2011, 07:24 AM)
If u want to be a lawyer,u need a kind of license,u want to be an architect u need a kind of license.so whats wrong with this?at least we dont have any tom d*** and harry working as it personnel.

And this thread get pinned..owai...
*
i dont see a problem with licencing too. but there's 1 thing i concern is about the cronies will abuse the law. theres only 1 way to know, just wait.
kingkingyyk
post Dec 9 2011, 08:16 AM

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QUOTE(azerak @ Dec 9 2011, 07:24 AM)
If u want to be a lawyer,u need a kind of license,u want to be an architect u need a kind of license.so whats wrong with this?at least we dont have any tom d*** and harry working as it personnel.

And this thread get pinned..owai...
*
Oh wai, IT support does not need to study.
Research + Experience will do the magic.
thesoothsayer
post Dec 9 2011, 08:35 AM

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QUOTE(azerak @ Dec 9 2011, 07:24 AM)
If u want to be a lawyer,u need a kind of license,u want to be an architect u need a kind of license.so whats wrong with this?at least we dont have any tom d*** and harry working as it personnel.

And this thread get pinned..owai...
*
My reasons for opposing are this:
1. I am against a law that forces people to only hire a member of a certain body.

2. Let the body exist and certify the IT people that wants to join it, but let the industry determine the value of the body and its members through free trade. If the members are less capable than the non-members, then don't hire them. In this way, if the body's certification and membership are of any use, industry will tend to hire them and not others.

3. Producing software is not like medicine or architecture that is a matter of life and death. Certain industries that require better software people (i.e. airlines, military, parts of wireless communication) already have more rigorous hiring process and another certification will not make a difference to them; they trust in their own hiring people, not a piece of paper. Lay people can also produce software, like writing a book, and there should not be a law to stop them from doing so. Even non-accountants can fill up their own tax forms. Are you looking forward to the day when only accountants can fill up tax forms, painters association members can paint your house, writers association can type your emails etc.?

rock_world
post Dec 9 2011, 08:43 AM

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i just wonder how if tukang masak gona take a license..job in it field is full ah? so need to apply this bill
CyberianHusky
post Dec 9 2011, 08:54 AM

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QUOTE(ynot @ Dec 8 2011, 10:00 PM)
on the bright side ... qualified IT professional will be treated as a respectable IT professional with a much more reasonable wages.
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That is one of the objective
CyberianHusky
post Dec 9 2011, 08:59 AM

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QUOTE(terrance511 @ Dec 9 2011, 12:52 AM)
me IT graduate, doing freelance thing, should i worry ?
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U may need to worry about taking exams to qualify to be registered and probably paying yearly membership
piumiu
post Dec 9 2011, 09:05 AM

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What are you all waiting for, lets storm Najib facebook and twitter on this.
elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 09:06 AM

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QUOTE(gallantdestroyer @ Dec 9 2011, 01:42 AM)
The problem is i have an business in mind... As an entrepreneur....
I do not dare to even think what will happen if this law enforce and all the step require to run a small basic business... aih...
*
Same here entrepreneur mindset.

QUOTE(satnam182 @ Dec 9 2011, 02:50 AM)
Screw this shit. You can't even think/sketch/build a prototype/discuss/or even email your friend about this new app idea you have if this bill goes live. If you're a developer and you love what you're doing. Then you should be at MOSTI's office on Tuesday to oppose this bill. This is about any political party or any political agenda. It's just that there some really idiot people in the goverment who thinks that they're right about everything.


Added on December 9, 2011, 2:53 amI'm a college dropout and I took up coding as a hobby and it's now my profession. If I had to go through our tertiary university studies to learn how to code, I'd be coding using .NET or Java right now. Those languages are bloody dead or are dying, we don't teach languages that people will use. I only see couple of students from Uni that actually took their own initiative to learn Rails or jQuery and they are the ones that normally gets hired by startups in other country or they are the ones that starts their own startup and become somebody that actually contributes to Malaysian's GDP.
*
Sometimes the best coders/designers comes from self-taught, passion & experience, and not from classroom.

If classroom style had worked, then all IT grads MUST be pro in what they do.
But is that the case?

Imagine this bill was passed during the start up time of Bill Gates or Steve Jobs or Mark Zuckerberg.



QUOTE(satnam182 @ Dec 9 2011, 03:20 AM)
http://www.facebook.com/events/205572512858664/
I did a Dip in Business Economics in KTAR. Took programming as a hobby to edit HTML/CSS for Friendster profiles and then moved to PHP. Dropped out the second year and never looked back.
*
Passion & initiative will always prevail.


QUOTE(thesoothsayer @ Dec 9 2011, 08:35 AM)
My reasons for opposing are this:
1. I am against a law that forces people to only hire a member of a certain body.

2. Let the body exist and certify the IT people that wants to join it, but let the industry determine the value of the body and its members through free trade. If the members are less capable than the non-members, then don't hire them. In this way, if the body's certification and membership are of any use, industry will tend to hire them and not others.

3. Producing software is not like medicine or architecture that is a matter of life and death. Certain industries that require better software people (i.e. airlines, military, parts of wireless communication) already have more rigorous hiring process and another certification will not make a difference to them; they trust in their own hiring people, not a piece of paper. Lay people can also produce software, like writing a book, and there should not be a law to stop them from doing so. Even non-accountants can fill up their own tax forms. Are you looking forward to the day when only accountants can fill up tax forms, painters association members can paint your house, writers association can type your emails etc.?
*
This hit home exactly!

IT is different from law and medicine or architecture.

IT can be found in everyday life and be accessed by All levels of society, as compared to law and medicine or architecture.


QUOTE(CyberianHusky @ Dec 9 2011, 08:54 AM)
That is one of the objective
*
By whom the salary will be paid?
SMEs?, start ups? Big Companies? Government?

SMEs?, start ups - They rather hire someone who is a dropped out but can delivery, as compared to a fresh IT grad that doesn't have the experience.
I know some people who are so good in whatever they do that, the cert is not necessary at all.

Big Companies - Can pay big bucks but how many people can Intel/Dell/Microsoft hire?

Government - to create another Myemail, Mywebsite, Myfoot is it?

Bottomline - This Bill discourage Entrepreneurship & Passion driven people from being creative.
Since when IT is not based on passion to create & think outside the box?


This post has been edited by elblink: Dec 9 2011, 09:13 AM
CyberianHusky
post Dec 9 2011, 09:09 AM

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QUOTE(lulusantos @ Dec 8 2011, 11:04 PM)
yay now IT guys can hav IR title ..
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Not IR ler but (RCP) , after your name
me0wSter
post Dec 9 2011, 09:10 AM

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Does anyone know of any other country that has this kind of board?
elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 09:12 AM

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QUOTE(me0wSter @ Dec 9 2011, 09:10 AM)
Does anyone know of any other country that has this kind of board?
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Yes it is under Post #11

QUOTE(sfx3000 @ Dec 8 2011, 08:56 PM)
Anyone caught working as Software Developer, diploma or degree or not, without being licensed by government, will be fined 20k or jailed 6 months.
The key is, the criteria for licensing would be very vague and prone to abuse.
Malaysia is probably the other country to implement this law other than Nigeria (pariah country)
*
piumiu
post Dec 9 2011, 09:14 AM

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Can we change this for a vote? Mod?

1. Support the bill
2. Against the bill

This post has been edited by piumiu: Dec 9 2011, 09:14 AM
lagenda
post Dec 9 2011, 09:23 AM

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oh shi- so i kena apply this liao. where to apply?
dharmabums
post Dec 9 2011, 09:38 AM

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QUOTE
“Computing”is    a  goal-oriented    activity  to    plan,    architect, design,    create,    develop,    implement,    use    and    manage information  technology 


Does anyone find this statement very wide? Are they gonna start saying that designers need to register too?
Did somebody get butthurt and decided to come up with this whole nonsense?
elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 09:46 AM

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Open Day to review the Draft

Board of Computing Professional Draft Bill for review: An Open Day will be held on 13th December (Tuesday) at MOSTI Block C4, Parcel C Putrajaya.

NOTE: This date is supposedly for the organizations that were represented in the committee representing the draft. However, I felt it is for the benefit of all IT professionals to show up and be able to review the bill as we don’t want what happened recently with the Peaceful Assembly Bill.

Date : 13 Disember 2011 (Selasa)
Time : 9.30 pagi – 5.00 petang
Venue : Dewan Perhimpunan,
Aras 1, Blok C4, Kompleks C
Kementerian Sains, Teknologi dan Inovasi

I'm planning to go.

Anyone going?


This post has been edited by elblink: Dec 9 2011, 09:47 AM
MarlboroFreshMint
post Dec 9 2011, 09:54 AM

 
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billgate need to apply this license too if he open IT industri here ? lolx
akmis
post Dec 9 2011, 10:02 AM

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Some kid out there would have a nice idea on IT, and he would not be able to pitch that idea as he is not registered it professional.

IT has grow a lot unregulated, open and free. If the an act that is not properly define to pass it will stop it innovation!
lagenda
post Dec 9 2011, 10:06 AM

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QUOTE(elblink @ Dec 9 2011, 09:46 AM)
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

I'm planning to go.

Anyone going?

*
working mang. if u go don't forget to post detail in here later.


Added on December 9, 2011, 10:08 ami think this is good la. because dowan catering company get IT jobs.

/truestory

This post has been edited by lagenda: Dec 9 2011, 10:08 AM
hunt2sp
post Dec 9 2011, 10:17 AM

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open source community members will just read the law, sit on it and give it a loud purrring fart...
khelben
post Dec 9 2011, 10:25 AM

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QUOTE(hunt2sp @ Dec 9 2011, 10:17 AM)
open source community members will just read the law, sit on it and give it a loud purrring fart...
*
RM20k, jail term. Choose one laugh.gif
simonseow
post Dec 9 2011, 10:28 AM

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If this bill is passed, I foresee a lot of IT company and IT outsourcing company will pulled out from Malaysia. There goes Cyberjaya. There goes MSC. Also, sometime a IT Professional need to work cross technology. It's already hard enough to get certified by the IT technology company like Mircosoft, Oracle or Cisco. Now we have to get license to work? This will really limit the creativity and growth of IT professionals in Malaysia. Who's bright idea is this?
Peculator
post Dec 9 2011, 10:44 AM

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Who the hell purpose this bill?
M30W
post Dec 9 2011, 10:47 AM

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I wondering what will happen if this law Passed.
lagenda
post Dec 9 2011, 11:15 AM

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QUOTE(Laser Beam @ Dec 9 2011, 10:52 AM)
I think better to migrate out of Malaysia. Seriously. Damn stupid law.

IT is one sector that has a potential to generate high income. Now u regulate and close it, there will be less jobs for Malaysia.

And before some smart dude says 'just sell nasi lemak lah', please understand that everyone is linked to a certain extent. U think u can get customers if there are less working people?
*
u tak suka, u keluar.

easy right?
azerak
post Dec 9 2011, 11:17 AM

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if u are really good in your field,i dont think it will be a problem for u to pass the test.

elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 11:30 AM

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QUOTE(azerak @ Dec 9 2011, 11:17 AM)
if u are really good in your field,i dont think it will be a problem for u to pass the test.
*
I wonder what kind of test/exams to warrant you a license?

What is the function of <div> tags?

What is a CSS for?

Write a code in PHP to develop a contact form?

Now do the same using C#.

How do you setup a forum??? I wonder if se7en needs a license to setup lowyat.net

??????


How about those who are already providing the services to the clients?

Does their past work & portfolio count?


This post has been edited by elblink: Dec 9 2011, 11:34 AM
yclian
post Dec 9 2011, 11:31 AM

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QUOTE(azerak @ Dec 9 2011, 12:17 PM)
if u are really good in your field,i dont think it will be a problem for u to pass the test.
*
That IS NOT the problem. The act (if ever approved) will:

- Limit what you can (freely) or can't do. (19.3)
- Give almost absolute power to the ministry and the board (I will call them rulers from now on) to decide who you can be or cannot be. (11.1, 21, 29)
- Set the rulers immortal. (39.1, 42)
- Make you and the tax payers to pay more. (17.2, Part 4: 45, 46, ...)

Dude, you seriously need to read it, if you haven't done so.

This post has been edited by yclian: Dec 9 2011, 11:53 AM
lpc26
post Dec 9 2011, 11:39 AM

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Bill Gates need to apply this also, because him opened Microsoft center at Malaysia, not only him affected, UBS Corporation, ICS, HP, Acer...etc, all need to apply this license.
potemkin
post Dec 9 2011, 11:42 AM

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QUOTE(azerak @ Dec 9 2011, 10:17 AM)
if u are really good in your field,i dont think it will be a problem for u to pass the test.
*
Poster above has already commented what i wanted to say. But to add more, my questions to those who agree with tests being conducted:

- What kinds of tests ? What will the questions be and the justifications for the tests
- Since the bill wants to limit what field you should be in , what makes the tests superior to what we already have to go through (CCIE , SAP , Microsoft certs etc)

Again , there are NO benefits to this. The only thing is see is increased costs passed on to the consumer for IT related services, with none of these extra costs being filtered down to the workers.


flagged
post Dec 9 2011, 11:45 AM

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QUOTE(azerak @ Dec 9 2011, 11:17 AM)
if u are really good in your field,i dont think it will be a problem for u to pass the test.
*
It's not about the test (even that can be contested) BUT it's about how broad are the implications of this BILL

warlove3
post Dec 9 2011, 11:46 AM

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Phone retailing and repairing business will also need to apply the same? since its also IT related thing...
NasiLemakMan
post Dec 9 2011, 11:46 AM

oh hai! wan naslemak?
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To those who agreed to the draft, don't you think the penalty is harsh?

