Thanks for telling me bout this thread, as requested. But what a misleading title...

Re post ekspress - As I told you through PM, only the sim card was sent over as if send the whole package, then it cannot fit into the post ekspress envelope. Previous buyers can confirm this.

Re registeration - As I told you through PM, its the purchasers obligation to register the number. More so when my brother is a personal seller. And its always easy for digi to just say that the number has been activated before and like you said since they are THE owner of the number, they know better and you cannot dispute them. And what damages can you claim when its you obligation to get the number registered and digi is suppose to register it?

Re activation - As I told you through PM as well, the number has never been activated before. And I really dont know how to tell you about it again as both of you, babana and LittleMin, and probably all that doesn't trust me or my brother, will not believe that the number has not been activated before.

Re claim for damages, "its your problem" etc - I have explain all those to you through PM already. Its a genuine sale. If this is a fraud then we would have disappear already but what is the point of cheating RM160 and get all this swearing and angry feedback for?

Re termination- My brother found out that all the numbers has been terminated the day I reply to your PM telling you about it. Thats why I have stopped BUMPing the thread. And I know that no one will buy or ask already for the number already since all the bad comments left there in that thread. Plus the 'nice' swearing from LittleMin. Yes, I can close it and if I do close it now after all this, people might just 'oh see, scammed discover already and baru now wanna close after dispute thread opened". And i have told you as well that my brother also upset digi just simply terminate the rest of the numbers but if he do go to digi, digi might also tell him the same thing that they told you, that the numbers has been activated before and "sorry there is nothing they can do about it". I guess being a typical lowyet.net regulars, soon the digi selling thread will be full of swearing, accusations etc.

Re scammed - Like I told you through PM, what scammed is there? is there an intention to cheat you or LittleMin. Its a genuine sale and purchase. Not sold subject to registerablity, if there is such word. And I will say this again, cheating 160 and get all this in return, is it worth it? and who will be the next victim? Anyone can clarify?

Re "final reply" from me - Of coz it a final reply from me since you have decided to open this thread. Hence we continue here.

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Added on August 5, 2007, 4:19 amYou can sue through small claim court.

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Added on August 5, 2007, 4:20 amErm..value of the number? different people different view.. and is that the point here in this thread?

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Added on August 5, 2007, 4:23 amthanks for more swearing LittleMin. Like we need more of it here. It is just biz.

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Added on August 5, 2007, 4:25 amLike posted here in everyone of my brother selling thread, his name is Colin Robin and his number is 0168877400. Really wanna cheat, what for wanna give out all the real information?

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Added on August 5, 2007, 4:28 amWhat other information do you need? Thats not the reason why the monies are not refunded. Th reason why the money is not refunded has been given to you already. Everyone know right now that my nickname here is rene. And how many dealing have I done through lowyat.net? Countless. And like i said to the buyers of the digi numbers previously, we are from Sibu Sarawak. Yes, that's mobile number is my brother's mobile number and that account number is my brother's BSN account number.

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Added on August 5, 2007, 4:32 amHis phone number is inside all the selling thread i opened for him, if you spend wee bit of time to search for it and wee bit less time on swearing. Like we need more of that here. And yeah, call him at 3am til he answer so that those who call can waste some money and have nothing better to do.

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Added on August 5, 2007, 4:33 amSo did he conned these 2 people? how much he bought the number for is not the point whether he should refund the money isnt it?

This post has been edited by rene: Aug 5 2007, 04:33 AM

Err... firstly, I'm not the only one that is helping someone else to post a thread to sell something here in lowyat.net. So wanna speak bout breaking the rule, then implement it to every single seller.

secondly, its a digi number we are talking bout here and how to check whether its working or not is to activate it or call and ask. Activate definitely cannot activate to check coz if activate already if cannot sell within the 3 months validity period then have to reload everytime? and you know how fussy some buyer is here, activate already not new already cant sell that price bla bla bla... and second is to call digi and ask and unfortunately for both side, no one call to ask. my brother coz he really think that the number is a working number coz it will expire in 2008 and wanna sell before the expiry. and the buyer coz he or she wanna get the number. so no false representation is given to anyone.

and what do u mean by taking something out and say its new? and what bought it home and just realize? of coz only realize when try to activate. if know already cannot use and sell, that mean bro is cheating. so what fair and not fair? and why is it a seller fault and not digi's fault? coz its easier to launch a complain against the seller instead of digi??

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Added on August 6, 2007, 12:49 amWah.. you also very nice and come here and swear like nobody business. then the moderator must be the baka for opening this sub forum if the seller cannot use this forum to defend themselves. nice swearing as well and try swearing it to the "right" person and you will be 'dead'. nak tetak ape? get a death sentence for 105 or 55 bucks? fikirla sikit tu. what totally irresponsible is what when he did nothing wrong? know how to give bad comment only without giving any real positive suggestion... sheesh...

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Added on August 6, 2007, 12:55 amHey like i told most buyers or potential buyer before, my brother doesnt have internet access at home and if want to go online have to go to cc in town which is half hour away. and pc in cc there mostly still use window 98 and cant upload pics. i have internet access hence i help him to post. nothing wrong with that right?

And what dare or not dare? You want him to answer your call for what? Just beacuse you dare to call him and he didnt pick up? think bout it.

fortunately or unfortunately nothing like this have happen to me before and i cant share my personal experience here. but bro did kena con 25 bucks buying from lelong before and yes, its not much money and guess what, he was angry and nope, he didnt complain or get the person's account suspended. not coz he's stupid or whatever but he said what babana said to him, "hope that bloody seller enjoy using the 25 freaking bucks!" so yeah, more or less he said nevermind.

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Added on August 6, 2007, 12:57 amAnd well, not a challenge but if wanna report then go right ahead. Nothing to be scare of here coz bro know he is not wrong and didnt cheat anyone and I know he didnt cheat anyone. I said my piece. Its just a solution that is not acceptable to the buyers.

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Added on August 6, 2007, 12:59 amWhat is a TS anyway? And if like I said earlier, not a challenge but if wanna report then go right ahead coz my bro know he didnt do anything wrong and I know he didnt do anything wrong. And with little addition.. If do report, then please let me know.

