Raw Milk Vs. Pasteurized Milk
Categories
Health through Nutrition

This 1938 BMJ (British Medical Journal) is yet again destroy's the mistaken notion that pasteurized milk is safe when to the contrary it has been repeatedly shown that most diseases from milk are not from the raw milk (which in fact has curative factors in it) but form the sloppy and filthy handling during milking and subsequent handling. Both of which can be prevented today yet we choose not too.

Chris Gupta

Raw Milk Vs. Pasteurized Milk

From Armchair Science, London (April 1938)

There is no substitute for clean, raw milk as a food, so far as children are concerned. Science has not yet succeeded in providing, in the pasteurized variety, those essential qualities that are the only real foundation for a healthy child.

Unfortunately, many grossly distorted statements are current regarding our milk supply. If we are to believe the protagonists of the Pasteurization-of-all-milk-at-all costs Party, raw milk is as good, or rather as bad, as rat poison-although as the Minister of Agriculture recently stated, "the human race existed long before Pasteur was heard of."

The process of pasteurization was debated in the House of Commons and the suggestion made that no raw milk should be sold for human consumption. This would mean installation of expensive machinery by every supplier, and if it should become compulsory there is little doubt that many small firms would shut down and the business pass in the hands of a few big dealers.

If we are to be compelled to drink pasteurized milk, we should at least understand what pasteurization means. It set out to accomplish two things: Destruction of certain disease-carrying germs and the prevention of souring milk. These results are obtained by keeping the milk at a temperature of 145 degrees to 150 degrees F. for half an hour, at least, and then reducing the temperature to not more than 55 degrees F.

It is undoubtedly beneficial to destroy dangerous germs, but pasteurization does more than this-it kills off harmless and useful germs alike, and by subjecting the milk to high temperatures, destroys some nutritious constituents.

With regards to the prevention of souring; sour raw milk is very widely used. It is given to invalids, being easily digested, laxative in its properties, and not unpleasant to take. But, after pasteurization, the lactic acid bacilli are killed. The milk, in consequence, cannot become sour and quickly decomposes, while undesirable germs multiply very quickly.

Pasteurization's great claim to popularity is the widespread belief, fostered by its supporters, that tuberculosis in children is caused by the harmful germs found in raw milk. Scientists have examined and tested thousands of milk samples, and experiments have been carried out on hundreds of animals in regard to this problem of disease-carrying by milk. But the one vital fact that seems to have been completely missed is that it is CLEAN, raw milk that is wanted. If this can be guaranteed, no other form of food for children can, or should, be allowed to take its place.

Dirty milk, of course, is like any other form of impure food - a definite menace. But Certified Grade A Milk, produced under Government supervision and guaranteed absolutely clean, is available practically all over the country and is the dairy-farmer's answer to the pasturization zealots.

Recent figures published regarding the spread of tuberculosis by milk show, among other facts, that over a period of five years, during which time 70 children belonging to a special organization received a pint of raw milk daily. One case only of the disease occurred. During a similar period when pasteurized milk had been given, 14 cases were reported.
Besides destroying part of the vitamin C contained in raw milk and encouraging growth of harmful bacteria, pasteurization turns the sugar of milk, known as lactose, into beta-lactose - which is far more soluble and therefore more rapidly absorbed in the system, with the result that the child soon becomes hungry again.

Probably pasteurization's worst offence is that it makes insoluable the major part of the calcium contained in raw milk. This frequently leads to rickets, bad teeth, and nervous troubles, for sufficient calcium content is vital to children; and with the loss of phosphorus also associated with calcium, bone and breain formation suffer serious setbacks.

Pasteurization also destroys 20 percent of the iodine present in raw milk, causes constipation and generally takes from the milk its most vital qualities.

In face of these facts-which are undeniable-what has the Pasteurization Party to say? Instead of compelling dealers to set up expensive machinery for turning raw milk into something that is definitely not what it sets out to be - a nutritious, health giving food - let them pass legislation making the dairy-farmers produce clean, raw milk - that is milk pure to drink with all its constituents unaltered.

The above was published in Magazine Digest - June 1938
Armchair Science is a British Medical Journal

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Added on March 26, 2008, 6:14 pmMilk and vascular disease
Categories
Health

Milk has acquired a bad reputation. Many are intolerant or even allergic to milk, yet it seems that not milk itself may be to blame but the way we treat milk, "sanitizing" it by pasteurization, making it more durable by homogenization. Both these processes alter the chemical and physical properties of milk and make it less nutritious, harder to digest, and some say - even dangerous to our health.

Of course real raw milk cannot be shipped over long distances and cannot be kept for any length of time. It does tend to turn into sour milk, cottage cheese and other very edible things, but that's not really what our agro industrial food supply chain wants.

Things must keep and they must be able to be shipped - oh really? and our health?

HOMOGENISED MILK COULD KILL


According to statistics 50% of New Zealanders die from heart disease, 25% from cancer and 5% from diabetes.
Research has shown that the epidemic of hardening of the arteries (which leads to more deaths annually than cancer) is directly attributable to homogenized milk.