Come, on, RM20000 or six months jail! I believe there other more serious offenses that are lower than that.
Instant_noodle
post Dec 9 2011, 12:12 PM

nyaaa~~
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now, how to define one as 'IT professional'?

does a clerk that knows simple excel functions/ VBA considered an 'IT professional'?

does a computer hobbyist that has great ideas considered an 'IT professional'?

does a fish monger who writes game mods (say elder's scrolls, warcraft3, starcraft series, or user interface for MMO) considered an 'IT professional'?

giving that there are many, many, many variants in coding (and standards), how does one getting defined as 'certified IT professional'?

there are many things they can tackle (other than corruption cuz everything are just overpriced, and cows doe live in condos) but they choose to propose this bill to leech more $$?

R*is Y*tim trolled us about the internut, the language mode and now this? WE SHOULD GIVE HIM SOMETHING ELSE TO THINK OF, LIKE A RETIRE PLAN!!! vmad.gif mad.gif
elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 12:19 PM

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QUOTE(Laser Beam @ Dec 9 2011, 12:02 PM)
In IT how do u become good?

If u have IT knowledge from year 2000-2005 and use it everyday and pass every exam for year 2000-2005, are u considered good. This is the main difference between medicine and engineering.
*
Exactly!! Pentium 3 & Core i7 are so much different.

Human anatomy is still the same since the discovery of modern western medicine.

Another example is in the field of SEO(Getting website ranked on Google), the method used before Feb 2011 is no longer effective.
This shows how fast IT changes.
ichi_24
post Dec 9 2011, 12:21 PM

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QUOTE(Instant_noodle @ Dec 9 2011, 12:12 PM)
now, how to define one as 'IT professional'?

does a clerk that knows simple excel functions/ VBA considered an 'IT professional'?

does a computer hobbyist that has great ideas considered an 'IT professional'?

does a fish monger who writes game mods (say elder's scrolls, warcraft3, starcraft series, or user interface for MMO) considered an 'IT professional'?

giving that there are many, many, many variants in coding (and standards), how does one getting defined as 'certified IT professional'?

there are many things they can tackle (other than corruption cuz everything are just overpriced, and cows doe live in condos) but they choose to propose this bill to leech more $$?

R*is Y*tim trolled us about the internut, the language mode and now this? WE SHOULD GIVE HIM SOMETHING ELSE TO THINK OF, LIKE A RETIRE PLAN!!! vmad.gif  mad.gif
*
ge is near, work your magic, rule him out

truly, this is mockery of IT industry in malaysia and around the world
elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 12:42 PM

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QUOTE(Laser Beam @ Dec 9 2011, 12:28 PM)
IT such a delicate field that I am very sure many people may have encountered some 'professional' IT people from reputable firms giving really crappy recommendations.
*
Some of the IT "professionals" are NOT IN TOUCH WITH REALITY of the fast moving IT world.
They are comfortable sitting in their Managerial seat and thinks that the IT world revolves around them.


The SMEs, freelancers, IT hobbyists are much more in tune with what everyone around the world needs, and cater for that needs, no matter how simple or small scale the project is.

So many innovations are created by a team of passionate IT hobbyist/freelancers.

And if you are lucky, the biggest search engine in the world might buy your technology up.


muyyaqdhom
post Dec 9 2011, 12:50 PM

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QUOTE(M30W @ Dec 9 2011, 11:47 AM)
I wondering what will happen if this law Passed.
*
w a r cool2.gif
khelben
post Dec 9 2011, 01:02 PM

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QUOTE(lagenda @ Dec 9 2011, 11:15 AM)
u tak suka, u keluar.

easy right?
*
u tak suka, u lawan.
elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 01:11 PM

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QUOTE(khelben @ Dec 9 2011, 01:02 PM)
u tak suka, u lawan.
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+1

"If we don't stand for something, we may fall for anything." Malcolm X
zorex
post Dec 9 2011, 01:20 PM

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curry rice, here i come
flagged
post Dec 9 2011, 01:26 PM

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prolly this is the first step to kill malaysiakini etc, next up PROFESSIONAL PHOTOGRAPHERS AND VIDEOGRAPHERS BILL
SUSchickenshit36
post Dec 9 2011, 01:32 PM

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next one... blogging need license lolol

seriously, if this was implemented in other countries we wouldn make much of a fuss, but implement this in msia and we will all think cronyism and corruption. shows u how much we think of the leaders... lap sap
iloveteddybear
post Dec 9 2011, 01:32 PM

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time to migrate~
flagged
post Dec 9 2011, 01:33 PM

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QUOTE(chickenshit36 @ Dec 9 2011, 01:32 PM)
next one... blogging need license lolol

*
Becoz the BILL is vague this might already be the case.
Instant_noodle
post Dec 9 2011, 01:34 PM

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QUOTE(iloveteddybear @ Dec 9 2011, 01:32 PM)
time to migrate~
*

dun migrate, i know you lurve this country.

educate people around you, and register to vote those idiots out


bai1101
post Dec 9 2011, 01:36 PM

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When bn can't win internet war so now there try manipulate it?


bitebug
post Dec 9 2011, 01:53 PM

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Election getting nearer. They want to show the bumis in Sabah and Sarawak they are top priorities since they are B-end's fixed deposits.
M30W
post Dec 9 2011, 02:01 PM

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QUOTE(elblink @ Dec 9 2011, 01:11 PM)
+1

"If we don't stand for something, we may fall for anything."  Malcolm X
*
+1
if it is passed, this will going to screw a lot of ppl life~

QUOTE(flagged @ Dec 9 2011, 01:26 PM)
prolly this is the first step to kill malaysiakini etc, next up PROFESSIONAL  PHOTOGRAPHERS AND VIDEOGRAPHERS BILL
*
U get the point~ they implement this law maybe they want to close all those website that they want it to be "illegal"

QUOTE(chickenshit36 @ Dec 9 2011, 01:32 PM)
next one... blogging need license lolol

seriously, if this was implemented in other countries we wouldn make much of a fuss, but implement this in msia and we will all think cronyism and corruption. shows u how much we think of the leaders... lap sap
*
nop! if the law applied, blogging might against the law too. Because those blogger are:
1. not graduate from degree
2. they didnt apply the professional license and they cant because of minimum requirement *degree
3. they indirectly provide coding to all blog reader~

so everything will be restrict~ rclxm9.gif rclxm9.gif
elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 02:03 PM

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Any retard regardless of political party that came up with this idea should be have his or her brains checked.

Before someone says <brain not found>

I am curious on how this idea came about.
Anyone else going to the Open Day?


The more people the better as I'm not skilled in taking videos.

This post has been edited by elblink: Dec 9 2011, 02:04 PM
birain
post Dec 9 2011, 02:08 PM

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i thought we already have PIKOM hmm.gif

PIKOM , THE NATIONAL ICT ASSOCIATION OF MALAYSIA is the association representing the information and communications technology (ICT) industry in Malaysia. Its membership currently stands at over 1300 comprising companies involved in a whole spectrum of ICT products and services which commands 80% of the total ICT trade in Malaysia.
Lord_Ashe
post Dec 9 2011, 02:10 PM

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If you notice, PIKOM and even MDeC has been suspiciously silent on this issue.
SUSsfx3000
post Dec 9 2011, 02:19 PM

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QUOTE(Lord_Ashe @ Dec 9 2011, 02:10 PM)
If you notice, PIKOM and even MDeC has been suspiciously silent on this issue.
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Because PIKOM and MNCC is involved in pushing and drafting the bill I heard.

Trojan horse associations.
duckhole
post Dec 9 2011, 02:23 PM

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all IT related citizens must rage and vote for opposition!
M30W
post Dec 9 2011, 02:23 PM

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Maybe they will get benefit from there?
duckhole
post Dec 9 2011, 02:29 PM

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QUOTE(M30W @ Dec 9 2011, 02:23 PM)
Maybe they will get benefit from there?
*
sure the gomen will benefit from this. extra profit to songlap from licenses.

also maybe make it hard for some companies to apply for the license, then request for songlap money more.
elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 02:32 PM

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QUOTE(duckhole @ Dec 9 2011, 02:23 PM)
all IT related citizens must rage and vote for opposition!
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I oppose this Bill regardless of which retard from which political party who proposed it.
cend
post Dec 9 2011, 02:33 PM

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Damnit, I was planning to go study CS. looking at malaysia like no hope to go forward AT ALL.

inb4 i don't think bumi's will benefit from this law. everyone going down with s**t.
duckhole
post Dec 9 2011, 02:33 PM

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QUOTE(Laser Beam @ Dec 9 2011, 02:30 PM)
Malaysia ni, makin lama makin terus.
*
malaysia going backwards at the speed of light. managed by gomen which is too powefuk.
birain
post Dec 9 2011, 02:35 PM

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IT professional need to spend money to get certified by IT body and now license to practice the trade doh.gif sweat.gif
puppeto4
post Dec 9 2011, 02:36 PM

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MALAYSIA KE ARAH KOREA UTARA, NIGERIA ETC ETC

Anyway comparing law and engineering industries with IT is just plain stupid
birain
post Dec 9 2011, 02:42 PM

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so which smart Alec propose this draft bill for the G?
geo-milano
post Dec 9 2011, 02:45 PM

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<html>
<title>Relax la, sell nasi lemak can earn alot too </title>
</html>
elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 03:13 PM

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Se7en has spoken

http://www.lowyat.net/v2/index.php?option=...d=5800&Itemid=2

This post has been edited by elblink: Dec 9 2011, 03:15 PM
justsome1
post Dec 9 2011, 03:17 PM

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for people who lives in BN rules constituencies, WRITE in to your MPs and voice your your displeasure and opposition to the bill and urge them to oppose it too if they know what's good for them.
birain
post Dec 9 2011, 03:24 PM

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the "pro" from this bill:-
1). it will weed out the tom,d*** and harry from offering IT services laugh.gif

the "cons":-
1). what charges will they imposed on us to register with the body and for how long will the next renewal registration with the body takes. hope not a hefty sum.
elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 03:31 PM

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QUOTE(birain @ Dec 9 2011, 03:24 PM)
the "pro" from this bill:-
1). it will weed out the tom,d*** and harry from offering IT services laugh.gif

the "cons":-
1). what charges will they imposed on us to register with the body and for how long will the next renewal registration with the body takes. hope not a hefty sum.
*
True, the "quacks" will be weeded out....but there are "quacks" in car mechanics, shutters installers, masseurs, hairdressers, house painters, plumbers, etc in every industry....

The issue here is if I'm an IT graduate but not being "certified" by the bill, I could go to jail or fined if i offer my services.
birain
post Dec 9 2011, 03:32 PM

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QUOTE(elblink @ Dec 9 2011, 03:31 PM)
True, the "quacks" will be weeded out....but there are "quacks" in car mechanics, shutters installers, masseurs, hairdressers, house painters, plumbers, etc in every industry....

The issue here is if I'm an IT graduate but not being "certified" by the bill, I could go to jail or fined if i offer my services.
*
yup,that's the problem lor. got black and white side. take your pick. tongue.gif
ichi_24
post Dec 9 2011, 03:40 PM

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QUOTE(birain @ Dec 9 2011, 02:42 PM)
so which smart Alec propose this draft bill for the G?
*
rais yatim, our goddamn information communication minister
anuarnor
post Dec 9 2011, 04:04 PM

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What's wrong with having tom, d*** and harry anyways. It's obviously better to let the market to weed them out rather than relying on some regulation. Why fix something that's not broken. IMO that is.
SUSchickenshit36
post Dec 9 2011, 04:14 PM

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price of IT support services will go sky high man... wtf... there wont be anymore cheap services coz all the big companies songlap.

imagine if they charged special license for mechanics, how much would it friggin cost to fix ur car? we pay more money coz of just that stupid piece of cert
ravi6662
post Dec 9 2011, 04:16 PM

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now all must be A+ certified as well.. lol..

and no more pasar malam cds....


Added on December 9, 2011, 4:19 pm“IT is a very fluid and flexible industry and, unlike doctors or engineers, does not endanger lives,” said Vijandren Ramadass, founder of online community Lowyat.net.

This post has been edited by ravi6662: Dec 9 2011, 04:19 PM
SUSs2peMocls
post Dec 9 2011, 04:22 PM

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BN politicians do not think the rakyat is poor enough yet. Need to table to make the poorer serfs.
AnneLulla
post Dec 9 2011, 04:22 PM

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Absolutely! Malaysia is as it is already brain-drained and backsliding; to add salt to the wound it is now heading back towards the Stone Age. wink.gif shakehead.gif
SUSashcrimson
post Dec 9 2011, 04:23 PM

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PR no more story?
elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 04:24 PM

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se7en in the news

http://www.themalaysianinsider.com/malaysi...s-alarm-online/

http://my.news.yahoo.com/proposed-law-to-r...-064638994.html

This post has been edited by elblink: Dec 9 2011, 04:29 PM
Invince_Z
post Dec 9 2011, 04:28 PM

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i prefer if the bill is without fees, just a way for IT professionals to be officially recognize as PRO, voluntarily. Fines and fees sound so wrong, what more, the bill forces every IT practitioners to legally recognize.
puppeto4
post Dec 9 2011, 04:29 PM

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QUOTE(ashcrimson @ Dec 9 2011, 04:23 PM)
PR no more story?
*
Here come BN trooper.

This is not politic matter, it's about putting a stupid constraint on the already challenging industry, and it will only help to enrich cronies

Use your brain please
r2t2
post Dec 9 2011, 04:34 PM

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QUOTE
OPEN DAY BOARD OF COMPUTING PROFESSIONALS MALAYSIA(BCPM)   
Adalah dimaklumkan bahawa Kementerian Sains, Teknologi dan Inovasi (MOSTI) telah diberi tanggungjawab bagi mengendalikan penubuhan Lembaga Jurukomputer Malaysia (Board of Computing Professionals Malaysia - BCPM). Sehubungan dengan itu, pihak Sekretariat ingin mendapatkan pandangan dan cadangan daripada orang awam mengenai penubuhan BCPM. Satu sesi open day akan diadakan mengikut ketetapan berikut:

Tarikh    :        13 Disember 2011 (Selasa)
Masa     :         9.30 pagi – 5.00 petang
Tempat  :        Dewan Perhimpunan
                       Aras 1, Blok C4, Kompleks C
                       Kementerian Sains, Teknologi dan Inovasi
                  
Semua dijemput hadir.

