Yeah, everything in the music isn't compacted. As such hearing every single piece of instrument and vocal was easier. One that surprised me was that in one song, there were backup singer. I thought they stopped when the chorus kicks in towards the end, but I was wrong. I think you're definition of sound stage is about right. The whole thing opens up more, more expansive.

This is my first encounter with a "high-end" (take this lightly ) DAP. I think I'm no more of a skilled listener than you are.

Soundstage would be the accuracy with which a reproducing system conveys audible information about the size, shape, and acoustical characteristics of the original recording space and the placement of the performers within it. So if I'm reading what you wrote correctly then yes, you just nailed the soundstage part.

If you're referring to the preset EQ called BBE then yes, I agree that when turned on, my songs feel more immersive.

Edit: That definition of soundstage was quoted from somewhere.. Can't remember where

This post has been edited by MrJinggles: Mar 11 2011, 10:14 PM

just got my unit on hand this morning...

seems like there is quite a few present EQ in C30..
do you know which one is the most suitable for overall performance?
i changed around but can't really feel the different using those sample files in C30..

If you like EQ, then the all round should be BBE.

Though now, I have started using user set BBE, mainly to adjust bass amount and freq because to me the preset BBE doesn't suit some song that's already have a lot of bass.

if you changed the presets around and didn't notice much difference then probabaly you are using the EQ presets like Rock, Pop, Classical, Jazz etc.

try the BBE presets esp these two -> Viva and MP

This post has been edited by wongpeter: Mar 12 2011, 02:15 PM

preset EQ is not something worth mentioning in C30. try the BBE EQ settings.

ooh i think i stumbled onto something about the BBE. Initially when I got hold of the C30 I was amazed and fascinated by the BBE and so at every opportunity I would try out the different BBE settings. Then I noticed there were times and with certain songs when the BBE menu 'disappeared' leaving me with the Normal, Rock, Pop etc choices or even more infuriating 'Disable BBE'. I thought maybe it was a bug or firmware issues or even a glitch and so I would do a reset but no joy. After awhile I resigned myself to the fact that this may be a quirk of the C30 and hey! for less than 200 bucks what was I expecting anyway, perfection? So I went along happily playing my songs and for the times the BBE menu disappeared, well it troubled me less and less cos I was more than satisfied with the SQ I got for the money I paid.

And then EUREKA! In my constant googling I came across something about BBE that seems to explain the missing BBE menu as well as the raison d'être for BBE. Here it is:



It may be that with lossless formats like FLACS there is no reason for the BBE to kick in and restore the dynamics and clarity since it is NOT compressed which is why the BBE menu on the C30 'disappears'. BBE would work with lossy formats like mp3's in restoring the dynamics and clarity. Another point I noted (I may be in conspiracy theory mode here ) is that Barcus Berry Electronics was started by a violinist and an electronics wiz, that is a musician and a techie. Most of you who listens to music do so in the persona of an audience that is you are sitting 30 or more feet away from the stage where the orchestra plays or some distance away from where the band performs. As an audience listening in on the performance of the artist/s is a totally different feel if you are the performer up on the stage with your peers playting the music. The sound has to be different for the performer and the spectator. Could the founders of BBE have been working to recreate an immersive feel to the music... so you would be right up there in the midst of the musicians and not be distanced from the music as in audience - artists. It seems that in later years BBE was undergoing constant development by notable electric guitar players so it has always been something with a lot of input in its development from musicians. Fascinating what with info on BBE being really scarce and hard to come by even on the internet.

So can some of you corroborate that the BBE choices menu goes missing when playing lossless formats like FLAC and WAV? maybe even APE....



This post has been edited by wongpeter: Mar 12 2011, 04:11 PM

pretty impressive information u have found.

when i read through the "less compressed" part, I was like , I guess it's really a typo there.

Nice find on the BBE. From my experience on BBE with flacs; at the EQ selection, all BBE options except for BBE are gone. It's usable and gives a similar effect when used with mp3, but there's a bug. The bug I detected is triggered by:
1) Changing the track, either going next or prev.
2) Going to file browsing by pressing 'M' or any other options, except for the main menu.

The bug is where the sound some sort of went back to normal EQ preset plus a huge increase in volume, about an extra 7, without indicator itself showing any increase in volume.

Choosing any other EQ WILL NOT change anything,(the screen will keep showing the BBE, and the sound is still bugged).

Here's some methods that I found that disables the bug.
1) Re-selecting BBE will turn the sound back to the regular BBE. Also, from this point foward, selecting any of the regular EQ presets will have the usual effect.
2) Going to Settings -> BBE Setting -> ShutDown BBE. This works by bringing back the EQ setting back to last non-BBE preset used.
3) Going to Settings -> Sound. It will automatically return back to last used non-BBE preset upon choosing 'Sound'.
4) Sometimes, long press M -> Music -> Now Playing. It goes back to the usual BBE.

That concludes my finding.

P/s: Oh yea, when I went to BBE Setting under Settings menu, the only options left are the USERs and ShutDown BBE. Also, playing around with the USER will not disable the bug.

EDIT: Added some additional findings.

This post has been edited by Agnaem: Mar 12 2011, 05:05 PM

sry I read that 'less compressed' part incorrectly. It was not a typo so I have corrected my error. It just means that the BBE is for improving the SQ specifically the dynamics and clarity of the (more compressed) music (meaning low bitrate mp3's) to the SQ level of 'less compressed' sources (meaning high bit rate mp3's). Since lossless is uncompressed you don't get to tweak the sound with BBE. Thats cool cos BBE does not allow for the colouration of 'good sound' from 'good sources' like lossless formats.

Now i understand. I mean for crappy mp3 format songs, the BBE will try to restore the sound so that it mimics the quality of those in less compressed format, like FLAC.

exactly and they used a very nice term for it.... sonic restoration!

wa sonic restoration. at least next time if i got those crappy mp3 files, they wont be as crappy as they are when the BBE is on.

---

Added on March 14, 2011, 5:25 pmLooks like BBE is not just a simple EQ setting, it's something beyond changing one up and the other down.

Sonic restoration. gonna google more about that.

This post has been edited by beederbest: Mar 14 2011, 05:25 PM

Meaning that if I am using FLAC format it is inadvisable to turn on BBE? as it doesn't help much on "restoring" the music reproduction?

BBE will still make the music more lively with flac, more dynamic is what the term some use on the effect of BBE on flac format music.

some even say with flac, the BBE can even function better. This is where I got the info. http://iaudiophile.net/forums/showthread.php?t=28828

not sure but with lossless files you use BBE as an amazing Equalizer
(just imagine car radio... the loudness button is always great to have it on no matter if you're playing CD or listening to Radio)

This post has been edited by power911: Mar 15 2011, 08:28 PM

I'll be getting my own unit of C30. cross fingers and wait impatiently.

This post has been edited by beederbest: Mar 17 2011, 02:28 PM

Put me in owner list.. cube c30 is an awsome player..

no problem. told u so.

Im using nationite nanite n2 from mp4nation, can i join u guys? Coz the spec all the same.