For more than 20 years Kurt A. Oster, MD, chief of cardiology emeritus at Park City Hospital, Bridgeport, Connecticut, has gathered evidence that provides a conclusive biochemical explanation for atherosclerosis (a form of arteriosclerosis, plaque clogging arteries). The culprit turns out to be the process of homogenisation, introduced to the dairy industry in 1932 as a means of improving marketing for products.

Homogenisation merely prevents the cream from separating from the milk. This is primarily cosmetic. It does nothing to enhance the quality of the milk. But according to Dr. Oster's findings, it does a great deal to improve marketability - at the expense of human life.

FRAGMENTED

Homogenisation causes the fat globules in whole milk to be fragmented into tiny, tight molecules that will not regroup. Not only do these intense molecules of fat refuse to regroup, they also resist digestion and manage to enter the bloodstream unaltered -which is one reason why so many people are allergic to milk. "Milk fat contains a substance called xanthine oxidase (XO). When milk is not homogenized both the fat and the XO are digested in the stomach and small intestine into smaller molecules, which are either used or excreted from the body. Homogenisation allows some of the XO to pass into the bloodstream intact" Oster reported.

XO is found in the liver of many animals, and humans, where it has a specific function: that of breaking purine compounds down into uric acid, a waste product. "When foreign XO, such as that from cow's milk, enters the bloodstream it creates havoc by attacking specific targets within the artery walls," Oster's report said.

The "specific target" within the arteries is called plasmologen, a tissue making up 30 percent of human heart muscle and artery wall cells. Plasmologen's presence is vital for the integrity of the outer cell membrane analogous to the way mortar holds bricks together in a wall. .

ARTERIES CALCIFIED

The direct attacks by foreign XO, Oster's research indicates, cause lesions within artery walls and the body's marvellous protective mechanisms respond to the damage by scarring and laying down calcified plaques.

"The simple thickening and hardening of the arteries is known as arteriosclerosis, whereas atherosclerosis is characterized by the additional accumulation of cholesterol and fatty deposits laid down adjacent to scars and plaques" Oster said. "Gradually, the artery wall thickens, obstructing the flow of blood. Arteries lose their elasticity in the later stages of the disease as additional calcium is deposited. Calcification of the arteries can contribute to high blood pressure which is actually not a disease in itself. High blood pressure is merely a symptom" Oster said.

The assault of XO on the artery walls has been further documented by autopsies performed on patients who died from heart and circulatory disease, Oster and Ross reported. "It has been found that plasmologen was completely missing in artery wall lesions and plaques, and the mystery was solved when researchers found XO in the plaques. The two substances cannot coexist" Oster said.

ORGANICS

In Rachel Carson's classic book "Silent Spring" the author warned us of the dangers of man-made pesticides. Rachel described how chemicals contaminate our environment and also accumulate in our bodies. Since then studies of human breast milk and body fat have confirmed her writings. Human beings in such remote areas as Canada's far northern Baffin Island now carry traces of persistent chemicals in their bodies, including such notorious compounds as PCB's, DDT and dioxin Even worse, in the womb through breast milk, mothers pass this chemical legacy on to the next generation.

After doing animal and human studies research scientists now link our exposure to man-made chemicals as having the following effects - low sperm count, infertility, hormonally triggered human cancers such as those of the breast and prostate gland, neurological disorders in children such as hyperactivity and deficits in attention and reproductive problems in wildlife

DPT the PCB's (poly chlorinated biphenyls) and dioxin are the most discussed, in terms of hormone disrupting chemicals These chemicals mimic estrogen but differ from plant oestrogen in that the body is able to break down plant oestrogen and excrete it. Unfortunately the man-made compounds resist normal breakdown and accumulate in the body, exposing humans and animals to low level but long term exposure. This chronic hormone exposure is unprecedented and some portion of the population is bound to be sensitive with infertility for example a prospect

Dairy Farmers are notorious for using huge amounts of chemical nitrogen, hormones and glyphosate. These are all known to be cancer causing agents. Queensland cancer research suggests 1 in 3 people will get cancer in their lifetime. 15,544 people were diagnosed with the disease in 1998. 6,075 died from the disease

Leading dietary therapist Kathryn Alexander, recently said "my patients don't recover unless they eat organically, regardless of whether they are eating meat or eating vegetables. If my patients can't get organic food, I can't treat them".

THE FACTS ABOUT PASTEURISATION

Raw milk has good and bad bacteria. The good bacteria are an inbuilt inhibitor to the bad bacteria. This is why raw milk lasts longer in the open than pasteurised milk. Once processed milk is open the bad bacteria flood in. Pasteurisation changes the calcium into an insoluble form which cannot be absorbed by animals or humans. More and more children and women are suffering from lack of calcium.

The Lee Foundation for Nutritional research say pasteurisation destroys vitamin A, it destroys about 38% of the vitamin B complex, and about 50% of the Vitamin C in milk.