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Added on August 6, 2007, 1:09 amHaiya, another reader that also only know how to give bad comment.

alamak, since when buying at a low price and selling at a higher price is a crime? and how many other sellers are doing it here? are you telling this to all of then as well? then no need to do biz la like that. buy harga factory sell harga factory... if like that where the word "untung" come from?? what for wanna use the word "untung" in the dictionary? even digi reatiler is doing it ler. all sim card have same fix price and they also sell premium number t a higher price. wrong kah? and the 0166666666 selling for 160k? what bout that price?

how about calling yourself selfish then? and yes i can put myself in the buyer's shoe and can you also put yourself in my bro's shoe? do genuine sale but kena with all these? is there a conning case here?

want money only pulak. if really want money then would have do what some real cheater do. sell some comp chips or something and run off with lotsa money. get 160 and get all these swearing? you want kah? think bout it ler...

and who r u to ask me how i survive in this world? you know me personally? i definitely dunno you personally but from the way you talk, with all the swearing and wishing someone dead, are you a good person yourself? any good religious people will wish death upon someone here? funny la you.

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Added on August 6, 2007, 1:14 amexplanation is explanation. long or short. yes i can just say, sorry no refund and go aheas and say whatever you wanna say. its not wrong to give explanation isnt it?

put urself in bro's shoe as well. he didnt activate and he didnt use the number. digi simply go and terminate. what he wanna do? he is a private seller and he dont do refund. its a genuine sale and thats why he unwilling to refund. if its a con case, i would be really glad to refund the money to you myself.

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Added on August 6, 2007, 1:21 amMy brother did get all the number from the same seller and thats why there is no reason why digi should terminate some and let some number go or for the buyer to accuse him of activating some numbers and not the other. and are you calling bro a cheat? if it is real that digi register then number already then there should be a record somewhere. there is the reason of registration. terminated on 01/07/07? and the buyer tried to register a week plus after that and digi cant give the buyer any particular and said number and any info deleted from the system at the end of july 07. what kinda answer is that? then what for gov wanna inplement the registration law? so that service provider can delete the info a week or a month after the expiry of the validity period? how can that be? isnt the registeration purpose is to keep track who the owner of the number is? thats y i said digi simply give an answer only.

and re polica report, if buyers do report then do let me know. maybe by then we can settle this once and for all and bro name can be cleared.

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Added on August 6, 2007, 1:23 amMy brother did get all the number from the same seller and thats why there is no reason why digi should terminate some and let some number go or for the buyer to accuse him of activating some numbers and not the other. and are you calling bro a cheat? if it is real that digi register then number already then there should be a record somewhere. there is the reason of registration. terminated on 01/07/07? and the buyer tried to register a week plus after that and digi cant give the buyer any particular and said number and any info deleted from the system at the end of july 07. what kinda answer is that? then what for gov wanna inplement the registration law? so that service provider can delete the info a week or a month after the expiry of the validity period? how can that be? isnt the registeration purpose is to keep track who the owner of the number is? thats y i said digi simply give an answer only.

and re polica report, if buyers do report then do let me know. maybe by then we can settle this once and for all and bro name can be cleared.

This post has been edited by rene: Aug 6 2007, 01:23 AM

how to compare a house and a number? how far fetch is that? house collapse coz building material bad, then thats negligence. of coz you can sue.. if can sue then happy la all developers...

you chose to read my reply as a challenge, where i am simply giving an explanations. choice of words are really up to you and you can choose not to swear and all but you did.

shot? then yeah, get a 20 years jail or death sentence for it. worth it? owning a gun itself is a big offence already. do you have one? I would definitely lodge a report, to my bro advantage too.. funny la you..

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Added on August 6, 2007, 1:32 amLike i said and this is the 4th time, if buyers do lodge a report then please letme know. And perhaph we can settle this once and for all and clear my bro's name. solution given and not accepted.

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Added on August 6, 2007, 1:35 amand babana, if you do go to digi center again, please ask them of the termination of valid numbers as well and why records were deleted from the system in such a short time.. my brother's name already given here. address is in sibu, sarawak. wanna fly there to tumbuk him? and what basis to ask bsn to freeze the account when there is no finsing of fraud case? wanna get sue kah?

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Added on August 6, 2007, 1:38 amThen does the buyer wanna go to sibu and find him? living in sibu is not a crime. and its really unfair for all those whose from sabah sarawak. its like you are saying, hey, people from east malaysia, very far away, anything happen then he is save coz we cannot touch him/her.

This post has been edited by rene: Aug 6 2007, 01:38 AM

Reply to your suggestions. Man, what a relieve! Yes, ask them why simply terminate people's number and just give a simple answer, sorry number activate before and we dont keep records. And i hope my bro hasnt throw away the starter kit pack.

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Added on August 6, 2007, 2:30 amIts not a reason its an explanation. What to do? Those who have traded with me before will know whether i'm honest or not. Its their choice whether they wanna trade with me or not from now on.

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Added on August 6, 2007, 2:32 amI said it before and i'll say it again, its not reason its an explanation. Unfortunately, you can say i'm wrong and I can say my bro is not wrong. I have said no refund unless someone can prove that there is an intention to cheat.

This post has been edited by rene: Aug 6 2007, 02:34 AM

I'm just repeating myself here. If anyone can prove there is an intention to cheat, then i am willing to refund.

Like I said to you before through PM, money is stil money whether its 25 or 105. If you wanna lodge a report, then like before, do let me know. And for tribunal to have jurisdiction, the action must taken against a manufacturer or an agent or a supplier, and bro is neither. but yeah you can always give it a try.

Numbers all gotten in 2006. Thats when he got me to post up the numbers. Impossible for numbers to be terminated in 2005. dont u think just so simple for digi? u bought in june 2007, digi said terminated in 2005. babana bought after 01/07/2007, number terminated on 01/07.

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Added on August 7, 2007, 7:31 amUnfortunately some store doesnt give you personal warranty and ask you to go straight to the manufacturer. So isnt it the same? when a private seller doesnt want to give personal warranty? Like I said, my bro doesnt know the number is inactivate already when he sold it. If he sold it knowing that its activate, i am very willing to refund the moey on his behalf. So there is a different whether he know with he doesnt know. And when bro sell the number and when I pass the buyers' particulars to my bro for nego and transaction purposes, both of us genuinely thought that the numbers are valid. so there is no question of we 'dont really know the condition of the sim card'. And yeah, with hind side, maybe should have put the reminder 'sold as it is' or 'buy at your own risk' but how sure are you that the buyers will not go down the same path as this, ie ask for refund and open a dispute thread. If the reminder can act as a shield for all sale, then I do advise all seller to put it up in their threads.

