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 Professional engineer status

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TSkennykck
post Apr 10 2008, 11:14 PM, updated 15y ago

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Is it good/ worth the effort to become an Ir / professional engineer(manufacturing field) in Malaysia? What position can they hold inside a manufacturing plant?(Manager etc) Any opinion/advice regarding this (Ir) are welcome.
SUSSeLrAhC
post Apr 10 2008, 11:20 PM

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usually those who wants the status are in design or consultantcy... however i would suggest any engineer to go for it... no harm.. at least to show you are qualified enough in your field...

ermmm ... any position also can.. depending how much experience he have lor...
nkphnx
post Apr 10 2008, 11:24 PM

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Depends on what field you are in... If you are in a field that involves approving blueprints/plans like civil/electrical engineering, then Ir is mandatory for you. And if you are planning to venture into consultancy firms, you also need an Ir..

But for normal manufacturing plants, you don't need an Ir for a manager's position, but an MBA helps a lot. You basic salary might be a bit higher but you'll still start from the bottom as a first level engineer.. smile.gif


bysquashy
post Apr 10 2008, 11:25 PM

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QUOTE(kennykck @ Apr 10 2008, 11:14 PM)
Is it good/ worth the effort to become an Ir / professional engineer(manufacturing field) in Malaysia? What position can they hold inside a manufacturing plant?(Manager etc) Any opinion/advice regarding this (Ir) are welcome.
*
The suffix IR derives from the word Ingenieur (Dutch: Master of Science)

IR only has value in Malaysia. If you are out of the country, the value is near to zero.
cyrixMII300
post Apr 10 2008, 11:27 PM

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an IR or even PE is surely a good thing to have especially if you intend to pursue a career in design or consultancy like others have mentioned. however, it is not the be all. bear in mind though that being a PE or IR lends more credence to your abilities as an engineer since it is based on a peer review system.

whichever your decision is on this matter, make sure you at the least register with BEM and pursue your GE certification from IEM.


Added on April 10, 2008, 11:31 pm
QUOTE(bysquashy @ Apr 10 2008, 11:25 PM)
The suffix IR derives from the word Ingenieur (Dutch: Master of Science)

IR only has value in Malaysia. If you are out of the country, the value is near to zero.
*
what??? you have to be kidding... just for info, a registration with a professional body and as an extension of that certification as an IR is pretty much a requirement for some of the highest paying jobs in almost all parts of the world except perhaps Asia just as PMP certification is.

try to get a job with Shell, Technip, Foster Wheeler or any other major engineering company, the requirement of at least a PE is there.


This post has been edited by cyrixMII300: Apr 10 2008, 11:31 PM
izcuje
post Apr 10 2008, 11:34 PM

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if I'm not mistaken, the suffix IR has since been changed to ENGR.
Like what they mentioned managerial position may not benefit much from this title, but in a consultancy, one that holds the title is much sought after for print approvals.(thus holding a great amount of responsibility for the overall outcome of the project as well; think - MRR2 project blunder?!)

cyrixMII300
post Apr 10 2008, 11:37 PM

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as far as i know, IR still remains the same to mean Ingenieur even with the 5 international member bodies. i dont think there has been any change to that.

and yes, it does carry a very big responsibility. you have to be absolutely sure of what you are doing before you put ur name somewhere and thats why its a criteria for design approvals.
bysquashy
post Apr 10 2008, 11:43 PM

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QUOTE(cyrixMII300 @ Apr 10 2008, 11:27 PM)
an IR or even PE is surely a good thing to have especially if you intend to pursue a career in design or consultancy like others have mentioned. however, it is not the be all. bear in mind though that being a PE or IR lends more credence to your abilities as an engineer since it is based on a peer review system.

whichever your decision is on this matter, make sure you at the least register with BEM and pursue your GE certification from IEM.


Added on April 10, 2008, 11:31 pm

what??? you have to be kidding... just for info, a registration with a professional body and as an extension of that certification as an IR is pretty much a requirement for some of the highest paying jobs in almost all parts of the world except perhaps Asia just as PMP certification is.

try to get a job with Shell, Technip, Foster Wheeler or any other major engineering company, the requirement of at least a PE is there.
*
Nope, my friend joined Shell as an freshgrad without PE status.

IR from BEM/IEM (i pun confused which is which) is only recognized in Malaysia. Do you think Japan's Engineering Body will look at our IR and think that it's on par with theirs?
cyrixMII300
post Apr 10 2008, 11:54 PM

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i'd like to clarify what i had said earlier. you need a PE or an IR to approve designs. Fresh grads DO NOT approve dwgs. and in anycase, no engineer is allowed to practice engineering without first having registered with BEM. and no one can build anything without the approval of an IR or a body of PE.

as a side note by the way, ask 100 engineers working in any industry in malaysia if they are engineers they will say yes but ask BEM how many of them are, they would probably tell you 30 to 40 because thats how many bother to actually register.

yes japan will accept the IR certification from Malaysia and so would Europe and the rest of the world as a recognition but all of them require any foreign engineers working in their particular country to sit for and pass an exam which is designed to gauge their knowledge of local regulations only and not their abilities as an engineer.