Scientific investigations have shown that an anti cancer protective element is contained in raw milk but destroyed in pasteurisation. The enzymes in raw milk are either destroyed or altered in the pasteurisation process. Raw milk was sold door to door in Queensland unti11989, about eleven years ago. And calves will die if fed pasteurised milk as their normal diet. Pups and kittens grow much healthier if fed organic raw milk.

This post has been edited by 4Rings: Mar 26 2008, 06:14 PM

Drinks RAW milk is much better for health.....rather than packed one.....

So...I have to search for a REAL ladies for raw milk....I mean...cows to maintain healthy....

This post has been edited by Gamatatsu0207: Mar 26 2008, 06:37 PM

That's the main point that i saw from the whole bla... bla...

So basically drinking processed milk is bad? or in other word "homogenised" milk?

This is nothing new. The whole thing is covered up by milk industry.
Milk is one of the cause of many degenerative diseases.

Mama milk is the best.

Wiki Degenerative disease
But i dont see any milk involved...

And i don't think anyone here is allowed to drink mama milk anymore...

This post has been edited by squall3377: Mar 26 2008, 08:21 PM

The Case for Raw Milk
By Terri L. Saunders

Milk is the only substance specifically designed and prepared by nature as food. In her wisdom, nature populated the planet with species of animals that could provide an abundance of this nourishing elixir for humans. Antelope, reindeer, sheep, camels, goats, water buffalo, bison, zebras, yaks, oxen and cows have all served humans in this way.

Historians link human consumption of animal milk with the beginning of civilization, dating back at least 30,000 years. In fact, no state of civilization has ever arisen without the shepherding of pastoral animals and the use of their milk as food. The earliest human artifacts include vessels containing traces of milk residue. The ancient Egyptians and Hindus considered the bovine species to be sacred, elevating the cow to goddess status. The constellation Taurus, depicted as a bull, is home to the Pleiades and is noted by many cultures around the world as the origin of the human species.

Hippocrates, Galen and other ancient physicians used raw milk in the treatment of disease. As late as the 20th century, modern physicians prescribed the raw milk cure to their patients for treatment of most diseases. During the 1920's, Dr. J.E. Crewe of the Mayo Foundation used an exclusive diet of raw milk to cure Tuberculosis, high blood pressure, prostate disease, diabetes, kidney disease, chronic fatigue and obesity. Raw milk therapy is still successfully used today in German hospitals. There have even been reports of people living for decades on nothing but raw milk.

How is it that a food that could sustain our ancestors around the world for thousands of years is now presenting health problems for modern man? Before the beginning of the practice of pasteurization in the late 1800's, milk allergies were not an issue. In fact, prior to the 20th century, many of the degenerative diseases we have today did not exist.

In the early 1900's Canadian born dentist Dr. Weston Price noticed that the children of his patients had problems that their parents didn't have. He noticed an increase in tooth decay and what he called dental deformities such as crowded and crooked teeth. He also noticed that the condition of the teeth generally reflected overall health. He suspected that changes in nutrition were the cause and to prove this, he embarked on a journey around the world to research the diets of native populations that were untouched by modern society.

During his extensive travels in the 1930's and 40's he discovered 14 primitive groups that enjoyed superior health with no evidence of tooth decay or dental deformities. He also noticed the complete lack of degenerative conditions such as cancer and heart disease. Only when they ventured into "civilization" and the white man's diet did they develop these conditions. The traditional diets of these people consisted of raw or fermented raw animal foods including meats, eggs and dairy foods from grass-fed animals. They also ate raw organ meats and animal fats, insects, and smaller quantities of legumes and grains which were mostly fermented. Biological analysis of their foods showed that they were high in nutrients found in animal fats that were largely missing from the modern diet including vitamins A and D and a fat soluble nutrient that Price called Activator X that played an important role in mineral absorption. Notably, the foods that Price found to be the most health-giving are the same foods that the current medical establishment warns patients to avoid.

Widespread pasteurization came about around the same time that Price started noticing his patients' health problems. As big city living began to replace more rural lifestyles in the 1800's, cows were taken off their natural pasture land and corralled in inner city pens where they were given grain feed. Since the war of 1812 cut off the supply of whiskey from the West Indies, grain distilleries were built which produced a grain byproduct that could cheaply be fed to cows. This produced inferior quality milk which, combined with the filthy crowded conditions in which the cows were forced to live, created dairy products that were deficient in nutrients and laden with disease-causing microbes. Impure water and poor sanitation added to this bleak situation and tuberculosis reached epidemic levels. The infant mortality rate rose dramatically during the next several years, and it was thought that the milk was largely to blame. It seemed that pasteurization, a process by which the milk is heated to at least 161 degrees to kill pathogens, was the answer.

For awhile, some doctors fought to make certified raw healthy pasture-fed dairy available. However, in spite of a study that showed that children fed raw milk had more resistance to TB and less tooth decay than children fed pasteurized milk (Lancet, 1937), pasteurization of all dairy became mandatory in most states by the 1930's.

