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 V3. Swiftlet Keeping Discussion, Home of Fuciphagus Domesticus

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Cergau
post May 30 2010, 04:34 PM

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THANK YOU FOR VISITING, DO COME BACK

Watch this forum for an announcement in a day or two.


This post has been edited by Cergau: May 30 2010, 04:34 PM
Cergau
post May 30 2010, 06:02 PM

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QUOTE(ChanK @ May 30 2010, 05:32 PM)
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «


if your sifu say is not important abt humi n temp, then u should instead of removing the partitions, u should removes your sifu first then only u remove the partitions one by one. look at the bird shits spot on the partition, u might find which part of the partition that u should removed.
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

*
rclxms.gif rclxms.gif

tauyik,
That's how some wisdom is dispensed here, sometimes.
ie there's wisdom in what was said in response.
Pls do not expect an A-Z write-up. The best has yet to be written.
You may hv done yrself a favour if you have posted a sketch/plan of yr BH.
No 2 here will agree on the ultimate design, but you have nothing to lose anyway.

limhongwoon,
Your questions are general and rather open ended.
I suggest you pick up the basics from V1 & V2. The links are available on the 1st page of this thread (V3).
If u dun need the basics..You may have better luck with more specific questions and get specific answers.
Otherwise you will invite smart-assed answers like
How you guys install the tweeter in BH ?? -----firmly
What is the best song for the swiftlets ?? ------their favourite
Which tweeter should i buy for internal and external ??-----the correct ones biggrin.gif
Oh I forgot to let you know, I not sifu, I tipu biggrin.gif

This post has been edited by Cergau: May 30 2010, 06:23 PM
Cergau
post May 30 2010, 09:22 PM

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QUOTE(West Wing @ May 30 2010, 05:51 PM)
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «
SO clever, you mosquitoes and hope that the authorities also learn like the mosquitoes.............. smarter for the sake of our nation.
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

*
So, instead of being a wannabe Zimbabwe, we instead hope
to be a nation led by the mosquito brained?

What if they don't learn as fast as the mosquitoes?
Will our nation be led by mosquitoes and administered by zombies with mosquito brains?
Won't our swiftlets have to go on a weight loss program with such sizeable insects?
Overtime, they will evolve into my night mare of turkey size swiftlet and tyre size nest. biggrin.gif

Cergau
post Jun 1 2010, 10:23 AM

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Fellow forumers,
We have tried reaching out to the authorities and the alleged 'industry representative'
1)Fed Assoc (both the Chairman and the secretary were addressed in email correspondences) - as shared earlier the secretary asked for an intro and was left at that.
They simply have chosen to ignore us despite my proposed (already past) deadline.
2)DVS - they have responded with a holding reply stating that the good Dr will respond and has not, thus our questions remain unanswered todate.
3)Our proposed press response to the Local Govt Minister's press statment in The Star remain unpublished and correspondence with NST is too totally ignored.
4)Only the legal depts of the government branches are responsive and deserves a pat.

As Parliament is to reconvene in early June, it leaves us little room and time for much else but a Petition.
After you have signed the Petition, please copy and paste from hereon to email away to friends and families and their families and friends.
The email below will be sent to 200 MPs some days after posting here.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
(suggested email in English)
Fellow Malaysians,
We seek your indulgence and intervention to help avoid being smothered a nascent industry. A god given opportunity of a estimated 1 mil ordinary citizen
for self help to mitigate the negative impact from the dire national financial state is being endangered.
Extract of our Petition
"A gross injustice is about to be permitted and institutionalised, where a whole plethora of new regulations with uncertain and frivolous objectives are put in place,
to regulate the conscientious majority, instead of penalising the errant few with breaches of existing by-laws.

We appeal that the industry be allowed to grow organically and not be smothered with unnecessary and misplaced 'assistance' coupled with severe penalties
that unnecessarily make criminals of ordinary citizens.

In the light of the precarious standing of our national finances and the dire need to enhance efficiency, let us not further pile on wasteful and costly bureaucracy."

Your assistance appreciated to further our cause by forwarding this email to friends and family.
Your influence is very much appreciated.
Kindly Read and Sign our Petition here
http://www.PetitionOnline.com/YgWalet/petition.html


(suggested email in B Malaysia)
Wahai Warga Malaysia,

Kami ingin menarik perhatian dan campur tangan tuan/puan untuk membantu mengelakkan tekanan keatas industri yang masih belum berkembang. Kesempatan yang diberikan Tuhan kepada warga biasa dianggarkan menjangkau 1 juta RM, berkeupayaan membantu masyarakat umum di dalam mengurangkan kesan negatif dari kegawatan kewangan yang meruncing.

