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Like I told you a few times, salvation solely by faith in Jesus Christ and not by the works of the Law has been a basic or elementary Protestant Christian teaching since the 16th-century Protestant Reformation against the corrupt Catholic Popes.

Maybe you have an incomplete understanding of God's Law or Moses Law.

As per the Book of Leviticus, only unintentional sins/law-breaking could be forgiven = no earthly curse/punishment from God or His agents, eg accidents, mistakes, negligence, forgetfulness, etc. Manslaughter or unintentional killing resulted in being exiled to sanctuary cities, not cursed/punished by the death penalty. Unintentional sins include inherited Adam's Original Sin that resulted in sin-in-thoughts or sinning-in-the-hearts.
....... Intentional or willful sins/law-breaking could not be forgiven = earthly curse/punishment from God or His agents followed, eg the death penalty for murder, adultery, idolatry, etc.

Only with a good understanding of God's Law or Moses Law as found in the Old Testament, can Christians truly understand the spiritual teachings found in the New Testament, eg HEB.10:26-31, 1JOHN.1:5 - 2:2 & 5:16-17, ROMANS.5:12.

So, it is OK for Christians to once in awhile commit unintentional sins(= forgiven by the blood of Christ = no earthly curse follows) and learn not to do them again; but it is not OK for Christians to commit intentional or willful sins/law-breaking and not learn to not do them again even after suffering the earthly curse/punishment of God or His agents for their sins, eg commit sexual immorality like adultery/fornication repeatedly(= later may kena terminal cancer) or remain a practicing homosexual "Christian"(= later may kena HIV/AIDS/STD).

Good day.
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This post has been edited by lurkingaround: Mar 31 2020, 04:47 PM

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No sin, whether intentional or unintentional, can disqualify a person from being saved from hell by faith, except the very rare sin of blasphemy against the Holy Spirit of God. Even the about-to-be-crucified young Jewish robber got saved but he still had to die for his intentional sin of robbery/stealing under Roman Law - LUKE.23:43.
....... But once the sinner has come into faith and become a Christian, he/she is to go and sin the former sin no more, lest a worse thing come upon him/her - JOHN.5:14 & 8:11.
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Yes, I agree with you that Christians should try their best not to even commit unintentional sins like accidents, mistakes, negligence, forgetfulness, etc that offended others or self or God/Jesus. But if they still fail to do so once in awhile, they can avail for forgiveness(= no earthly curse/punishment from God) through the following Scripture, .......

1JOHN.1:5 - 2:2 = Fellowship with Him and One Another

1:5 This is the message which we have heard from Him and declare to you, that God is light and in Him is no darkness at all. 6 If we say that we have fellowship with Him, and walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth. 7 But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin.

8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.

2:1 My little children, these things I write to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. 2 And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world.

IMO;

"walk in darkness" = commit intentional or willful sins - 1COR.6:9-11, GAL.5:19-21, HEB.10:26-31

"no sin" and "we have not sinned" = involuntary or unintentional sinning-in-the-heart, eg immoral sexual lust for another's wife or daughter or sister - inherited Adam's Original Sin.

"if anyone sins" = unintentional sins, not intentional/willful sins, since apostle John was likely writing to his fellow Jewish Christians who were already well-versed with God's Law or Moses Law.

Good day.
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This post has been edited by lurkingaround: Mar 31 2020, 10:35 PM

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Because that statement of mine applies only to a non-believer coming into faith in Jesus Christ as a new born-again Christian, ie my statement does not apply to already-born-again believers, especially mature Christians like yourself, as per REV.22: 12-17, 1COR.6:9-11, GAL.5:19-21, HEB.10:26-31 & 6:1-8 = a mature Christian who continue unrepentantly to sin willfully/intentionally or practice lawlessness will suffer the earthly curses/punishments of God or His agents and will also not inherit the kingdom of God in heaven. It's the difference between the "before and after" coming into faith or becoming a Christian.
....... IOW, if you apply my statement above to already-born-again Christians, you are going into error or false teachings.