Last Updated ( Friday, 09 December 2011 )


So, in order to prevent the draft from being presented as bill (to be debated) in Parliament, it's better to nip this in the bud? How open would MOSTI be to suggestions, or is this just a formality (to get it over with)? If they are adamant in getting this through to House of Representatives, when will it be presented? The current sitting is already over, right? What else can be done? Write to MPs, make a big noise online, Cyber Spring, ....?

This post has been edited by r2t2: Dec 9 2011, 04:36 PM
whoopa
post Dec 9 2011, 04:38 PM

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waffakk!!
elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 04:50 PM

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New law puts noose around computer techies

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «


This post has been edited by elblink: Dec 9 2011, 04:56 PM
cybercrew
post Dec 9 2011, 04:53 PM

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QUOTE(cend @ Dec 8 2011, 09:24 PM)
File sharing site alredi blocked. mabe after this govt. gonna block to all opensource program (GIMP, blender etc..)

Welp, we just have to rely our friend Anonymous again...
*
YEah totally agree.!!
r2t2
post Dec 9 2011, 04:55 PM

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I like this comment by a certain nah from the malaysianinsider article.

QUOTE
"The goal of the proposed Malaysian law appears to be aimed at bringing the IT profession to higher levels of accountability, especially in light of numerous large-scale IT projects that fail or experience cost overruns."
What has this got to do with Computer Professionals. This is BN crony problem. Dont blame the professionals.


Damn right.

_____________

QUOTE
However, system administrator and business intelligence specialist Brian Ritchie said that the unspoken fear was that “the government is building a hacker database and can profile and identify all specialists.”


hmm.gif all part of the plan ...

This post has been edited by r2t2: Dec 9 2011, 04:56 PM
chanti-sama
post Dec 9 2011, 05:29 PM

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user posted image

KILL KILL KILL~~~~
flagged
post Dec 9 2011, 05:30 PM

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also checked out fb page

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Malaysians-A...289002177811647
elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 06:12 PM

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QUOTE(chanti-sama @ Dec 9 2011, 05:29 PM)
user posted image

KILL KILL KILL~~~~
*
Thanks. Added this in my LYN & FB avatar.

QUOTE(flagged @ Dec 9 2011, 05:30 PM)
Spread the word, Get more Likes!
Kampung2005
post Dec 9 2011, 06:34 PM

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This is very harmful to the development of our IT industry.

With this, our IT industry will be further eclipsed by countries such as India which has large supply of qualified IT professionals.
smokey
post Dec 9 2011, 06:35 PM

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this is the stupidest thing i ever heard...

already got so many professional bodies cert, y i need your stupid cert...

i can stay in sg, and provide IT services to ppl in msia...then u come to sg and catch me ar?
Avex
post Dec 9 2011, 06:37 PM

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projects fail and cost overruns are due to too many stupid politics involved when delivering the system. If it take six months to deliver, the requirement already changed by the time of the system delivery. Business moves faster than you think. The accountability is not so much on the IT professionals more so regarding the never ending change to business requirements. With this new bill, no outside IT professionals are allowed to practice in this country unless they are registered. Bye bye india IT professionals from Malaysia.

This post has been edited by Avex: Dec 9 2011, 06:45 PM
dma0991
post Dec 9 2011, 07:02 PM

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All the more reason for me to GTFO ASAP from here. Massive brain drain imminent.
rosamundwo
post Dec 9 2011, 07:13 PM

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how much to register? RM1k

Anyone read this?

KUALA LUMPUR, Dec 8 — Malaysia is among several fast-growing economies that are about to lose funds from the European Union (EU) from 2014, the Financial Times (FT) reported today.

http://www.themalaysianinsider.com/malaysi...ging-economies/

This post has been edited by rosamundwo: Dec 9 2011, 07:14 PM
FLampard
post Dec 9 2011, 07:23 PM

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se7en has spoken!!
QUOTE
“IT is a very fluid and flexible industry and, unlike doctors or engineers, does not endanger lives,” said Vijandren Ramadass, founder of online community Lowyat.net.


http://www.themalaysianinsider.com/malaysi...s-alarm-online/
elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 07:29 PM

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QUOTE(rosamundwo @ Dec 9 2011, 07:13 PM)
how much to register? RM1k

Anyone read this?

KUALA LUMPUR, Dec 8 — Malaysia is among several fast-growing economies that are about to lose funds from the European Union (EU) from 2014, the Financial Times (FT) reported today.

http://www.themalaysianinsider.com/malaysi...ging-economies/
*
RM1K? Where is it listed?
iloveuforever
post Dec 9 2011, 07:36 PM

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f*** la....this country...what should we do now....mother f.u.c.ker....do i need your cert...we move to another country then... o0o=.=o0o What law is this??? vmad.gif vmad.gif mad.gif mad.gif
dma0991
post Dec 9 2011, 07:41 PM

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QUOTE(rosamundwo @ Dec 9 2011, 07:13 PM)
how much to register? RM1k
*
I'm not too worried that I will have to pay 1k for it. I'm more concerned about the increase in cost that will be passed down to the consumer. Nobody will want to buy my software if I will have to hike up the price to cover the cost of my license. Not to mention the inefficiency of the governing body will make it harder for us who are not part of their crony to attain the license. IT is a low risk unlike an engineer whose negligence can cause the death of workers or a doctor whose incompetence could kill a person during an open heart surgery.
Forgotten06
post Dec 9 2011, 08:09 PM

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QUOTE(iloveuforever @ Dec 9 2011, 07:36 PM)
f*** la....this country...what should we do now....mother f.u.c.ker....do i need your cert...we move to another country then...  o0o=.=o0o  What law is this???  vmad.gif  vmad.gif  mad.gif  mad.gif
*
I understand you are pissed off by that but can you refrain from using strong words? This is a serious talk after all.
iloveuforever
post Dec 9 2011, 08:12 PM

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QUOTE(Forgotten06 @ Dec 9 2011, 09:09 PM)
I understand you are pissed off by that but can you refrain from using strong words? This is a serious talk after all.
*
okay... nod.gif


But this is really pissed off.... This rules gonna kill many people.....mang....Oppose...oppose.. vmad.gif vmad.gif
SUSsfx3000
post Dec 9 2011, 08:28 PM

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I edited original post to include the KEYWORD... CNII's definition and industry coverage.


This is the blank cheque in the bill! It is defined outside of the bill and can change anytime to suit as they wish.
salimbest83
post Dec 9 2011, 08:35 PM

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ini sudah bengong punya law..
zz
happy4ever
post Dec 9 2011, 08:36 PM

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QUOTE(dma0991 @ Dec 9 2011, 07:41 PM)
I'm not too worried that I will have to pay 1k for it. I'm more concerned about the increase in cost that will be passed down to the consumer. Nobody will want to buy my software if I will have to hike up the price to cover the cost of my license. Not to mention the inefficiency of the governing body will make it harder for us who are not part of their crony to attain the license. IT is a low risk unlike an engineer whose negligence can cause the death of workers or a doctor whose incompetence could kill a person during an open heart surgery.
*
Dont worry

your consumer would most likely not be a consumer.

because the definition of computing involves the consumer in using the system you developed. which also means, to be a user, u also need to be certified lol


time to code my websites using my good old typewriter.
mindspring
post Dec 9 2011, 09:07 PM

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QUOTE(dma0991 @ Dec 9 2011, 07:41 PM)
I'm not too worried that I will have to pay 1k for it. I'm more concerned about the increase in cost that will be passed down to the consumer. Nobody will want to buy my software if I will have to hike up the price to cover the cost of my license. Not to mention the inefficiency of the governing body will make it harder for us who are not part of their crony to attain the license. IT is a low risk unlike an engineer whose negligence can cause the death of workers or a doctor whose incompetence could kill a person during an open heart surgery.
*
not entirely true. a flawed system is fatal especially in automotive, aviation, medicine, military, and those rocket science.
dma0991
post Dec 9 2011, 09:23 PM

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QUOTE(happy4ever @ Dec 9 2011, 08:36 PM)
Dont worry

your consumer would most likely not be a consumer.

because the definition of computing involves the consumer in using the system you developed. which also means, to be a user, u also need to be certified lol
time to code my websites using my good old typewriter.
*
lol

QUOTE(mindspring @ Dec 9 2011, 09:07 PM)
not entirely true. a flawed system is fatal especially in automotive, aviation, medicine, military, and those rocket science.
*
True, Aaron Tan Dani has already covered that.
QUOTE
Aaron Tan Dani, chairman of the International Association of Software Architects, said that a board of computing professionals was good but it should only be for those involved in critical functions such as IT architects and project managers for large-scale projects where the risks due to failure was high.

“It is good but it must be based on industry needs,” said Dani. “It should be registering only those in critical functions and not try to register everybody.

Some of those that you mentioned are mission critical applications and the screening to even get those who could do the job is at least 100x tougher than the government license. The license by the government is worthless in those field that you mentioned because of the difficulty in getting that position in the first place. I would place my fate on their years of experience rather than a piece of paper that tells that they are qualified to do the job.
elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 09:33 PM

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QUOTE(mindspring @ Dec 9 2011, 09:07 PM)
not entirely true. a flawed system is fatal especially in automotive, aviation, medicine, military, and those rocket science.
*
A fellow member also mentioned this earlier in post #182 as follows bolded for easy reference:

QUOTE(thesoothsayer @ Dec 9 2011, 08:35 AM)
My reasons for opposing are this:
1. I am against a law that forces people to only hire a member of a certain body.

2. Let the body exist and certify the IT people that wants to join it, but let the industry determine the value of the body and its members through free trade. If the members are less capable than the non-members, then don't hire them. In this way, if the body's certification and membership are of any use, industry will tend to hire them and not others.

3. Producing software is not like medicine or architecture that is a matter of life and death. Certain industries that require better software people (i.e. airlines, military, parts of wireless communication) already have more rigorous hiring process and another certification will not make a difference to them; they trust in their own hiring people, not a piece of paper. Lay people can also produce software, like writing a book, and there should not be a law to stop them from doing so. Even non-accountants can fill up their own tax forms. Are you looking forward to the day when only accountants can fill up tax forms, painters association members can paint your house, writers association can type your emails etc.?
*
SUSautoman5891
post Dec 9 2011, 09:35 PM

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What a great idea to songlap more money through license fees and test fees. Way to go BN.
elblink
post Dec 9 2011, 09:50 PM

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Repost from the Malaysia Against the Bill Facebook Page

user posted image




Youtube - Hitler Angry towards Malaysian Computing Bill 2011





Source from Grey Review
user posted image

This post has been edited by elblink: Dec 9 2011, 09:56 PM
mindspring
post Dec 9 2011, 10:26 PM

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i do not support this CPB at all, as im myself is a programmer. well.. im worried how well CPB able to evaluate someone skills and experience, and decide what a person could do and whats not. no, they not gonna hire specialists or even conduct a test to evaluate us. they will probably force us to join training just like what CIDB did to all the contractors and construction personnel. and who are them? are they able to provide training at higher level? are they the expert of <insert language> ? fuq no. if we need their cert to get a job, whats the point of taking microsoft, cisco, etc, certs? and if we use their cert, will we able to ask the same salary as <insert cert name> holders? hell no. if the cert is used as indication of someone skills and knowledge, it just bloody plain stupid. people with higher education level will get more clearance, and 3rd party certs are bonus. but how about people who dont have a cert, but they are very skillful and able to deliver? they will be classified as the lowest tier practitioner. there are lot of people holding software engineering degree but they couldnt do a shyt in programming. and they expect us to trust that their cert is legit? come on.
Sarah Angelina
post Dec 9 2011, 10:51 PM

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QUOTE(automan5891 @ Dec 9 2011, 09:35 PM)
What a great idea to songlap more money through license fees and test fees. Way to go BN.
*
Even I'm not in the IT field completely, or rather the IT professional but also can see where this is heading to. What's the point of having such a thing? Even is meant for the so called government projects, it only tells people openly that they want more money for whoever want to get a project with them. For normal licensing already an issue for some of the industry, yet want to come up with all this kind of thing to shake others rice bowl for their own happiness.


iloveuforever
post Dec 9 2011, 10:53 PM

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QUOTE(Sarah Angelina @ Dec 9 2011, 11:51 PM)
Even I'm not in the IT field completely, or rather the IT professional but also can see where this is heading to. What's the point of having such a thing? Even is meant for the so called government projects, it only tells people openly that they want more money for whoever want to get a project with them. For normal licensing already an issue for some of the industry, yet want to come up with all this kind of thing to shake others rice bowl for their own happiness.
*
Ya la...this government do know doing wat...come and disturb and shake people rich bowl...no brain....this plan totally not working...i m not going to have it...we will see how they fall...i will wait and see... mad.gif mad.gif
satnam182
post Dec 10 2011, 12:03 AM

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Even if the bill says that only developers that is involved with government related work(CNI Sectors, take note of this) has to be certified, I'm pretty convinced to say that almost every developer has/or will be involved with government related work in their lifetime.

Now, here's the sectors that CNI covers,
http://cnii.cybersecurity.my/main/about.html
The CNII sectors are:

National Defence & Security
Banking & Finance
Information & Communications
Energy
Transportation
Water
Health Services
Government
Emergency Services
Food & Agriculture

Now tell me, who hasn't worked on any of the category of project listed above? I've been programming for 3 years now and has been/am involved with 8 of the categories, either by freelancing or my own agency work.


Anyway, these online argument won't prove anything. If you're worried about our future and our children's future, be there at Putrajaya next Tuesday. If you need a ride, I have space in my car from Wangsa Maju/KL. PM me.