Ekstrak Petisyen kami

“Ketidakadilan akan terus berlaku apabila mereka yang bersalah tidak dihukum dengan undang undang yang sedia ada tetapi majoriti pengusaha dikekang dengan peraturan-peraturan baru dengan tujuan yang kurang jelas.

Kami merayu agar industri walet dibenarkan tumbuh secara organik dan tidak dikekang dengan peraturan yang kelebihan dan sia-sia.

Dimasa keadaan ekonomi yang meruncing kini, kita perlulah meningkatkan kecekapan. Bukan dengan memburukkan lagi keadaan melalui sistem birokrasi yang sia-sia dan mahal.


Sokongan anda sangat dihargai.

Sila Baca dan tanda tangan Petisyen kami di sini.
http://www.PetitionOnline.com/YgWalet/petition.html


(suggested email in Chinese)

至所有马来西亚同胞,

我们请求您的豁免与介入,以帮助一个新兴的产业避免被扼杀。上天所赋予约100万普通市民自助机会,以减轻正受严重威胁的国家财政状况.

我们的请愿书摘录

“ 一个不公新规定即将批准和制度化,整体具有不确定性和轻浮因素, 其规定不适合规范大多数, 而应采用与现有的法律来惩罚少数违反者.

我们呼吁业者可以健康地成长,不要为了不必要的和错误的'协助'而覆盖它, 加上严重的惩罚是不必要的.

在我们国家财政岌岌可危的地位和迫切需要提高效率的光芒,让我们不要再浪费和支付昂贵的官僚。”


感谢您的影响力.
请阅读并在这里签署我们请愿书
http://www.PetitionOnline.com/YgWalet/petition.html


This post has been edited by Cergau: Jun 1 2010, 11:05 AM
Cergau
post Jun 1 2010, 11:11 AM

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QUOTE(aeiou228 @ Jun 1 2010, 11:07 AM)
Cergau,

I've just signed as 2nd signature after you. Will spread this petition via email to all my kaki, family and friends for more signatures.

Last but not least, thank you so very much for your effort to help the BH owners.  notworthy.gif  notworthy.gif
*
thks, do that and ask the same of them to their frens and families.
But I haven't signed yet being so busy getting this ready.
I will sign later on after I've washed up he he.

I would like to thank those of you who have volunteered and assisted.
Thank You rclxms.gif

This post has been edited by Cergau: Jun 1 2010, 11:14 AM
Cergau
post Jun 1 2010, 01:03 PM

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QUOTE(DarkNite @ Jun 1 2010, 11:47 AM)
Any info for the man-in-the-street as to why they should also support you?
*

Of course they are.....
Just not in a nice little package you can take away to disseminate. biggrin.gif
I'm afraid you will have to depend on your own resourcefulness.

So these are all in question form to trigger discussion and maybe someone will put it all together.
Are we not part and parcel of the national economy?
Is the national financial situation healthy?
Do we not contribute to the national current account and forex?
Anyone know the value of the downstream economic benefit of this industry?
Are we not all fellow sufferers of incompetent little emperors and crony hijacking?
Are we not one of proven green industry with enormous potential.
Someone try comparing income/sq ft vis-a-vis other agricultural industry.
That's why it's considered 'high-value', it's a point we have yet to sell.
What abt carbon footprint, anyone? I will not be too surprised if it goes -ve.
Though some may disagree, I still think that swiftlets do contribute to beneficial control harmful vector borne diseases eg dengue etc...
http://www.nps.gov/archive/npsa/5atlas/partzo.htm
There should be much more ....just add on to David Lim's write-up (oldies here shd know this document)

Anyone want to sponsor a weekend brain storming session?
I can help drive and moderate it, but you guys already 'on-shore' have to fund and organise it.
It would be nice and encouraging if there were more volunteers as there is only so much I can do alone. sad.gif

support you?
just so you know, I DO NOT yet own a BH...so to be accurate s/b
"support existing BH operators"
Cergau
post Jun 1 2010, 01:07 PM

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Can someone help link/post the petition here? It's in Chinese.
http://cforum1.cari.com.my/viewthread.php?...age%3D1&page=33
Cergau
post Jun 1 2010, 01:37 PM