OTOH, even the worst sinners, like murderers(eg Paul), adulterers, robbers, prostitutes(eg Mary Magdalene), tax-collectors for the hated Romans, etc could be saved from hell by becoming a born-again Christian through new-found faith in Jesus Christ, as per 1COR.6:9-11. .......

1COR.6: = 9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, 10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God.

11 And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God.
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REV.22: = Jesus Testifies to the Churches

12 “And behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give to every one according to his work. 13 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, the First and the Last.”

14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. 15 But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie.

16 “I, Jesus, have sent My angel to testify to you these things in the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, the Bright and Morning Star.”

17 And the Spirit and the bride say, “Come!” And let him who hears say, “Come!” And let him who thirsts come. Whoever desires, let him take the water of life freely.
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In the context of the 4 Gospels and ACTS in the New Testament, Jesus Christ was preaching to His fellow Jews who had been keeping God's Law or Moses Law for about 1,500 years, ie since the days of Moses at about 1500 BC. So, the Jews and apostles understood very well what Jesus Christ meant when He referred to the Law and the Prophets, eg that He did not come down to earth to destroy the Law but to fulfil it or LUKE.16:16, MATT.7:12 & 19:16-22 & 22:37-40. Similarly for the various apostolic epistles or letters in the NT, eg when Paul mentioned the Law.
....... IOW, the Law and the Prophets in the NT gospels plainly referred to the Old Testament, ie from GENESIS to MALACHI.

uw is publicly confessing that nobody, including mature Christians, can actually keep the Law, which may be a false statement because even Jews and Greeks/Gentiles could keep the Law, either knowingly or unknowingly - MATT.19:20, ROMANS.2:14 = not commit willful or intentional sins/law-breaking/evil-deeds/unrighteousness. Other Christians may interpret uw's statement as it is OK for them to commit willful or intentional sins/law-breaking/evil-deeds/unrighteousness and still be saved from hell by faith since nobody can actually keep the Law. = as if faith has given them the license-to-sin = to even commit intentional sins/law-breaking/evil-deeds/unrighteousness with full assurance of forgiveness and salvation.

But if uw actually meant nobody can actually not commit involuntary or unintentional sins-in-thoughts occasionally and/or nobody can actually not commit unintentional sins once-in-awhile, then that is OK.
....... IOW, uw needs to elaborate on what he actually meant by "nobody can actually keep the Law", in order to clear up mis-teachings or misunderstanding.

LUKE.16:19-31 says that the rich young Jewish man died and was sent to Hades for not keeping the Law at DEUT.15:11, ie by intentionally not doing charity to the poor every Sabbath year. Beggar Lazarus died and was sent to heaven for keeping the Law, ie he did not commit intentional or willful sins/law-breaking, like stealing. Lazarus might have committed unintentional sins but these were forgivable by animal blood sacrifice = no curse/punishment from God or His agents. See also 1PETER.3:19 & 4:6, MATT.17:3 & 27:52.
Good day.
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You should also challenged me, have you turned the other cheek.?, have you walked the extra mile.?, have you lent to all who asked.?, have you loved your enemies.?
= No, I have not foolishly gouged out my eyes or chopped off my hands, have not foolishly turned the other cheek, have not walked the extra mile, have not lent to all who asked or have not foolishly loved my enemies. Have you.?

Do you know why I have not.? = ....... https://forum.lowyat.net/topic/4880254 - Protestant issue #03 - love your enemies.?

Also, God's Law or Moses Law in the OT does not have "You shall gouge out your eyes" and "You shall chop off your hands." Has God added new laws to His Law or Moses Law as found in the OT.?

Good day.
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This post has been edited by lurkingaround: Apr 1 2020, 09:33 PM

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FYI, today we have false pastors/prophets/teachers professing false beliefs and false teachings among the Churches, eg Prosperity Gospel, Hypergrace, LBGTQism in the Church(eg gay pastors/bishops), OSAS(.?), Antinominianism, etc. Some of them have been caught committing CBT and sexual immorality like adultery, fornication, homosexuality, etc. During the Protestant Reformation, we had corrupt Catholic Popes = Bishop of Rome.