This post has been edited by satnam182: Dec 10 2011, 12:05 AM
elblink
post Dec 10 2011, 12:14 AM

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Someone caturday-ized the following.

user posted image
Sau Seng La
post Dec 10 2011, 12:20 AM

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user posted image
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This post has been edited by Sau Seng La: May 17 2012, 03:49 AM
Joey Christensen
post Dec 10 2011, 01:38 AM

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I need to obtain the license in order to play my PS3 system?
kingkong22
post Dec 10 2011, 01:46 AM

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oh god this country cannot live anymore...
firedauz
post Dec 10 2011, 02:10 AM

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No matter what everyone says..

YOU KNOW THIS BILL IS GONNA GET A GREEN LIGHT ANYWAY wink.gif
Syaz1
post Dec 10 2011, 02:16 AM

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i'm surprised no BN supporters try to claim we're blowing facts out of proportion. after all, they accused us of doing the same with the PAB2011.

shakehead.gif i'm getting tired of this stupid gomen la...

QUOTE(khelben @ Dec 9 2011, 01:02 PM)
u tak suka, u lawan.
*
rclxms.gif

great words!

QUOTE(Laser Beam @ Dec 9 2011, 02:30 PM)
Malaysia ni, makin lama makin teruk.
*
kan dah betul, slalu ada dasar pandang ke afrika, skrang kita ikut undang2 nigeria!

QUOTE(ichi_24 @ Dec 9 2011, 03:40 PM)
rais yatim, our goddamn information communication minister
*
mad.gif i feel like throwing something at his coconut head right now.
Syaz1
post Dec 10 2011, 02:19 AM

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QUOTE(firedauz @ Dec 10 2011, 02:10 AM)
No matter what everyone says..

YOU KNOW THIS BILL IS GONNA GET A GREEN LIGHT ANYWAY wink.gif
*
mad.gif we're f***ing useless generation who dono how to fight back.

shit, time for me to grow bigger balls.
annoymous1234
post Dec 10 2011, 02:20 AM

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QUOTE(Syaz1 @ Dec 10 2011, 02:19 AM)
mad.gif we're f***ing useless generation who dono how to fight back.

shit, time for me to grow bigger balls.
*
Wat do u suggest? I don't mind civil war
Syaz1
post Dec 10 2011, 02:24 AM

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QUOTE(annoymous1234 @ Dec 10 2011, 02:20 AM)
Wat do u suggest? I don't mind civil war
*
major street protests like BERSIH would be a good start. feddup oredi, and as an IT fella this proposed bill just hits too close to home.
NoobboyZzZ
post Dec 10 2011, 02:25 AM

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do you know mostly IT worker also keyboard warrior? goverment try to make us have a hard time
, i though we citizen build up goverment is for our safety but not NOT.
we must do something before too late
and
mean now i need to format pc by it self also get sue ? lol ?
KannaSai1
post Dec 10 2011, 02:28 AM

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the field is so WIDE!!!!!

song convert to mp3 oso computing.
photoshop oso computing.
jail breaking oso computing.

BN prepare to send us back to stone age!!!
Syaz1
post Dec 10 2011, 02:29 AM

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QUOTE(NoobboyZzZ @ Dec 10 2011, 02:25 AM)
do you know mostly IT worker also keyboard warrior? goverment try to make us have a hard time
, i though we citizen build up goverment is for our safety but not NOT.
we must do something before too late
and
mean now i need to format pc by it self also get sue ? lol ?
*
hmm.gif no doubt...

a lot of the stuff i learn about computing, i learn before i even started secondary school. now i help out families and friends with computing problems. now illegal for me to help them, sucks...

we shud have Keyboard Revolution!
annoymous1234
post Dec 10 2011, 02:35 AM

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QUOTE(Syaz1 @ Dec 10 2011, 02:24 AM)
major street protests like BERSIH would be a good start. feddup oredi, and as an IT fella this proposed bill just hits too close to home.
*
Well if it really happens count me in
Syaz1
post Dec 10 2011, 02:38 AM

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QUOTE(annoymous1234 @ Dec 10 2011, 02:35 AM)
Well if it really happens count me in
*
same here, dun care if i've graduated or not, dont want UUCA to be an excuse not to attend protest anymoar. last time my parent dont allow me to protest, now see what happen, i din speak up, now i regret. definitely wanna protest if they decide to pass this bill and anymore stupid draconian future bills.
akisendro
post Dec 10 2011, 02:38 AM

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QUOTE(NoobboyZzZ @ Dec 10 2011, 03:25 AM)
do you know mostly IT worker also keyboard warrior? goverment try to make us have a hard time
, i though we citizen build up goverment is for our safety but not NOT.
we must do something before too late
and
mean now i need to format pc by it self also get sue ? lol ?
*
even keyboard warrior can influence the mass protest .. .remember the ARAB spring ... the words just spiral among the netizens at 1st ...... but after a while .. the man in power are now history .. not only for 1 country ... but almost every arab country were affected ...

here..... still remember the GE 2008 ???? how those political blogs have influences the urban voters ....... i really doubt when someone told me the keyboard warrior cannot do anything with this ... in fact this is the best thing we can have .... remember .. the thing that you cant take from the person away is the IDEA ... one move can rattle down and deny the 2/3 majority last time .. and now .. i dont think its possible with the mass movement started with just a simple words/post from these so called "KEYBOARD WARRIOR" ... sorry for the TLDR
annoymous1234
post Dec 10 2011, 02:42 AM

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QUOTE(Syaz1 @ Dec 10 2011, 02:38 AM)
same here, dun care if i've graduated or not, dont want UUCA to be an excuse not to attend protest anymoar. last time my parent dont allow me to protest, now see what happen, i din speak up, now i regret. definitely wanna protest if they decide to pass this bill and anymore stupid draconian future bills.
*
Yea. I actually regretted tat I didn't went for the bersih thing. Then last couple of weeks I went to d assembly bill protest. We have to fight wat is rightfully ours
Syaz1
post Dec 10 2011, 02:47 AM

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QUOTE(akisendro @ Dec 10 2011, 02:38 AM)
even keyboard warrior can influence the mass protest .. .remember the ARAB spring ... the words just spiral among the netizens at 1st ...... but after a while .. the man in power are now history .. not only for 1 country ... but almost every arab country were affected ...

here..... still remember the GE 2008 ???? how those political blogs have influences the urban voters ....... i really doubt when someone told me the keyboard warrior cannot do anything with this ... in fact this is the best thing we can have .... remember .. the thing that you cant take from the person away is the IDEA ... one move can rattle down and deny the 2/3 majority last time ..  and now .. i dont think its possible with the mass movement started with just a simple words/post from these so called "KEYBOARD WARRIOR" ... sorry for the TLDR
*
keyboard warriors also have a certain level of patience. when ur livelihood is under threat from the gomen, expect major resistance. this new bill proposal infuriates me even more than the PAB did...

QUOTE(annoymous1234 @ Dec 10 2011, 02:42 AM)
Yea. I actually regretted tat I didn't went for the bersih thing. Then last couple of weeks I went to d assembly bill protest. We have to fight wat is rightfully ours
*
i've been trying to join many protests for now, but parents dont allow, too scared of the gomen. i think next time i'll definitely sneak out to protest.

soujiro_seta
post Dec 10 2011, 02:53 AM

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QUOTE(Syaz1 @ Dec 10 2011, 02:47 AM)
keyboard warriors also have a certain level of patience. when ur livelihood is under threat from the gomen, expect major resistance. this new bill proposal infuriates me even more than the PAB did...
i've been trying to join many protests for now, but parents dont allow, too scared of the gomen. i think next time i'll definitely sneak out to protest.
*
do u really know what r u protesting about?
shareduwan
post Dec 10 2011, 02:54 AM

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i didnt agree about this.. lols 100% not agree about this law
annoymous1234
post Dec 10 2011, 02:54 AM

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QUOTE(Syaz1 @ Dec 10 2011, 02:47 AM)
keyboard warriors also have a certain level of patience. when ur livelihood is under threat from the gomen, expect major resistance. this new bill proposal infuriates me even more than the PAB did...
i've been trying to join many protests for now, but parents dont allow, too scared of the gomen. i think next time i'll definitely sneak out to protest.
*
Haha tat is normal. Tell ur parents this is ur generation. Its no longer our parents generation but ours. We are d one who is gonna live for another 50 years or so. And wat these dumb ppl are doing will affect us in the long run. Tell this to ur parents maybe they will understand.
doppelganger111
post Dec 10 2011, 02:55 AM

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Even if you just consider the development perspective, in theory, if you write an Excel macro, you fall under this bill as well...

If a board should exist, firstly, it needs to deliver value to its members. For example, by running internationally-renowned examinations for specific products (i.e. Oracle Certification), providing access to academic journals, acting as a union, etc. If not, it is sucking money for nothing.

Secondly, if such a board should be setup, it should not be setup by the government - every government puts in place laws that are ideally long-term and for stability purposes - there is no such thing as "long-term" in terms of technological advancement. As a result, the board needs to be setup by the professionals themselves.

Thirdly, membership of a board should never be mandatory as it devalues the quality of said membership, unless that membership is really something that is difficult to earn (i.e. certification of medics and lawyers). Anyone with a computer and a text editor can become a software developer, while you need a degree, additional training, additional qualifications and lots of experience to become a doctor or lawyer.

I can see merit in membership of a board for critical projects such as hospital systems and would not mind a hospital demanding such certification, but in practice it doesn't really matter because experience is always better. Would a company rather hire someone with membership of this board with a subject in security, or someone who has worked with security software companies and actually developed things with them?

In order for this membership to be worth it, the board itself needs to be internationally-respected by professionals and governments. It can only be internationally-respected if the professionals themselves find true value in joining this group (see the first reason above), where a hirer will see this membership certificate and realise that this candidate has gone through the trouble of certifying himself or herself with a renowned board.

Making it mandatory, however, defeats the point, and is probably infeasible - how do you certify every single person who has worked on software today in Malaysia? Are you going to cram thousands of people into some exam hall in KL and force them to learn?

In my experience, IT training is often rather rubbish, anyway, unless it is in a specific technology or product (i.e. Oracle Certification, JCP (Java), Microsoft training, etc.). There might be some merit in things like ethics courses or copyright courses, but then again, these should ideally be taught at school level more than anything.

So the government needs to step back and let the professionals work it out. They will be the ones who will sign up or leave the country, after all. If it's accountability they are worried about, don't blame the developers and architects - blame the project managers. Regulating the developers is like regulating the cleaners - it really isn't their fault.
annoymous1234
post Dec 10 2011, 02:58 AM

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Anyways, lets just see how things goes
soujiro_seta
post Dec 10 2011, 02:58 AM

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QUOTE(shareduwan @ Dec 10 2011, 02:54 AM)
i didnt agree about this.. lols 100% not agree about this law
*
most of them know nothing about it..
allinuff
post Dec 10 2011, 02:58 AM

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Lol...

If Singapore is "fine" country soon we will be "permit" country.

Want format computer? Apply permit.

Want go mamak with 4 friends? Apply permit.
KannaSai1
post Dec 10 2011, 02:58 AM

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Syaz1
post Dec 10 2011, 03:00 AM

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QUOTE(soujiro_seta @ Dec 10 2011, 02:53 AM)
do u really know what r u protesting about?
*
dey brother dont insult my intelligence biggrin.gif

of course i know. i still remember the many protests i wanted to join but cant, like bersih, aziz bari, anti-PAB, etc.

QUOTE(annoymous1234 @ Dec 10 2011, 02:54 AM)
Haha tat is normal. Tell ur parents this is ur generation. Its no longer our parents generation but ours. We are d one who is gonna live for another 50 years or so. And wat these dumb ppl are doing will affect us in the long run. Tell this to ur parents maybe they will understand.
*
exactly my point, but sometimes i just too good, always obey them. and yes, oredi told them, hard time making them seeing my point. tongue.gif
soujiro_seta
post Dec 10 2011, 03:00 AM

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QUOTE(doppelganger111 @ Dec 10 2011, 02:55 AM)
Even if you just consider the development perspective, in theory, if you write an Excel macro, you fall under this bill as well...

If a board should exist, firstly, it needs to deliver value to its members.  For example, by running internationally-renowned examinations for specific products (i.e. Oracle Certification), providing access to academic journals, acting as a union, etc.  If not, it is sucking money for nothing.

Secondly, if such a board should be setup, it should not be setup by the government - every government puts in place laws that are ideally long-term and for stability purposes - there is no such thing as "long-term" in terms of technological advancement.  As a result, the board needs to be setup by the professionals themselves.

Thirdly, membership of a board should never be mandatory as it devalues the quality of said membership, unless that membership is really something that is difficult to earn (i.e. certification of medics and lawyers).  Anyone with a computer and a text editor can become a software developer, while you need a degree, additional training, additional qualifications and lots of experience to become a doctor or lawyer.

I can see merit in membership of a board for critical projects such as hospital systems and would not mind a hospital demanding such certification, but in practice it doesn't really matter because experience is always better.  Would a company rather hire someone with membership of this board with a subject in security, or someone who has worked with security software companies and actually developed things with them?

In order for this membership to be worth it, the board itself needs to be internationally-respected by professionals and governments.  It can only be internationally-respected if the professionals themselves find true value in joining this group (see the first reason above), where a hirer will see this membership certificate and realise that this candidate has gone through the trouble of certifying himself or herself with a renowned board.

Making it mandatory, however, defeats the point, and is probably infeasible - how do you certify every single person who has worked on software today in Malaysia?  Are you going to cram thousands of people into some exam hall in KL and force them to learn?

In my experience, IT training is often rather rubbish, anyway, unless it is in a specific technology or product (i.e. Oracle Certification, JCP (Java), Microsoft training, etc.).  There might be some merit in things like ethics courses or copyright courses, but then again, these should ideally be taught at school level more than anything.

