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News Ukraine army launches large assault on SE Ukraine, Probable probing attack on Russian lines

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chaosneo
post Jun 5 2023, 05:03 PM

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actually RuAF is not useless.
it just that both sides have layered air defense that is too risky for any aircraft to do ground support role.

i had hope the counter offensive has started but i doubt that it is, more like localized probing force.

we are talking about 9 bridages, prizgoshin said 72,000 soldiers.

edit: i assumed that we are talking about russia air force

QUOTE(takbodoh722 @ Jun 5 2023, 04:59 PM)
RuAF useless though. mainly arty fight.
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This post has been edited by chaosneo: Jun 5 2023, 05:03 PM
chaosneo
post Jun 5 2023, 05:09 PM

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i wonder how the russian military command is going to react if the flow of information is really bloating all the way to the top...

like what a probing force end up being confuse as a battalion level strike force, hence reinforcement is immediately deploy to there.


chaosneo
post Jun 5 2023, 05:15 PM

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yes it can but it be costly, military aircrafts are costly and take time to make, training capable pilots for it is a whole level of complications.

i think we can agree that on both sides, CAS is now relegated to drones units, cheaper, not much danger to operators, and easily replaced.


QUOTE(takbodoh722 @ Jun 5 2023, 05:09 PM)
layered AD can be penetrated. RuAF (yes, Russian) have a clear lack of CAS capability. more doctrinal than equipment issue.
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chaosneo
post Jun 5 2023, 05:19 PM

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lol don't look down on those...
they have been used extensively on both sides to a great degree of effectiveness.

QUOTE(azbro @ Jun 5 2023, 05:17 PM)
They invade using what?

DJI drones strap with DIY grenade is it?

Janji ada wayang to show.
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chaosneo
post Jun 5 2023, 05:49 PM

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this i agree.
a high ranking commander should not go near the front lines especially when your enemy has better intel than you.

QUOTE(MilitaryMadness @ Jun 5 2023, 05:44 PM)
Huh? wtf?

"Goddamit Gerasimov, you're the Chief-of-Staff of the Armed Forces, not a lieutenant!"
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chaosneo
post Jun 5 2023, 05:53 PM

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the town Neckushne is the one that the MRAP is heading to?
most likely recovered if what the russian telegram channels saying is true about capture of the town.

i wonder what is the actual losses?


chaosneo
post Jun 5 2023, 09:29 PM

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there is a lot if happenings across the frontline.
most of the reports are coming from russian telegram channels. almost all sections of the frontlines are active.

we can probably expect this week will be the most eventful.
chaosneo
post Jun 6 2023, 02:46 PM

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there is some discussion that this is done by russian side.

Ukraine lacks amphibious ability to transport large troops across the river without getting blown and shot at.

any.large scale offensive will be likely through land and this incident will make the land area available even more narrow to reach Crimea.

but could be due to mismanagement and damage from last year explosion.
the damn was reported to be very full at the time of breaking and locals so far did not report any explosion or loud sound.




QUOTE(MilitaryMadness @ Jun 6 2023, 02:41 PM)
Possible effect of the destroyed dam:

1) Flooding of Russian initial defensive lines and minefileds near the river areas downstream

2) Drop in water supply to Crimea via the Crimean canal

3) May disrupt inflow of reactor coolant water to Zhaporizhia nuclear powerplant

4) More frequent disturbances to regional power grid and brownouts

5) Drop in water level upstream, easier for Ukraine to do amphibious invasion across the Dniepr?

hmm.gif
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This post has been edited by chaosneo: Jun 6 2023, 02:51 PM
chaosneo
post Jun 6 2023, 03:32 PM

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this is just me but i think the ability to disrupt, slow down, affect Ukrainian counter offensive, especially towards Crimea, take precedence over trenches, dragon teeth, and especially lack of manpower to defend them.

plus having less lands to defend means it will be more consolidated than having a bigger frontline.

this is just my logic, i could be wrong and maybe the Ukrainians did have a lot of means to cross river.

just to add Crimea use to have no water from canals until Feb 2022 so not so critical.

i am surprised no video of the dam at the point of breaking comes out, usually these videos are very quickly posted.




QUOTE(MilitaryMadness @ Jun 6 2023, 02:55 PM)
Russia already control the dam and the water locks tho. If they want to do something like that it would probably be in a controlled manner, not by blowing the dam.

Plus according to topography maps, the Russian side of the river is lower in elevation so flooding would affect the Russian defence line more, which the Russians have invested considerable time preparing up to now.

This would also reduce flow to the Crimean canal which was blocked by Ukraine in 2014 and was recently restored by Russia.

As I stated above, Russia has a lot more to lose in the destruction of the dam.
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chaosneo
post Jun 6 2023, 03:37 PM

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even before the dam exploded it be unlikely as Ukrainian have no able to shown they are capable of large river crossing operations.

and if send trickle of troops across at one time, it probably be a suicide mission.

edit.
but i think this dam flooding is a bane to both sides.