Malaysian IEM is a charter organization of the international council and therefore Msian engineers need to do this. when and once Malaysia is accepted as full member then even this would not be required.
iDk
post Apr 11 2008, 12:05 AM


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As i know, Malaysia called it IR, USA called it PE, and so on with other countries will have their own title of professional engineer. Which mean if you are IR at Malaysia, and you go to USA, you cannot call yourself professional engineer unless you receive title from them. So basically IR only worth value in Malaysia. But again, you should compare the IR title with other professional certificate, i think those certificates are much more useful and help a lot in career.
cyrixMII300
post Apr 11 2008, 12:16 AM

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QUOTE(iDk @ Apr 11 2008, 12:05 AM)
As i know, Malaysia called it IR, USA called it PE, and so on with other countries will have their own title of professional engineer. Which mean if you are IR at Malaysia, and you go to USA, you cannot call yourself professional engineer unless you receive title from them. So basically IR only worth value in Malaysia. But again, you should compare the IR title with other professional certificate, i think those certificates are much more useful and help a lot in career.
*
try and read the following

http://www.engc.org.uk/news/default.aspx

http://www.engc.org.uk/international/about...E_register.aspx

http://www.engc.org.uk/international/inter...nal_bodies.aspx

http://www.ieagreements.com/APEC/

really i suggest one to read this before commenting further. IR is used internationally and as I have mentioned earlier you need to sit for qualification exams for certains charters.

we in europe at least need to be accredited as Eur IR before being able to work cross border across EU to approve designs. and having been in South America, I also know for a fact that IR is also the accreditation norm there although the enforcement is somewhat weak.

you are correct though about US and their accreditation system but then again americans dont adhere much to any of the engineering norms of the international bodies.

This post has been edited by cyrixMII300: Apr 11 2008, 12:20 AM
TSkennykck
post Apr 12 2008, 12:27 AM

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Will the IR status expired after a certain period? Meaning have to retake the examination again to obtain the status. Also, is it wise to go for chartered eng instead of IR (meaning is it really worth the effort? I know chartered eng exam is alot more toughter but higher status)
SUSSeLrAhC
post Apr 12 2008, 12:46 AM

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QUOTE(iDk @ Apr 11 2008, 12:05 AM)
As i know, Malaysia called it IR, USA called it PE, and so on with other countries will have their own title of professional engineer. Which mean if you are IR at Malaysia, and you go to USA, you cannot call yourself professional engineer unless you receive title from them. So basically IR only worth value in Malaysia. But again, you should compare the IR title with other professional certificate, i think those certificates are much more useful and help a lot in career.
*
no lar... PE means professional engineer... u put the Ir. in front of ur name fot title sake... zzzzzzzzz... you can put the Ir. in front of ur name when u r a PE...

US dont recognize any1's PE status... in the states, every single state have their own institution.. so it is diff there, eg if u have ur PE status from alaska you still can practice there.... visit ncees' website for more info

wherelse IMechE/IEEE UK & IAust recgonizes it but u need some interview to pratice...

QUOTE(kennykck @ Apr 12 2008, 12:27 AM)
Will the IR status expired after a certain period? Meaning have to retake the examination again to obtain the status. Also, is it wise to go for chartered eng instead of IR (meaning is it really worth the effort? I know chartered eng exam is alot more toughter but higher status)
*
nope... but you have to get enough CPD points/year to maintain it...

no... CEng in msian terms and also UK are for those that have difficulties getting an academic degree... therefore they sit exams set by the board to be certified... and no.. it is not higher status... if you look at those that got their CEng you will know...
iDk
post Apr 12 2008, 01:20 AM


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Added on April 12, 2008, 1:21 am
QUOTE(cyrixMII300 @ Apr 11 2008, 12:16 AM)
try and read the following

http://www.engc.org.uk/news/default.aspx

http://www.engc.org.uk/international/about...E_register.aspx

http://www.engc.org.uk/international/inter...nal_bodies.aspx

http://www.ieagreements.com/APEC/

really i suggest one to read this before commenting further. IR is used internationally and as I have mentioned earlier you need to sit for qualification exams for certains charters.

we in europe at least need to be accredited as Eur IR before being able to work cross border across EU to approve designs. and having been in South America, I also know for a fact that IR is also the accreditation norm there although the enforcement is somewhat weak.

you are correct though about US and their accreditation system but then again americans dont adhere much to any of the engineering norms of the international bodies.
*
I lazy to read those terms. Just put it the easy way for everyone to know.