So the government needs to step back and let the professionals work it out.  They will be the ones who will sign up or leave the country, after all.  If it's accountability they are worried about, don't blame the developers and architects - blame the project managers.  Regulating the developers is like regulating the cleaners - it really isn't their fault.
*
professional need license.

akisendro
post Dec 10 2011, 03:06 AM

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QUOTE(doppelganger111 @ Dec 10 2011, 03:55 AM)
Even if you just consider the development perspective, in theory, if you write an Excel macro, you fall under this bill as well...

If a board should exist, firstly, it needs to deliver value to its members.  For example, by running internationally-renowned examinations for specific products (i.e. Oracle Certification), providing access to academic journals, acting as a union, etc.  If not, it is sucking money for nothing.

Secondly, if such a board should be setup, it should not be setup by the government - every government puts in place laws that are ideally long-term and for stability purposes - there is no such thing as "long-term" in terms of technological advancement.  As a result, the board needs to be setup by the professionals themselves.

Thirdly, membership of a board should never be mandatory as it devalues the quality of said membership, unless that membership is really something that is difficult to earn (i.e. certification of medics and lawyers).  Anyone with a computer and a text editor can become a software developer, while you need a degree, additional training, additional qualifications and lots of experience to become a doctor or lawyer.

I can see merit in membership of a board for critical projects such as hospital systems and would not mind a hospital demanding such certification, but in practice it doesn't really matter because experience is always better.  Would a company rather hire someone with membership of this board with a subject in security, or someone who has worked with security software companies and actually developed things with them?

In order for this membership to be worth it, the board itself needs to be internationally-respected by professionals and governments.  It can only be internationally-respected if the professionals themselves find true value in joining this group (see the first reason above), where a hirer will see this membership certificate and realise that this candidate has gone through the trouble of certifying himself or herself with a renowned board.

Making it mandatory, however, defeats the point, and is probably infeasible - how do you certify every single person who has worked on software today in Malaysia?  Are you going to cram thousands of people into some exam hall in KL and force them to learn?

In my experience, IT training is often rather rubbish, anyway, unless it is in a specific technology or product (i.e. Oracle Certification, JCP (Java), Microsoft training, etc.).  There might be some merit in things like ethics courses or copyright courses, but then again, these should ideally be taught at school level more than anything.

So the government needs to step back and let the professionals work it out.  They will be the ones who will sign up or leave the country, after all.  If it's accountability they are worried about, don't blame the developers and architects - blame the project managers.  Regulating the developers is like regulating the cleaners - it really isn't their fault.
*
i do agree with some points ...... but the move for the bills which asking all the IT professional to be the members of the board is not a wise move ... if you're professional enough.. this kind of body should be exist on their own ... not by some kind of act or bills .... professional for professional ....

QUOTE(soujiro_seta @ Dec 10 2011, 04:00 AM)
professional need license.
*
yes they do .... but only if they're willing to have one .... the difference between the professional by paper compared to those with experience are immense ..........

doppelganger111
post Dec 10 2011, 03:10 AM

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QUOTE(soujiro_seta @ Dec 10 2011, 03:00 AM)
professional need license.
*
Why?

By definition, a "professional" is someone who does something for money. Your mamak stall cook is a "professional" - does he/she need a license to cook? A cleaner is a "professional" - does he/she need a license to clean?

The question is whether IT is an industry that requires mandatory licensing. The answer is no, because unlike, say, medicine, the world of IT is not that concerned with "low-skilled users" bringing down the reputation of the industry as a whole. IT doesn't mind users with a lack of skills, as sometimes they can bring creativity to the table through out-of-the-box thinking, or they are Mike Zuckerberg/Bill Gates. On the other hand, someone who picked up "Surgery for Dummies" will tarnish the entire industry should they become an employed doctor. Certification as a doctor provides assurance to employers that they have all the required skills to become a doctor. Certification as an IT professional just proves you know what technology is like today - which is not going to be that useful in 10 years time.
doppelganger111
post Dec 10 2011, 03:17 AM

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QUOTE(akisendro @ Dec 10 2011, 03:06 AM)
i do agree with some points ...... but the move for the bills which asking all the IT professional to be the members of the board is not a wise move ... if you're professional enough.. this kind of body should be exist on their own ... not by some kind of act or bills .... professional for professional ....
*
Agreed - the government doesn't know anything about IT. The industry isn't stupid - if the industry feels that it needs more certification to stop low-quality programmers from flooding the market, then they might take that step.

But such a step would stop Zuckerbergs from appearing.

In addition, a lot of companies in Europe are starting to hire people with few IT skills, because they don't conform to the standard IT mindset. They even have "unusual" degrees like History or Economics. They just have a desire to solve problems, design good software, conform to standards and requirements, and negotiate with others - all good skills to have. None of these would be feasible in Malaysia under this Bill.
dma0991
post Dec 10 2011, 03:36 AM

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QUOTE(doppelganger111 @ Dec 10 2011, 03:17 AM)
Agreed - the government doesn't know anything about IT.  The industry isn't stupid - if the industry feels that it needs more certification to stop low-quality programmers from flooding the market, then they might take that step.

But such a step would stop Zuckerbergs from appearing.

In addition, a lot of companies in Europe are starting to hire people with few IT skills, because they don't conform to the standard IT mindset.  They even have "unusual" degrees like History or Economics.  They just have a desire to solve problems, design good software, conform to standards and requirements, and negotiate with others - all good skills to have.  None of these would be feasible in Malaysia under this Bill.
*
That is the thing about creating algorithms for software, it requires logic from the user itself. The programming language itself is just a syntax and not as important as the logic behind it. With the bill restricting users from self learning and train the mindset to culture their logic, I would doubt that we will go anywhere in terms of software development. What if I wanted to teach my son at a young age and develop his logic so that he could get a good feel about programming in general. Would the bill account me as breaking the law since we are both doing something related to IT?

There are a lot of IT greats now that do not start out with formal methods and are have a very crude start. For example, Mark Zuckerberg or HP, which started from a garage. If the bill wants to make IT more 'formal', it would just hinder development. Just look at how good Linux is while being open source and no rules to hold it back. Being closed source and held back by rules will just make things worse. Despite the fact that Windows is far more popular than Linux, I'd still take Linux in a heart beat.
akagidemon
post Dec 10 2011, 06:41 AM

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i have been working with pcs since the day of IBM.remember those huge clunkers. and i never had a formal education in the IT field. it is my passion. i learn the ins and out of windows and it's various systems and problems through sheer trial and error and reading a lot of books and articles and magazines. mind you, it was in the 90s and the internet was just being born.

now is 2011 which makes me 21 years in this field. in 21 years i have helped many people in fixing, buying and teaching normal people to use their pcs. with a fee but not on a comercial basis. it is more on an education basis. people wanted to learn, to use the computer for they know it will enrich their lifes but were afraid to go to the shops in fear of getting cheated. so they go to a friend they can trust to help them. how many of you have been in that situation? a new tech comes along and you wanted to try it out but is unsure of what ur getting and ask a friend who knows to help you.

with this bill, if it ever gets passed self thought people like me will be banned forever from the IT service world. since we dont have a nice cert from universities or colleges. But what makes those who have certs better then us? Have certs but cgpa is only 2.0. then ask for thousands of ringgit in salary but when under job pressure, they cracked saying it is too hard and cant be done.

Lets go to the other end of the scale. someone who is a clerk. who happens to be an accounting clerk or someone who uses excel. If that someone wrote a macro or a formula in excel those that makes that person an IT pro and have to be license? if it does then i can forsee the whole nation grounding to a halt since i know many-many people who can do this. imagine showing to ur friends your IT licences when they ask you"what class do u have?"."excel user class". and u can only use excel.

ranting in the morning, makes me feel want to use the loo.

KTHXBAI rais. you should have gone to hell a long time ago. Mr. Minister Of Misinformation and Miscomunication...
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post Dec 10 2011, 09:32 AM

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9 Dec 2011 : The Establishment of the Board of Computing Professionals Malaysia (BCPM) Print E-mail
PRESS STATEMENT

http://www.mosti.gov.my/mosti/index.php?op...d=3670&Itemid=1

The Establishment of the Board of Computing Professionals Malaysia (BCPM)

Recently, there was a misconception about the proposed BCPM Act currently being drafted by the Ministry of Science, Technology and Innovation (MOSTI). The claim is that the new Act will regulate computing practitioners and force them to register with a new Board called the Board of Computing Professional and that those who are not registered with this new board would not be allowed to practise programming, software engineering or apply for government tenders regardless of their years of experience or other qualifications.

MOSTI would like to assure all concerned parties that the establishment of the proposed BCPM is a body that will give recognition to the information, technology and communication (ICT) practitioners in the country as professionals in their respective computing domain. BCPM does not aim to regulate the computing profession in the nation but only applies to those that are identified as Critical National Information Infrastructure (CNII) entities with the intent to safeguard the interest of the nation in view of the current dynamic and challenging global environments. CNII is defined as those assets, systems and functions that are vital to the nation that their incapacity or destruction would have a devastating impact on National economic strength or National image or National defence and security or Government capability to function or Public health and safety. The CNII entities will be as identified by the The Chief Government Security Office (CGSO).

As for the need to be registered as Computing Professionals with BCPM, it is not mandatory. Registration with the BCPM does not apply only to graduates from the computing domain but will also take into consideration those from other disciplines with adequate computing experiences as well as those with professional qualifications in their respective computing domain.

Why do we need this Act? The need of this Act is to achieve the following objectives:

Enhance the value of the profession as it will require registered members to possess minimum levels of qualification/experience;
Raise professional standards by developing and maintaining a code of conduct for computing professionals;
Review qualifications offered by other bodies in order to serve as a guide and reference when gauging which certifications are valid and relevant;
Provide some level of assurance of the quality of computing professionals to employers who hire those who are registered by BCPM;
Enhance the supply of ICT manpower in the country and help the nation achieve the goals of the New Economic Model in becoming a productive high-income nation; and
Serve as a central repository of all computing professionals and practitioners in the country.


The vision of BCPM is to ensure that all computing services provided by the Malaysian Computing Professionals are globally recognised and with full regards to the public interest in mind. BCPM’s mission is to elevate the standing, visibility and recognition of Computing Professionals to ensure that computing services provided by the Computing Professionals in the country are in compliance with appropriate legislation and policies.

Within the context of this draft BCPM Bill, “Computing” has been defined as a goal-oriented activity to plan, architect, design, create, develop, implement, use and manage information technology or information technology systems.

In coming up with the draft of the BCPM Bill, MOSTI has initiated an effort to ensure the views of all key stakeholders are taken into consideration. With this intent, MOSTI has engaged various parties from both the private and public sectors such as the Ministry of Information, Communications and Culture, Malaysian Communications and Multimedia Commission (MCMC), Public Service Department of Malaysia, Malaysian Administration Modernisation and Management Planning Unit (MAMPU), National Security Council, CGSO, National ICT Deans Council (MADICT), National Professors Council, Association of the Computer and Multimedia Industry Malaysia (PIKOM), Multimedia Development Corporation (MDeC), CyberSecurity Malaysia, MIMOS Berhad and Malaysian National Computer Confederation (MNCC) to deliberate and confer on all pertaining issues on the subject matter of computing professionals in the country.

In order to solicit further inputs to improve the BCPM Bill, MOSTI will be having an open day on 13 December 2011 (Tuesday) from 9.30am to 5.00pm at the following venue:

Dewan Perhimpunan
Ministry of Science, Technology and Innovation
Level 1, Block C4, Complex C,
Federal Government Administrative Centre,
Putrajaya

The intent of the open day is to inform the public of the proposed establishment of the BCPM and to provide a platform for all interested parties to view the draft BCPM Bill and give the opportunity for members of the public to present constructive feedbacks, opinions and thoughts on the draft BCPM Bill. All feedbacks, opinions and thoughts will be considered by MOSTI in ensuring the draft Bill address the concerns and issues of all parties.


Last Updated ( Friday, 09 December 2011 )
Sarah Angelina
post Dec 10 2011, 09:37 AM

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Ya right, out of all days, want to choose a Tuesday. So that will be the day with most MC nationwide or asking us to shaddup just sit in the office? What kind of idiotic people they are? Came up with the news on a Friday evening and now having this so called open day on Tuesday? For Selangor people having long weekend, how to apply leave? We don't need to work is it? Or shall be the whole IT company not operating on that particular day to attend?
BzBody100
post Dec 10 2011, 09:38 AM

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Don't like it. People who are in charge of dealing with CNII project should be INTELLIGENT enough to sieve the lousy IT consultant from the good IT consultants.

Staffing the correct people in CNII is the government's duty.
puppeto4
post Dec 10 2011, 09:44 AM

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Is there any chance that this bill will also affect artist who do his/her drawing digitally too actually? hmm.gif
yen223
post Dec 10 2011, 10:33 AM

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I'm really curious - who started this idea?
thesoothsayer
post Dec 10 2011, 11:02 AM

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QUOTE
Why do we need this Act? The need of this Act is to achieve the following objectives:

Enhance the value of the profession as it will require registered members to possess minimum levels of qualification/experience;

The industry already screens out candidates through both their qualifications and ability using a rigorous interview process. People without an IT certification demonstrate their ability through their projects and output. This law just creates another layer of worthless overhead for everyone.

QUOTE
Raise professional standards by developing and maintaining a code of conduct for computing professionals;

Companies already have a code of conduct. Freelancers who show poor work ethics lose out on work. People who cheat are prosecuted using the criminal code. How does this bill ensure that IT people become more professional?

QUOTE
Review qualifications offered by other bodies in order to serve as a guide and reference when gauging which certifications are valid and relevant;

Degrees in Malaysia and other countries are subject to each country's education bodies. People in the industry know what they are looking for when they hire. Certifications don't mean anything if the candidate flunks the interview. Why is it necessary for the government to decide what certifications for IT are valid and relevant for a largely self-governing industry?

QUOTE
Provide some level of assurance of the quality of computing professionals to employers who hire those who are registered by BCPM;
How does the bill provide this assurance? Will they interview all the computing professionals to make sure they are capable? Or will they just audit the certificates they have? If they are just auditing the certificates, what value is added compared to companies auditing the certificates themselves? If they are interviewing, who will be conducting the interviews and how can we be assured of the quality of the interviewers and how will they know the specific needs of each company?

