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> No more festival celebration at school..., Jakim says students easily influenced

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Namelessone1973
post Jan 15 2020, 10:46 AM

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QUOTE(Bonchi @ Jan 15 2020, 10:33 AM)
That's 15th day prayers only by the taoists from specifically the hokkien dialect will do and it's lighting candles burn incense hang tebu or pineapple etc... that prayer is done at night so obviously have to light a lantern what....

and this 15th day prayers also so happens to coincide with the lanterns. So just dont join that one if you feel offended... and flying lanterns are dangerous, dont participate better. And if you did not know, there's alot of events going on the 15th day as well... like Chinese valentines aka throw orange. The reason why there's so many different celebrations happening on the 15th day of CNY for the Chinese because it's the first full moon... so go figure.

but tanglung is tanglung which is lit way before the first day of CNY... if it's religious, China wouldve long banned it...

also the 15th day prayers don't happen in communist china and is also not practiced by various other dialect group.
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Hokkiens do not pray on the 15th day. Hokkiens pray on the 8th day of CNY. It is another celebration that have some links to religion but generally it is more like thanksgiving. I think it started during Ming dynasty where Fujian province where Hokkiens originated were attacked by bandits. People believe those bandits were Japanese as there were lots of raids from Japan during this period. They pray using sugarcane because Hokkiens hide in sugarcane field when the bandits raided and thank to heavens they were not discovered.
Lanchio
post Jan 15 2020, 10:47 AM

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Wait till the men in robes come into power. What's happening today will be a walk in the park.

Don't think it's gonna happen? Nons already slightly less than 30% population. Majority are trending to be more religious, some have embraced hard line R&R (no thanks to UMNO 60 years rule, propaganda and brainwashing) and this number is growing. Sooner or later, mainstream parties will either become religious party (or be seen to be religious) or be in coalition with hard line religious party. This will ensure winning majority vote and place these men in robes in power. By then, you just be Syukur to keep your citizenship (unlike Brunei where none are not given citizenship) but your life will change drastically and you have zero say on it.

My prediction, earliest GE17 latest GE19, within your lifetime. Nothing is gonna stop this. It is already too late to do anything, no thanks to those damn politicians.
aliesterfiend
post Jan 15 2020, 10:49 AM

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QUOTE(drowning @ Jan 15 2020, 10:22 AM)
I grow up in national school, attended countless of Hari Raya, Deepavali, Wesak, CNY and other festival like Raya Korban, Ponggal and Thaipusam.

Still don't make me any bit of religious at all.
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Did you puasa and during Korban slaughter a cow too?

Celebrating is different than participating. I celebrate CNY in the office and in friends home too bit I did not participate in rituals like praying to ancestors etc.
Namelessone1973
post Jan 15 2020, 10:51 AM

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QUOTE(Bonchi @ Jan 15 2020, 10:39 AM)
hnghhhh can see so many misinformed ppl out there lol...

I can give yall the biggest tip for Chinese celebrations... as long as it involves a jostick and burning paper money, it's religious. Other than that... it's not and it's safe to participate laugh.gif
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Actually, all Chinese celebrations have links to religious or folk believes including CNY. As I have said before, Chinese beliefs are a mixture of Buddhism, Taoism, Confucianism and folk believes.

However, all Chinese celebrations are also linked to the Chinese calendar and the rational for celebration is because of the seasonal agricultural period which are totally not religious at all.

SUScatherintherye
post Jan 15 2020, 10:55 AM

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QUOTE(Namelessone1973 @ Jan 15 2020, 10:51 AM)
Actually, all Chinese celebrations have links to religious or folk believes including CNY. As I have said before, Chinese beliefs are a mixture of Buddhism, Taoism, Confucianism and folk believes.

However, all Chinese celebrations are also linked to the Chinese calendar and the rational for celebration is because of the seasonal agricultural period which are totally not religious at all.
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Seasonal agricultural celebration also a belief....before all these Jesus, Muhhamad, Gautama, Ayotollah comes about, people praying to Goddess of fertility, sun, mountain, trees, sea, land for good harvest.... so it is a belief system.....



Bonchi
post Jan 15 2020, 10:57 AM

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QUOTE(Namelessone1973 @ Jan 15 2020, 10:51 AM)
Actually, all Chinese celebrations have links to religious or folk believes including CNY. As I have said before, Chinese beliefs are a mixture of Buddhism, Taoism, Confucianism and folk believes.

However, all Chinese celebrations are also linked to the Chinese calendar and the rational for celebration is because of the seasonal agricultural period which are totally not religious at all.
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yep.. deswai if you dont join in to light a jostick and burn paper money then it will not be religious.... because there's just too many different things happening altogether and each dialect group have their own... for example some taoist especially hokkiens again will pray every 1st and 15th of the lunar month which is a date that quite alot of other chinese celebrations will clash.
drowning
post Jan 15 2020, 11:00 AM

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QUOTE(aliesterfiend @ Jan 15 2020, 10:49 AM)
Did you puasa and during Korban slaughter a cow too?

Celebrating is different than participating. I celebrate CNY in the office and in friends home too bit I did not participate in rituals like praying to ancestors etc.
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No puasa but I have participated in a few cow slaughtering, during school time and during adult including few years ago slaughter of camel. During the agama class, me and a few non-muslim stayed at the back of the class (school don't have enough non-muslim student to have POL class) until we can hafal alfatihah, which is the first thing they do during agama class.

