Geez... short reply doesn't constitute to poor reply...

And apparently u don't understand that analogy neither.

What i'm saying is, in order for u to successfully search/look/find something, u need to know:
1. What is it you're looking for
2. Where to look for it
3. How to look for it.

Your retorts does not work on me. I can say i don't believe there's no Satan because simply i'm an aethiest.

What i've said in my earlier posts (that is, if u're even bothered to read any of the post), we aren't even sure in the first place if ghosts exist.

Situation A:
When a person dies (according to Christianity and Islam, and some other religion i suppose), he/she will go to hell/heaven, and spend eternity there.
Well if so, how come there'll be ghosts wandering around? (since they'll be confined to Hell/Heaven)

Situation B:
According to some other religion, a person shall be reborn after death.
(so whilst waiting for their turn to be reborn, they wander around as ghost?)

Situation C:
According to another religion (kinda forgotten if it's Hinduism or what), after death you'll be falling to a never ending hole.
(so, some point while falling, they escaped and wander as ghosts?)

Concluding from these 3 situations, whether i will see a ghost or not depends on my religion? XD


Fine, Assuming that there are ghosts around us. Assuming that they can be seen.

So how we are gonna measure them scientifically? (which is the main question here in this thread)
In terms of frequency? Voltage? pH? Power Factor?

Interesting discussion here.

When somebody spells out the the word ghost, immediately we would be able to picture the "image" of it in the head. And this image would be different pending on the culture or the religion one belief in.

Could be a beast, long hair or even a person wearing Ching dynasty suit.

Which one to measure? How could it be, aren't it suppose to be "universal" if it originated and came out from the physical body?

Most part of the cultures that the world adopting has their values, else none of these will exist until today.

The concept like remembering and appreciate what the ancestors have done is positive value. However, the practices of it varies different from one culture/religion to another. And many culture and religion believes that they still can hear us in the form of spirit.

This is the part of the culture that lead people believes in spirit.

Another part that lead people to believe in spirit is usually assiociated with the childhood.

Example, a mother tell her 5 year old son, don't go out at night, as the bad guy might catch you. You would understand that there is no way for a 5 year old to understand what bad guy mean.

The mother instead telling her 5 year old, don't go out at night for there are many ghosts out there, they look scary, and come out from no where.

Which way is more effective?

Here come the discussion of intention vs result.

The intention of the mother was good, however the result is not too good as it makes the kid fobia of something that he has not seen before.

I am not saying every mother telling the same story above. The point is we are influence much by such story while we were kids.

Aren't for many childhood, watching tv series, movies and books on ghost story were part of they life?

As a kids, when they see family members have some event remembering the ancestors, this pratice indirectly implant the concept of spirit.



When athiest says there is no ghost, the believer will come out defending it.

It is not the ghost that the believer trying to defend, but the culture and belief that one holds that they are trying to protect.

If you believe in ghost, please ask the following questions:

1) Is spirit "universally" the same or depends on culture/religion?

2) Our fellow forumer pixelsheep posted an interesting question:

[[[Imagine a world where ghosts do exist. Photography would be a much more difficult task. Think you got that shot just right? Well think again, that ghost just got in the way again. "Put your arm on your waist. Yeah just like that. That's perfect. Looking good. Now let's just chec--Ah for f***s sake it's that goddamn ghost again."

That recording of your band's newest song? Sorry, it's ruined. "That was a good you guys. Except for the talking, could you keep it down? What do you mean you weren't talki--Oh jesus it's that f***ing ghost again. Will you just get a f***ing job already."

All scientific experiments would have to include a "ghost f***ing around with our data" factor to account for deviations of measured data due to ghosts f***ing around with measurements]]]

In our shool or university time, in chemistry, biology, physics whatever measurement made, do we take in the "measurement values/results" directly or we need to ask if the ghost factor influencing the PH, voltage, the EM wave we measured?

3) Why the victims of murder case did not translate into ghost and interact to the physical would telling what is happening? This would definately help on justice.

Oh, they are forbid to do so you said, how come others can be wondering around?

The truth is out there -cue X-files music-

about these ghost things, i would say there is more important things need to be discover.

As the ghosts, we could not see them every day, day and night, there is nothing you can check to confirm. Like a biscuit, kadang2 ada.

We also could not predict where it comes from, or what is a physical values of these ghosts.

Until you can put it in the "bottle" and test it, then, you can know what it is.

But, what we gonna do after we found the physics value, turn the ghosts into a electric generator?

It is clear that skeptics will forever be skeptics until the time it hits them

Like me

Used to be same as you guys, there is no ghost, it's just an imagination of people's whose mental states are unstable

Until that very fateful night

I won't go on that since it has nothing to do with this section, suffice to say, yes, ghosts exist

Well i have my share of experience too.

surely u guys heard of like when u sleep, u sometimes feel like your body's being pressed?
i've felt tht sort of thing for alot of time XD

apparently got some explanation about it, something about blood vein getting blocked or something :/

Used to happen when i was young. My mind is awake but body cant move

me too. to ~lynn~, I think you should really read whether in Islam when people die, they will go straight to hell/heaven. Or there is another world in between.

