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 Clearing stocks before the coming crash, what have I missed out in the analysis?

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markedestiny
post Jan 8 2019, 02:40 PM

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QUOTE(icemanfx @ Jan 8 2019, 02:25 PM)
Official numbers like economic recession gdp data is normally lagging behind the market.
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That's right, this has been proven during the previous recession. Based on what I have read and gathered, I would think that we may be already at the early phase of recession. This is still very much debatable as opinions are split on this.

markedestiny
post Jan 10 2019, 01:23 PM

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QUOTE(Singh_Kalan @ Jan 9 2019, 04:46 PM)
If you practice the below, you will never make money from stock in a long run.  Its either you time your selling wrongly OR miss out on the rebound.  Always stay in the market is the key to long term growth.  As wise man say, timing the market is for fools.

Clearing stocks before the coming crash, what have I missed out in the analysis?
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OK, I can understand what you are saying as I have the same thoughts initially but I have since change my perspectives. Some veterans here already shared experience about difficulties in timing the market or seeking out the bottom during recession. Also with the widespread use of algo/robo trading, the market have become even more volatile compared to the previous recession in 2008/09, which is what is happening to the market now. Further, not sure how long the coming recession will last, months or years. The market I here refers more to the US market, which I follow more, not so much of the asean market.

What do you think is the best approach or strategy for the current volatile market and glooming days ahead?
markedestiny
post Jan 17 2019, 09:25 PM

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QUOTE(Ancient-XinG- @ Jan 16 2019, 03:57 PM)
the market really gone haywire.

bad news but indices gone otherwise...
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This is what they called value trap rally or more bluntly suckers rally. Hopefully not, but let's see

markedestiny
post Feb 19 2019, 02:08 PM

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I realised that I have changed in my investment strategy during these period while waiting for the 'recession' after having been away from this forum and reading up various investment related articles, news, foreign forums, etc.

I decided to stay invested, gradually in small sum and lately have started to invest on good stocks which have been deeply undervalued since end December 2018 and if these met my consideration of risk/reward aspect. These stocks may dive, but hopefully not too deep if recession happens but I am going to long on these.


markedestiny
post Feb 19 2019, 02:38 PM

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QUOTE(cezardewitt @ Feb 19 2019, 02:29 PM)
mind sharing which stocks youre invested in? would like to have a look
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Which market are you in? If local market, I have exited for cash position except for one two REITs
markedestiny
post Feb 20 2019, 10:18 AM

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QUOTE(Boon3 @ Feb 20 2019, 09:22 AM)
Markets trades to as per future expectations...
Many months ago, the US stocks traded based on insane earnings projections.
Without those rocket numbers (many implied CAGR profits of close to 30% laugh.gif) , markets were simply pricey.
Then the trade tariffs came.
Profits started to slump and the market reacted in EXPECTATION of lower earnings...
Now we have the trade talks... which implies the possibility that profits declines could end....
Hence the markets .........

Perhaps this is proving CLEARLY again that you do not and should not attempt to time the market (LIKE ANTICIPATION OF A MARKET CRASH).....

icon_rolleyes.gif
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It's risk mitigation for some people with all the signals/charts/data or whatever analysis that they are monitoring especially if they are heavily invested in equities and they are learning from history...

For myself, I am new to stock and I am wary too of the market news and signals..some waited by the side for the recession to happen with the assumption that this is a one time drop and got ample time to invest on the cheap before the market goes up again (I admitted I have this assumption or idealism initially). I realised during the market rout last December where most expected a 'santa rally' but it turned out to be a significant drop, it's too fast to catch hold and react to the market and opportunities are gone.

Now I decided to stay invested, very selectively and gradually in small sum and add as I go along with the goal of buying more if recession do come by around the corner.
markedestiny
post Feb 20 2019, 01:19 PM

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QUOTE(Boon3 @ Feb 20 2019, 11:32 AM)
Yes, of course, understanding and managing the risk is utterly paramount but shouldn't one understand the theory and risk of a particular strategy first? The strategy of clearing stocks assuming a crash would happen is simply predicting an event would happen. And such a strategy is simply risky itself as the user would most likely get it wrong by either exiting the stocks way too early or way too late.