To sum things for conclusion. If you are an IR in Malaysia, do you still IR or professional status in US or other countries without sitting any paper, interview or whatsoever program that country need? If no, then the IR in Malaysia can ONLY BE USE in Malaysia as easy as that! Dont tell need to wait for this and that, take this paper and that, no means no.

This post has been edited by iDk: Apr 12 2008, 01:31 AM
SUSSeLrAhC
post Apr 12 2008, 01:24 AM

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QUOTE(iDk @ Apr 12 2008, 01:20 AM)

Added on April 12, 2008, 1:21 am
I lazy to read those terms. Just put it the easy way for everyone to know.

To sum things for conclusion. If you are an IR in Malaysia, do you still IR or PE in US or other countries without sitting any paper, interview or whatsoever program that country need? If no, then the IR in Malaysia can ONLY BE USE in Malaysia as easy as that! Dont tell need to wait for this and that, take this paper and that, no means no.
*
depends on how u say 'use it'... if it is for approving designs then no country will recognize another countries' PE then because standard n laws are different from country to country... if u mean 'use it' for being a consultant and giving ideas... then you maybe 'use it' ... most of the time we talk a bout approving designs and consultation... approving stuff depends on government policies... wherelse recognition for consultation knowledge depends on the professional institution..
iDk
post Apr 12 2008, 01:26 AM


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QUOTE(SeLrAhC @ Apr 12 2008, 12:46 AM)
no lar... PE means professional engineer... u put the Ir. in front of ur name fot title sake... zzzzzzzzz... you can put the Ir. in front of ur name when u r a PE...

US dont recognize any1's PE status... in the states, every single state have their own institution.. so it is diff there, eg if u have ur PE status from alaska you still can practice there.... visit ncees' website for more info

wherelse IMechE/IEEE UK & IAust recgonizes it but u need some interview to pratice...
nope... but you have to get enough CPD points/year to maintain it...

no... CEng in msian terms and also UK are for those that have difficulties getting an academic degree... therefore they sit exams set by the board to be certified... and no.. it is not higher status... if you look at those that got their CEng you will know...
*
For your sake, what do they call professional engineer in U.S?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Professional_engineer


Added on April 12, 2008, 1:30 am
QUOTE(SeLrAhC @ Apr 12 2008, 01:24 AM)
depends on how u say 'use it'... if it is for approving designs then no country will recognize another countries' PE then because standard n laws are different from country to country... if u mean 'use it' for being a consultant and giving ideas... then you maybe 'use it' ... most of the time we talk a bout approving designs and consultation... approving stuff depends on government policies... wherelse recognition for consultation knowledge depends on the professional institution..
*
who would want to hire you as their consultant at the first place when the country dont ever recognize your status? So you are still trying to tell me the chicken same as duck?

This post has been edited by iDk: Apr 12 2008, 01:35 AM
SUSSeLrAhC
post Apr 12 2008, 01:42 AM

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QUOTE(iDk @ Apr 12 2008, 01:26 AM)
For your sake, what do they call professional engineer in U.S?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Professional_engineer
*
did u check the source... dont use wikipedia to source things not good.. use the source wikipedia uses... ncees website

if u talk title. they put P.E. there in their academic qualifications together with BSc/BEng...

in america there are diff steps to be a PE... 1st step is to be a FE.... dont tell me u go put FE in front of ur name meh... in the US it is more complicated as it differs from state to state... check out ncees' website for more info...

most US PEs dont usually put P.E. with their names... even if they do... they put it at the back of their names.. but that will be confused with their middle name... so they just ignore it..

eg
Cindi Christenson, P.E

http://www.ncees.org/licensure/licensing_b.../california.php


for msia...

Ir. Chow Kuai Toew
BEng (hons), Phd Eng., PEng.

not

PEng/PE. Chow Kuai Toew
BEng, Ir.

but some msian PE uses Engr. to know the diff check out IEM's website
ohserena
post Apr 12 2008, 04:47 PM

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I guess in the PE status is not important in manufacturing line and RND line. I don;t see any of my peers, manager or directors has it. They are mostly PHD or Master.
SUSSeLrAhC
post Apr 12 2008, 05:00 PM

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important or not doesnt matter... no harm getting it right? phds or masters are academic degrees...

getting extra recognition can only show how good you are ^^

u must be working in msia ^^
Umm
post Apr 12 2008, 10:54 PM

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usually the status as analyst, consultant, team-leader projects, manager, etc...an Ir / professional engineer can choose a lot of positions in company, depends on qualifications, skills, and how much experiences he have.

btw, good luck for u!

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