QUOTE
Enhance the supply of ICT manpower in the country and help the nation achieve the goals of the New Economic Model in becoming a productive high-income nation; and

Does this even make sense? A bill attempting to limit the IT professionals through their education background will enhance the supply of ICT manpower?

QUOTE
Serve as a central repository of all computing professionals and practitioners in the country.

It can serve as a repository, but what does the government want to do with such a repository? Is it imagined that companies that want to hire will be able to look through the resumes and qualifications? That role seems to be already occupied and provided by websites like jobstreet, monster, etc. The question, really, is why?
Currylaksa
post Dec 10 2011, 11:27 AM

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It's just a new board to give employment to the failed graduates hired by UMNO government.

Failed graduates who probably can't make a simple Word document, let alone understand the difference between Cisco or Oracle.

MamulaMoon
post Dec 10 2011, 12:02 PM

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IT profession is already the most stressful job... and most of the IT experts in Malaysia are totally underpaid... sad.gif

http://www.talktalk.co.uk/jobs/features/stressful-jobs.html
thesoothsayer
post Dec 10 2011, 12:08 PM

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QUOTE
MOSTI would like to assure all concerned parties that the establishment of the proposed BCPM is a body that will give recognition to the information, technology and communication (ICT) practitioners in the country as professionals in their respective computing domain. BCPM does not aim to regulate the computing profession in the nation but only applies to those that are identified as Critical National Information Infrastructure (CNII) entities with the intent to safeguard the interest of the nation in view of the current dynamic and challenging global environments. CNII is defined as those assets, systems and functions that are vital to the nation that their incapacity or destruction would have a devastating impact on National economic strength or National image or National defence and security or Government capability to function or Public health and safety. The CNII entities will be as identified by the The Chief Government Security Office (CGSO).
Posted this in another thread and I would like to repeat it here since MOSTI released the statement above.


Wait. Have you read and understood it?

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1j1VC50E...8/edit?hl=en_US

Tell me where it mentions that you only need it when you want to do work for the government.

It only mentions that IT professionals working on areas of the CNII need to be registered. The areas of CNII encompasses a very wide swath of work. Almost every IT professional works in a field related to the CNII.


QUOTE
2.(1)    This Act applies throughout Malaysia.

(2)    This    Act    applies    to    the    Critical    National    Information Infrastructure (CNII).


(3)    Every    Registered    Computing    Practitioner,    Registered Computing        Professional    and        Registered    Computing        Services Provider  shall be subject to this Act.


(4)    The  Minister may, by notification in the Gazette,suspend the  operation  of  this  Act  in  any  part  of  Malaysia  or  suspend  the operation of any part of this Act
QUOTE
“Critical National Information Infrastructure(CNII)” refers    to those assets, systems and  functions that  are  vital to the  nation that  their  incapacity  or  destruction would  have a devastating impact  on  National  economic  strength or  National  image  or National  defense  and  security  or  Government  capability  to function or Public health  and  safety;
QUOTE
The Critical National Information Infrastructure (CNII) sectors are:
National Defence & Security
Banking & Finance
Information & Communications
Energy
Transportation
Water
Health Services
Government
Emergency Services
Food & Agriculture



http://www.nitc.my/index.cfm?&menuid=60

Notice that Government is only a part of the CNII?

Please do not be fooled by Government statements.

We need to make sure that everything is worded accurately in the Bill. Giving our blind consent allows the Government to reinterpret it in whatever manner they choose to once it has been passed.
wellwellwell
post Dec 10 2011, 12:54 PM

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QUOTE(BzBody100 @ Dec 8 2011, 09:07 PM)
Get ready to go back to stone age. Siao law. IT is the fastest moving subject and they want to have this law? Bodoh! It is already hard to get GOOD IT people, u want to impose this law. Better be a snatch thief.
*

It is already one of the kind of "snatch thief law"!
If this law implement, malaysia for sure going backward of development.
(May be that's what amno still dreaming of it would help for the voting in election)

Other country is moving fast forward with help from IT.
Yet, malaysia show its true "development".
fridel
post Dec 10 2011, 01:05 PM

kuran ka? ok e oi?
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habis la doh.gif
kroegand
post Dec 10 2011, 02:06 PM

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I wonder if the gov/glc staff working in it dept need to be reassess if they fit the bills or not. This will surely impact everybody using/operating IT equipment.

People sell smartphone in garage can be sued if not register yo hmm.gif
okyee_mal
post Dec 10 2011, 03:13 PM

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My gut feeling is some bunch of MOSTI and government servants (who are Undi Munafik Negara Okay - ass-lickers)
are using the "success" of the 6P "pemutihan" solution on the illegal immigrants as an example.
They hope to crush those anti-government IT practitioner,
and weed out the bad hats as they can't control cyberspace.

Basically, a very political motive by (so-called) non-political organisations...sigh shakehead.gif


lulusantos
post Dec 10 2011, 04:28 PM

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*snip/

This post has been edited by lulusantos: Dec 10 2011, 04:29 PM
Koki
post Dec 10 2011, 07:27 PM

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Kita semua mati mang, everyone in this LYN confirm mati
tan_pang
post Dec 10 2011, 08:08 PM

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PM: Intellectual capital crucial to nation’s development

IT professional not included??
marsha1l
post Dec 12 2011, 06:23 PM

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mad.gif
why must they make things worst..

if this thing happen..cant do my modding plan for 2012 vmad.gif
SUSMuhammad Nur Hanief
post Dec 12 2011, 07:13 PM

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yitjuan
post Dec 12 2011, 10:14 PM

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QUOTE(Muhammad Nur Hanief @ Dec 12 2011, 07:13 PM)

*
my god that guy's English is horrible.
SUSatombom123
post Dec 13 2011, 01:26 AM

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ok i'm going to migrate to australia... terima kasih kepada kerajaan


Added on December 13, 2011, 1:30 amcan't run IT business even i'm malaysian? might as well treat me as foreigner..

This post has been edited by atombom123: Dec 13 2011, 01:30 AM
SUSatombom123
post Dec 13 2011, 01:34 AM

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QUOTE(BzBody100 @ Dec 8 2011, 09:07 PM)
Get ready to go back to stone age. Siao law. IT is the fastest moving subject and they want to have this law? Bodoh! It is already hard to get GOOD IT people, u want to impose this law. Better be a loan shark.
*
correction
d4rkholeang3l
post Dec 13 2011, 02:04 AM

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is android dev subjected to dis law too?
elblink
post Dec 13 2011, 02:05 AM

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QUOTE(d4rkholeang3l @ Dec 13 2011, 02:04 AM)
is android dev subjected to dis law too?
*
Anyone that make use of IT.
slier81
post Dec 13 2011, 02:45 AM

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stupid govt making stupid policy
btw good luck with the dream, rofl govt full of idiot
they cant even do any shait about piracy, yet wanna do this summore?
trol of de year

This post has been edited by slier81: Dec 13 2011, 02:46 AM
SUSatombom123
post Dec 13 2011, 03:14 AM

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QUOTE(soundsyst64 @ Dec 8 2011, 09:20 PM)
Untuk kelulusan cepat dan tiada songeh, pemohon mesti bumiputera.
*
rclxms.gif rclxms.gif rclxms.gif
SUSatombom123
post Dec 13 2011, 03:17 AM

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QUOTE(cend @ Dec 8 2011, 09:24 PM)
File sharing site alredi blocked. mabe after this govt. gonna block to all opensource program (GIMP, blender etc..)

Welp, we just have to rely our friend Anonymous again...
*
now singaporean probab;y laughing at us..

inb4 we laugh singaporean internet everything also block
SUSatombom123
post Dec 13 2011, 03:22 AM

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QUOTE(RoyMcAvoy @ Dec 8 2011, 10:26 PM)
I don't see this brings benefits to the IT professional.

We might have to pay to get certified in the future
*
or they can remove your license if you' disobey BN politic interest
theK
post Dec 13 2011, 05:29 AM

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were doomed
chanti-sama
post Dec 13 2011, 08:54 AM

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Nobody went or going for that mosti open day?
wacrop
post Dec 13 2011, 10:19 AM

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Easy man,It just a draft. I think it wont get approved in the end.
Trust me.


Added on December 13, 2011, 10:22 amIf this law being approved , i will sure migrate to Singapore liao.


This post has been edited by wacrop: Dec 13 2011, 10:22 AM
SUSsfx3000
post Dec 13 2011, 10:48 AM

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QUOTE(wacrop @ Dec 13 2011, 10:19 AM)
Easy man,It just a draft. I think it wont get approved in the end.
Trust me.


Added on December 13, 2011, 10:22 amIf this law being approved , i will sure migrate to Singapore liao.
*
https://twitter.com/#!/eemay/status/146419411383894016

#cpb2011 seems to be already decided. Open day doesn't look like it is to hear public feedback, but just to tell the public more bullsh*t
SUSsfx3000
post Dec 13 2011, 10:50 AM

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QUOTE(sfx3000 @ Dec 13 2011, 10:48 AM)
https://twitter.com/#!/eemay/status/146419411383894016

#cpb2011 seems to be already decided. Open day doesn't look like it is to hear public feedback, but just to tell the public more bullsh*t
*
https://twitter.com/#!/eemay/status/146419873319358465

IT public sounds very very furious in this open day. #cpb2011
SUSsfx3000
post Dec 13 2011, 10:50 AM

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Everyone go twitter and search ALL for #CPB2011 and read all the real-time news at MOSTI gathering!
SUSsfx3000
post Dec 13 2011, 10:58 AM

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IT IS WAR!!!


WAR!

imin
post Dec 13 2011, 11:15 AM

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BN has made more enemies with this
r2t2
post Dec 13 2011, 11:22 AM

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QUOTE(sfx3000 @ Dec 13 2011, 10:48 AM)
https://twitter.com/#!/eemay/status/146419411383894016

#cpb2011 seems to be already decided. Open day doesn't look like it is to hear public feedback, but just to tell the public more bullsh*t
Oh mai ... fear realized.

Let's say the draft does become bill, and the bill is tabled in the Parliament, and Gomen instructs all BN MPs to vote for it ... really nothing else can be done?
How about the selection of the Board of Computing Professionals? Make sure that none of those elected are from GLCs or are politically affiliated?

Still smells very fishy why Gomen / MOSTI / BN wanna push for this Act. The cons outweighed the pros.
pkiensing
post Dec 13 2011, 11:28 AM

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you can see they are pushing the bills... IT WILL HAPPEN NO MATTER WHAT!

the fundamental is simple, is stupid enough to vote BN, malaysian from the kampung area please dont be stupid forever.

We need change!
Sherry86
post Dec 13 2011, 11:35 AM

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Waa then my job as IT coordinator will be void?
sickx
post Dec 13 2011, 12:14 PM

:)
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has anybody went to the MNCC website?

http://mncc.com.my/
blackamikaze
post Dec 13 2011, 12:37 PM

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QUOTE(sickx @ Dec 13 2011, 12:14 PM)
has anybody went to the MNCC website?

http://mncc.com.my/
*
wtf ... shakehead.gif
Oblivionz
post Dec 13 2011, 12:51 PM

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http://www.mncc.com.my/members.htm

Students also need to pay LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
C-Fu
post Dec 13 2011, 01:12 PM

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bodoh gila kata Gabungan IT Pros but I swear i thought i was visiting geocities in 1995
sickx
post Dec 13 2011, 01:37 PM

:)
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QUOTE(Oblivionz @ Dec 13 2011, 12:51 PM)
http://www.mncc.com.my/members.htm

Students also need to pay LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
*
medic students also need to pay to become member of MMA what..
thesoothsayer
post Dec 13 2011, 01:39 PM

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QUOTE(C-Fu @ Dec 13 2011, 01:12 PM)
bodoh gila kata Gabungan IT Pros but I swear i thought i was visiting geocities in 1995
*
Dulu takde wang, tapi tidak lama lagi akan keluarkan tender RM1M/page untuk update website dia orang.
M30W
post Dec 13 2011, 01:50 PM

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GUYS~ view source of http://mosti.gov.my/ ... Damn nice~~


Added on December 13, 2011, 1:51 pmGUYS~ view source of http://mosti.gov.my/ ... Damn nice~~

This post has been edited by M30W: Dec 13 2011, 01:51 PM
VinluV
post Dec 13 2011, 01:55 PM

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Question.

Can you register someone who uses open source?
If they can come up with something like ubuntu certified user or cetificate for google-fu. I'm gonna leave.

This post has been edited by VinluV: Dec 13 2011, 01:55 PM
elblink
post Dec 13 2011, 01:57 PM

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QUOTE(M30W @ Dec 13 2011, 01:50 PM)
GUYS~ view source of http://mosti.gov.my/ ... Damn nice~~


Added on December 13, 2011, 1:51 pmGUYS~ view source of http://mosti.gov.my/ ... Damn nice~~
*
Can't go into the website...bandwidth full?

or some is doing "something" to it?

This post has been edited by elblink: Dec 13 2011, 01:57 PM
M30W
post Dec 13 2011, 02:12 PM

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u right click it.. view page source... then u will know how well did the "web-developer"
birain
post Dec 13 2011, 02:16 PM

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QUOTE(blackamikaze @ Dec 13 2011, 12:37 PM)
wtf ...  shakehead.gif
*
keep on refreshing ar? laugh.gif rclxms.gif
elblink
post Dec 13 2011, 02:21 PM

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QUOTE(M30W @ Dec 13 2011, 02:12 PM)
u right click it.. view page source... then u will know how well did the "web-developer"
*
Can you access the website? You can't view source unless the website is loaded.

Try and see what happens.

