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News Ukraine army launches large assault on SE Ukraine, Probable probing attack on Russian lines

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ycs
post Jul 8 2023, 12:14 PM

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chaosneo
post Jul 8 2023, 01:21 PM

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the legality depends, as much as i don't agree on its used.
both sides have been using it based on CNN report and Ukraine has been using one from Turkish origin.

i unable to find it that its usage is a war crime or illegal through google and these two countries are nor a signee of anti cluster munition, so there is there and that. 🤷

it is a war crime if you used any munitions against civilian targets.

QUOTE(countingcrows @ Jul 8 2023, 11:50 AM)
The use of cluster bombs is only illegal and a war crime when Russia uses them.
If the US and NATO uses them, it's fine and necessary to defend democracy and fight evil Russia.


Jen Psaki
28 Feb 2022
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This post has been edited by chaosneo: Jul 8 2023, 01:22 PM
bengm2019
post Jul 8 2023, 01:23 PM

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QUOTE(ycs @ Jul 8 2023, 12:14 PM)
Haha.... Best thing on earth
TSMilitaryMadness
post Jul 8 2023, 01:24 PM

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Biden said it himself:


TSMilitaryMadness
post Jul 8 2023, 01:28 PM

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QUOTE(countingcrows @ Jul 8 2023, 11:50 AM)
The use of cluster bombs is only illegal and a war crime when Russia uses them.
If the US and NATO uses them, it's fine and necessary to defend democracy and fight evil Russia.
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countingcrows
post Jul 8 2023, 01:28 PM

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QUOTE(chaosneo @ Jul 8 2023, 01:21 PM)

it is a war crime if you used any munitions against civilian targets.
Oh I didn't realize that it's not illegal or a war crime if chemical/biological WMDs or cluster munitions were only used on military targets, and not civilians.

TSMilitaryMadness
post Jul 8 2023, 01:34 PM

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TSMilitaryMadness
post Jul 8 2023, 01:39 PM

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Fully armed Ka-52 Alligators take off for a night operation


TSMilitaryMadness
post Jul 8 2023, 01:44 PM

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Russian paratroopers storm a Ukrainian trench system and the aftermath


TSMilitaryMadness
post Jul 8 2023, 01:49 PM

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A Ukraine soldier's GoPro cam captures his own death

ohmy.gif

SiakapRM1000
post Jul 8 2023, 01:54 PM

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QUOTE(countingcrows @ Jul 8 2023, 12:06 AM)
RU 1,400 vs UA 1,500  confused.gif

Ukraine's Tank Numbers Now Equal Russia's – Analysis
6 July 2023

According to the Kiel Institute's Ukraine Support Tracker, Russia has lost over 2,000 of the 3,417 tanks which it used to invade Ukraine in February 2022.

Oryx estimates that the Russian army now has about 1,400 tanks remaining.

Ukraine in comparison has lost 550 of the 987 tanks it had at the start of the invasion and has managed to capture 545 Russian tanks, according to Oryx. Western allies have transferred 471 tanks to Kyiv, with an additional 286 expected to arrive soon.

In total, the Ukrainian Armed Forces are estimated to have approximately 1,500 tanks.
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WOW...1500 tanks, and Ukraine beg for 10-20 german leopard tanks.
countingcrows
post Jul 8 2023, 01:57 PM

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How cluster munitions work. 😮

chaosneo
post Jul 8 2023, 02:03 PM

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each of these are different category so don't lump them together.

i believe it is legal to use it on cluster munition bombs on military targets since there is no clause on international law or unless one is a signee of the convention of cluster munition but morally right or not, depends on countries view.

WMD is a whole different category.

i think biological weapon is listed under international law banned and enforced under UNSC.

QUOTE(countingcrows @ Jul 8 2023, 01:28 PM)
Oh I didn't realize that it's not illegal or a war crime if chemical/biological WMDs or cluster munitions were only used on military targets, and not civilians.
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This post has been edited by chaosneo: Jul 8 2023, 02:11 PM
chaosneo
post Jul 8 2023, 02:10 PM

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interestingly the end of the video they show the bodies, those looks like russian helmets and some like russia troops camo color.

the standard dull olive green helmet and none of troops have colorful blue/green tape around.