As per MATT.7:15-23, only their bad or evil fruits/works of lawlessness could be used by sincere Christians to identify false prophets/pastors/teachers. .......

https://www.thestar.com.my/news/nation/2020...out-despite-mco -
Own goal part two: 24 Catholic seminarians punished for kickabout despite MCO - Thursday, 02 Apr 2020
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Good day.
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This post has been edited by lurkingaround: Apr 2 2020, 05:22 PM

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At MATT.5:17-20, Jesus Christ categorically stated that He did not come down to earth to destroy the Law.

Jesus Christ did not raise new laws to destroy the old Law, ie He did not raise or issue the new law of "You shall gouge out your eyes." and "You shall chop off your hands" to replace or destroy the old Law of "You shall not commit adultery." and He also did not issue the new law "You shall love your enemy" to destroy the old Law of "You shall love your neighbor as yourself". At MATT.22:37-40, Jesus Christ reiterated that the commandment/law "You shall love your neighbor as yourself" is one of the 2 great commandments of God.

Something is not right with your interpretation of the Bible if you believe that Jesus Christ had raised new laws (= destroy the Law) at MATT.5:17-48 = gouge your eyes out, chop off your hands, love your enemies, turn the other cheek, walk the extra mile, lend to all who asked, etc. Like you said, if you keep one of these "laws", you need to also keep all of the new "laws", ie no point loving your enemies or turning the other cheek if you do not also gouge out your eyes and chop off your hands. .......

MATT.5:17-20 = Christ Fulfills the Law

17 “Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. 18 For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled. 19 Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20 For I say to you, that unless your righteousness exceeds the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven.
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MATT.22:37-40 = 37 Jesus said to him, “‘You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.’ 38 This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ 40 On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets.”
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MATT.5:17-20 = Christ Fulfills the Law

17 “Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. 18 For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.

19 Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20 For I say to you, that unless your righteousness exceeds the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven.
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The more important point is how does the Lord/God Jesus Christ fulfill the Law.? It is not just by Him dying on the Cross to bring salvation from hell to the world and then full-stop. The risen and ascended Jesus Christ/God-eternal continues on to dwell in the believers' heart and mind to implant His Law in them by the power of His Holy Spirit, in order to empower them to keep the Law from within(HEB.8:10 & 10:15), unlike non-believers who have to be compelled by external powers like the police, to keep the Law or keep local/national laws.
....... This was how Jesus Christ fulfilled the Law, ie by empowering His people to fulfill or keep the Law.

Problems arise when certain Christian believers reject and/or ignore the Law of God as found in the Old Testament for various reasons, especially Gentile Christians who were mostly lawless Gentiles previously (cf; Jewish Christians like the apostles - ACTS.15:19-29 & 21:20-25, ROMANS.14:1-5) = the power of the Holy Spirit of God to empower them to keep the Law gets short-circuited = they may not or do not keep the Law - this may include you who has said, "nobody can actually keep the Law".

If such wayward Christians do not repent or correct themselves, their faith will likely get shipwrecked or lost because intentional or willful sins/law-breaking will bring the judgment/curses of God upon them and they may lose faith while suffering for their sins, especially the sins of sexual immorality, eg lose faith while suffering painfully and dying of cancer or the Wuhan virus.
....... Eg, I know of a rich Christian lay-member who donates generously to the Church but has the long-time habit of committing adultery. Presently he has hypertension in his 40s. I worry for him in his later years.

As per MATT.5:17-20, Spirit-filled Christians are supposed to exceed the non-Spirit-filled Jews in righteousness = in the keeping of the Law. Alas, even certain Christian pastors behaved worse than ordinary Jews or atheists, eg pastors who profess the Prosperity Gospel, Hypergrace, Antinominianism, LGBTQism, etc.
....... "Judge them by their fruit".
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This post has been edited by lurkingaround: Apr 2 2020, 10:34 AM

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Of course you can, but the problem is, ROMANS.7:19 was directed at(= applied to) unconverted Jews and Gentiles, not to already-Spirit-filled Christian believers.