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QUOTE(DarkNite @ Jun 1 2010, 01:17 PM)
IF THE MAN-IN-THE-STREET had care about these, we would have a new FED GOMEN LIAO.
*
Agreed. But can't give up.
Can we?
Cergau
post Jun 1 2010, 06:36 PM

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fyi,
Datuk Chor Chee Heung was appointed the new Housing and Local Government Minister while Datuk Seri Kong Cho Ha replaced Datuk Seri Ong Tee Keat as Transport Minister in a minor Cabinet reshuffle today.
Cergau
post Jun 1 2010, 07:15 PM

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QUOTE(Bobby C @ Jun 1 2010, 07:09 PM)
CSL's son Chua Tee Yong, has been appointed Deputy Agriculture and Agro-based Industries Minister. May be he can help too.
*
If not mistaken DVS falls under Natural Resources and Environment
Cergau
post Jun 1 2010, 11:04 PM

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Anyone seen this before?
This international anti-swiftlet site (now closed) had better support biggrin.gif
http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/total-ban...tural-swiftlet-

A bad case of...Not_My_Businessitis?
biggrin.gif

Lies, lies, lies (always in 3s) biggrin.gif
With the picture of that pile of dead chicks implying that swiftlet farming does that to chicks on a routine basis
I hope this particular writer's children know what their parent/s are doing to swiftlets, advocating shutdown of these BHs.
It will be on their karma.

It's being RSS fed to overseas sites too.
Read below
http://www.cityfarmer.info/2010/04/13/the-...s-in-the-state/

This post has been edited by Cergau: Jun 2 2010, 01:06 PM
Cergau
post Jun 2 2010, 10:04 AM

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I have receive request to update the Petition to reflect the Minister's name due to the Cabinet reshuffle.
Please note the host software does not allow that.
It makes sense....else after getting 28million signatures, I amend it to petition me be the Minister of Vices?

Those of you helping to post the Petition else where, please include an explanatory note.


Cergau
post Jun 2 2010, 06:50 PM

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QUOTE(hackwire @ Jun 2 2010, 05:56 PM)
We need more people to support and sign this petition.

http://www.PetitionOnline.com/mod_perl/signed.cgi?YgWalet&1

thanks
*
All,
Hackwire's link is for viewing the signatures, not for signing


The link for signing is here

Kindly Read and Sign our Petition here
http://www.PetitionOnline.com/YgWalet/petition.html
Cergau
post Jun 4 2010, 12:22 PM

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QUOTE(Cergau @ Jun 1 2010, 10:23 AM)
Fellow forumers,
We have tried reaching out to the authorities and the alleged 'industry representative'
1)Fed Assoc (both the Chairman and the secretary were addressed in email correspondences) - as shared earlier the secretary asked for an intro and was left at that.
They simply have chosen to ignore us despite my proposed (already past) deadline.
2)DVS - they have responded with a holding reply stating that the good Dr will respond and has not, thus our questions remain unanswered todate.
3)Our proposed press response to the Local Govt Minister's press statment in The Star remain unpublished and correspondence with NST is too totally ignored.
4)Only the legal depts of the government branches are responsive and deserves a pat.

As Parliament is to reconvene in early June, it leaves us little room and time for much else but a Petition.
After you have signed the Petition, please copy and paste from hereon to email away to friends and families and their families and friends.
The email below will be sent to 200 MPs some days after posting here.


Kindly Read and Sign our Petition here
http://www.PetitionOnline.com/YgWalet/petition.html

*
For the benefit of casual browsers not logged in, thus unable to view my signature with the Petition link.
Here's a repost for the weekend.

Parliament starts Monday 07/June, so there is little time left.

Send it off to frens and ask to forward to 10 of their frens and so on...
Ask if they are going to continue being ring side spectators all their your lives?
If EBN is not their thing, ask to sign the petition for the principle of it....

NO frivolous regulation should be allowed to be enacted for the unnecessary purpose of threatening the compliant majority whilst not pulling up the delinquent few within the current by-laws. Unnecessary non transparent licensing breeds unhealthy practices.

It unnecessarily make criminals out of ordinary folks like us...for a simple thing like forgetting to renew your harvesting license
1)First the licensing is Unnecessary and serves no obvious purpose
2)Becos of the above it unnecessarily makes a criminal out of us with it's penalties unmatched with the infringement.
We risk being put into the nearest police lock-up and treated like criminals (it's in the WildLife Bill, Clause 93, para 2)
Enforcement officers shall have the powers of a Police officer (Clause 92, para 2)
There's plenty more of such ....licensing has a quota and is lumped together with hunting with guns....


