My Avanza Front camber bolts were supplied and installed by this Kim Heng Tyre Service SS14/1 some 6-8 years ago, no problem till todate and are still in use.

Did wheel alignment over there too, not aware of any dis-satisfaction with their service thus far.

@speedy3210 is probably well versed with some tyre shops in Subang Jaya/USJ too?

This post has been edited by zeng: Aug 25 2021, 02:49 PM

Hi bro, thank you for sharing your experience with Kim Heng (Subang Jaya) and Kee Hin (Jalan Klang Lama) for the benefit of the readers here.

It appears to me your usual go-to tyreman could well be a 'hard to find' knowledgeable alignment guy around in the market.

Besides adjusting alignment angles according to reading your tyre wear patterns, can he mods and makes alignment adjustment to Rear cambers and toes of a fixed live axle (like Avanza) and/or rear torsion beams (like prius) or could he recommends one who can undertake such mods (as Toyota factory does not provide for Rear camber/toes adjustment) ?

Mind sharing location of your usual go-to tyreman for the benefit of all, as I'm keen to check with him on the mods ?

This post has been edited by zeng: Aug 27 2021, 02:10 PM

Short answer: incorrect toe angles.CMIIMW.

Any computer print-out or phone camera picture on specific readings , including Rear alignment angles?
....... unlike alignment angle picture in Post #1 which is NOT complete,
without Rear alignment angle readings.


Mind sharing what car model is that?

I suppose your Front suspension is MacPherson type, just guessing.

What about rear suspension type?

Is it Independent suspension or non-Independent types?

If non-Independent, is it Rear live/dead/fixed axle type (like Avanza) or Rear Torsion beams (like -2015 Prius) or ...........???

2016-up Prius is NOT rear torsion beam type!

I know most owners do not know all the above details about their own cars...... and that's forgiven imo,
however at least provides Car models and Model Year..........
which would help (a lot of) other readers here to better understand your context and circumstances, and comment accordingly if need be.

Otherwise, most of us would be just blur blur......

This post has been edited by zeng: Aug 28 2021, 12:29 PM

All readings were in green and none in red colours?
Actually, being all green is NOT good enough.
Did any one of your Rear angle readings in red?
I ask because Factory most likely does not provide rear alignment angle adjustments for a Rear Torsion Beam design. After-market? Not sure.

This post has been edited by zeng: Aug 28 2021, 01:30 PM

You mean whilst driving straight ahead, I suppose?

Either way during testing do you:
a )let go steering wheel with both hands off OR,
b )either or both hand(s) has to 'hold tight' to the steering wheel?

Steering wheel off centre whilst driving straight ahead?

Pointing towards 11 o'clock (Left) or 1 o'clock direction (Right)?

This post has been edited by zeng: Aug 28 2021, 01:38 PM

That is why majority of car owners like us pay buta-buta for so-called the alignment service BUT end up with 'cannot pakai' or unsatisfactory alignment jobs including me, which is as good as NO alignment job was done.

This is part of my motivation in initiating this thread, so that we learn some knowledge and eventually make required 'demands' on those half-past-six alignment shops/tyreman scattering all over the towns.

Edit:
a )Is the car driving stable on straight highway fast speed, say around 110 km/hr or more?
b )and turning left and turning right equally firm and steady, or a bit nervous?

This post has been edited by zeng: Aug 28 2021, 01:57 PM

Assuming there is no suspension components being loose/faulty and absence of tyre conicity, most likely the Front and/or Rear toes are out.

Cambers may or may not be a problem.

In this scenario, one or more tyres (Front Left in particular) may get uneven tyre wear in times to come.

How severe? I don't know as we have no data points at the moment.

I went back to same shop for foc re-alignment rectification job (7-10 days after the first alignment job) as my Avanza drifts/veers towards left whilst driving straight ahead with both hands off the steering wheel, hence I suppose you could go back to your shop with the above description of problems with a view of getting a re-do at FOC.

To snap phone camera pictures, try stay nearby right in front of computer screen snapping pictures away as the re-alignment job is being done, come back here for clarification if need be.

If your current Front suspension strut does not come with adjustable eccentric bolts for Camber adjustment, you may consider getting the eccentric camber bolts set sorted out and do up the Front camber at one go.

See if you can snap Rear alignment angles as well, never mind it may not be Factory adjustable for now.

This post has been edited by zeng: Aug 28 2021, 05:44 PM

With new tyres in Front, you can rule out tyre conicity as a cause of your current predicament.

Having said that, the overlays of nylon ply and/or steel belts circumferencially as such during the factory manufacturing process itself could also be causing tyres pulling or drifting to one side whilst driving straight ahead.

However, this is very rare indeed but it still happens. Such 'problematic' new tyres installed at Rear axle could go undetected until that particular tyre is installed on either of Front tyre in days ahead.

Hence I personally do install two new tyres at Front axle and not Rear, for this possible but rare scenarios.

One really need not unnecessarily worry about the above scenario of new tyre 'problem', until and unless a near 'perfect' alignment of all 4 wheels have been achieved (and this is NOT easy to attain) .......
failing which contributes to the super majority of drifting/veering one side, off centre steering wheel etc phenomena.