Like I already told you, non-Spirit-filled non-Christians are compelled by external forces like the police, to keep the Law or local laws but when the local laws are relaxed or changed, eg by liberals, non-Christians often go full throttle in committing evil-deeds that are against God's Law, eg adultery, fornication, homosexuality, alcohol-drinking, chain-smoking, gambling, money scams, etc.
....... During war and riots(= the breakdown of law and order), there will be the full display of unconverted Man's wickedness/evilness.

In comparison, mature adults-in-Christ believers continue to keep or fulfill God's Law by the power of the Holy-Spirit of God/Jesus from within, no matter how local laws(= Caesar's Law) have been relaxed or changed.

Seems you are more to teaching the unconverted, eg atheists, Buddhists, Hindus, Jews, Muslims, etc than to teaching Spirit-filled Christians like babes-in-Christ and children-in-Christ, unlike some of the brothers-in-Christ here. Eg you are still harping on the basic or elementary 16th-century Protestant teaching by Martin Luther about justification for salvation by faith in Jesus Christ alone, and not by the works of the Law.

Good day.
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This post has been edited by lurkingaround: Apr 2 2020, 11:23 AM

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GAL.3: = Purpose of the Law

19 What purpose then does the law serve? It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was appointed through angels by the hand of a mediator. 20 Now a mediator does not mediate for one only, but God is one.

21 Is the law then against the promises of God? Certainly not! For if there had been a law given which could have given life, truly righteousness would have been by the law. 22 But the Scripture has confined all under sin, that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe. 23 But before faith came, we were kept under guard by the law, kept for the faith which would afterward be revealed. 24 Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith. 25 But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.

The purpose of the Law is tutorship to bring the unconverted Jews and Gentiles to Christ for salvation by faith.

If Spirit-filled and salvaged Christian were no longer under the tutorship of the Law, why was Paul still talking about the Law.? It was because he was teaching against the Judaizers, led by James the Just, the bishop of Jerusalem, who were requiring new Gentile Christians to keep all of the Law in order to be accepted by them as saved Christians, eg required to be circumcised - GAL.2:9-17, ACTS.15:19-29.
....... So, Paul was explaining how the unconverted were converted by faith, and not converted by the Law, in order to prevent new Gentile Christians from being bewitched by the false teachings of the Judaizers and James.
....... This was just a teething problem of the early 1st-century Church and has been mostly solved since the 16th century Protestant Reformation by Martin Luther.

For Spirit-filled Christians today who are mostly knowledgeable about the 16th-century Protestant teaching by Martin Luther about justification by faith alone, and not by the works of the Law, and about the false teachings of the Judaizers, James and the Catholic Popes, the teaching of the inadequacy and misuse of the Law by Paul at ROMANS.7:19 and GAL.3:24 mostly no longer applies to them, but more to the unconverted Jews and Gentiles.
....... It's like a uni/college student has no need to go back to primary school. Mostly the unconverted need to go to the primary school of Christianity to be tutored by the Law towards salvation by faith in Jesus Christ. Maybe babes-in-Christ still need to go back to primary school. But not other Spirit-filled Christians.
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GAL.2: = 9 and when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that had been given to me, they gave me and Barnabas the right hand of fellowship, that we should go to the Gentiles and they to the circumcised. 10 They desired only that we should remember the poor, the very thing which I also was eager to do.

No Return to the Law

11 Now when Peter had come to Antioch, I withstood him to his face, because he was to be blamed; 12 for before certain men came from James, he would eat with the Gentiles; but when they came, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing those who were of the circumcision. 13 And the rest of the Jews also played the hypocrite with him, so that even Barnabas was carried away with their hypocrisy.

14 But when I saw that they were not straightforward about the truth of the gospel, I said to Peter before them all, “If you, being a Jew, live in the manner of Gentiles and not as the Jews, why do you compel Gentiles to live as Jews? 15 We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles, 16 knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law but by faith in Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, that we might be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the law; for by the works of the law no flesh shall be justified.