Spiders cause the mind awake body cant move phenomena. next time it happen to you, look around for the spider. You WILL find it.

These are call believes. In malaysia certain race are force to follow without obligation.
Honestly i do believe in ghost before i felt it before at least 4 times all my life. Its something unexplainable. For no reason in a quiet place suddenly u feel chill. Then suddenly you have this feeling keep telling yourself Pls get out of the room.

Another one was a room i always entered a TV ROOM. I didnt think anything bad or scary but when i sleep there i have nightmare tat something is in the room. I woke up with chills and sweating. If someone tell you that room is haunted and u still sleep there its call scaring yourself but
I also have a friend that can see these things. When she all of a sudden just keep quiet i immediately understand

This post has been edited by aspire2oo6: Oct 3 2009, 12:04 PM

When you yourself have switched off the light, and you are the only one in the building, and then the light is switched on by itself

Then you go switch it off again, thinking to yourself that "Stupid me, I forgot to switch off the light", but as you step out of the place, the light is on again

And this repeated enough times to get the message through your thick skull "I am here and I want the light on"

"No, it has nothing to do with ghost", those skeptics would said

But if it isn't ghost, what is it?

Its not 100% ghost but its just something that cant be explain yet in scientific yet or havent have the technology to do so. But i do believe in ghost.

U havent experience it doesnt mean it dont exist. Some ppl experience it and never have the chance to come back to tell the story.

Contradictory statement

If it is something that can't be explained yet, how do you know it is not a ghost?

How do you know its a ghost? The word ghost is created by u? Its something unexplainable.

The word god created by who? Also human. Suddenly everyone born then suddenly in their mind have a word call ghost and god?

Its a believes. When our parents are growing up they guide us a method. Then everyone follow it that creates a believes.

This post has been edited by aspire2oo6: Oct 3 2009, 06:46 PM

If you are interested in true science, you would know that things has yet to be proven can not be unproven

Nah dont really believe in true science. I have felt something even science cant be proven yet. I choose what i want to believe not let some nerds trying to proof something.
Like coke and cigarette it took them 50 years to prove that its bad.

So lets if it take sciene 500 years to prove i ma die already before i know the truth.

Have u seen certain diseases even science cant heal. Ive seen certain diseases being healed using non science method. Important it works. You want to wait till science to proof it can be healed only heal meh? Die di lor

This post has been edited by aspire2oo6: Oct 3 2009, 08:47 PM

It's kinda true, you have to accept that some diseases science (still) does not have the cure.
But the truth is, every disease has its' cure.
Just because it has not been proven scientifically,
does not mean it does not exist.
Just how many percent of our brain are we using, man? Do you think we will and can know it all?

"Nothing exists until or unless it is observed. An artist is making something exist by observing it. And his hope for other people is that they will also make it exist by observing it. I call it 'creative observation.' Creative viewing." -William S. Burroughs

I think the same principle also applies to Scientist.

Now, you can try to explain the taste of kiwi juice to people who never taste kiwi juice, but do you think he will understand? huhu~

Not all diseases are supposed to be cured

Some diseases are supposed to be embedded in the hosts, like the chlorophyll in plants, chlorophyll was not in the plants in the beginning, it "infected" plants and one way or another it co-exists with the plants, and they become one

What u said is true? But for human you cant compare. Compare apple with apple not coconut and chicken

What is cancer? Cancer is something no scientific way to cure it they name it cancer. So if you are sick and u gonna die then you gonna wait the scientific take 20 years to research your cure when u have 1 month to live?
Dont compare human and plant? Are u a plant?


Another believes i seen nothing to do with ghost but the effect is similar.
I seen some family due to their upbringing when ppl want take photo they anti like hell they do not allow baby 1 year old and below to take photo.


But modern parents today u ask them how many photo they take. They have like 500 to 1000 ? Both are human but the believes are so different?

Another example ive seen you tell an english educated and non english educated. You ask do you let your young baby listen to music when 1 year old? She said huh need meh? What for?

When u ask an english educated they tell you the music is for their brain to create curiousity so when the baby grows up they absorb knowledge faster. Baby are very sensitive to sound wave that creates a habit in their life indirectly.


Do you notice its all about believes its your life you choose what do you want to believe not let believes of others choose for you.

This post has been edited by aspire2oo6: Oct 3 2009, 10:13 PM

Science is just experiments ,logics and facts.
We choose science because it's explainable or definable.
Doesn't the crappy old saying always repeat?
"There's something science could never explain"
The world have alot of mystery happenings that are usually dismiss as myths and lengeds.
Mainly just because it could not be experimented or define with science.
Same goes for peeps who doesnt believe in god and yet we still see growing number of churches , temples and mosque.