The commercial dairy industry and public health officials claim that pasteurization does not change the chemical composition, nutrient availability, taste or digestibility of raw milk, however an abundance of evidence proves otherwise. Raw milk from healthy pasture-fed cows has a rich array of essential nutrients including vitamins A, D, C, all of the B vitamins, calcium, magnesium, phosphorous, essential fatty acids and trace minerals. Pasteurization destroys up to 50% of these nutrients.

Cows fed on rapidly growing spring grass produce milk that contains high levels of beta carotene and five times the amount of CLA found in pasteurized milk. CLA is an essential fatty acid that has a strong anti-cancer effect and helps to maintain optimum weight. The "Price Factor X" is only found in raw grass-fed milk butterfat, fish eggs, and the organs and fats of animals. The beta-carotene in grass-fed raw dairy is most evident in butter that is a rich deep yellow color. Grain-fed cows produce a butter that looks white, so yellow coloring is added to it to make it appear more appetizing.

Raw dairy is rich in vital enzymes that enable us to digest the milk, including the enzyme lactase. Those who are lactose-intolerant and therefore "allergic" to milk, often find that they can drink raw milk without difficulty. In fact, the test for adequate pasteurization is the absence of any enzymes. Pasteurization also destroys the beneficial microflora such as lactobacillus acidophilus normally present in raw milk which are an important part of our immune system. Fermented dairy products such as yogurt and kefir produce even more enzymes and beneficial microflora which further enhance the digestibility and nutritive value of raw milk.

A 1999 study demonstrated that children who drink raw milk have fewer allergic skin problems and far less asthma than children who drink pasteurized milk. Research also proves that raw milk is superior to pasteurized milk in promoting growth and calcium absorption. Studies have even shown that baby calves fed pasteurized milk become sick and die before they reach maturity.

Unlike the cows that provide us with healthy organic, certified raw dairy, commercial confinement dairies keep cows in 4 ft by 6 ft stalls contained by metal bars that keep the cow in position for milking. There she stands, at times in up to 3 ft. of her own excrement, for her entire miserable existence which averages 42 months compared to 15 years for a cow on pasture.

Natural food for cows is green grass in spring, summer and fall, and green feed, silage, hay and root vegetables in winter. Commercial cows are fed an inferior diet of grains often laced with soy meal, cottonseed meal and chemicals. They are given antibiotics for frequent udder infections and growth hormones to increase milk production. In some cases, the carcinogenic genetically engineered bovine growth hormone is administered. Testing often shows commercial milk to be full of disease-causing microbes, so to protect the public it must be pasteurized.

Even so, pasteurization is not a guarantee of safety, since it does not always kill the commonly found bacteria for Johne's Disease which is suspected of causing Crohn's disease in humans. Ironically, all of the many cases of salmonella contaminated dairy have occurred in pasteurized milk. Raw milk contains lactic-acid producing bacteria that protect against pathogens. Frequent testing shows unsafe levels of disease-causing microbes are rarely if ever found in the milk of organically raised pasture-fed cows.

Homogenization is another man-made process that breaks down butterfat globules so they do not rise to the top. Studies link homogenized milk to heart disease. While whole milk, cheese and butter have been blamed for high cholesterol and heart disease, 10 major studies comparing consumption of cholesterol by heart disease patients and healthy people show no statistical differences. In fact, the heart disease groups had lower cholesterol. Despite this evidence, the medical community still tells their patients to drastically reduce their consumption of cholesterol and animal fats.

Butterfat has essential fatty acids that protect against disease and stimulate the immune system. Raw butter has been used successfully to help heal autism since it helps nourish and heal the leaky gut associated with this condition. In addition, butterfat helps to protect the nerve cells from demyelinization. The disinformation campaign of recent decades, has led to a marked increase in heart disease and other degenerative conditions since people began replacing healthy butterfat with margarine derived from unsaturated vegetable oils.

In spite of the overwhelming evidence of the safety and nutritive benefits of organically raised raw dairy, the commercial dairy industry and the politicians they support have successfully campaigned to outlaw or restrict the sale of raw dairy products in most states, and put thousands of independent dairy farmers out of business.

too long la macha! but its worth reading..lol

just drink soy milk...i heard is that the cow milk only suitable for calf only...not for human...

some vegetarianist will also encourage drink soy bean milk...

I'm drinking my prebedtime HL Milk and whey shake. My growing muscles seem to contradict this thread.
You guys know what? Sometimes too much reading can make people paranoid. There're even articles claiming multivites are bad for you. Geez, any good thing can be bad if taken in excess. Don't worry about it. HL milk = good. =)

Got Milk?

I find HL Milk taste very different from other milk brands.

Taste like vanilla, seems even more so when mix with Vanilla Whey Protein.

Too bad, my family don't buy those, they buy some other brand instead.

I am a milk lover, I eat a bowl of oatmeal with milk and tea with half a cup of fresh milk and a bit of sugar (Tea + milk = almost 500ml worth of liquid) every morning with the exception on weekend.

This sentence seems true enough... hmm....