Suspected someone is doing something to it. DDOS?
me0wSter
post Dec 13 2011, 02:33 PM

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This is the MOSTI source code:

CODE

<script language="Javascript">
window.location = ''
</script>

chanti-sama
post Dec 13 2011, 02:34 PM

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cant access
Oblivionz
post Dec 13 2011, 02:46 PM

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QUOTE(sickx @ Dec 13 2011, 01:37 PM)
medic students also need to pay to become member of MMA what..
*
Is it necessary for IT students to pay this kind of fee?

Can you give me any reasons why IT students need to pay this kind of fee?
wacrop
post Dec 13 2011, 02:54 PM

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We no need CPB2011 to boost Malaysia leading in IT field.
IT Filed should stay in open mind, free, no restriction , promote creativity environment !!!
Anyone one in Malaysia have the right to develop software !
CPB2011 will kill creativity which is very important in nowadays.
IT field is not like engineer filed , accountant field, doctor. We need freedom to develop software !
Don't kill Malaysia future economy !!!

So Nigeria leading in IT field ? IF not why we follow ?
Squidward
post Dec 13 2011, 03:03 PM

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fully support this bill, keep quality in, and keep rubbish out. too much cowboy in IT industry, tiem to bring it to the level of other engineers
wacrop
post Dec 13 2011, 03:05 PM

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If 12 years old kid register as Apple Developer and want to developer IPAD apps and publish to Apple Store will be fined ( Rm 20 000 ) if not register to MOSTI ?

This is RIDICULOUS !!!

Rubbish Proposal .
Uzumaki NaruTo
post Dec 13 2011, 03:11 PM

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mncc , let me do you a website. memalukan rakyat malaysia la. ini tahun 1990an punya website doh.gif
wacrop
post Dec 13 2011, 03:12 PM

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Cert is NOTHING !!!
People with cert not mean everything !!!
People with cert not mean he / she can code !!!
you know study dont mean you know how to code !!!

M30W
post Dec 13 2011, 03:19 PM

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QUOTE(elblink @ Dec 13 2011, 02:21 PM)
Can you  access the website? You can't view source unless the website is loaded.

Try and see what happens.

Suspected someone is doing something to it. DDOS?
*
the page will never loaded... coz it keep redirect... once u hit enter... then right click it and view course... dont need to wait it fully load..
after that u will know how amazing it is~
sickx
post Dec 13 2011, 03:21 PM

:)
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QUOTE(Oblivionz @ Dec 13 2011, 02:46 PM)
Is it necessary for IT students to pay this kind of fee?

Can you give me any reasons why IT students need to pay this kind of fee?
*
to become member of MNCC?


M30W
post Dec 13 2011, 03:33 PM

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QUOTE(sickx @ Dec 13 2011, 03:21 PM)
to become member of MNCC?
*
Y should i become a member of MNCC as no one*beside malaysia will going to recognize this certificate..........
EVEN PPL who above 55 need to pay to coding~ .......
elblink
post Dec 13 2011, 03:40 PM

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Try www.mosti.gov.my with the www.

The side is accessible.
Nothing special with the code.
sickx
post Dec 13 2011, 03:44 PM

:)
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QUOTE(M30W @ Dec 13 2011, 03:33 PM)
Y should i become a member of MNCC as no one*beside malaysia will going to recognize this certificate..........
EVEN PPL who above 55 need to pay to coding~ .......
*
im not saying you should pay or you should become member but i just wanna state the comparison.it's the cost of being a professional.
Uzumaki NaruTo
post Dec 13 2011, 03:45 PM

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Here are some of the pasta-ed slides for those who didn't go. Im still inside meeting room twitching to go there.

http://amanz.my/2011/12/lebih-info-berkait...-diperlihatkan/

They want to make it (IT Industry) on par with Engineering and Architects standard. Registration is not mandatory.
ToshinRaizen
post Dec 13 2011, 05:13 PM

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QUOTE(Uzumaki NaruTo @ Dec 13 2011, 03:45 PM)
Here are some of the pasta-ed slides for those who didn't go. Im still inside meeting room twitching to go there.

http://amanz.my/2011/12/lebih-info-berkait...-diperlihatkan/

They want to make it (IT Industry) on par with Engineering and Architects standard. Registration is not mandatory.
*
then what 20k penalty and 6 moth jail for?
thesoothsayer
post Dec 13 2011, 05:19 PM

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QUOTE(Uzumaki NaruTo @ Dec 13 2011, 03:45 PM)
Here are some of the pasta-ed slides for those who didn't go. Im still inside meeting room twitching to go there.

http://amanz.my/2011/12/lebih-info-berkait...-diperlihatkan/

They want to make it (IT Industry) on par with Engineering and Architects standard. Registration is not mandatory.
*
Go read through the bill. It's too ambiguous and all-encompassing. The CNII covers basically every field.

Bills which are ambiguous and lacking in direction should not be passed. Streamline the bill first, then we talk.
Uzumaki NaruTo
post Dec 13 2011, 05:27 PM

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QUOTE(thesoothsayer @ Dec 13 2011, 05:19 PM)
Go read through the bill. It's too ambiguous and all-encompassing. The CNII covers basically every field.

Bills which are ambiguous and lacking in direction should not be passed. Streamline the bill first, then we talk.
*
Agreed. It is poorly written. I stand corrected. The bill is too vague and open to abuse later on. Even Mosti officials take such a beatings today so bad that they will wrap up and craw back where they come from.
piumiu
post Dec 13 2011, 07:17 PM

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These 'skilled' people that will evaluate us. Geocities website look better.
Kilang botol website look better!
elblink
post Dec 13 2011, 07:22 PM

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The CBP 2011 Open Day 1st hour discussion video ~50 minutes


SUSatombom123
post Dec 13 2011, 08:28 PM

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I mean, really. What do these people think it will do, besides *restrict* technological innovation? That is defact the point with this kind of legislation.

In the case of licensing doctors, it is to *restrict* people with dodgy credentials performing surgeries, or proscribing medications. Ideally, this is to protect patients, as it helps regulate a standard QoS in that industry. Same with legal professionals. Likewise, that restriction reduces the number of people performing those services. This has two immediate effects: 1) it reduces supply for that service, increasing costs. 2)it reduces the number of people doing that work, naturally reducing the number of minds that would bring innovative ideas to those service industries.

The whole reason why the internet exploded with applications (both computational, and user service oriented) and service providers was *because* of that lack of regulation. The emergence of top players comes about as genuine success stories in an unregulated/minimally regulated system. If providers were abusive, people stopped using them, and other providers gobbled them up. The reason for this explosion of innovation was because literally *anyone* with an internet connection and some intelligence could contribute to, or create a new idea, and promote it. This is how free software thrives. Anyone with an internet connection can download a code repository, read it, and suggest improvements. It doesn't matter if you are a millionaire payboy, or an ammonia scented cleaning woman, if your suggested changes are sound, you have improved the collective work, and everyone benefits from your innovative idea.

Instigating this kind of licensing would block out the vast majority of users from legally engaging in this process. As such, their ideas, even if perfectly valid, and even game changing, are withheld from inclusion, because "they aren't licensed."

This applies to every level of internet culture and its distributed source of innovation. It is poison to the very infrastructure they want to control.

The addage "don't ascribe to malice what can be ascribed to ignorance." Is stretched very thin here. How can you create such legislation, knowing what the internet is, and NOT see how it is antithetically counter opposed to the very foundational source of that system's recourcefulness and robustness in terms of innovation?

elblink
post Dec 13 2011, 09:08 PM

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IT Bill may be dumped, says MOSTI Yahoo News

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

Uzumaki NaruTo
post Dec 13 2011, 09:09 PM

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lol. in the end its dieded. poorly written and too vague.
NasiLemakMan
post Dec 13 2011, 11:18 PM

oh hai! wan naslemak?
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QUOTE(Uzumaki NaruTo @ Dec 13 2011, 09:09 PM)
lol. in the end its dieded. poorly written and too vague.
*
Don't count on your chickens yet. The article mentioned
QUOTE
if the industry can find a better way to boost the local industry towards meeting world-class standards.
that's a big IF.

teknokrasi
post Dec 14 2011, 05:53 AM

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This fella has clear headed explanation on the dreaded bill;

http://illegitcode.wordpress.com/2011/12/1...-2011-analysis/
teknokrasi
post Dec 14 2011, 06:00 AM

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I think the bill is needed, but its SCOPE and most importantly its NAME, should emphasized ONLY on NCII exclusively.
We sure don't want some unknown bloke working on critical govt. function codes. With the bill, the govt. can sue the contractor at court if any shit happens.
Current contract law from what I understand, have too many loopholes, which many assholes contractor escapes legal punishment.

This post has been edited by teknokrasi: Dec 14 2011, 06:01 AM
iloveuforever
post Dec 14 2011, 06:10 AM

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Lets play around......we all just don get the CERT....See how many they can caught.... icon_idea.gif rclxms.gif
iloveuforever
post Dec 14 2011, 06:13 AM

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Just don mentioned about you are conducting IT then you are not caught....I do online selling....i do online survey...can?? laugh.gif laugh.gif Stupid..law...let it be laugh.gif
grey_m45k
post Dec 14 2011, 08:54 AM

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they do law like these so that they can make profits. Every person need to get the cert. , cert. means money , from there government will get their share. Everything is business .vmad.gif
Joey Christensen
post Dec 14 2011, 12:07 PM

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QUOTE(Uzumaki NaruTo @ Dec 13 2011, 09:09 PM)
lol. in the end its dieded. poorly written and too vague.
You didn't read properly. There's a catch. If you could read one more time, there's the big "if" word.
SUSsfx3000
post Dec 14 2011, 01:56 PM

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QUOTE(Joey Christensen @ Dec 14 2011, 12:07 PM)
You didn't read properly. There's a catch. If you could read one more time, there's the big "if" word.
*
Indeed.. no it's not dead.

They will 'improvise' it.



http://www.nst.com.my/local/general/it-bil...lexible-1.19036


'IT bill will be flexible'


PUTRAJAYA: The proposed Computing Professionals Bill (CPB) 2011 will be improvised if the need arises.

Deputy Science, Technology and Innovation Minister Datuk Fadillah Yusof said there was a public outcry against the bill.

"We will make the necessary improvements, depending on the needs," he said, adding that information technology professionals had expressed their concerns through social media.

The professionals claimed that the bill would stifle innovation among industry members. The ministry yesterday held an open day to gather feedback on the proposed bill. Fadillah said the event was held after an industrial dialogue session. Many concerns were raised, including the difficulties of implementing the bill.

Read more: 'IT bill will be flexible' - General - New Straits Times http://www.nst.com.my/local/general/it-bil...6#ixzz1gUBELDSC

Uzumaki NaruTo
post Dec 14 2011, 04:14 PM

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QUOTE(Joey Christensen @ Dec 14 2011, 12:07 PM)
You didn't read properly. There's a catch. If you could read one more time, there's the big "if" word.
*
It was a pun.

QUOTE(sfx3000 @ Dec 14 2011, 01:56 PM)
Indeed.. no it's not dead.

They will 'improvise' it.
http://www.nst.com.my/local/general/it-bil...lexible-1.19036
'IT bill will be flexible'
PUTRAJAYA: The proposed Computing Professionals Bill (CPB) 2011 will be improvised if the need arises.

Deputy Science, Technology and Innovation Minister Datuk Fadillah Yusof said there was a public outcry against the bill.

"We will make the necessary improvements, depending on the needs," he said, adding that information technology professionals had expressed their concerns through social media.

The professionals claimed that the bill would stifle innovation among industry members. The ministry yesterday held an open day to gather feedback on the proposed bill. Fadillah said the event was held after an industrial dialogue session. Many concerns were raised, including the difficulties of implementing the bill.

Read more: 'IT bill will be flexible' - General - New Straits Times http://www.nst.com.my/local/general/it-bil...6#ixzz1gUBELDSC
*
Now they will spend another 2 years contemplating it while IT industry make leaps and bounds.Come 2014 the Bill is still outdated.
choyster
post Dec 15 2011, 12:18 AM

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so this bill is to reduce project failure while the bill itself as a project has already become a failure, ironies
DarkNite
post Dec 15 2011, 07:45 AM

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QUOTE(choyster @ Dec 15 2011, 12:18 AM)
so this bill is to reduce project failure while the bill itself as a project has already become a failure, ironies & cronies!
*
Computing Bill: Big businesses vs practitioners
The federal government today admitted that it facilitated the Computing Professionals Bill 2011 at the behest of multinational companies and industry leaders
elblink
post Dec 15 2011, 09:10 AM

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QUOTE(DarkNite @ Dec 15 2011, 07:45 AM)
Computing Bill: Big businesses vs practitioners
The federal government today admitted that it facilitated the Computing Professionals Bill 2011 at the behest of multinational companies and industry leaders
*
Why we are not surprised at all?

Dear <certain famous MNCs>, your founder also dropped out of college/uni & started you from his basement....no certification whatsoever.
Have you forgotten yo?

Why do you have to make things ALSO difficult for us who are smaller than you?


This post has been edited by elblink: Dec 15 2011, 09:12 AM
SUSsfx3000
post Dec 15 2011, 10:00 AM

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QUOTE(elblink @ Dec 15 2011, 09:10 AM)
Why we are not surprised at all?

Dear <certain famous MNCs>, your founder also dropped out of college/uni & started you from his basement....no certification whatsoever.
Have you forgotten yo?

Why do you have to make things ALSO difficult for us who are smaller than you?

*
Yea.... I find it ironic so many people use Microsoft and Apple as their rolemodel example against #CPB2011


Turns out these are the ones lobbying for the bill under PIKOM, and also at the same time, they probably promised our govt wide powers under ambigous CNII.


Then you have Tan Sri Vincent tan's IT arm under MOL ganesh on the council too..

And eGenting.... notorious gambling/casino legal Kongsi Gelap organisation exploiting IT grads for immoral business.

http://www.pikom.org.my/cms/General.asp?wh...=22716&CatID=60



My my my, no wonder Academic circle also support the BILL.


Academic circle in Malaysia is one of MS's STRONGEST base because they are heavily influenced and buy edu version of MS products on huge discounts.


