From what I can see, your investment principles and views is no different from a fund manager.

I wouldn't put my trust on you either.

Your how to be in 5% group don't seem new to me. In fact, I think it's probably the very same thing from what a "financial advisor" will tell me.

So, I still cant see why I will be able to succeed under your approach, especially when you attribute investment as gambling which requires ALOT of luck.

What are the odds of DIY and beating the rest of crowd especially for a person who has no financial knowledge/background as compared to those involved in it for years.

The fallacy to me is not on the profession but the whole entire monetary systems. It was never designed to be sustainable. Introduction of complex financial derivatives or whatever structured products is only there to serve a purpose, a means for people to trade and speculate, a system that was never needed.

This post has been edited by legiwei: May 9 2009, 12:52 AM

lol bullsh*t, tell that to the ppl who got arrested recently and got charged for sedition.


Can ... insider information. Or share manipulation. Both happening all the time in M'sian market.

Yes, those things are known by people, very old fashioned. But can you do that? For every 10 years we will have a bear market and even you know that from history, there are still tons of people losing big. Tell me why? Cos we are all human, we make the SAME mistakes everyday, every year, every decades. Why so many people rush to buy stocks before the the market collapse? Why the turnover usually broke all the time record before the market collapse. you explain this to me?

My point is even you know what i said are correct but you still cant do that. Only 5% of people can do that and they can win big. That means you need to acting in extraordinary way. The world likes a Pyramid, only the tip is the success.

Provided Fund Manager don't CON people of telling them "sweet" "sweet" words which is very wrong.

The last year market crash render many many investor investment back to stone age!!
Many of my colleague shaking their head coz the sweet of agent that promised them the return will be much better than EPF dividend..

Many of my colleague are taken in by the Mutual funds "extra unit dividend" which increase the investment value but last year Market crash really shatter thier confidence.

Can you tell me how many so-call "niche funds manager" never got burnt last year???

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Added on May 9, 2009, 10:53 amDon't understand why people worship warren buffet so much..

Can we be like Warren Buffet?

we have our own brain which can analyse what is wrong and right...read more...see current trend....invest wisely...which is basically all we can do now.
It is more important how well your investment portfolio fare during good and bad times.

What i meant is that fund manager don't promise this and that.




This post has been edited by MakNok: May 9 2009, 10:53 AM

I don't get it, you are criticising the fund managers because they are treating your money like it's a game and they don't care if they were to lose at all.

And then, you make a U-turn with your "how to succeed method" + your aggresive approach which is no different from those whom you're trying to critise.

And you know, those people who are losing money are also doing the very exact same thing like you're trying to get us to do but only end up losing it big.

So, my point is, I don't see you being any different from the rest.

This post has been edited by legiwei: May 9 2009, 12:44 PM

My successful methodology is not to be another fund manager to cheat other money. I mean you need to be a fund manager to manage your own money, to earn for yourself. This method is unique to anyone. Anyone cant copy your method and win the same like you. You develop your own method and can work only on yourself. Cos if you can beat yourself, then you could beat the market.

Got ... there were a handful of bear funds that were short on CDOs & all those other derivatives when the markets started crashing, those made tons of money.

Vast majority of everybody and anybody involved in any sort of securities lost big though.

And @ TS >> Your posts are all flowery talk and no substance. Kind of like a bad motivational speaker who only talks about how u should always aim for success (or etc) but doesn't actually tell you anything more than you already know.

God, never makes mistake.

Warrent Buffet mistake is when he take over Berkshire Hathaway.

rock, do u know that there are actually funds which outperformed the market when it was down?

And, I actually find that it would be pointless u ask ppl not to be another fund manager nor invest in them.

Afterall, it depends on people. If there weren't so many funds out there, do u think that the economy can be stimulated? People would just keep their money in bank or even dig a hole at the back of their garden and bunge it! Imagine if u do not invest, the economy will just move slow like a snail.

And u can't deny the fact that not everyone also has the finance knowledge. Some do still think that they can earn a profit when they invest in funds.

If u do not agree with me then explain to me why there are still so many people buy lottery?

This is life, so give fund managers a break! Peace~

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Added on May 10, 2009, 4:33 amOf coz you can be like warren buffet, provided that you can do it at the right time, right place, and with the element of luck. Which has one of a million chance. How many people are there on this earth?

Of coz nothing's is wrong if u try to be like him. Even if u can't but i guess what u learnt would transcend a lot of people. Which makes u a better person, or perhaps, wealthier?

This post has been edited by kokofai: May 10 2009, 04:33 AM

Rich, middle-class and poor are choices that one make.
Everyone can be rich but not many choose to do it.
By paying attention to their word, you can spot their choices.

To be like WB, is not to do what he do.
It's to be a WB then do as WB and finally having what WB have.
Be, do and have.

The words we say are our being-ness. The Be part.
Most people just want to do and have. Most of them would not be rich.


To be rich, change our vocabulary.

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: May 10 2009, 10:19 AM

sounds so 高深莫测 hehe. But I agree that not all choose to be one.

其实是蛮简单的。

Words like "It takes money to make money" and "The rich are greedy" is not in my vocabulary.

One thing I do agree.
Most people that choose not be an investor, they should stick to a financial plan.
Mutual fund is one of the plan that suits them.

folks -

first, being a fund manager myself, the aim of opening this thread is trying to help out by sharing insights for those who arent, as well as trying to make friends with anyone who agrees to me.