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Added on August 7, 2007, 7:37 amThe explanation is gave is the explanation that i know is correct. If i have to give an explanation that is acceptable to the people here, then what for la wanna have this subforum for seller to clarify things? its not the question of majority win here.

Like I said, my brother not going to pursue digi on the termination since he is not pursuing for the termination of his own unsold numbers. Wanna advise on making the police report? just go to balai nearest to you home and they will know what to right. But before you sign make sure you read the statement. You give false statement, I will get my bro (and if necessary myself too) to lodge a report against you too.

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Added on August 7, 2007, 7:42 amI'm not a guilty party here nor am my bro, guy. If I'm or my bro wrong that means I cheat or my bro cheat, I said already, I AM very willing to refund. And I repeat, if any of the buyer do lodge a report, let me know.

I know the consequences of defennding this, but when there is an ethics in biz there is also a principle in biz world. Why should we apologize when we are not cheating anyone? Just because we got the money in our pocket then we are the bad people here? Like I said before, its up to the others whether they wanna trade with me in the future. They trust me, they will continue to trade with me and my brother.

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Added on August 7, 2007, 7:45 amAnd its this a different story give to babana? babana was told by digi that the number is not in the system already and thats why its IMPOSSIBLE for him/her to get the number. I dunno how to cut the PM screen so I just quote what babana told me through PM:

"oh, n i forgot t tell u that i was informed by ms. radha of digi service centre in taipan usj subang jaya that the number is no longer in digi's system anymore. dats y they cant trace when it was activated, who activated it, how long was it used (if it was used) or any details pertaining to this line. it was totally deregistered on 1/7/07. meaning the number was activated probably in say...1/3/07. after 3 mths (90 days) idle, it is now totally barred, purged and deleted off the system. no one is using this number now."

now digi is telling a different story already. So how? isnt digi simply give answer only?

Answer to your question, numbers are new numbers unless stated otherwise in my thread. I did posted some activated numbers to sell before in the thread and if the numbers has been activated, then it will be stated in the thread.

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Added on August 7, 2007, 7:54 amI will reply to you tomorrow. its early there in m'sia, its late here... Or you can just read my other reply first. Probably my replies to the other comment are replies to you comments as well...

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Added on August 7, 2007, 8:00 amsince when digi is concerned about where someone got the number from and since when digi must look so surprise that a west malaysian is getting a east malaysian number. then what for give promo for one call one rate etc if all numbers not the same? i do wonder whether if my bro send over the sim pack and all, the number will suddenly become alive and kicking or digi will activate the number for you... and is the starter pack part of the activation process? or the inserting the card into a mobile phone the only way to activate the card? think about it since you said the sim card is not detached from the actual big card itself. And like i said before, my brother is not as determine as you to in pursuing the unsold numbers with digi. he's letting it go.

(edited by wK to fix up broken quotes)

This post has been edited by wKkaY: Aug 7 2007, 10:41 PM

Some people just like to curse.
some seller also sell as it is. and clothing, I check before buying. So no question of refund.

[quote=deathbringer,Aug 7 2007, 11:47 AM]just put it this way ppl....

seller might have inadvertently sold a useless simcard, but the main reason she doesn't want a refund (even after admitting that all her numbers were useless) is becoz of:

1) trying to cut loss for all those useless numbers with the one number she sold.
2) greed (RM105 might mean a lot to her)

those r the only reasons she would not even consider a refund. she keeps blabbing about making a genuine sale and it's not of her business after that and that it's Digi's fault.....those r only to distract from her real motives.

[/quote]

Knowledge only after selling, not before or when selling. Admission of uselessness doesnt mean admission to termination or activation of number. Doesn't want to refund coz not bro's fault number terminated. If explaining is blabling, then are you saying i should just shut up and just swalllow all the comments? Then explain why digi is giving different explanation everytime? digi is the service provider and has the right to terminate the number isnt it? So why blame bro if bro terminated when the number never activated before?

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Added on August 8, 2007, 6:50 am[quote=LittleMin,Aug 7 2007, 12:32 PM]
digi...digi...digi again...

U KEEP SAY IS DIGI'S PROBLEM~
OK DEN GIV ME MY NUMBER'S SIM PACK!!!

Of coz its digi. Bro doesnt has the right to terminate the number, does he? he's not the ditributor. You know by now the sim pack in dusbin somewhere already. You never ask for it before this so too bad la.

u dun giv me simpack i dun realli noe wanna how 2 settle wif digi....

yeah? digi need to see pack to settle? Cant just say sorry, throw already? sim pack is just the booklet and box only right.

dun wan waste time talk wif u anymore~
u jz keep tok kok onli~a bunches of excuses...

You look at it as excuses, I look at it as explanation.

now"ur bro dun wan pursue tis matter" tis excuse oso cum out ady....

That's what he said. So he is not pursuing the matter. Thats his view.

later u wil tell me my simpack kena dump ady~
Of coz dump la. If want say earlier. Keep box for what?

so wat more i can do??
yaya~its not ur wrong~its me n babana's wrong 2 bank in money 2 u n ur bro these 2 GREAT SELLER....

You said this yourself. I said its digi's fault.

realli not interested wif ur so called explaination...
hahahaha~~false statement????
u giv me reason y shud i do false statement??
n wat da hell tat my statement wil bcum false????!!