This post has been edited by zeng: Aug 28 2021, 08:26 PM

On cars without Independent Rear Suspension systems (as most Asian cars are, which could be Rear Torsion Beam type or solid rear axle type) anyone has attempted on adjusting Rear cambers and/or Rear toes with 'parts' such as a shim like this or with any other 'methods' ?



Any recommendation of tyre shops and/or mechanics workshop in Klang Valley/Seremban/Malacca that can do rear camber and/or toe adjustment on cars with Rear torsion beam or solid axle well ?

Would like to consider this kind of service.

This post has been edited by zeng: Sep 27 2021, 07:25 PM

This is from Bandar Kinrara 5 Puchong, different from Post #2 Ah Man of Balakong.

Are they related ? IDK.

Why are you doing wheel alignment, if I may ask?

Uneven wear at front/rear, drifting to one side on straight ahead driving, steering wheel off-centre etc?

Share with us about your good/bad experience with this BK5 if any.

This post has been edited by zeng: Oct 9 2021, 07:20 AM

I only do tyre balancing ONCE throughout a tyre life when newly installed and I had not been doing any tyre rotation for like a decade or more.

All my current 2 pairs of XM2 (Front tyres about 75k kms and Rear tyres about 100k kms) are still at its original installed positions, though front tyres exhibit some uneven wear before Dec 2020 alignment as per post #1.

My car currently veers very slightly to the left when hands off the steering wheel during straight ahead driving after previous December 2020 alignment. Unlike previous position of accepting it as a matter of fact and make do with whatever I encounter, after initiating this thread some 10 months ago this time around I intend to re-do another alignment (not so soon yet though 12k km has lapsed) so that I can see with my own eyes actual Rear alignment angles (which I am ignorant of today) and hopefully an alignment shop can be found (which is hard to come by) to adjust my Avanza Front Cambers and Toes sort of 'exactly' to the value I want or 'insist' ......
as I come to realise now driving experience of whatever car one drives can be appreciably improved IF we get an 'ideal' set of alignment angles, never mind my Avanza with solid live axle has no Rear alignment adjustment capability.

Not sure your SUV comes with typical Preferred positive Front camber, which is not conducive for a little bit hard cornering you may want to consider reducing it to negative regime whatever factory specs.

Ah Man of Balakong adopts manual alignmenrt method, not sure about this Kinrara shop. I told myself to one day go for a Manual alignment method (Ah Man Balakong or Salak South guy) if and when several attempts by computer/laser methods fail to meet my requirement/satisfaction in several years to come.

This post has been edited by zeng: Oct 9 2021, 09:50 PM

Thank you Bro for your update/contribution on the 'background' of the Ah Man Kinrara whose chief has 18 years working experience under his belt in Balakong Branch.

This background gives me improved confidence on his skill levels and experience talks and by extension competence of Ah Man Kinrara but, who knows?

The test of the puddings is in the eating. Hence dirver feedbacks are appreciated for the benefits of other forumers in assessing the competence of a particular shop/alignment sifu.

By the way, what's the reason you think your car needs/requires a wheel alignment work .....
like pulling/veering to one side with straight ahead driving (temporarily hands off the steering wheel) or
feel nervous/unsteady or
hands must hold tight on steering wheels on straight driving, or
unpleasant/heavy turning effort or
unsteady cornering at relatively quick driving or
very sore eys/irritating with steering wheel cocked to one side? or
uneven tyre wear (in which corner) ? etc etc

Similarly after alignment now, do you encounter any of the above scenarios? Your driving experience/sensation resolved?

Note: By the way how much is the charges and how long a time it takes to do the (manual) job if you don't mind sharing with us?

This post has been edited by zeng: Oct 17 2021, 07:03 AM

Wow Bro, another Manual method alignment shop here.

M. B. stands for Benz ? And late Uncle Lim's Benzs all go there, must be good quality I suppose?

Ok, this reference is linked to Post #2 summary of alignment shops .....

and appreciate any good/bad feedback from MB Liew's customers .

This post has been edited by zeng: Oct 17 2021, 07:15 AM

I guess @NobodyII meant to say RM260 is the sum of Wheel Balancing at RM35 per tyre X 4 tyres and Wheel Alignment at RM120.

Would link suggested Autovest Service Centre to Post #2 summary of alignment shops and would you mind elaborating on his pricing, assuming you are very happy with his job?

This post has been edited by zeng: Oct 18 2021, 10:39 AM

Honestly, I don't know what's actually wrong with your wheels as the specific facts surrounding them are with you and unknown to all readers here.

By specific facts I meant to say additional infos like:

Readings of rear camber and toe alignment angles, whether or not they are adjustable from Factory or with aftermarket products;

your E90 suspension types (like Standard, or Performance or Sport etc)?

Is the Suspension lowered/not lowered? I guess not ?

Besides is it a 2WD aka RWD or AWD?

Tyre size too, to a certain extent seeing your Front toes may be displayed in mm(?), not in degrees/minutes.

All the above would influence actual Factory Alignment Specs (from BMW), which is not displayed in your print out through no fault of yours btw.