But then again.... if this milk issue is true, then there should be some sort of "milk crisis" by now...

Heh. I'm not saying the OP is paranoid. Just sayin we should read every article with a grain of salt. Just because an article is lengthy and scientific sounding doesn't mean it's entirely accurate. Too many studies are based on meta-research and not the research itself.

look like i need to reduce HL milk redy

HL milk bad?
i especially like the ones with the added grains. nyam nyam, adds bulk to my man-boobies

Really? New flavour? Where?

As far as I know, HL Milk in Malaysia available in original, chocolate and banana currently. No multi-grain yet. But Singapore got strawberry already.

Zomg! I love strawberry! My whey is strawberry, if they had strawberry HL i'd get that too, then i'd have a double strawberry protein shake. *Smiles* ^^

Strawberry is available here~! I saw it at Carrefour Mid Valley when i bought my stocks there yesterday

Ooh.. It has arrive eh. Didn't know it cause Tesco (where I buy my groceries) has ceased to bring in HL and Vitagen products.
darklight79, your dream has come true!

Omg I luv you both! (No homo). Gonna check it out tomorrow. Ugh... time for bed, chest workout was a killer. 30 over sets.

=P

we know. brotherly love. *wink*

Your muscles grow because you are eating other foods plus whey, unless your are only drinking HL Milk then you may said that it contradicts this thread. Reading too much don't make one paranoid, it makes one wiser and more knowledgeable.

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Added on March 27, 2008, 5:57 amThe research done on commercial milk is nothing new. Ever since commercial milk was made available to public back in the early 1900, cardiovascular disease and other degenerative diseases were on the rise. Scientists then began to do their research and had since linked
pasteurized and homogenized milk as one of the source. You can check them out at the Medical Journal. There are probably hundreds of research done on that. I am in the complementary medicine industry long enough to learn about the truth of milk and its product. I was a hardcore believer and a consumer of commercial milk products just like you when I was a bodybuilder. I didn't believe all those carps advocate by the critics. I always think I was better because I was once a competitive bodybuilder.

Ever since I joined the complementary medicine industry and I have worked with many healthcare professionals, I learned more about the good and ugly side of food industry and the drug industry. You have to know the right people to get the right info. What you believe in may not be true.
The food and drug industry are very 'dirty' just like politics. Money is the main culprit.

I know people who work in milk companies and they don't even consume their products. I am not asking you to believe me. You are free to choose whatever you want to drink. A little more knowledge won't do any harm.
I am more open minded now. If someone tells me something which is believed to be good turns out to be bad, I would listen and do some research on that.

Another thing I would like share is Raw Milk vs Pasteurized Milk.
My brother in law used to buy HL Milk for his kids. His kids always had flu and cold problems. His son had eczema.
A friend recommended raw milk to my brother in law and he decided to try. After a few months, he noticed his kids had better immune system (no more flu and cold) and also his son eczema had gone.

I did try that on my daughter a few years ago. I noticed that she had better skin complexion.
My neighbour's son was on HL Milk and the kid always had flu. I asked my neighbour to try raw milk
and he is very happy with the results.

This post has been edited by 4Rings: Mar 27 2008, 05:57 AM

U know what, as much as the research goes, the scientists could be wrong. They're all humans too. Just like how everyone in the olden days thought that the world was flat.

4Rings, from now on I want to see you drink raw milk everyday. Do you?

This post has been edited by Iliveunderwater: Mar 27 2008, 12:38 PM

Drink HL milk...mix with whey..exercise...

Good dieting.


Wutz the problem? Been drinking HL milk once in awhile previously...now...its so damn expensive..I'm buying UHT skim milk like Fern Leaf or Dutch Lady depending on their price + stock.

HL is freaking expensive now.
From RM3.20 for 1 pack now its like what..RM4.20-RM4.60

madness

HL milk is my favourite
I almost consume 1 pack per day for last few weeks..Now reduce to 1 pack per 2 day lol , because I mix with whey.

OI
mahal lah....holy shit you seriously took 1 a day????

Nothing wrong with it. I also take 1 - 1.5 packs a day. Milk does the body good.

haha yea i dont mean its wrong

but for me..I feel its kinda expensive. I drink other brands nowadays...UHT ones...still low fat(or so they say)

but...still not 1 pack a day tho...at most also twice only...on my shaker...hhm...crap wat was the measurement

10ounces? >.< more or less a CUP i think.

1 post protein shake. 1 pre bed protein shake(only on workout days)

This post has been edited by metalfreak: Mar 27 2008, 01:50 PM

Well, I take 500ml milk with a cup of oats and whey in the morning. Then if i have the time, same thing preworkout, and 500 ml more before bed with whey again.
On non workout days it's just 1 litre. Yes, the price is a killer, i'm one of those who felt the price hike keenly. I remember the good ol' days, RM4 per pack. =(

Ya, Seriously lol ~ Now scare already ..Need to watch my budget lol ~ Need to save some money for something else

I get it at The Giant , Tmn connaught lol .. Its RM 27.9 if im not mistaken , Kinda stable as my friend 90kg pull it but didnt fall down.. But at last he go and Swing , it slip out and he fall down lol

Note: I didnt put on the screw , just tighten it to the wall only .