I also have supported my friends who are taking the kavadi in batu caves, and have to endure the climb up the cave.

Yes you are right. Celebrate! No one is asking to join in the prayers. During the prayers, all you need to do is keep silence and be respectful. Niat itu penting.
aliesterfiend
post Jan 15 2020, 11:05 AM

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QUOTE(drowning @ Jan 15 2020, 11:00 AM)
No puasa but I have participated in a few cow slaughtering, during school time and during adult including few years ago slaughter of camel. During the agama class, me and a few non-muslim stayed at the back of the class (school don't have enough non-muslim student to have POL class) until we can hafal alfatihah, which is the first thing they do during agama class.

I also have supported my friends who are taking the kavadi in batu caves, and have to endure the climb up the cave.

Yes you are right. Celebrate! No one is asking to join in the prayers. During the prayers, all you need to do is keep silence and be respectful. Niat itu penting.
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True. However, in Islam it's not just about belief. There are things that can do and things that cant do. Cant do then means cant do lah. Simple as that.
Namelessone1973
post Jan 15 2020, 11:06 AM

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QUOTE(catherintherye @ Jan 15 2020, 10:55 AM)
Seasonal agricultural celebration also a belief....before all these Jesus, Muhhamad, Gautama, Ayotollah comes about, people praying to Goddess of fertility, sun, mountain, trees, sea, land for good harvest.... so it is a belief system.....
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Its up to your interpretation. Seasonal agricultural celebration is because people want to have some fun after working hard. In the olden days, the Chinese calendar is vital as it will signify important things such as when to start planting, when to harvest, etc.

There are hardly any celebrations around the world which have no links at all to religion or folk belief. Look at Halloween, if you want to link it to religion, you can but if you just take it as just a time to do something silly, then there will be no problem at all.

The question is do you need a group of people to dictate what is permissible and what is not permissible. People need to use their common sense when it comes to celebration.


Bonchi
post Jan 15 2020, 11:07 AM

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QUOTE(Namelessone1973 @ Jan 15 2020, 10:46 AM)
Hokkiens do not pray on the 15th day. Hokkiens pray on the 8th day of CNY. It is another celebration that have some links to religion but generally it is more like thanksgiving. I think it started during Ming dynasty where Fujian province where Hokkiens originated were attacked by bandits. People believe those bandits were Japanese as there were lots of raids from Japan during this period. They pray using sugarcane because Hokkiens hide in sugarcane field when the bandits raided and thank to heavens they were not discovered.
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ah right the 8th day.. but 15th also got some prayers... i really dunno all these prayers lol. I just watch ppl do it...

especially my relatives who married to hokkiens... they macam alot of prayers going on every month. (luckily im not hokkien)
iwan_smtk
post Jan 15 2020, 11:12 AM

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QUOTE(archonixm @ Jan 15 2020, 09:51 AM)
Pongal (பொங்கல், /ˈθaɪˈpo�ŋ�l/, also spelled Poṅkal), is also referred to as Thai Pongal (தைப்பொங்கல், also spelled Tai Pongal), is a multi-day Hindu harvest festival of South India, particularly in the Tamil community.[3][4][5] It is observed at the start of the month Tai according to Tamil solar calendar,[4] and this is typically about January 14.[3][1] It is dedicated to the Hindu sun god,[6] the Surya, and corresponds to Makar Sankranti, the harvest festival under many regional names celebrated throughout India.[7][8][9] The three days of the Pongal festival are called Bhogi Pongal, Surya Pongal and Maattu Pongal.[7]
Its dedicated to the Hindu god? No wonder its forbidden for muslim..
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even some /k also dun understand this yet labeled Muslim racist.

Muslim can't join such ceremony. end of story
Namelessone1973
post Jan 15 2020, 11:12 AM

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QUOTE(aliesterfiend @ Jan 15 2020, 11:05 AM)
True. However, in Islam it's not just about belief. There are things that can do and things that cant do. Cant do then means cant do lah. Simple as that.
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Who told you it can't do? That is the question you should ask yourself using common sense instead of following blindly what a group of people decide.

Look at the Ponggol festival. Even if you participate in the cooking or eat the prayer food, does it mean you are praying to their gods? In Islam, you only believe in 1 god, Allah. So if you say participating in the cooking or eat the prayer food means praying to their gods, does it mean you're acknowledging the existence of gods other than Allah. This is also a question some Christians need to think too. There are a lot of Christians who do not want to eat prayer food as well.
Taikor.Taikun
post Jan 15 2020, 11:13 AM

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QUOTE(RGRaj @ Jan 15 2020, 08:59 AM)
Yes, technicaly non-Hindus shud not b celebrating it as its abt ofering thanksgiving to d gods for a bountiful crop harvest.
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You should say MUSLIMS should not b celebrating it while other nons r free to join the celebration; no issue.

Technically, anybody can join the celebration n b merry without much relating to religion. Even some veneration to Hindu Gods r not an issue to most people
TrialGone
post Jan 15 2020, 11:20 AM

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QUOTE(aliesterfiend @ Jan 15 2020, 11:05 AM)
True. However, in Islam it's not just about belief. There are things that can do and things that cant do. Cant do then means cant do lah. Simple as that.
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Let's be precise. What jakim says u can or cannot do.

Except smoking, smoking is fine despite fatwa.

LOL.
augkyos
post Jan 15 2020, 11:21 AM

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rilek la.. biar politicians apa dz / jakim did their shit.. you keep your mind with you then you r safe. otherwise you are their puppet

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