I dunno what the reason why you wanna give false stateent. Probably the reason why you swear so much. False is false. It doesnt just become false.

now onli u here think u r not in wrong~n yeah mayb majority doesnt means win~
If you didnt do anything wrong, you didnt. 100 people say you wrong also you would say you wrong?

but u jz go ahead said 2 policeman afterwards....
Can,I can say what I said here to the police if I need to.

i waiting u n ur bro 2 lodge a so called report 2 against me~
What for lodge report if there is no false report lodge?

mayb u wil think tat i said "da seller cheat me" as false report~
Its the seller cheat and promise that and this and give you that this representation that amount to a false report.

but dun worry i wont tell police tat u cheat me~i wil jz explain my story 2 them n let them decide wat shud they think~
Then we can also give our statement. You tell your side, we tell our side.

now i dun see any ur so called "digi simply giv answer onli"~
Er... babana said she/he was told number not in the system already but 1 forumer was told the number is still not registered and still in the system. So isnt that a big contradiction?

wat i see is my seller simply explain kosong at here onli~
n if describe in more awkward way~
its U JZ TOK KOK AT HERE N DUN WAN 2 DO ANYTHING 2 SETTLE OUR PROBLEM~

I see nothing for bro side to settle. Since he didnt do anything wrong.

if u wan tok kok~go bek tok wif ur bro~since ur bro oso pandai 2 tok~
i can stil remember da kok tat he told me by sms when i found out tat my sim card cant b use...
n u jz continue say im swearing~yes im swearing coz my EQ not so good 2 tolerant wif ur kok words....
ok sorry im wrong at here~
its not registeration~its activation~

Numbers all bought in 2006. So activation or registeration, its not the point. It just impossible for the registeration/activation to take place in 2005.

DA NUMBER WAS NOT REGISTERED~BUT IT WAS ACTIVATED~
funny me??da funny one is u...

Back in 2005, activation for prepaid happen when you put the simcard into the phone, isnt it? The simcard not detached from the main card itself, so how to activate?

of coz i wont complain tat time coz I THINK TAT MAYB TIS IS CONVINIENCE FOR HIM AS DA POSLAJU ENVELOPE WIL B TROUBLE 2 FIT IN DA SIM PACK~
i m a person tat wil think for ppl~not like u n ur bro~
Yeah, thats the reason why he take the simcard out so that he can put in the pos ekspress envelope.

n of coz i wil onli think bout the pack when i got into trouble larr~
who wil wan da simpack if da sim card can b used??????
use ur brain ok miss???

And how to use the sim card if the sim card is still undetached? Where is your brain then?

wil sending over the starter pack make da number work??
GOOD QUESTION!!
U NOE Y I WAN U SEND DA STARTER PACK??
BCOZ MY SELLER WAS IRRESPONSIBLE N UNWILLING 2 SETTLE MY PROBLEM NOW~
THEY JZ CLOSED THEIR EYES N EARS N CLAIMED TAT THEY R NOT IN WRONG~
SO WAT CAN I DO??
WAT I SHUD DO NOW IS BRING DA WHOLE SET OF DA NUMBER 2 DIGI CENTRE~IZNIT??

DIgi centre ask you to bring the whole starter pack over? Only now you told me this. No when you pm earlier. Too late to ask isnt it?

i dunno da starter pack useful onot~but at least it wil better den i jz take my sim card 2 digi centre~
ok so u said ur bro got da simpack~DEN CAN HE SEND 2 ME NOW??

Bro doesnt keep the box or starter pack for souvenier or hope for some buyer to ask for it 1 month plus down the road.

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Added on August 8, 2007, 7:03 am[quote=chitchat,Aug 7 2007, 12:41 PM]
Stop using those color and XL font size. It dont not help at all and LittleMin you need to write a proper english and not those shortform you make it up yourself. You dont want to do that if you want other people to read your post and help you.

Rene need a big dispute tag since he does not willing to refund at all. You sold a thing that is not working to a buyer and ask the buyer go settle themself with DiGi. Why dont you refund him the money and the buyer send back the card to you and you go settle with DiGi or whoever you bought it at the first place ? Too troublesome for you ? Because you know you cannot settle it also ?

If dispute tag is necessary then there is nothing i can do about it. its the moderator's discretion. And like i said before, Digi will give my bro the same answer to those 2 buyers.

You claim that you will refund if you bro is found cheating. Hey you sold something that you promise working but in the end cannot be used/faulty to buyer that is not cheating ? Is the buyer responsibility to register the card themself before the expired date and they did that but the problem now is the card you sold to them is already activated. Is the seller responsibility to check the item sold is it working or not. Is like you sell a card and claim is working and in the end is not. THAT IS CHEATING !!! You seem to know the word "UNTUNG" well but you earn the money and did not provide a proper service/responsibility.

Erm.. when did anyone give promise? Like I said, way to check whether working or not is to activate the number. Activate already not new already. and if can't sell have to reload etc. Doesnt cheat doesnt mean cheating. Cheating is a deception for untung. So no deception, no cheat.

Are you trying to sell handphone in the future again ? Then they will be more case like oh the HP your buyer bought is faulty and its not your problem and you ask them go find Nokia/SE/Motorola settle it themself. Wow that is easy money to earn there. Look at this thread man no one agrees with you and the way you try to push the responsibility as a seller. Think again is your reputation just worth a few hundred RM ? Is your reputation that gonna bring more income for you in the future. Please do the right thing.

I buy more hp in lowyat.net than selling and i never got any problem either selling or buying. And hp have warranty card and warranty period. So yeah, I always buy hp with original warranty so yeah I always go back to the service center, not the seller. Reputation is one thing and priciple is also one thing. I can defend my reputation right. I dont have to say i'm wrong or bro is wrong just because the rest of you think we are wrong. Like i said, willing to refund if anyone can prove my bro cheat.

The only solution to this matter is:
Take the card back and refund the money to buyer and you can go settle with anyone you want be it DiGi or the person you bought it from the first place to get the card working again.

Repeat again here. Prove there is an intention to cheat and I will refund. Buyer has responsible to register.

I hope babana or LittleMin wont go sell that card again and be another rene like seller. "Oh the card is not working is not my problem, i bought the card from rene he said is working when i bought it, go settle it yourself with DiGi, if cannot settle bear your own losses i keep the money no matter what, is better you lose money than myself"

[/quote]

And as for this, answer already so I just repeat. If continue selling if know the number is not working then its cheating.

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Added on August 8, 2007, 7:06 am[quote=LittleMin,Aug 7 2007, 12:51 PM]
u think i wan 2 use color n bold words???
those r my main points~
if i dun use these 2 things~den mayb da seller wil miss them out~
coz i see her explanation oso see til pening kepala...n keep miss her words....
n u jz see my reply up ur reply there~
da quotes all cant use~if i dun bold my reply~den it wil jz same like wat i quoted rene's words~
n den my whole reply wil b all same n damn long...
ppl wan see my reply oso susah...

wah~use short form oso wrong at here??
ok i try to use proper english at here~but dont blame me if my reply is damn long....

and be assured that of course i wont sell this card anymore~
i still have the feel of guilty and shame....