Hehe I feel better to hear that . Darklight you are a milk freak then

1 HL milk is like RM4.20 on average

my UHT Low fat mil are like RM3.59~RM3.89 depending on which is cheaper. but only 2 brands so far.. Fern Leaf or Dutch Lady

=)

Yes I am. It's easier to go down than 10 eggs.

=P for me....the good old days were when HL Milk was ONLY RM3.20

haha

nevertheless =D whatever works now haha so far so good. =)

All my runnings for this upcoming 10KM run has really lowered my body fats...can't wait to start working out in a gym next week.

Hope can see more progress soon. but so far so good. hehe

How about UHT? Same dangerous as Pasteurized? Which 1 is better then?

Maybe it would be cheaper to rear a cow..

nice findings. is fresh milk same as raw milk?
if not, where to get this raw milk in malaysia?

would raw milk solve problems of lactose intolerance? (i dun think so tho...)

*Snicker* Good point.

Yeah you're rite. They are all wrong.

Raw milk taste good. I use to drink it until the seller stops selling. Probably ran out of cows.
1 small plastic bag cost $3. I mixed it with whey and shake it. Jolly good taste.

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Added on March 27, 2008, 5:31 pmFresh milk that is sold in the stores here are not fresh milk. I was told by Mat Sallehs. So they are different from raw milk.

Check your area if you see an Indian guy on bike selling milk. If don't have, you have to rear a cow.

I am not sure about lactose intolerance. Commercial milk regardless of liquid or powder form is lacking in enzymes that help to digest the lactose due to pasteurization process that destroyed it. Raw milk contains all the enzymes, vitamins and minerals which are present in milk.

This post has been edited by 4Rings: Mar 27 2008, 05:31 PM

i saw it somewhere that cow's milk can increase the chance to get prostate cancer(more than 6 servings per week; 1 liter equals 4 serving). After that, I start lower the consumption of milk.

Whether its true or not, I don't really care that much since I'll be only taking it until I achieve the body shape that I want.

Actually I don't think that theres food thats 100% healthy for our body ... Everything has pros and cons .. I think it applies to food too.

There are clinical studies linked to that. Those studies were on commercial milk consumption not on organic raw milk.

I've been hinting about this for ages, but it this is but a drop in the vast ocean of billiooooooooooon dollar pro-milk marketing.

You cannot win.

You might as well become a doctor, and reap the rich rewards of sick people coming to you for a pill, a cut or a dose of chemo to cure them of years and years of milk consumption. These people are everywhere (greedy docs and ignorant patients).

Tell them this and you earn zero dollars.

You are right about this.

so conclusion HL milk is bad for health O_O ?

Any good food consumed in excess, is bad. All a matter of degree.

yeah I gues not so.

haih, i have lactose intolerant so i takes 1 litre of soy milk everyday!

anyhow, chugging tons of milk for bb is still better than steroids right

Pretty sure you can take HL milk even if you're lactose intolerant, they break down the lactose into simple sugars, which is also why it's sweet.

For results regardless of side effects, steroids win. That's why athletes at the top of their game who need to step it up, use steroids and hgh.

Yea. I'm so lactose intolerant that if I take any other brand than HL, I'd be camping in the toilet the whole day.

And redline666, nothing can emulate or even come close to the anabolic properties of steroids. But the risks are simply not worth it.

I just bought 4 packs of UHT Dutch Lady

superrrrrrrrrrrr cheap for me at least.

Since I'm starting gym on Monday( i know i know..mentioned many times already..but I'm excited as hell......) ...will be taking whey more often i guess..especially pre bed. I get hungry around 10pm nowadays...


More muscle = More fat burning right?

I think my diet is pretty okay so I'm looking forward to see some results in afew months I hope

Dutch Lady Low Fat Milk RM3.35!

And of course... will continue to post journal updates and pls do correct me if i'm wrong

About lactose intolerance. i'm like that too.. but the bad part is even with HL milk, i'll still be camping in the toilet... milk is just not my thing -.-"

even worse is some protien shakes also can give me the same effect
so i have to think twice before trying another brand of protein.

Hmmm, I didn't know so many people are lactose intolerance though.....

What are the replacement for people who are lactose intolerance other than HL Milk?

Cheers

Soy milk I guess if you want milk, some butters, cheeses and yogurts are good to go but you'll have to check to be sure.

I would milk it...

Yogurt is the best. The lactose is predigested and a rich source of friendly bacteria.
Home made is recommended.

meh.. i take 1L of HL too on the day i workout. last week, it was my 1st time taking HL + BSN True Mass as a shake, somehow i think my stomach couldnt take it. then you know what happened after that..

HL milk ..
i tried 1 night drink 2 bottle..
direct detox me..
go to tandas..
ee

haha ... me too ... now take 500ML a day ... scare already

Soy milk is definitely quite nice.

