So its normal ? Glad to hear that , thought I was stressing myself too much . Been training for 1 month .

I switch them
Fly as pre-exhaus.
Btw press give me pump

lol the guy looks to be the experienced bb'er to me. but yeah, the guy prob needs some cardio and diet control. IMO during the gvt training, its more to training for muscle endurance, or something. im just 2 years in so i dont know the intricacies and the finer details for weightlifting. one thing for sure atm, is the rep ranges i like vary from 3-8. and usually 8 would be the first few sets. i notice when i do go to failure for any exercise, its usually from reps 4-6.

i still do my cardio, but i have not tried steady state, slow type like you have. am thinking of incorporating that in but that would mean spending more time in the gym. oh well, looks like i have to get in earlier and brave the pasar malam crowd lol.

i had those dizzy spells when i first started. not anymore though.. you'll get used to it i suppose..

i always start with presses. logic for me is if i go too heavy on flyes its gonna affect my rotator cuff, and wrists (im talking db flys here) whereas presses i can go to my maximum load when im at my freshest state.

since we r talking about chest, has anyone done DTP for chest?

plenty of times

apa macam? afaik DTP is not really to make the body part grow, just 'define' it and more for cutting exercise.
i was wondering how to do it. you do 10sets of presses and 10 sets of flyes? or either one?

Presses first for me.
Flyes are better isos to really empty the tank. That and I'm not keen on heavy flye movements.

my friend, no such thing as cutting exercise man. What is a cutting exercise? A high volume exercise? Apart from having a cardio from that, there's nothing cutting about it. And quite frankly, trying to achieve a cardio exercise solemnly from weight training is quite impractical to be honest. Exercises with weights are to stimulate the muscle body part, there's no spot reduction with it and that's that. Every training method will make you grow, a matter of whether you gonna grow more or less depending on how you define your rest, your intensity, nutrition and recovery. The ways you can cut comes from your dieting and your cardio.

What DTP does, is that it combines 2 antagonistic muscle groups(opposing muscle groups) such as:-

Chest/Back
Bis/Tris
Quads/Hams

and perform exercises in a supersetted fashion. But it's really down to what you want to do with it. Basically, you can also use it for single muscle group, for a straight set manner. The usual way of going about with DTP are as follows:-

DB Bench/ DB Rows
Any Bar Curls/ Lying Tricep Extension(skullcrushers)
Leg ext/leg curl ( Usually a straight set of leg press, but it's good to change things up)
DB/BB/SM Shoulder Press (First half) Wide Grip Upright Rows(Second Half)

I've tried it with SM Decline/ Underhand BB Row for 1st half, then SM Incline/OverHand BB Row with chest back b4. I've also tried SM Shoulder Press/ BB Shrugs. Even DB Side Raises straight set DTP.
The key to building muscle is to maximize the amount of muscle fibres to be stimulated, hence more preferably, a compound movement. But it's really down to your creativity on what to perform DTP with.

I posted the long link here b4 this. Trying searching for it.

On a separate note, what's with the building exercise and toning/defining exercise? There's only 2 category of exercises I know, Compound and Isolation. One hits multiple muscle group fibres and one targets singular muscle group fibres.

This post has been edited by razorboy: Oct 24 2011, 08:34 PM

Btw, 10 more posts and this thread is gone

New Thread Here

think i should have said, this is the exercise better done if you r cutting bcoz it gives better definition overall seen if you r cutting. this happens to my arms.

erm, not really, it hits both muscle fibres, fast twitch and slow twitch, and according to Kris Gethin, really enters the deep regions between the fibres to stimulate even the subcutaneous fat within by pumping a lot of blood in there.
Fascia stretching and such. Hence a more defined look and at the same time, it does make you grow. Still, how cut you are depends on your bodyfat levels.

fascia stretching comes into play if you do superset imo. otherwise, just bloody stretch that body part.

so u r following the exercises recommended by him only. was thinking whether there's chest only DTP. like flyes + presses

your fascia stretches when your muscles are pumped like hell, when both muscle fibres are gorged with blood. There's no rule saying you can't do your own. I've repeated it already. It comes down to how creative you are. If you think it's feasible to do press + fly in a superset manner as high volume as DTP then be my guest. There's a reason why ANTAGONISTIC is the rule of thumb here. If you think you can pound the same body part with so much volume in a superset manner like that, go ahead.



This post has been edited by razorboy: Oct 24 2011, 09:24 PM

I always start out with press on chest. Because compared to Legs(which is huge and can take a hell lot of pounding), chest is a rather small body part, even shoulders too. Hence, I find it not logical to pre-exhaust them, I want to target them mainly in the pressing movements,and if I pre-exhausted them, I'm more likely to use other muscles more, to compensate for the fatigued muscle group. With legs, it's different, squats regardless of how good your form is, will still bring in the lower back(hip drive area), and hence, your lower back (smaller muscle) is more likely to give out first, compared to your quads. But then again,for chest, there's nothing wrong in pre-exhausting. I choose to train this way but everyone can do however that they wish to do

for certain people that have stubborn muscle group to grow,they have to do some pre-exhaus
eg me,i always pre-exhausted my delt cause i have hell diffculty to growing deltoids

If you're looking to grow, would you use Iso or Compound movements?



This post has been edited by razorboy: Oct 24 2011, 10:18 PM

This is the thing I've been trying to say. By the end of the w/o, you're weak , in a glycogen depleted state, it's all about emptying the tank, bringing the muscle beyond it's threshold. At this point, no heavy weights is needed(relative), it's all about isolating it, forcing it to work past it's endurance point and then go on out to recover. Not saying ISOs dont make the muscle grow, but having a heavy compound(relative), you make your body secrete more growth hormones , proceeding to isolating it, it's gonna reap the benefits of not only it's own stimulation, but with the flow of growth hormones from the heavy compound

people would say heavy compound
i do bench press,squat,whatever compound when i started
but now i realize i dont gain much from seated shoulder press,so i do different variety of raise for shoulder width
and i will do widegrip upright row 1st only follow by press(due to my curve clavicles structure i have easy growing traps but hell developed delts<<)
for the rest bodypart i still sitck to compound

move here ^