Good day.
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This post has been edited by lurkingaround: Apr 2 2020, 01:32 PM

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Do you really believe that "gouge out one's eye and chop off our hands", "love your enemy", "turn the other cheek", "lend to all who ask", etc, are part of God's Law.?
....... Didn't Jesus Christ said that He did not come to destroy the Law but you assumed He has raised New Testament laws to replace OT Law or God's Law or Moses Law, eg "You shall gouge out your eyes and chop off your hands" to replace or destroy "You shall not commit adultery".?
....... Did any of the apostles mention these "new laws", raised by Jesus Christ, in their epistles/letter.? (cf; ROMANS.12:19-21)

Seems, you have mostly ignored my answers and Bible quotes and cherry-picked what you wish to believe in the Word of God. Again, for my answers and relevant Bible quotes to your question, please refer to ....... https://forum.lowyat.net/topic/4880254 - Protestant issue #03 - love your enemies.?

Good day.
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Let's see how the Lord/God Jesus Christ gave His Law to Moses and the Jews in 1500 BC and talked to the Jews and Pharisees in 30 AD, .......

EXO.20: = The Ten Commandments

20 And God spoke all these words, saying:

2 “I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.

3 “You shall have no other gods before Me.

4 “You shall not make for yourself a carved image—any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; 5 you shall not bow down to them nor serve them. For I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, 6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.

7 “You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain, for the Lord will not hold him guiltless who takes His name in vain.

8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.

12 “Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long upon the land which the Lord your God is giving you.

13 “You shall not murder.

14 “You shall not commit adultery.

15 “You shall not steal.

16 “You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.

17 “You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his male servant, nor his female servant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor’s.”

The People Afraid of God’s Presence

18 Now all the people witnessed the thunderings, the lightning flashes, the sound of the trumpet, and the mountain smoking; and when the people saw it, they trembled and stood afar off. 19 Then they said to Moses, “You speak with us, and we will hear; but let not God speak with us, lest we die.”

20 And Moses said to the people, “Do not fear; for God has come to test you, and that His fear may be before you, so that you may not sin.” 21 So the people stood afar off, but Moses drew near the thick darkness where God was.
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MATT.5:27-30 = Adultery in the Heart

27 “You have heard that it was said to those of old, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’ 28 But I say to you that whoever looks at a woman to lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart. 29 If your right eye causes you to sin, pluck it out and cast it from you; for it is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell. 30 And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and cast it from you; for it is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell.

Do you think Jesus Christ was raising a law at MATT.5:27-30.? For my answer, see my link above.
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Your question is more appropriate and effective for unconverted Jews and Gentiles like aral3005 and the Pharisees of 30 AD. Your question has no effect on me, a long time Christian, who knew about justification by faith alone and not by the works of the Law many many years ago.
....... Like I told you a few times, going round and round, my answer is found in my link above and in the early pages of this thread.

The more important thing is your erroneous belief that Jesus Christ raised new laws at MATT.5:17-48, when He did no such thing, eg "You shall gouge out your eyes and chop off your hands"; and that nobody can actually keep the Law.

At MAAT.5:17-48, Jesus Christ was only challenging the Jews' and Pharisees' false assurance that they were still going to be saved from hell by just keeping the Law, eg did not commit murder, adultery, blasphemy, etc. This was because the Old Covenant of the Law was going to be replaced by the New Covenant of Faith by the impending death of Jesus Christ on the Cross, wrt salvation from hell. See also LUKE.16:19-31, MATT.17:3 & 27:53, 1PETER.3:19 & 4:6. .......
https://forum.lowyat.net/topic/4886095 - post #18 - What is the difference between the beliefs of Jews vs Christians wrt salvation from hell.? Issue #19

Good day.
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This post has been edited by lurkingaround: Apr 2 2020, 03:26 PM

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Up till the ministry of Christ in 30AD, the Jews and Pharisees believed they were going to be saved from hell by keeping the Law, which was true, as I explained in my above post and link.