Cergau
post Jun 4 2010, 01:16 PM

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QUOTE(mois @ Jun 4 2010, 12:55 PM)
Hi cergau,
The conclusion is sign the petition if we want to let this industry running? Like that isnt we can put random full name n email to sign?
*
If you have privacy concerns, the email address is blocked by default to prevent illegal harvesting of emails for spam marketing.
Only valid emails are accepted by the petition host.
Signing multiple times with diff names with the same email address is rejected automatically by the host site.

This is an attempt to appeal to the authorities to do the right thing for the industry and to Members of Parliament to intervene in Parliament when the Wild Life Bill is debated during the 2nd reading anytime starting Monday 7/Jun.
It does not however guarantee a reversal.
It is your democratic right to exercise for a legitimate cause.
Have your say or keep quiet when an injustice is being legitimised.

Are you operating a BH or are you planning to deal with regulations for the duration of your operation?
Once it's enacted they will be hell to pay to have it either amended or repealed.
Prevention better than cure???
No one can ever accuse us of not trying unlike some.

Some say....
The only thing sadder than being blind,
Is to have sight....
But no VISION


This post has been edited by Cergau: Jun 4 2010, 01:36 PM
Cergau
post Jun 4 2010, 05:15 PM

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Just checked the Parliament site, Wild Life Bill is scheduled for debate (none if you dont NOW write your MP) & be approved.

:Second & Third Reading
D.R.15/2010 Road Transport (Amendment) Bill 2010
D.R.16/2010 Wildlive Conservation Bill 2010
D.R.18/2010 Hire-Purchase (Amendment) Bill 2010
D.R.19/2010 Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill 2010
D.R.37/2009 Goods and Services Tax Bill 2009
D.R.13/2010 Direct Sales (Amendment) Bill 2010
D.R.14/2010 Stamp (Amendment) Bill 2010

:: Approved
D.R.35/2009 Personal Data Protection Bill 2009
D.R.06/2010 Competition Commission Bill 2010
D.R.02/2010 The Supplementary Supply (2009) 2010
D.R.04/2010 Strategic Trade Bill 2010
D.R.05/2010 Whistleblower Protection Bill 2010
D.R.07/2010 Competition Bill 2010
D.R.17/2010 Criminal Procedure Code (Amendment) Bill 2010
D.R.03/2010 The Supplementary Supply (2010) Bill 2010
D.R.36/2009 Credit Reporting Agencies Bill 2009
D.R.01/2010 Educational Institutions (Discipline) (Amendment) Bill 2010
D.R.08/2010 Suruhanjaya Pengangkutan Awam Darat 2010
D.R.12/2010 Land Public Transport Bill 2010
D.R.11/2010 Commercial Vehicles Licensing Board (Amendment) Bill 2010
D.R.10/2010 Tourism Vehicles Licensing (Amendment) Bill 2010
D.R.09/2010 Railways (Amendment) Bill 2010

Cergau
post Jun 11 2010, 08:39 AM

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QUOTE(Bobby C @ Jun 10 2010, 07:15 PM)
Good good, vote Pakatan for Selangor for 5 yrs then vote them out thereafter.
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

*
Vote them out if they are just a re-branded BN.
Voting out a govt just to safe guard your interest is a little short sighted isn't it?
Sounds just like a certain Chinese based party being in BN/Alliance the past 50 years doesnt it?
Dun you think that it is this very thinking that we have all the leakages, corruption, cronyism that run into billions?
If it;s obviously bad, it's bad, one doesnt cover the bad so that the majority good pays the penalty for your bad?
Save your immediate future with whatever means for your children??? What kind of country do you think you will have left your children?
So why does one complain abt the govt spending your children's future away, while you do the same?
Just my 2 bit.


Added on June 11, 2010, 8:44 am
QUOTE(ChanK @ Jun 10 2010, 09:45 AM)
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «
and they plead (my words only lah) and HOPE that farmers in selangor to register as member to strengthen their position to fight for our rights...by the way, they only have 300 plus members.

so, those interested please contact this no : 016-3225819
and also we are given 3 months starting 1/6/10 to apply the licence to die!

act fast this time.

else we will die NATURALLY instead of Mass Massacre.

Again good luck!
*
What abt bringing the Petition to your local assoc for discussion at the exco level.
Let them make a decision on if they are for or against the Petition.
If your local assoc so decide that they are for, then do whatever it takes to bring it to the attention of their 300 members!
Do you guys actually prefer to treat the symptoms instead of prevention????