[/quote]

Someone will only have the guilty or shame feeling if someone do something wrong. I dont feel it.

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Added on August 8, 2007, 7:12 am[quote=babana,Aug 7 2007, 03:01 PM]
rene's bro jus sent me a sim card by itself only, no simpacks or watsoever (same for littlemin). i've verified wif digi...they cant trace the serial number frm my sim to the system. n dats wat i meant earlier when i said the line was purged/deactivated already. i have told rene clearly abt this issue during our earlier pm's n have even told her that no one is using this line now. she is aware of this.
dun worry, i had even quoted the exact same example to rene in one of my pm's to her. quoting from one of my pm's - "imagine now if i opt to sell this number...i could oso tell the seller dat u shud contact digi...not my problem coz its stated on the sim card expires on 2008...but its just not right."

And a forumer asked digi again and got a different answer in return. As for the 2008, I have replied to it through PM.

if really i wanted to sell back the sim card, i wouldnt have opened this thread in the 1st place. would've just opened a [WTS - VIP Digi Number] thread instead. but dat beats the point of this topic anyway.


to the forumners who suggested reporting this case to police...1st of all, i dun even haf rene or her bro's full name, address, ic number, etc.

2ndly, the sum involved here is not substantial enough to generate a case. say...u lost ur phone. will u report it to the police? same goes for tribunals. rene knows this...dats y she's daring me n littlemin to lodge a report wif the police or tribunals. i just have to say...i'm really speechless wif the attitude of this type of sellers. rene, after hearing all the comments frm everyone in this forum, u're still holding on and defending dat its digi's fault, am i right?

Like i said. its not a dare or anything. Just a request to let me know so me and bro can prepare ourself. You don't think Digi is wrong? number not detached from main card. not insert into phone. but activated? and different esplanations given to different people?

so rene...do u wanna settle this onot????? chitchat's point was exactly where i was coming from when i was pm-ing u to solve this problem even before i opened this thread.

[/quote]

Like I said, refund if prove intents to cheat.

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Added on August 8, 2007, 7:16 am[quote=temptation1314,Aug 7 2007, 03:19 PM]
Hmm.. if there's no chances... It's either Rene, Full Refund @ Find the same number that on market, buy it and send to buyers.

That's fair enough right?

[/quote]

Digi tel anyone where can find this number?

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Added on August 8, 2007, 7:17 am[quote=blinky,Aug 7 2007, 06:33 PM]
Rene, you kept insisting that the malfunctioning cards are a problem between your buyers and DiGi.

It doesn't make sense.

To me, it is a problem between your brother and DiGi. You can't just toss the problem to an unknowing buyer.

[/quote]

bro also an unknowing seller..

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Added on August 8, 2007, 7:21 am[quote=kevinboey86,Aug 7 2007, 10:33 PM]
From the 1st post i realize this sentence
"i called Colin (rene's bro as his number is posted in the thread as well) to tell him about my predicament. He said not to worry, guarantee ok wan."
ur bro say guarantee ok then now cant work isn't it call cheating?
u explain so much also coz u think if u get back the sim card and then scared cannot settle wit digi? i tell u 1 thing la if u don't want to be responsible for wat u have sold then don't sell things anymore

[/quote]

He said that without knowledge that the number has been terminated earlier. Digi will give bro a same answer. So not the question of scare cant settle etc but the point is digi terminate the number. So only digi can settle it. Can be responsible if prove there is an intention to cheat both buyers money.

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Added on August 8, 2007, 7:31 am[quote=donki85,Aug 7 2007, 11:21 PM]
Rene,

in Trade Practices Act 1957 under "Fitness for Purpose"

Conditions Implied in Contracts of Sale.
The Sale of Goods Act implies certain important terms in all contracts for the sale of goods. The terms implied are condition as to title, correspondence with description, quality and fitness of goods supplied under contract

Fitness for purpose.
Where the buyer expressly or by implication, makes known to the seller the particular purpose for which the gods are required, so as to show that the buyer relieds on the seller skill or judgement, and the goods are of a description which it is in the course of the seller's business to supply, THERE IS AN IMPLIED CONDITION THAT THE GOODS ARE REASONABLY FIT FOR SUCH PURPOSE.

- For your information your little discussion with TS and the other guy is considered as a valid contract due to your OFFER and their ACCEPTANCE of your offer.

Under Fitness of purpose SELLER IS RESPONSIBLE FOR THE "FITNESS" of the goods, which covers the usability of the goods. Your action can be classified as fraudulant action (Misleading and Deceiving Act)

Since their goods are not usable your are directly liable for it

hope this helps to clear things up

[/quote]

Offer and acceptance is a contract of sale i agree but bro is not in the course of the business to supply so the above statutes doesnt apply to bro. And the above statutes from aussie or nz? and isnt it fair trading act instead of misleading and deceiving act?

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Added on August 8, 2007, 7:41 am[quote=donki85,Aug 7 2007, 11:33 PM]
Rene, if you sell a goods or services it is your responsibility to make sure that the goods are workable/functioning/are fit to perform its purpose. In this case your goods are not usable hence you are liable for a refund

Reply already above.

Example.
KAKA buys a "remote toy air plane" from Beckham which turns out, only a normal decorative miniture air plane. Thus this goods does not perform as it IMPLICITLY(as expected) deem it is. Although it is not listed or written or told that it can be like/perform like a Remote air plane but due to its implicit information, Beckham action is classified as a fraudulant action as midleading n deceiving act

Misleading description given.

2nd example
U go to the market u buy a pack of Sugar like substance (which u assume is sugar" plus is written there GULA. When u reach home, u found out that it is a pack of salt. When u go back the seller told u, "Hey! i didnt tell u is a pack of Sugar no refund!!"

[/quote]

Wrong description tto the packaging.

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Added on August 8, 2007, 7:43 am[quote=ataris,Aug 7 2007, 11:35 PM]
its a simple seller ethics. sell stuffs. cannot work. refund. no question asked. if you cant do that, dont sell stuffs then.

