QUOTE(hfi @ Feb 28 2009, 07:26 AM)
You are missing the point bro. They had Joe Cole, SWP and Duff as options and cover for the left flank alone. Yeah that can be seen as a little meh at first, but its far from that once you start listing out all the positions and the players competing for it. As you said earlier, its not about winning against a particular side but rather winning consistently against all the teams all season long. A league challenge is like a marathon, a long and slow race, the first most consistent runner reaching the finish line wins it. However, a team with 4 decent runners taking turns running at full capacity will finish the race much quicker against a team with a single or two exceptional runners. Basically, its all about quality of depth when it comes to challenging for the title. If Duff was losing form or gotten injured, they had the likes of Cole and SWP waiting to claim the position. Yes they're not world class but they are decent enough. That kind of quality in depth meant the competition for a place in the starting line up was fierce and players worked harder to impress. The more players and the higher the quality of the player competing for the same position, the higher it is the the standard of performance, focus and commitment generated from the players. So massive was Mourinho's squad that he practically 2 or more world class and decent players competing for each position on the starting 11. No teams in the league at that time had that kind of quality in depth as Chelsea did. Jose was literally spoiled with choices with team selection and i actually feel he didnt really need some of the those players he bought. He had the financial advantage, so why not buy players to deny his opponents the players they need to strengthen their teams. To make matter worse, Chelsea spending spree inflated the transfer market and made it almost impossible for cash stricken team such as ours to pursue targets.
A manager can only control certain things like the trainings, team tactics and subs but there are certain thing beyond his control such as injuries and form. You cant really prevent those from happening but if it happens and it always does, the manager can only rely on the depth of his squad to deal and minimize the damage.
To give you an exact opposite scenario to Jose, recall our our team in the year Jose took over Chelsea. Ever wonder why Rafa didnt straight away purchase a 20 mill winger and were reluctant years after even tho we could actually afford it ? Its because the team and depth needed to be urgently improved. The lacked of depth was evident when Rafa took over, the test of managerial ability started almost immediately when the team was struck with an injury crisis. We practically had zero depth to cope with it. Rafa had to rely on the fresh inexperienced Academy graduates who lacked both abilities and mentality to perform at senior level. We simply didnt have the team and depth to compete in all competitions, the league was destined to be won by Chelsea as they steamrolled teams unscathed. We were probably at the level of the current Villa team, maybe slightly worse. But when Jose was having a headache selecting his first team from a massive reserve, Rafa was having a nightmare coping with the injuries and his managerial ability was tested to limit in working out tactics and shuffling his first 11 from a severely depleted team roster.
Against all odds, we managed to get to the Carling Cup Final only to lost the game for unlucky own goal. Thats ok because we went on winning the CL with a team that was nowhere near as complete and lethal as Chelsea. Despite their sudden and uninspiring success in football, no one is going to remember that Chelsea team that. Because the year 2005 will always be remembered as the year a cracked Liverpool team marshaled by Rafa, bulldozed their way through the CL, beating the likes Juventus and Chelsea, reaching the final and overcoming a 3 goal deficit in perhaps the greatest comeback in European football. In just one year Rafa had his managerial ability tested to the limit and he not only survived it but actually overcame with a bang! He transcended the Liverpool team and made us believing again. This is why i feel Rafa is the better manager because he has proven to be a very capable manager, he is cunning and fears no one, witty yet modest, respectful and diplomatic, calm in crisis and a brilliant problem solver. What kind of inspiring feat has Jose achieved that really puts him above Rafa ? Did he transcend the Chelsea team? Was he really the real reason why Chelsea won those titles ? Reckon most managers wont have problem winning the league.

You got your point on Mourinho's success correlating with a huge Chelsea squad. I have my point on Mourinho being successful manager because he delivered trophies for Porto, Chelsea and maybe soon, Inter. You got your point about Rafa being THE man if given MORE time. I have my point about Rafa being a good manager for Liverpool at this time and season.
So, i dont think anyone is missing the point
Your last point is interesting. Looks like any manager could manage that Chelsea team and win the league. Looks like managing a huge bunch of stars and expensive players is a breeze because the players will know what to do and no real tactical acumen is needed. Looks like Roman Abrahamovic is a nice sugar daddy and there is no pressure to deliver anything. Jeeezz...Mourinho is one lucky fella isnt he?
So if Mourinho comes to a club like Liverpool, what really matters is to buy expensive players and make them stand in the line behind the likes of Torres, Gerrard, Skrtle so that they will be under pressure to perform and then we will automatically win the league? and because of that, Mourinho is guaranteed to fail because Liverpool dont have the financial resources? So we can count Jose out if the Liverpool job is available because he doesnt have what it takes to bring a team like Liverpool to push for the title? Or because he is an arrogant prick, who said some bad things about us and is just an overhyped self proclaimed special one with a huge bottle?
Having the likes of Duff and SWP covering your first 11 is good and i wont mind having such luxury with Liverpool. But its the 90 minutes, 11 vs 11 out there that bags the points. If not mistaken, Joe Cole went through a transformation and did well under Jose's management.
To me, over-rated is when the 2 US clowns tried to bring in Klinsmann, on the basis that he speaks English well and brought some excitement to Germany in World cup. That is over-rated or overhyped. Thank goodness it didnt materialised!
As much as I love Liverpool and consider the Istanbul comeback as THE match, I wont discredit what Jose and Chelsea done in the league. First season, new players and they dominated the league and were only stopped by 2 breathtaking semifinals in Europe (by us, and Rafa...

).
To summarize that Jose wont bring success to Liverpool because Liverpool is not Chelsea per se is taking away some credit to the man. I believe that the current Liverpool squad plus perhaps 1-2 clever buys (can be expensive but not necessarily sky rocket price) can be taken by someone like Mourinho to push for title.
Dalglish benefitted from having the $ to buy good players as a Liverpool manager and also from Jack Walker's millions during his Ewood Park days but still, he is a good manager.
But then, thing have changed since yesterday isnt it? Now it looks like Rafa will assume full control and sign the contract. hopefully, we will finish this season well, and prepare for next season. (wont say next season will be our season because the phrase is now becoming like a joke associated with us long suffering fans)
BTW, I am not a Chelsea fan or Rafa hater okay? This discussion is just what healthy forums does...talk about football and possibilities...cheers! IF you want to kutuk and ask why discuss over something so unrealistic (as in Rafa being replaced by Jose) I can understand. haha!

Added on February 28, 2009, 12:39 pmQUOTE(led_zep_freak @ Feb 28 2009, 12:14 PM)
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Ditto, great post!

In fact, a supposingly inferior manager Avram Grant brought the same team to the Carling Cup final (Lost at extra time), 2nd in league (2pts away) and the Champions League final (Lost by Terry's slip).
Makes you wonder where did Scolari gone wrong, eh?
wow, so Avram Grant is inferior? and he just drove the team bus to make sure the players reach their playing venue? Yes, he did inherited a great squad from Mourinho..(oh wait....from Abramovich millions) but surely, to achieve what he achieve only to be stopped by a rampant Ronaldo and MU team is not a bad performance at all. What did Liverpool achieve last season? So its still all due to Abramovich's millions eh? Poor Rafa..
yeah...where did Scolari gone wrong...Or maybe apa yang Mourinho buat betul?
This post has been edited by nando: Feb 28 2009, 12:53 PM