This post has been edited by chaosneo: Jun 6 2023, 03:37 PM
chaosneo
post Jun 8 2023, 08:36 AM

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Forbes has an article also mention no where the main force is seen, so far majority of the battles conducted across all the frontlines are IFV and/or 1 or 2 tanks.

as if waiting and prodding for a breach.

edit
i wonder where is the main force. you cannot really hide tons of tanks and vehicles from satellite 🛰️

QUOTE(MilitaryMadness @ Jun 8 2023, 08:32 AM)
Russian sources say Ukraine army currently heavily attacking Melitopol region with an estimated force of 14 brigades with 90 tanks and 18k+ infantry!

ohmy.gif
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This post has been edited by chaosneo: Jun 8 2023, 08:43 AM
chaosneo
post Jun 8 2023, 08:37 AM

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you guys make your own conclusion.





This post has been edited by chaosneo: Jun 8 2023, 08:46 AM
chaosneo
post Jun 8 2023, 09:08 AM

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in my humble opinion,

65% land grab
- resources rich regions.
- bring back glory of soviet era.

15% NATO deterrent (failed badly as how Finland is now next door NATO)
- buffer states between russia and NATO. as russia has been invaded many times through history.
- creating a vassal state in Ukraine like belarus.

15% secure land bridge for Crimea.
- also securing the entire northern area of black sea.
- security for the naval port Sevastopol.

1% denazification
1% defending russian natives outside of russia (LRP/DPR)
1% defending russian language
1% chemical weapons
1% etc etc

QUOTE(M4A1 @ Jun 8 2023, 08:46 AM)
actually end of the day what does russia want from this war?

land grab ?
change ukraine govt?
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This post has been edited by chaosneo: Jun 8 2023, 09:09 AM
chaosneo
post Jun 8 2023, 05:49 PM

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just be patience,
no offensive against a peer to peer will not incur losses.

it would be naive to expect that Ukrainian probing attacks won't incur losses but the good thing is, some of these probing attacks actually broke through and capture territory as claim on russian telegram channels.

while Ukrainian is in tight OPSEC and the russian media is ablaze with panic, we probably see some changes by end of this week.


QUOTE(arubin @ Jun 8 2023, 05:36 PM)
Russia reports that they destroyed 4 Bradleys before any even arrived in Ukraine.

You listen to Russian war reports, you bodo tahap gaban.
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chaosneo
post Jun 8 2023, 05:55 PM

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as well as people who post from sources who has history of using fake or edited images.

QUOTE(MilitaryMadness @ Jun 8 2023, 05:52 PM)
Again, this war totally broke my trust of people on socmed drawing large arrows on maps
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chaosneo
post Jun 8 2023, 11:12 PM

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i don't doubt the losses but the progress as i seen in a pattern across other media seems to indicate differently with a few towns under occupied by russia issue immediate evacuation orders and civilians reporting sounds of fighting getting close.

but we shall see...
chaosneo
post Jun 9 2023, 01:49 PM

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the commander for one of the sectors


chaosneo
post Jun 9 2023, 01:52 PM

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QUOTE(angelgemini @ Jun 9 2023, 09:59 AM)
every day says major offensive.
are they have enough weapons or supplies?
probably not. so the US should really supplied more.

just more of a Guerrilla war rather than a major offensive.
i hope that is what russia thinks too.

Does Ukraine have enough male to have a major offensive?
a population of 40 million can fight a long time even if one quarter are of conscription age.

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chaosneo
post Jun 9 2023, 02:40 PM

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this is the question.
how large is considered large?

and no way we can ascertain the losses but one thing we can ascertain is the ferocious of the battle across the few concentration point is especially strong.

there is day battles as well as reportedly night battles as well.


QUOTE(MilitaryMadness @ Jun 9 2023, 02:26 PM)
I wonder how long Ukraine is gonna continue these 'probing attacks' in light of the apparently large losses of its units.

If they are looking for weaknesses in the Russian lines, I don't think they've found any yet.
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chaosneo
post Jun 9 2023, 03:20 PM

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you are right there.

so far i see one? three? leopard tanks. if i am not wrong, they should have a few dozens and is the challengers arrived in Ukraine yet?
based on this, i think UA is still holding its main force and still prodding.

and the three layer defense lines, i think it is especially challenging for any kind of offensive, not to mention by military doctrine, offensive force will take a 3 to 1 casualty rate on average. we shall see if they will manage to reach the first defensive line though i read unconfirmed reports that some section they reach the first defensive lines and also second, but fail to hold onto the second defensive line.

all these reports are from russian milbloggers, UA keeping OPSEC very tight and not willing to divulge anything on operational level.


QUOTE(MilitaryMadness @ Jun 9 2023, 02:53 PM)
I have heard many people say the offensive will truly begin when western armor gets involved. I think we're past that stage.

Also the fact remains that the Russians have constructed three belts of defensive lines that Ukraine need to break. I don't think they even reached the first defensive line proper, all the fighting is currently on the grey zone screening line.
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