Is there a difference between soya milk and soy milk?

I know there's a brand called Vitamilk (Not the Thailand ones) or something back in Australia. Unlike a lot of soy milk here, it's not sweet at all and also comes in chocolate and strawberry and even coffee. Very nice but quite pricey, so nice that I usually finish half of the 1.25 litres in less than half a day.

Soya and soy is the same.

Just go with no milk, there are other sources of calcium.

Soy can give you man boobs.

Hello, is Nespray & other milk powders considered raw or pasteurized milk?

Where can I get Raw Milk, other than the Farm?

Is our local Milk safe?

How bout goodday milk? i drink it every week.. almost 2 big cups a day..

I m quite dissapointed wif HL milk recently, it turn sour and got harden before the expiry date shown on the box. It happen to 2 boxes already, i wonder where can file a complaint for that.. Its really unethical to sell unfresh food to ppl.

Probably due to bad storage on the part of the retailer...You should complain at the place where you bought it or let the manufacturer know where you bought it if they refused to refund you.

Is the chocolate and strawberry flavour HL Milk any good (in taste)?

Is there a banana flavour milk as well? Haven't had those since I came back.....

I love chocolate and strawberry (except when it tastes like cough syrups)

Cheers

All commercial milks are pasteurized. The original form has to be pasteurized before spray dried into powder form.

Please scroll back for 2nd question.

Dunno, not tested.

Chocolate HL is decent, not as chocolatey as I'd like, a little on the sweetish side. If you're used to really chocolatey stuff, it'll probably not be up to par. Try it, only about 5$ for a 1L carton.

This post has been edited by malaysianPotato: Apr 2 2008, 06:37 PM

I ALWAYS unscrew the cap and take a sniff at it no matter what. It may attract some weird stares but after buying 10 packs from a hypermart once and all of them turned up spoilt, i'm not taking anymore chances.
But then the 7 Eleven outlet staff where i purchase milk regularly are used to my habits already. =)

Just bought 2 small carton of HL milk chocolate earleir from canteen.

Taste quite good (yum) , doesn't seem to be too sweet for me.

This will have to last me till 8 pm plus.

gawd! i never knew all of this...I have been drinking HL milk like mad because i cannot afford Whey T_T

it gives 5gm protein per 100 ml...dats a lott..... man...i cannot drink it anymore T_T

wht about the grain ones? are they HL too ??

The article originally posted isn't only about HL milk but all pasteurized milk in general. Powdered milk is pasteurized aswell.

Meaning all milk is dangerous right now? @_@"

What brand is considered raw milk in Malaysia?
I better buy the correct ones.... kinda getting the feel right now....
unless there is an article to prove that HL MILK BEING BAD is a Myth...

Milk protein is mainly casein. Casein clogs in our guts for hours. Casein is one of the main cause of milk protein allergy.
Pasteurization denatures certain % of the protein. Denatured protein has no use to our body.
Mother's milk is rich in whey protein. Our human gut is not designed to digest casein.
That's why whey protein is added to infant formula to balance the whey and casein composition.
Amino acids get into our blood stream within 1 hour after ingesting whey protein.
While casein is still clogging in your gut.

Some history on whey,

HL milk isn't bad, people get along fine drinking it.

The point of the article was to point out the benefits of raw milk, not to say that pasteurized milk was bad. Atleast that's how I see it. Cause if you look at it in a different way, alot of people don't even drink milk and their bones, teeth, w/e are just fine. They just eat well, exercise and get on with life.

If that's you, then drinking HL milk should be perfectly fine.

There are several sides to the story anyhow and if you want to make an educated decision you'll have to dig into it and read up.

i can't help noticing that the first journal article dated 1938, meaning its 70 years old already. even the subsequent articles are not new. there are many advances in the field of milk processing over the years as well. unless u can find me a newer article, preferable something within the last five years to make it more relevant to our current life, i'm sorry to say that i don't think that pasteurized milk is bad.

yes, casein can cause milk protein allergy, but this doesn't mean that its bad. Since cow milks are easy to get (i haven't heard of natural mama milk industry ), its no wonder casein are easily found too.

though whey have a higher bioavailability, its more expensive as well. rmbr, milk industry caters for the general population, not just the wealthies.

hl milk has 5g per 100ml (if i rmbr correctly), highest amongst the boxed milk. the choc taste is one of the best around too

for me, too much of a gud thing is bad. i rotate between soy milk and other milks on the shelf, a little something so that my gut wun get sick of the same o' milk

(sorry 4Rings, i dun mean to criticize the articles u got, but if caution towards pasteurize milk is to be made, let it be based on recent research. no hard feelings ya )

No problem felixlhy. I was just trying to share some info. Nutrition is like religion. Either you believe or you don't.

The first research was done in the early 1900. It still stands until today.
There are hundreds of clinical studies done since the 1st until now.
You may check from the medical journal. There are hundreds of references. I have forgotten the website. I used to do a lot of checking when I was involved in complementary medicine years ago. Any tom and harry in health industry knows about this topic.