QUOTE(MilitaryMadness @ Jul 8 2023, 01:44 PM)
Russian paratroopers storm a Ukrainian trench system and the aftermath

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chaosneo
post Jul 8 2023, 02:19 PM

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well... i can see why russian forces are kind of worried. their multi trench defense lines will be greatly affected by this kind of weapon.

but i am bot sure how effective will this be on the current battlefield, so many videos showing russian trenches are usually defended by 5 to 15 troops that Ukrainian battle taxi of three usually overwhelmed it.

unlike WW1 and WW2 , those trenches are packed with tons of troops but then, that time no cluster weapons too.

QUOTE(countingcrows @ Jul 8 2023, 01:57 PM)
How cluster munitions work. 😮

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chaosneo
post Jul 8 2023, 02:24 PM

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comments got mention friendly fire with shouting of "ours ours"

just like this...

edit
that is one fu**ing angry russian soldier shouting with their own artillery raining on them.as well as tank fire from their own side. intel must have screw up some where. he requested for evac as many wounded and dead.



QUOTE(MilitaryMadness @ Jul 8 2023, 01:49 PM)
A Ukraine soldier's GoPro cam captures his own death

ohmy.gif
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This post has been edited by chaosneo: Jul 8 2023, 02:32 PM
countingcrows
post Jul 8 2023, 02:29 PM

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QUOTE(chaosneo @ Jul 8 2023, 02:19 PM)
well... i can see why russian forces are kind of worried. their multi trench defense lines will be greatly affected by this kind of weapon.
My only worry is Putin taking the high road, and not authorize mass use of cluster munitions against the AFU.
I reckon the use of cluster munitions by both sides will hasten the end of the war.
The sooner one side runs out of soldiers the better it is for everyone. biggrin.gif


19 Jun 2023
Ukrainian Gov has announced a full general mobilization for the entire territory of the Ukraine.
ALL men over 18 MUST report to the military recruitment office within 10 days, even if medically unfit.


Once these men are gone. The End. thumbup.gif C'est la Vie.

user posted image

This post has been edited by countingcrows: Jul 8 2023, 02:49 PM
countingcrows
post Jul 8 2023, 03:03 PM

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QUOTE(chaosneo @ Jul 8 2023, 02:24 PM)
edit
that is one fu**ing angry russian soldier shouting with their own artillery raining on them.as well as tank fire from their own side. intel must have screw up some where. he requested for evac as many wounded and dead.
UA propaganda to please its western audience since the counter offensive is going splendidly.
Intercepted comms. 🤣 If I could speak Russian, I could make one up in 5 mins.
chaosneo
post Jul 8 2023, 03:05 PM

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fact check:

QUOTE
The document circulating online was published on June 19, 2023, by authorities in Obolon, a district in Ukraine's capital, Kyiv. It does not call for a nationwide conscription but asks residents age 18 to 59 to confirm their military credentials and eligibility for military duty, as required per Zelensky's February 2022 general mobilization order.


https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.newsweek.c...1808672%3famp=1

for those who still wanna share fake news.


QUOTE(countingcrows @ Jul 8 2023, 02:29 PM)
My only worry is Putin taking the high road, and not authorize mass use of cluster munitions against the AFU.
I reckon the use of cluster munitions by both sides will hasten the end of the war.
The sooner one side runs out of soldiers the better it is for everyone.  biggrin.gif
19 Jun 2023
Ukrainian Gov has announced a full general mobilization for the entire territory of the Ukraine.
ALL men over 18 MUST report to the military recruitment office within 10 days, even if medically unfit.


Once these men are gone. The End.  thumbup.gif  C'est la Vie.

user posted image
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chaosneo
post Jul 8 2023, 03:07 PM

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i won't deny it could be a propaganda but i seen videos of russian soldiers declaring they been shell by their own before, so i believe it has a high possibility it happened.

QUOTE(countingcrows @ Jul 8 2023, 03:03 PM)
UA propaganda to please its western audience since the counter offensive is going splendidly.
Intercepted comms. 🤣 If I could speak Russian, I could make one up in 5 mins.
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