And then recessionary data. Such data is lagging. The confirmation of recession might take several months after it has happened... or not.

If you are new to stocks and I have one and only advice. Paper trade or paper invest.. Many lose money because they don't have the patience to study in depth the markets and the trading or investing strategies... They just dive in.... and when they are wrong, they never admit they are wrong by cutting losses. They just sit and hope that the market will go up back to their cost and correct their initial mistakes... A 50% drop in a stock, would need the stock to double up just to recover their cost....
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That's why I have stay invested, selectively. Already invested in KLSE, SGX and HKEX.
markedestiny
post Feb 22 2019, 10:03 AM

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QUOTE(Boon3 @ Feb 21 2019, 02:22 PM)
... er...
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yes? I do appreciate your advice smile.gif
markedestiny
post Feb 26 2019, 02:08 PM

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QUOTE(plumberly @ Feb 26 2019, 01:27 PM)
That company is one of the big sisters and yet it dropped by 55% in 2008 crash.

During recession, fundamental skeleton can still break down, though not as much as those not so fundamentally strong. Eg Maybank took a hit as well.

Just my 2 cents.
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I am kinda agreed with his statement, when recession comes, there will be 'blood on the street' regardless how strong fundamentally the stock is until the market recovers.


markedestiny
post Feb 26 2019, 02:13 PM

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QUOTE(Krv23490 @ Feb 26 2019, 01:33 PM)
LOL better dont need say anything in that case..

sharing a counter which you sold will make people know who you are ? Ha

you are a funny man, preaching people about recession and saying you are not timing the market but contradicting what you say in the same sentence. Haaa
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There is no lesson to be learnt from knowing the exact counters he bought as his entrance/exit timing, market conditions, etc are too varied and besides, everyone has different investment strategy or risk tolerance mindset.
markedestiny
post Feb 26 2019, 02:53 PM

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QUOTE(Boon3 @ Feb 26 2019, 02:31 PM)
Of course that's true but that's only if and if the recession is proven to be true. Right?

The problem is the assumption that the recession will happen.......
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The assumptions could come from some of the recession indicators which one could make reference to, but these are not crystal ball to predict exactly when it will happen...so yeah, up to one's risk appetite to decide for himself.

Although TS tried seeking opinion on his exit strategy, the decision on this is solely his, and he has managed to exit just before the December rout lol rclxms.gif

If i recalled, TS has shared some of the criteria which seems to be the fundamentals of the stocks he bought and hence his decision on when to exit. It is just my opinion that his criteria has too many fundamentals to consider for each stocks but he managed anyway.

Looking back, I am interested if he ticked all the criteria he set for his stocks when he exit? biggrin.gif plumberly?
markedestiny
post Feb 26 2019, 03:44 PM

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QUOTE(Krv23490 @ Feb 26 2019, 03:34 PM)
That's why I ask for his stock which he exited, so we can see share knowledge and insight of his rationale as well. But oh well.. private.. lol

No harm I feel, but just to share knowledge
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No, I am not asking about what his stocks were, but rather whether he ticked off the list of criteria he set before making his final decision to exit. smile.gif
markedestiny
post Mar 3 2019, 02:07 PM

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QUOTE(plumberly @ Mar 3 2019, 10:13 AM)
Saw a TV report recently and yes, it was on one of my favourite subjects,  the current touch and go volatile stock markets & economy. Ha.

Mentioned to review one's investment portfolio as we are now at the tail END of this EXTRA LONG CYCLE. Sensible and wise thing to do.

Try this quiz ….

Assume stock indices in the USA & Europe dropped by more than 13% overnight, what would you do the next morning?

AA
Stay calm and collected, do nothing, it will be OK days later.  hmm.gif
If the drop is too fast for me to react, I will stay put and do nothing. It may not be ok in days but months or years, will wait it out, no choice.