Added on June 11, 2010, 8:57 am
QUOTE(West Wing @ Jun 10 2010, 08:46 PM)
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

Do join the swiftlets Associations for your own sake or otherwise, don't blame anyone for what may happened to your BHs. I am not saying that all Swiftlets Associations are good but at least if we are united and in strength, we at least have the power to negotiate or else, doomed day is not so far away......be it @ town or agriculture land. If the Committee of the Association isn't doing their job, kick them out and replace them with people who are willing to sacrifice time for the industry and the love of the swiftlets.
*
Yes, do join your local association.
BUT do not stop there.
Raise issues, participate.
Democracy is not practised once every 4/5 years for the country and once a year for the assoc, it is supposed to be practised everyday.
The local association is as good as the active members or if many are active, as good as the sum.
MOST GOOD THINGS REQUIRE EFFORT AND MAINTENANCE.

This post has been edited by Cergau: Jun 11 2010, 09:02 AM
Cergau
post Jun 11 2010, 10:02 AM

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QUOTE(Bobby C @ Jun 11 2010, 09:25 AM)
End of the day, what we like to see is a healthy two party system tats all. How sure are you PR wouldnt turn out to be DN one day?
*
For the simple fact that they haven't being in power long enuff to feel comfortable and behave arrogantly towards the rakyat!
They haven't started to behave like it's their right and w/o an ounce of guilt to rip the guts out of the national coffers to line their own pockets.
One doesn't throw away the baby with the bath water.
A bad member doesn't represent the whole party.
Basic diff between the opposing side?
One's fronted by race based parties (though not all) the other isn't.
It's Malaysian own brand of institutionalised apartheid.

Once they behave like the BeEnd, vote them out.

As for the industry...
Read this, they are determined to extract their pound of flesh from the industry for what....
Who'll win - the cronies or rakyat?
It's all slogans and w/o substance.
By the time they remove all the subsidy w/o stopping the leakages, implement the GST and not fixing the fundamentals, we will be left holding banana money.

This post has been edited by Cergau: Jun 11 2010, 10:26 AM
Cergau
post Jun 12 2010, 11:38 PM

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QUOTE(Bobby C @ Jun 11 2010, 10:56 AM)
Similarly a rotten party does not mean all members are rotten.

Even the porn president (as some may call him) have my respect for being rational, dare to speak up when needed and did the right thing in the past where many have failed to do. Even got stripped naked he could climb up from the sh*t hole to become a president. Tabik! Even LKS said good things abt him when he got screwed by his own members in 2007 before stepping down. Real enemies in fact its own members. Similarly, not surprise our enemy are own asshociations heads. Go read history of formal communist party, how many got killed all because of one head who worked with the british, jap and own party.

Again, we human are not perfect, so no point act perfect/hero, or claim perfect/hero or  try to be seen perfect/hero. Only end result will proof who is less evil. What we like to hear is what is the rational behind they made tat kind of decisions. Tats all.
*
That' wishful thinking, party system does not allow breaking ranks.
In the corp world it's known politely as concensus.
Even a good guy as you term it will have to compromise.
In some democracy they do, but still largely frowned upon and will soon fall out of favour (even in the US)

It's further compromised by being in an alliance where the alliance view may reign supreme.
Unless that good guy is as powerful as a past PM and at the top of the pyramid.
Thus your point may theoratically be correct, but realistical incorrect.
Good guy personal interest take the backseat I am afraid.
Only at the ministerial level some leeway is given in allowing some of the goodness to show through.
In our case this is where it is lacking?

They dont qualify for being good let alone perfect .No one asking for perfection,
Breaking ranks to stand up against the obvious bad is sufficient, it's not happening.
We have seen resignations in the past over principles.
If it's happening behind closed door, yet the evil is pushed through, the party and it's members have sold their soul.
Since it has happened for so long and continue despite exposures both officially and unofficially, there is no 2 ways about being bad.
And we are not talking about a last minute snap decision.

I don;t wish to go personal on the politicians.
We are in agreement, it's what's produced that counts.
I dont care 2 hoots about their personal life.
If you read their tweets over a day, you know how hard some of them work.
I dont envy them nor their life.
If they steal from the rakyat or act in bad faith I do.
Cergau
post Jun 13 2010, 12:05 AM

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QUOTE(aeiou228 @ Jun 12 2010, 11:45 PM)
Er...hm...!
Gentlemen....sudah terlampau off topic liao lor....
*
Ok, Sorry lah.
A good point deserves a response mah!
Let get bk to birds.

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