As usual milk manufacturers will deny it. They will come up with 101 stories to back up their stand.

There is no problem drinking pasteurized milk. Even if it is that bad as claimed it won't kill you straight away. It may take many many years to get the side effects. As long as your immunity is still good you won't feel it now. This is what I was told. As for me I don't need milk. Adult don't need lactose. Adult is lacking in enzymes to digest the lactose particularly yellow skin ppl like Chinese.

I have plenty of whey. My whole family is drinking whey, my father, mother, wife, daughter, brother and sister. I import 1 ton of whey protein in every 2 months.

Dairy industry is a billion dollar industry. It is well supported by the government in their respective countries.
Every drop of milk is not wasted. Whey is a by-product of cheese making. Whey can be used to make whey protein concentrate and isolate.
The by-products of making whey protein are lactose and fats. Lactose is separated to make lactose powder. The fats can be used as fat solids or milk fat. Nothing is wasted.

Dairy manufacturers pay a lot to advertise their products. They also pay a lot to nutritionists to write good things about their products.
But they don't tell you about the bad things. The only good product made from milk is whey protein.
In recent years, there are many clinical studies on the health benefits of whey protein. Most are done by independent researchers.
Some of the studies are even patented. Not all whey proteins are created equal. Whey proteins are very complex. The processing method determines the quality.

This post has been edited by 4Rings: Apr 3 2008, 06:57 AM

you've just triggered my curiosity *miao*

i've always thought that whey, just like other proteins, helps the body to repair / build tissues but at a faster rate. that was until i found this:



hopefully i can find an article about pasteurized milk as well



bro, where did u get your whey supply? can you get them from the normal supermarkets? roughly how much is the cost?



I think this has something to do with the topic title

We buy direct from dairy manufacturers in US and NZ. The same manufacturers that produced pasteurized milk. We supply the raw mat to traders and local manufacturers. We also can get skim milk but we are not interested to sell this.
We supply the finished products to hardcore gyms in Klang Valley region (not all) and to complimentary and medical doctors as well.
We have 4 grades of whey proteins. Due to the increased in dairy products whey proteins are very costly now. There are no more stocks available in NZ and US now.

Our US whey are very expensive due to its medical quality. Doctors are using it for treatment of chronic diseases incl cancer.

About the price you can check my garage sales.

This post has been edited by 4Rings: Apr 3 2008, 09:09 AM

What's In Your Milk?: An Exposé of Industry and Government Cover-Up on the Dangers of the Genetically Engineered (rBGH) Milk You're Drinking (Paperback)

http://www.amazon.com/Whats-Your-Milk-Gove...07247685&sr=8-1

Also, try to research more on the casein cancer connection in "The China Study"


The China Study: The Most Comprehensive Study of Nutrition Ever Conducted and the Startling Implications for Diet, Weight Loss and Long-Term Health (Hardcover)

I see there's 403 customer reviews giving it 4.5 out of 5 stars.

HL Milk lovers will definitely refuse to accept the facts lol.
The scientists also human ma, they make mistakes too.

Then they'll reap what they sow.

Soy milk mix with whey how does it taste like?

Are those soya milk from Thailand which are very sweet good for health? I would think that they are riddled with sugar therefore high carbo....

Thanks.

Taste is very personal. One man 's apple is another man's poison.
The best soy milk is home made, free from preservative.
I would prefer to buy from the hawker who sell soy milk and taufufa.
Those are fresh soy milk. Bottled soy has preservatives.

homemade wif brown sugar or sugarless then tats wat i call good stuff. but currently i m consuming organic soy powder

I can't drink Soy Milk, even though my father sells homemade fresh soy milk. I just don't know why. I've tried with various combinations, and it still doesn't get into me. I really don't like the taste at all.

So far, I think I've tried Milo and Soya. Not good. Soya and syrup, not good. Still looking for the right combination. Because i would also think too much milk is also bad.

Btw, i'm drinking Dutch Lady Fresh Milk now.

Try soy milk in soft gel capsule.

This post has been edited by 4Rings: Apr 8 2008, 06:53 PM

hahaha. you got a good point there.

I think i might alternate milk and protein shakes. Sounds healthier that way.

LOL. same same!
back in primary school i used to camp in toilet after drinking Dutch Lady milk,
till i started in HL milk. i remembered all the weird flavor milks i tried goooey!
i seriously like mixing my cereals with loads of milk and i could use up 2 packets of milk in a day
now college already, everything on my own, milk also expensive
seriously, nothing wrong in drinking milk.
build up your bones and etc etc etc.
oh and i tried this fresh goat's milk.
uwek!

i still remember last time i bought HL for RM7.xx for a twin pack. that was like 1 year ago, now the twin pack offer is hard to find, and it's priced at RM8.

for a single pack, it's priced at RM4.90 and the store where i always purchase my milk is offering GOODDAY for Rm4.50. Normal price for GOODDAY is RM5.50, so temporarily i'm switching to GOODDAY. one thing good about GOODDAY is that it doesn't taste that sweet compared to HL