I do not try to convince anyone to be my client as the co i work in only take in big clients. I criticize was to trying to help others who are lacking of financial skills to STOP wasting/spending money on those so-called 'fund manager' cos i live with them in my entire life, i know who they are, how they are like.

Im hoping to help anyone with interests of learning instead of stuffing food into his mouth, i prefer to teach him to fish. Thats why Im here. I hope u can read my posts again with a different pov from now on.

Once again, i believe winners are not only for genius. You first need to have your mindset in correct direction plus hardworking (try to know as many as things in the world). You still have chance to be the winner.

The strength of an investor is being neutral.

Im going to share something simple today - something can prove the method i mentioned it works and makes money.

Q1. Do you know what is the biggest consensus about the economy now?
Answer: 2nd half 2009 recovery of the global economy.

My comment: All wrong. If such a big bubble of banking bubble burst globally (especially in US and Europe) can recover after about 1.5 year (since 2008), it must be someone is joking or daydreaming. The bubble is bigger than ever in human history, bigger than tech bubble, any of those we know of.

2. Can China escape from this crisis?
No. US and Europe take over 40% GDP in the world. It is China (whole Asia indeed) to depend on US and Europe rather they need us. China will become the net importer from now on. China to import natural resources from US and Europe but at the same time exports are all dead like a dead fish. So called "World Factory" doesn't work any more. CHINA CANNOT SAVE THE WORLD, Please stop telling the joke.

3. But one thing we need to bear in mind that the market structure has changed a lot since 2000, due to the rise of internet. Traditional way of accessing to information from hard copies is an era past behind us, it is all about internet now.
The length of bear market will be shortened comparing with the past, say from 4-5 yrs to 2-3 yrs. It's because people need less time to be educated that this is a bear market as information flowing freely and quickly in internet and other media.

Conclusion: Don't lost faith upon current bear market cos IMHO the next bull market may come around 2010-2011. Hence, Now Please Sell everything on hand: stocks/real estates and buy them back around mid of 2010. Remember, not to worry too much about the downturn cos when all the people are bearish, then you take out your money under your bed and buy anything to ride the next bull.

What do you think?

This post has been edited by rockcrawler: May 14 2009, 09:48 PM

I tend to agree. Markets have been rallying lately but I see it as no more than blind optimism.

Which is bad news for me cos bear market = shit income T_T

rockcrawler,

Stock Market is not equal to economy.

1) Global economy will not recover in 2nd half 2009. In fact, it probably will not recover in 2010 too.

2) Which stock market are you talking about?? In US stock market, the stock market is a leading indicator. The stock market tend to recover 8 to 9 months before the actual recovery.

3) Malaysia economy and stock market will not recover. Malaysia economy has not recover from 97/98 and now it is going down and not coming back up.

<<Hence, Now Please Sell everything on hand: stocks/real estates and buy them back around mid of 2010. >>

4) Which market?? Malaysia?? Malaysia will not recover. It will get worse over the next 3 to 5 years.

Dreamer

Thank you, Dreamer.

I'm sorry that the recovery may not necessarily happen in Malaysia even all the other markets do that because we have a pretty closed economy. Malaysia's edge is only oil. But oil price may not get back to over $100 level in the coming few years cos oil supply is so huge that there is no such thing of energy crisis at all.

I do agree what you said. My suggestion was meaning to try putting an eye/investment in Hong Kong and or Singapore market during 2010. We can still win big.

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Added on May 15, 2009, 6:51 amI will share a real example of my trading this week:

Action: I shorted Hang Seng Index futures twice this week from 17400 and closed yesterday at 16480, gained 1000 points in 3 days.

Rationale:
1. Hong Kong mkt turnover broke HK$100bn this week since 17000, but the index met resistance at around 17400-17500. Remember high turnover is a bad sign in bear market rally, meaning people came out to sell.

2. Dont underestimate the resistance in 250 day moving average.

3. It became a low quality rally since 16000 as many bad fundamental stocks also went up huge.

Follow up:
Now waiting for rebound today and short again around 16700-16800.

This post has been edited by rockcrawler: May 15 2009, 06:55 AM

rockcrawler,

You are a FUND MANAGER. It is YOUR full time job to watch the market and play the market. For REAL people like me, I INVEST. I have a REAL job some where else or I have a life to live. So, why should I spent that much time on watching the market?? In fact, if I CANNOT go to sleep for 5 years and be comfortable about what I am investing, I am doing something wrong.

I LOST 50% of my life saving learning this lesson. I ONLY invest on ONE managed mutual fund. The rest on index funds.

http://finance.yahoo.com/q?s=VWELX

VANGUARD WELLINGTON INCOME FUND

It existed since 1930. It is the OLDEST mutual fund. No load and annual fee of 0.35%.

I only invest on ONE stock. And, that is because I used to work as supplier to that industry for a few years. I have sufficient knowledge to invest on that. But, still it is just play money.

So, I really do not understand the point of your thread?? Most people has neither the ability, willingness, or capability to speculate in stock market. They have a life to live. They have no business trying to beat fund manager or whatever.

Dreamer

Dreamer

Maybe he is trying to share insight so that everyone will stop falling into traps of other FM/investment traps... instead of trying to beat anyone in the forum. Maybe he means for good, maybe everyone can lower their guards and give him more room to tell us more about his ideas, maybe.

SS

This post has been edited by secretsquirrel: May 15 2009, 01:05 PM