[/quote]

Ethic v ethic & principle.

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Added on August 8, 2007, 7:51 am[quote=subpar,Aug 8 2007, 12:14 AM]
i'll give you an analogy.

my brother's supplier takes in water set handphones, but my brother does not know it. he inadvertently sells those off as zitron/midland/whatever sets, but when the handphones kong your customers complain that the official service centres do not entertain them. so what do you do? say that you did not know about the fact that those were waterset handphones and refuse to take responsibility of the warranty issues, but still sell them off at original sets' prices?

Your bro a reseller/agent, has to check whether its water set or not. supplier from a authorised supplier? As a person in the course of his biz, he ought to have the skill and knowledge to know whether its a genuine set or waterset.

whether you knew or did know know about the real facts we don't care. we as consumers only know that these are not original sets, and we cannot claim warranty from official service centres and that you are responsible for it.

I care whether bout the prior knowledge coz thats how malice intents is established.

you get screwed by your supplier, we don't care. we are dealing with you, not your supplier. it's a risk you take when you sell things, that you must be responsible for the working conditions and usage of the items you sell. if you refuse to take the risk, you might as well stop selling things and sapu sampah at the roadside for all we care.

Registeration, you are dealing with provider. Risk involve also when you buy things. And those sapu sampah people is not for insult. No one sapu sampah on the road, we all susah also.

same thing with this case. we don't care if u get screwed by the sim cards u sell, that u never check properly if it'll be working, if it has an expiry date etc. we only want the thing to work when we buy it, and if it does not, you MUST refund.

Already answered above...

if i sell a digi sim card to you and i claim that it is in working condition, then when you try to register it but it isn't i will tell you that it is not my fault and that you can deal with digi yourself. you happy anot? you buy this digi sim card, and a few days later you go register it but u're told you cannot. i, the seller, can just claim that i didn't know about it. so u're left to deal with the mess lar.

Answered already...

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Added on August 7, 2007, 7:42 am

you don't need to cheat to be in the wrong. i sell you external harddisk then when u take home rosak already, i claim that i didn't know it is kong already. so i'm free of taking up the responsibility??? pure bullshit. what also say i didn't know, i thought it was working, then i can take the money and ciao?

[/quote]

Already answered... and another rude people. If I wanna ciao, I dont have to explain so much. Just ignore all and never come back to this forum.

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Added on August 8, 2007, 7:54 am[quote=temptation1314,Aug 8 2007, 12:45 AM]
Say so much also no use lar. If only she could understand what is seller ethics early in the beginning.

Btw, I think it's time.

I hope 2 buyers here can post update whether seller got contact or you got contact with her regarding this dispute. And any TE or Admin here could issue a dateline for a dispute tag for rene?

I feel more and more dispute is coming if that rene is real a scammer.[Sell those number which already purged]

Good lucks.

[/quote]

Already answered all... Well see whether there is more previous buyers to come. Already been prejudge a scammer just because the buyer said so.

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Added on August 8, 2007, 7:58 am[quote=babana,Aug 8 2007, 12:49 AM]
Nope, have not received any pm or any forms of contact from rene. I bet its the same case wif u littlemin. Sigh...looking at how things go, my guess is dat she would go missing now and will prob register another account n start sellin items frm dat account instead

[/quote]

As I said before, all reply will be done here since this thread open already. And I do have to work etc not sitting in front of lappy waiting for a new comments. And what's the point of going missing or oen another account and etc? if wanna do that i might as well just ignore all ur pm.

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Added on August 8, 2007, 7:59 am[quote=zac1,Aug 8 2007, 01:38 AM]
hi TS,i have 1 idea ,

to proof that ur word is correct ,go digi cust care again ,try ask them to print out or write an letter and the body of the letter must clearly state that this number was inactive,purged orwhatever

then post it here

[/quote]

The point being? I'm saying digi is wrong, not babana is lying bout what digi told him/her.

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Added on August 8, 2007, 8:01 am[quote=kingmaker_20,Aug 8 2007, 06:26 AM]
Rene,

You could settle this issue in the first place by refund the buyer but you choosed to protect you and your brother with a non-logical term(s) (Own business policy).

It's clear now with Trade Practices Act 1957 under "Fitness for Purpose".

It's not we're blaming you whatsoever,maybe you didn't know how trade works but now everything clear.

I hope you'll clear yourself and refund the amount to the buyers so that we can settle this in good manner.

[/quote]

Already answered above.

This post has been edited by rene: Aug 8 2007, 08:01 AM

[quote=temptation1314,Aug 8 2007, 08:58 AM]
@Rene,

Let's recall the past.

1st, Your brother sell babana the sim card on 1st of July, and he sent it on 3rd of July. Buyers Received on 5th of July and go to Digi Center to Register the sim card on 9th of July but found out that sim card already been terminated/purged(whatsoever).

2nd, Now you claim that you already checked before sending. Even babana/Littemin claim that your brother guarantee the sim card is working. When babana or Littlemin try to re-register again, they get the same answer again. The number is being purged.

already check what before sending? and where did i say that? And bout guarantee, I answer that already. And bout the answer from Digi i also answer already.

Summary from stories :
Sales date : 1/7/2007
Delivery date : 3/7/2007
Received date : 5/7/2007
Registration date : 9/7/2007

Date of the card is being purged : 30/6/2007

From here, everything is happen after the date where all the card is being purged. And your brother could also guarantee, whereby there's no effort for your brother as a seller to help their customer check. Since there's no effort on your so call "business" to provide even a single little services and you only keep know how to sell your "product", please don't mention that you had the business ethics infront of me.

And seller can hv their own biz rule etc right?

And now, you are defending your so called "business ethics" and refuse to refund where your sim card reach on babana side is already virtually DOA.

Bro doesnt know number RIP already when he send them mover.

The Only Solution to this matter :

Since you said Digi couldn't reactivate the number again, most probably, you need to do full refund to the customer already, which I doubt you would do because you had a lot of lame excuses.

You view it lame excuses, i view it explanations.

Good lucks in your own "ethics" life.

And i don't need luck to enable me to lead an ethical life.