Anyway thank you for your upload of 'invaluable' print out and clarifying it being an E90 chassis, otherwise no meaningful or purposeful follow up comments/opinions can be had vs hot air/speculation talk.

If I may take a jab, the both Front Cambers and left LF toe are probably within Specs, but the Right Front RF toe being negative aka toe-out is out of specs, as per BMW IIRC.

On typical straight ahead driving scenario your E90 may drifts or veers to the Right (with hands temporarily off the steering wheel, CAUTION please). Care to provide feedback ?

Though Total front toes (is it 3.1 mm, ?) are within BMW Specs, however do monitor and look out for potential uneven outside edge wear on your Left Front LF tyre .... IDK.

Can you have a visual check, on RF tyre as well?

Do you need to exert greater input or effort on steering wheel during turning Right vs turning Left? I suppose you do?

Feedbacks from you would be appreciated for the general benefits of other readers here.

Other Sifus may have more spot on assessments/comments forthcoming.

CMIIMW.

Edit: For easier identification/reference and avoiding likely confusions among readers, it would be nice if Model Year and type (like saloon, coupe, 3xx i petrol/diesel etc) of vehicle are disclosed for readers' benefits.

This post has been edited by zeng: Oct 19 2021, 01:17 PM

That sounds strange (to me) whether a 'proper' 4 wheel alignment has actually been done in your case here.

E90 has stock Factory adjustments for both Rear Cambers and Rear Toes, as per youtube attached below:



With due respect, your Front After alignment report uploaded above does NOT suggest to me a 'proper' Rear Camber and Rear Toe balanced adjustments had been made in this 4 wheel alignment as you made known here.

Question:
Did you ever see with your own eyes the alignment tyreman actually went under the Rear Axle to inspect and actually spending some 10-20 minutes time with some spanners Adjusting the eccentric bolts for both Rear Camber Arms and Rear Tie rod Arms?



IF you don't, then that is not considered a 4 wheel alignment per se imho but a Thrust Line Alignment which meant different ways of doing wheel alignment.

Yes, your Left Front toe of 3.2 mm is about +00°17' (toe-in) and the Right Front toe of -0.1 mm is about -00°005' (toe-out). RF toe is numerically out of specs IINM.

Imho, if a real and proper Rear Camber and/or Rear toe adjustments (in this paid 4 wheel alignment) had actually been carried out then the Front After alignment values of this car may suggest tendency of car drifting/veering towards Right during straight ahead driving scenarios, if I may speculate.

Of course mechanical conditions of suspension system components and/or tyres conicities would have unknown influence as well on vehicle dynamics.

Just my 2 sen.

Note: Mind sharing with us the name of this Glenmarie alignment shop?

Edit: Add picture.

This post has been edited by zeng: Oct 22 2021, 09:46 AM

Oops, you have indicated the screenshot as Before alignment adjustment.

Please ignore previous comments that assume otherwise.


Instead of possible inside/outside edge wear on Left Front LF tyre, can't figure out why would Right Front RF tyre has relatively more severe (inside/outside edge?) wear than LF other than tyre rotation beings practised, unknown Before Rear cambers and toes angles and/or driving styles etc.

This post has been edited by zeng: Oct 22 2021, 10:12 AM

Whether or not Rear cambers and toes of a vehicle car is adjustable (for Rear Independent Suspension design) or
non-adjustable (for Rear Torsion Beam or solid live axle design),
it IS critically important to measure and display Rear cambers and toes in a typical 4-wheel Alignment or Thrust Line Alignment.
Front Wheel Alignment (as commonly practised locally in Malaysia) without any regards to Rear cambers and toes readings is a sure recipe for headaches or poor driving experience for local car owners imho.


Source: What Every Motorist Should Know About Wheel Alignment
by www.aa1car.com

This post has been edited by zeng: Oct 25 2021, 12:28 PM

During straight ahead driving/tracking a steering wheel points to left phenomenon usually means toes setting problems.

That is assuming during alignment process, the steering wheel was properly 'squared' by the shop.

I suppose you have to apply effort holding on to the steering wheel at ALL time whilst tracking straight ahead?

Does the car veers or drifts to left/right with hands temporarily off the steering wheel?

In the absence of alignment result screenshots, I would speculate your problem is not caused by camber angles, not suggesting these camber angles are perfectly set up here.

If it is under warranty, I suggest you go back for an foc re-do/re-work .....
otherwise look out for another shop, where a good one is hard to come by IME.

Edit: 2018 Saga vvt has a Rear Torsion Beam suspension design which is non-adjustable stock. This shop may have overlooked and not considered the Rear cambers and Rear toes in this alignment job and contribute to your current problem.

This post has been edited by zeng: Oct 27 2021, 10:18 PM

There is a limited number of wheel alignment shops listed in Post #2 in this thread, not sure about their quality or finishings though.

Balakong ??....

May be have a look at Ah Man who uses manual method and provide feedback here on how he fares?

Note: I too am personally looking out for a top class wheel alignment shop with good finishing and quality service at reasonable price, hopefully near Subang Jaya/PJ area.

This post has been edited by zeng: Dec 22 2021, 11:09 AM