One of the extra point of MATT.5:27-30 was that if the Jews and Pharisees had no eyes and no limbs, they would not be able to immorally sexually lust at another man's wife or sister or daughter or grand-daughter and go on to commit adultery with the woman even if the men wanted to.

IMO,
If they had accepted this challenge = gouge out their eyes and chop off their limbs, Jesus Christ would truly have granted them salvation from hell since they actually believed in Him and His Word. But all of them declined the challenge for the Bible recorded no such persons gouging out their eyes and chopping off their limbs.
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Your earlier statements show that you falsely believe that Jesus Christ has raised new laws at MATT.5:21-48, eg "You shall gouge out your eyes and chop off your hands."

Only your last few statements "Did Jesus Christ say those things." tried to divert attention from your earlier statements.
....... It's like you trying to change the goal post when proven wrong by Scripture, in order for you to try to score a goal.

Good day.
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"'''''' Up till the ministry of Christ in 30AD, the Jews and Pharisees believed they were going to be saved from hell by keeping the Law, which was true, as I explained in my above post and link. ''''''''

Believe is faith. If the Jews and Pharisees did not believe or have faith they were going to be saved from hell by keeping the Law, as promised by God, they would not have kept or done it, eg the rich Jewish man of LUKE.16:19-31 who was cursed by God with dying young and then ended up in Hades for intentionally or willfully breaking the Law at DEUT.15:11 repeatedly, ie by not doing charity to the poor like beggar Lazarus every Sabbath year.

Keeping the Law does not equate to no-faith. The Jews, Jesus Christ, apostles and early and latter Christians kept the Law. It is what you believe the Law will do for you, as promised by God, that is important. Will the keeping of the Law save you from hell or just get you earthly blessings from God(DEUT.28).? See also 1PETER.3:19 & 4:6.
....... Before the ministry of Christ, only Jews who kept the Law could be saved from hell because they believed or had faith in God for it to be so, eg beggar Lazarus, Moses, Elijah, etc = the Old Covenant of the Law. Abraham and Noah were under different personal covenants with God. Covenants is like a business contract between 2 parties.
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PS - Like I said before, Christians keep the Law from within (= by the power of the Holy Spirit of God dwelling in them) = in-Christ the Law is fulfilled; whereas Jews and others keep the Law from without(= compelled by law-enforcers). Problem is, certain Christians ignore and/or reject some of God's Law for various reasons = the Spirit could not work fully in them, eg those who believe in the false teachings of Hypergrace, Antinominianism, Prosperity Gospel, LGBTQism, etc.
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This post has been edited by lurkingaround: Apr 3 2020, 12:37 AM

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We are arguing about why we have such Christians, .......

https://www.thestar.com.my/news/nation/2020...out-despite-mco -
Own goal part two: 24 Catholic seminarians punished for kickabout despite MCO - Thursday, 02 Apr 2020
GEORGE TOWN: Twenty four seminarians, including a priest, pleaded guilty at George Town Magistrate Court to flouting the movement control order (MCO).
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MARK.7: = Defilement Comes from Within

7 Then the Pharisees and some of the scribes came together to Him, having come from Jerusalem. 2 Now when they saw some of His disciples eat bread with defiled, that is, with unwashed hands, they found fault. 3 For the Pharisees and all the Jews do not eat unless they wash their hands in a special way, holding the tradition of the elders. 4 When they come from the marketplace, they do not eat unless they wash. And there are many other things which they have received and hold, like the washing of cups, pitchers, copper vessels, and couches.

5 Then the Pharisees and scribes asked Him, “Why do Your disciples not walk according to the tradition of the elders, but eat bread with unwashed hands?”

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

6 He answered and said to them, “Well did Isaiah prophesy of you hypocrites, as it is written:

‘This people honors Me with their lips,
But their heart is far from Me.
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And in vain they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’

8 For laying aside the commandment of God, you hold the tradition of men—[d]the washing of pitchers and cups, and many other such things you do.”