---

Added on August 9, 2007, 2:11 am[quote=kevinboey86,Aug 8 2007, 10:30 AM]
How come u sell something to ppl that does not work? u think logically for ur self la.....if u have stated in ur theread that "this sim card is faulty" or "this sim card might not be activated" then i understand la if the buyer buy it at a risk....now u claim ur brother don't know what he guarantee then next time don't ask him to guarantee something he is not sure of him self....if don't know = don't sell.....you can c in almost ever thread in garage sales or bulk they at least will help them claim from manufacture or wat....but u keep insisting ur innocent.....yea i agree u dont know anything but then its ur responsibility to ensure that the product works fine and the customer is satisfied wit ur service.......yea i do agree to some earlier post that pirated dvd seller will even exchange for u another movie if the 1 u buy is spoiled....

[/quote]

Answer to this already. and pirated?

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Added on August 9, 2007, 2:13 am[quote=gtghost,Aug 8 2007, 11:05 AM]
OMG for gods sake......I rather pay him back RM105 than to type all these explainations. Medical consultation fee also more than that already :S

[/quote]

Expected it already...

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Added on August 9, 2007, 2:15 am[quote=LittleMin,Aug 8 2007, 11:22 AM]
yes me too...

so wat u gonna do now??

already answer before this.

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Added on August 8, 2007, 11:25 am

i think post at here oso useless~

since da seller's logic is : i sell things 2 u~n when i sell i duno it cant work = not my fault....

so even our words r correct wif evidence~it cant represent anything oso...
we stil cant get our money bek...

[/quote]

Already answer.

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Added on August 9, 2007, 2:16 am[quote=bdl,Aug 8 2007, 11:34 AM]
... why take so much trouble to settle ... very simple only -mah ...

-- 1. seller refund to buyer .. if the sim card doesn't work .. or ..

-- 2. seller get the sim card to DiGi centre .. activate the sim card and send back to buyer ..
-- it's the responsiblity of the seller make sure the sim card is working .. right ..?

-- not need to explain whose fault here -lah .. just 2 options to settle only -mah ..

[/quote]

Already answer to this.

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Added on August 9, 2007, 2:24 am[quote=LittleMin,Aug 8 2007, 11:36 AM]
his brother??
if u saw my quoted thread at front there~
den u wil see how i describe his bro...
he bro indeed got guarantee~but is guarantee tat he is a honest great seller n said that im the only one problematic buyer that keep kacau him~
i was so angry so i dont reply him anymore~
but after tat another his so called the only one problematic buyer who is babana (i thought ONLY ONE = ONE??) appear out and he is more pitiful than me coz he paid rm105 for his number...

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Added on August 8, 2007, 11:40 am
both the options u mentioned are not accepted by seller~

for 1.~she said that it is not her wrong so no refund...
for 2.~she said her bro dont want pursue those terminated numbers anymore~so if i and babana want to activate~we have to go by ourselves....

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Added on August 8, 2007, 11:49 am

Does your bro confirm with digi centre that the numbers that he wil be selling can be used???maybe you think that it is unnecessary but i thought that it is seller responsible to make sure that the things that he gonna sell can be used??so even if this is digi's wrong~but your bro still partly blamed for this....n now u n ur bro dont willing to settle me n babana's problem~so.....ur bro still shouldnt be blamed??

well, i think u know wat my reply will b but will say it anyway. number valid til 2008 n never detached from main card before. new never use, hence din check. n did u thought of checking w digi before buy? no also.. all said with hind side. i dunno how to blame bro when he din terminate or activate the number.
And one more thing~i dont know whether u know this or not...

Actually the terminated number that im holding now is not my choice initially~I WAS FORCED 2 CHOOSE THIS NUMBER!!
Why??jz because my favourite number which is 016-5898589 EXPIRED ON 1/7/2007!!!
And ur bro only tell me tis WHEN I HAVE BANK IN TO HIM!!!
AND HE CLAIMED THAT NO REFUND~so i can only choose another number which is 016-5765769 n which is terminated also...

forced? with gun to ur head? CAP words start to come out again... i do see seler imposing no refund policy



This post has been edited by rene: Aug 9 2007, 02:24 AM

erm.. yeah.. i just hit reply.

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Added on August 9, 2007, 2:29 amfortunately i dont wear make upp or fancy fancy dress. And money paid to bro directly, not me.

This post has been edited by rene: Aug 9 2007, 02:29 AM

Not couldn't understand but we have different view. If mod think i'm wrong, then tag. But if mod tag me coz of pressure from you all, well mod doesn't has to be pressured to tag.

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Added on August 9, 2007, 2:33 amAnswer already...

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Added on August 9, 2007, 2:40 amErm, i just cut and paste your own words. so how am i twisting? and i didnt say YOU contradict i said DIGI contradict. understand?

what i understand from that forumer is that the number is n the system already. so i dunno how you can say i twist your word.

if explaining is getting to your nerve then i might as well just keep quiet n ignore your pm in the first place. then when u open a thread here, i also keep quiet n ignore it. so that wouldnt trigger your nerve?

So i cant explain cant i?or when i explain it must be something that is acceptable to everyone?So my mission here is not to get to your nerve?

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Added on August 9, 2007, 2:44 amErm its not fake. it was a real card but unfortunately terminated by digi before its time. talking bout providing link, then to all private seller in the buy & sell forum, be careful.... and yeah drag digi in. just unfortunate no previous buyers willing to come and give positive statements.

police report - reply already.

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Added on August 9, 2007, 2:46 amokie... will try...

---

Added on August 9, 2007, 2:47 amkinda lazy to use colour.. sorry yah..

This post has been edited by rene: Aug 9 2007, 02:47 AM

Answer to this already...

I also say to make sense. So say once enough if you wanna accept. keep keep repeating also no use if you think it doesnt make sense. me one person replying. you how many people commenting?
dunno me in real life, don't say it. i also dunno you so i;m not commenting anything. dont say real or what. i have been cheated before but not in this kinda thing. But thats personal. N i said already, where is the prove that bro or me cheat? just because buyers feel and said they are cheated then bro and me r cheater? then might as well i said bro and me feel and said we are cheated by digi.