They're the easiest to be manipulated by these corporations and hence at the MOSTI panel, software patents are one of the objectives to be introduced in the industry. They even said if you are certified by MS/Oracle, you don't need to worry about the bill.


Like this, these MNCs can crush SME and small/competitive vendors that rely on OSS solutions/tools.


Clearly a CARTEL in the making, sleeping with the government, offering them more control over rights of dissent use of IT.


NWO New World Order in the making. *lmao*



http://www.opensource.org/statements/CPTN
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/01/12/cp...s_from_germany/
http://techrights.org/2011/01/11/cartels-and-escapes/

This post has been edited by sfx3000: Dec 15 2011, 10:05 AM
elblink
post Dec 15 2011, 10:29 AM

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QUOTE(sfx3000 @ Dec 15 2011, 10:00 AM)
Yea.... I find it ironic so many people use Microsoft and Apple as their rolemodel example against #CPB2011
Turns out these are the ones lobbying for the bill under PIKOM, and also at the same time, they probably promised our govt wide powers under ambigous CNII.
Then you have Tan Sri Vincent tan's IT arm under MOL ganesh on the council too..

And eGenting.... notorious gambling/casino legal Kongsi Gelap organisation exploiting IT grads for immoral business.

http://www.pikom.org.my/cms/General.asp?wh...=22716&CatID=60
My my my, no wonder Academic circle also support the BILL.
Academic circle in Malaysia is one of MS's STRONGEST base because they are heavily influenced and buy edu version of MS products on huge discounts.
They're the easiest to be manipulated by these corporations and hence at the MOSTI panel, software patents are one of the objectives to be introduced in the industry. They even said if you are certified by MS/Oracle, you don't need to worry about the bill.
Like this, these MNCs can crush SME and small/competitive vendors that rely on OSS solutions/tools.
Clearly a CARTEL in the making, sleeping with the government, offering them more control over rights of dissent use of IT.
NWO New World Order in the making. *lmao*
http://www.opensource.org/statements/CPTN
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/01/12/cp...s_from_germany/
http://techrights.org/2011/01/11/cartels-and-escapes/
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Well put!

The academic circle are mostly concerned with producing students to fulfill the trend of the big boys, so that the students have jobs to work along the same big boys who controls the market.

It's all about business now, education is about what we want you to know and follow, not we want you to think for yourself & think out of the box.

In 2 words, modern slavery. Subtly done until many people doesn't realised it at all or won't believe it is real.

Singapore is already a NWO playground, Malaysia is showing more signs of getting there soon.
Unless we realised it early and stop it fast.

The show up at the MOSTI open day is a good start for all IT people.
SUSsfx3000
post Dec 15 2011, 10:39 AM

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QUOTE(elblink @ Dec 15 2011, 10:29 AM)
Well put!

The academic circle are mostly concerned with producing students to fulfill the trend of the big boys, so that the students have jobs to work along the same big boys who controls the market.

It's all about business now, education is about what we want you to know and follow, not we want you to think for yourself & think out of the box.

In 2 words, modern slavery. Subtly done until many people doesn't realised it at all or won't believe it is real.

Singapore is already a NWO playground, Malaysia is showing more signs of getting there soon.
Unless we realised it early and stop it fast.

The show up at the MOSTI open day is a good start for all IT people.
*
First, we have to accept and recognize the goons engaged by geeks/nerds at MOSTI are mostly just PATSIES.


These are dime a dozen people these cartel/corporations can pick from anywhere.


IT Geeks/Nerds need to look at the bigger picture. It's no longer just a politic/govt issue.

Foreign corporations are getting their hands dirty as well, sleeping in bed with our govt, to consolidate our rights and enslave us totally.


PIKOM is their agent/vector in infiltration and subduing us.


We need to stop blaming just the govt. There're other forces at work in the private sector and we all have to wake up.


This is not just happening in Malaysia. We're a testbed but soon this similar style Corp takeover using govt approach that will show itself all over the world soon or already has.


IT Geeks/Nerds are too preoccupied with a limited world view (their own geek/nerd world) to see everything else happening in the real world.


Faidzal
post Dec 15 2011, 07:54 PM

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QUOTE(sfx3000 @ Dec 15 2011, 10:00 AM)
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «
Then you have Tan Sri Vincent tan's IT arm under MOL ganesh on the council too..

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «


LOL, last time i remember Ganesh Kumar Bangah quit his 1st degree (Bach. Electrical Engineering UTM) because his MOL business was booming....

and now he expects people to be certified before being considered as an IT practitioner?
RyoKenzaki
post Dec 15 2011, 08:45 PM

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Does this new bill affect video editor and graphic designer?
foohoa
post Dec 15 2011, 09:19 PM

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so wat, like those electrical man, need license to work
but they just work for freelance
and
property agent, the license is very hard to get
but there got many freelance too
they even no need to pay any tax, better then those who have license
sweemeng
post Dec 16 2011, 06:16 AM

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everything is interconnected.

software developer used to just do thing without restriction. need a web server, download apache run it.

Now some idiot up there said, apache considered as infrastructure. We might not be able to download or what not.
illyz0909
post Dec 16 2011, 11:22 AM

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Lagi baik kalau kita buat proposal suruh RAIS YATIM quit dia punya kerja,Sebab all his idea was Useless and RAIS YATIM lebih teruk daripada "SAMPAH MASYARAKAT"
Deimos Tel`Arin
post Dec 16 2011, 12:30 PM

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how will this new draft law affect web hosting companies, bloggers, forum operators, websites etc?
ocphangaz
post Dec 16 2011, 01:37 PM

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QUOTE(empire23 @ Dec 8 2011, 08:59 PM)
I do not support this law.

It would put IT goons on par with engineers with legal registration and powers to commit to public projects.
*
so you're saying IT are not professional professions?

good for you... this is what i've been saying all these while.
wellwellwell
post Dec 17 2011, 01:34 AM

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What kind of stupid bill drafted for own stupidity???!

Lots of IT profession from all different backgrounds, eg: graphic designer, electronics, business, etc.
They still do well as IT profession, who said a cert can represent how well a person's performance to perform?

Lots of "IT profession" change to other field after their study in it as well.
Can bills control these people for making their own decision in life?
yitjuan
post Dec 18 2011, 03:10 PM

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QUOTE(wacrop @ Dec 13 2011, 03:12 PM)
Cert is NOTHING !!!
People with cert not mean everything !!!
People with cert not mean he / she can code !!!
you know study dont mean you know how to code !!!
*
would you trust a non graduate to design your house? Cert doesn't mean anything, right. So get a non civil engineer to design and build your house. Put your money where your words are.
jasonkidd91
post Dec 19 2011, 09:05 AM

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Hi guys,
can sum1 tell me whether this rules apply already ? if not, when will it execute?
or this is juz their pending idea ?

appreciate for your precious reply =)
elblink
post Dec 19 2011, 09:22 AM

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QUOTE(yitjuan @ Dec 18 2011, 03:10 PM)
would you trust a non graduate to design your house? Cert doesn't mean anything, right. So get a non civil engineer to design and build your house. Put your money where your words are.
*
Again, to answer the concern regrading a Doctor/Lawyer/Architect VS. an IT person i.e. web designer, graphic designer, programmer, etc

I bring back post #182 by 1 of our member, highlighting the address in bold as follows:

QUOTE(thesoothsayer @ Dec 9 2011, 08:35 AM)
My reasons for opposing are this:
1. I am against a law that forces people to only hire a member of a certain body.

2. Let the body exist and certify the IT people that wants to join it, but let the industry determine the value of the body and its members through free trade. If the members are less capable than the non-members, then don't hire them. In this way, if the body's certification and membership are of any use, industry will tend to hire them and not others.

3. Producing software is not like medicine or architecture that is a matter of life and death. Certain industries that require better software people (i.e. airlines, military, parts of wireless communication) already have more rigorous hiring process and another certification will not make a difference to them; they trust in their own hiring people, not a piece of paper. Lay people can also produce software, like writing a book, and there should not be a law to stop them from doing so. Even non-accountants can fill up their own tax forms. Are you looking forward to the day when only accountants can fill up tax forms, painters association members can paint your house, writers association can type your emails etc.?
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To add on the above statement, we can Learn, Practice, Apply IT on OUR OWN, design our own blogs, repair our own PC, write our own macros, design a flash animation, create & produce a video, do SEO for our website, create a software....START A FORUM like lyn...etc.

Even without any formal training.

But for the case of Medicine, Architectural, Engineering, Law, - We can't learn & practice on our own because we need certain equipments & we need to get the input from the government, banking, other people etc.

So we can't compare apple & oranges.

Whoever drafted the bill COPIED + PASTED + MODIFIED 10% the template used in the drafting the Medicine, Architectural, Engineering, Law & trying to apply it onto the IT industry, without understanding the differences of the IT industry as compared to the other industry.

This post has been edited by elblink: Dec 19 2011, 09:35 AM
elblink
post Dec 19 2011, 09:32 AM

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QUOTE(jasonkidd91 @ Dec 19 2011, 09:05 AM)
Hi guys,
can sum1 tell me whether this rules apply already ? if not, when will it execute?
or this is juz their pending idea ?

appreciate for your precious reply =)
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In my understanding, it is a draft therefore it is pending approval.

The bill will be presented to the Parliment to get it approved by the 2/3 majority of the MPs.

(Kindly correct me if the above statement is incorrect, Thanks.)

What the horde of IT people had done in the MOSTI Open Day is to let the ones who are behind the bill know that We think this draft is a bad idea...because <the reasons>......but those people do not understand....

But the effect is that they may drop the bill if the IT industry can come out with certain standard to ensure good practice.

I am aware that there are IT people who are in the midst of discussing on how to come up with the right standard for IT.
These people are the the ones who uses IT in everyday lives, who are in touch with the reality of the IT world.

You can do a post search in this thread on the news that were posted in the earlier pages.

That's what I did to ensure i don't post something that has been already been addressed earlier in the previous posts of this thread. Cheers!

This post has been edited by elblink: Dec 19 2011, 09:34 AM
SUSsfx3000
post Dec 19 2011, 03:01 PM

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We have a big problem.


The consensus is we DON'T want any bill/LAW to govern computing profession.


But now there're nerds/geeks taking advantage to represent everyone, and they will help draft the bill to be put into LAW.



Trojan horses surfacing among the IT/Nerd/Geeks community.



The struggle is to kill the bill of any kind.


Now you have these idiots coming out saying they're the professional community, helping to modify the CPB2011 bill so it can be made into law.



Beware of MOSTI's planted moles !
asdzxc
post Dec 20 2011, 01:42 PM

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i support this act smile.gif less con-man out there
tan_pang
post Dec 20 2011, 02:42 PM

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QUOTE(yitjuan @ Dec 18 2011, 03:10 PM)
would you trust a non graduate to design your house? Cert doesn't mean anything, right. So get a non civil engineer to design and build your house. Put your money where your words are.
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I could say computing is not very certification dependent. (Emphasize on the word Computing)
For example, I can do VB.net programming very well even without certification from Microsoft: MCTS Visual Basic .NET Programming
And are all the Anonymous member Certified Ethical Hacker? (I guess they will laugh at you if you said you are C|EH)

You may choose to trust the certificate, but I rather trust the person's ability over certificate.
apsidewatch
post Dec 20 2011, 07:17 PM

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guys, so in other words, any business activities that are related in IT need to be registered? including marketing ur products in a blog,facebook page,website and selling discount coupon like groupon ? is it?
Instant_noodle
post Dec 21 2011, 10:00 AM

nyaaa~~
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QUOTE(apsidewatch @ Dec 20 2011, 07:17 PM)
guys, so in other words, any business activities that are related in IT need to be registered? including marketing ur products in a blog,facebook page,website and selling discount coupon like groupon ? is it?
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dun think so far as business

installing a legally bought modern warfare (a game) would get you jailed or fined or both under tat bill becoz you had altered the system existed in the computer without a cert
Swordsmen
post Dec 21 2011, 04:49 PM

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Still.. no matter what the damage done, they still win in every goddamn erection competition.

This post has been edited by Swordsmen: Dec 21 2011, 04:50 PM
SUSsfx3000
post Dec 21 2011, 05:15 PM

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Hey my posts in page 22 has been deleted.. why is this so ? Any mods wanna clarify ?
hvk13
post Dec 21 2011, 05:20 PM

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this will cause m'sia to lose alot of IT ppl. those pros that dun hav enuf money to get their stupid certification how? more ppl will leave m'sia to find IT job
SUSs2peMocls
post Dec 21 2011, 08:25 PM

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QUOTE(elblink @ Dec 15 2011, 10:29 AM)
Well put!

The academic circle are mostly concerned with producing students to fulfill the trend of the big boys, so that the students have jobs to work along the same big boys who controls the market.

It's all about business now, education is about what we want you to know and follow, not we want you to think for yourself & think out of the box.

In 2 words, modern slavery. Subtly done until many people doesn't realised it at all or won't believe it is real.

Singapore is already a NWO playground, Malaysia is showing more signs of getting there soon.
Unless we realised it early and stop it fast.

The show up at the MOSTI open day is a good start for all IT people.
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That's a dumb reasoning. Students who know they can't get a job without certification will AVOID the course. Which is why fields like marketing, management, sociology etc far outnumber law, medicine and engineering.

Foreign multinationals can't be bothered with asking govt to regulate IT sector, they just outsource it to India or worse.... pack up to another country.

you guys have been fed a lie.
jiraiya77
post Dec 29 2011, 01:39 PM

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QUOTE(Swordsmen @ Dec 21 2011, 04:49 PM)
Still.. no matter what the damage done,  they still win in every goddamn erection competition.
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i wonder why.
malaysian,any ideas?

This post has been edited by jiraiya77: Dec 29 2011, 01:40 PM
homerthewhopper
post Jan 3 2012, 05:23 PM

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i guess i am going to jail for helping my mom with her school library computer rolleyes.gif

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