9 He said to them, “All too well you reject the commandment of God, that you may keep your tradition. 10 For Moses said, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘He who curses father or mother, let him be put to death.’ 11 But you say, ‘If a man says to his father or mother, “Whatever profit you might have received from me is Corban”—’ (that is, a gift to God), 12 then you no longer let him do anything for his father or his mother, 13 making the word of God of no effect through your tradition which you have handed down. And many such things you do.”

14 When He had called all the multitude to Himself, He said to them, “Hear Me, everyone, and understand: 15 There is nothing that enters a man from outside which can defile him; but the things which come out of him, those are the things that defile a man. 16 If anyone has ears to hear, let him hear!”

17 When He had entered a house away from the crowd, His disciples asked Him concerning the parable. 18 So He said to them, “Are you thus without understanding also? Do you not perceive that whatever enters a man from outside cannot defile him, 19 because it does not enter his heart but his stomach, and is eliminated, thus purifying all foods?” 20 And He said, “What comes out of a man, that defiles a man. 21 For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, 22 thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lewdness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness. 23 All these evil things come from within and defile a man.”
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No, I think you are quite wrong about the original source and path of fallen Man's evil or wickedness or sins/law-breaking from the devil, which is spiritual or unseen.
....... Like they say, knives and guns do not kill by themselves, certain people who use them do. Similarly for our eyes and hands which can be used for good or evil depending on the owners' heart - are they for God/Jesus or for the devil/mammon.?
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This post has been edited by lurkingaround: Apr 2 2020, 08:39 PM

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You fail to see that the root problem in fallen Man mentioned by MATT.5:27-30 is the heart, not the eyes and hands, as per MARK.7:21-23.

Since the Fall and Adam's Original Sin, there has been a grave spiritual problem with fallen Man's heart, eg GEN.6:5 = God regretted He created evil and wickedly-hearted Man and wanted to destroy all of them with a Great Flood but Noah found grace in the eyes of God.

It is this fallen condition of Man's heart that will be sending them to hell, not Man's eyes and hands = they are in need of a Saviour/Messiah/Christ to save them from hell and to transform their hearts of stone into live-in-Christ hearts = Christians who will do good works of the Law from within their new born-again of the Spirit hearts. It is not their eyes and hands that will be born-again of the Spirit(HEB.8:10 & 10:15 = God implants His laws in their hearts and minds, not in their eyes and hands).
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This post has been edited by lurkingaround: Apr 2 2020, 09:06 PM

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Your interpretation of Jesus Christ saying, "You shall gouge out your eyes and chop off your hands." at MATT.5:27-30 as a law, is not found in God's Law in the Old Testament. So, it is a "new law" which you falsely claimed that Jesus Christ has raised to replace or destroy the old law of "You shall not commit adultery." = earlier you challenged me to keep this "new law" by gouging out my eyes and chopping off my hands to prove that I can keep the Law since I had questioned your previous statement that "nobody can actually keep the Law." as not in accordance with the Scripture at MATT.19:16-22 and ROMANS.2:14 which showed that even Jews and Greeks/Gentiles could keep the Law by not committing intentional or willful sins/law-breaking/evil-deeds.

In fact, Jesus Christ Himself stated that the law, "You shall not commit adultery.", was an old law or a law which applied to those of old; and He did not classify His Word about plucking out your eyes and cutting off your hands as a law. Only you have falsely claimed that Jesus Christ raised the law of gouging out your eyes and chopping off your hands. If as you falsely claimed, to me that is a "new law" vs the old law, similar to NT vs OT. .......

MATT.5:27-30 = Adultery in the Heart

27 “You have heard that it was said to those of old, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’ 28 But I say to you that whoever looks at a woman to lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart. 29 If your right eye causes you to sin, pluck it out and cast it from you; for it is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell. 30 And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and cast it from you; for it is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell.

Good day.
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This post has been edited by lurkingaround: Apr 3 2020, 12:22 AM