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Added on August 10, 2007, 1:49 amre dispute tag - answer already and i dont think mod need yo to teach them what to do.

re responsible - answer already.

re excuse - answer already.

re agree with me ; answer already

re selling policy - answer already

re dispute tag - answer already.

re lame reason - answer already

re irresponsible seller? - really? i buy sell so long also first time kena like this. i guess there is a first time to everything.

re stop this kinda seller - goosh, you do sound like some defender or something.

re ethic - answer already

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Added on August 10, 2007, 1:56 amre consumer tribnal court - answer already. issue on jurisdiction.

re found guilty - there is no concept of 'being found guilty' except in criminal case. it finding of liability.

re judgment - its a finding and order, not judgment, if not mistaken.

re complying of finding - wait til ther eis a finding first.

re court - tribunal is a tribunal not a court.

re drastic action - arrest, unlikely. bankruptcy, minimum limit is RM30,000.

re dishonest - answer already. where is the dishonest and the intention to cheat?? can prove i refund. even civil and criminal court need proving. so whats the different here? not just coz buyers say i or my bro cheat then we r cheater or dishonest. and like i said before. majority doesnt mean its true or buyers should win. you want trial by jury? then where is the evidence?

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Added on August 10, 2007, 2:13 amAnswer already...

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Added on August 10, 2007, 2:18 amand the main point here is you are saying what you are thinking as and when you thought of it. I can also say you didnt ask on the expiry date even after my bro told you bout the expiry date for the first card.

And i didnt say your comments are some lame comments isnt it? so why label and keep and labeling?

you have right to have what you have... and whether you are forced to make a decision, is that the point here?

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Added on August 10, 2007, 2:24 amthe digi number selling thread dont have to temporary closed. its dead in the water already. I have said this earlier and mod can proceed to close it. the reason why i didnt close it has been given earlier.

And on the issue of knowledge of the termination, also answer already earlier. me and bro doesn't know.

This post has been edited by rene: Aug 10 2007, 02:24 AM

Answer to this already earlier.

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Added on August 10, 2007, 2:29 amhow many selling thread do I have? you wanna highlight it all here? Then go right ahead. And when did i cheat anyone? Prejudge.

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Added on August 10, 2007, 2:33 amRe re re re re - Explanation given. Short answer better since people said i bla bla bla.. long explanation bla bla bla.. short answer re re re.

Re lame - really? You can prove bro or me cheat?

Re dispute tag- where is the evidence that bro and me con?

Re stubborn - Really? Not following people's wish is stubborn?

Re irresponsible - Willing to be responsible if there is a con.

Re prove me wrong - its not prove me wrong. Its prove the buyers right.

Re solution- answer already. prove there is a con and i'll refund.

Your choice to read so your choice to be sien.

This post has been edited by rene: Aug 10 2007, 02:36 AM

Yes you have to prove the intention to murder regardless body in front of you or body not found. thats will decide whether you get death or jail.

i didnt sell the "bread" pass the expiry date. The expiry date for the "bread" is 2008. Me and bro has been labeled con through out. Then prove it. And no mistake made when the number is sold.

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Added on August 11, 2007, 9:37 pmAnd are you trying to be the profiler here? Whatever i say will look lame, robotic, arrogant etc unless i said what you all wanna read. Like i said, please keep me informed if the buyer do proceed with futher action. And when and what was the promise made before the sale is made? it is a classic textbook case that yo need to prove what you accuse/allege a person of doing/saying.

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Added on August 11, 2007, 9:49 pmI agree lenght of time has nothing gotta do with it but where is the 'con' factor? o its fair to give out an automatic dispute tag if there is no solution found and seller don't wanna do refund even though its not a con case?

As for the refund policy - answer already.


This post has been edited by rene: Aug 11 2007, 09:49 PM

yup i know the difference and i know someone will say this and guess what? concept of guilty or not applies to criminal law. civill law, its either you liable or not liable. and motive - in a death case - its motive to murder and motive to cause harm. in civil law - its not motive to get money but motive to con. so where is the evidence of con? i have offer a solution- prove the intention to con and i will refund.

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Added on August 11, 2007, 9:59 pmAnswer already.

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Added on August 11, 2007, 10:03 pmAnswer already to all the above comments. No all question can be answer with one word yes or no.

---

Added on August 11, 2007, 10:13 pmAnd how "smart" of you to call other people name. I do wonder how rude can rude be...

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Added on August 11, 2007, 10:19 pmAnswer to all already.
And you have the right to judge me or bro?
How can bro b responsible if digi terminates the number before the expiry date and before activation?
understanding? why should i agree with your view if i don't?
And I said already, if proven con case, then I will refund. So issue whether money spent or not, I will refund it.

---

Added on August 11, 2007, 10:22 pmsolution offered already...
er... terms doesnt hv anything to do with it.

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Added on August 11, 2007, 10:25 pmtwo totally different product. i check hp before i buy.
expired food- someone gave the example already and answer to it already.
con - answer already too. knowledge? intention?

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Added on August 11, 2007, 10:28 pmits a con just because its 7 pages already and just because you and the rest of the people say so?

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Added on August 11, 2007, 10:29 pmIts a con just because you said so?

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Added on August 11, 2007, 10:31 pmIf pack say 2008 and you can't activate the number to check the validity and didn't call the digi to check on the validity, how would you know the number has been terminated? You are already, like there rest of them out there in this thread, suggesting that bro and me are cons... and have you check the digi selling thread?

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Added on August 11, 2007, 10:41 pmWhere is the intention to con? Prove it. So easy for you to just throw accusation isn't it? I'm I the only one posting a thread for someone else in the buy & sell section? And has this gotta do with everything? I;m a cheat just because the rule is broken? I'm at fault just because the rule is broken? And did the buyers ever raise this as an issue when they buy from my bro?

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Added on August 11, 2007, 10:43 pmcan you activate a card without putting the sim card into the phone and if you can then who can do it? and why didnt check etc, has been explain already and my bro is not at fault for not checking.

This post has been edited by rene: Aug 11 2007, 10:47 PM

And not bro fault that the sim & number is not "functioning". I said this already.

due to a true accuser from someone like you..

This comment has been made before and has been answered to.

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Added on August 12, 2007, 12:37 amYes, all crime has to prove prove. That's what court are for. Accident depends on quantum of liability. As on the issue on checking before selling, answer to this already.

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Added on August 12, 2007, 12:38 amand let the blaming game begin...

This post has been edited by rene: Aug 12 2007, 12:38 AM