Wait for 2-5 days, get out if confirmed it is a real global crash (>20% in 2 or more major indices), stay put if it is just a correction.  brows.gif
In reality,  you won't have the luxury of 2-5 days to confirm; for example look at last December Xmas drop. It caught everyone off guard. But if you have stay put, the market will go back to normal as it is now

CC
Start selling some or all shares.  bruce.gif
Nope, see above

DD
Contact your best friend or fund manager for advice.  icon_question.gif
I think if you depend on others for opinions or decisions,  you may not have the knowledge & you may want to stick to index funds or etf only.  The market has an intrinsic tendency to transfer monies or riches from the unknowledgeable to the knowledgeable investors.

EE
Demand DTM or PH to freeze KLCI till this storm is over  cry.gif

FF
Review your homework on your top 10 companies for investing when the prices are right.  rclxm9.gif
Yes, currently doing this, looking for stocks which were heavily discounted

GG
???
Don't play margin or borrowings, if not gg

Mind sharing your answer and why you selected that option? No right or wrong answer. Everyone is different, different situation, different needs, different views, etc.

Food/wine for thought …

LOOKING AHEAD is creating your own luck when preparation meets opportunities.

AWARENESS is the first step to improvement

ANALYSIS is the muscle of success

ACTION crosses the final hurdle to SUCCESS

. . . . . . .  ©   A . . S i m p l e . .  M a n
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My opinions in blue. Edited this, can't seem to get it right using mobile initially.

This post has been edited by markedestiny: Mar 4 2019, 09:32 AM
markedestiny
post Mar 3 2019, 11:04 PM

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QUOTE(plumberly @ Mar 3 2019, 08:53 PM)
Ya, sometimes with problems when using mobile.

Don't quite get it which is your preference when there is a >13% dip in major indices though you have covered all.

Cheerio.
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You mistaken me with another person, it's not me who said that 13%. Curious too, why 13% is the trigger point.
markedestiny
post Mar 4 2019, 09:33 AM

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QUOTE(plumberly @ Mar 4 2019, 08:22 AM)
13% came from me. I used that in the scenario to see how people will react at the start of a storm.
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Ok, now I have edited the post again, as in blue fonts.
markedestiny
post Mar 28 2019, 11:09 AM

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QUOTE(plumberly @ Mar 28 2019, 10:58 AM)
If the inverted yield data is valid/applicable/normal distribution etc, then with

** 68% probability (1 standard deviation), the recession may hit us by May 2020
** 95% probability (2 standard deviations), the recession may hit us by Oct 2020

DISCLAIMER : Take the above with a tonne of salt.  devil.gif  icon_question.gif  doh.gif  sweat.gif  thumbup.gif
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Did the inverted curve stayed longer than 10days? If not, the above still applicable? devil.gif
markedestiny
post Mar 28 2019, 01:55 PM

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QUOTE(plumberly @ Mar 28 2019, 12:40 PM)
Tak tahu lah.
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For the 3m/10y inverted curve to be an accurate predicative recession tool, some analysts pointed out it has to stay inverted for weeks or one good month to begin your countdown....

Also the 3m/1y curve is supposedly widely used in US banks, so this could be a self fulfilling prediction.


markedestiny
post Mar 28 2019, 01:59 PM

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QUOTE(ViktorJ @ Mar 28 2019, 12:51 PM)
Disclaimer: I am not contradicting anyone here, my personal stance is pretty bearish. This is just for purely academic/discussion purposes.

https://seekingalpha.com/article/4251345-yi...me-highs-stocks  <--- talking about how inaccurate inverted yield curves are
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I can't seem to find the article content highlighting the duration of the inverted curve for it to be effective, so take it with a pinch of salt.
markedestiny
post Jul 10 2019, 01:10 PM

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QUOTE(Showtime747 @ Jul 10 2019, 09:55 AM)

I would say global banking health is at +5 now
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Thank you for your insights.

The above quoted took into consideration the current crisis that Deutsche Bank is facing ?

Do you think this crisis could be one of the catalysts to recession similar to what happened to Lehman Bro in 2008 ?
markedestiny
post Jul 10 2019, 02:33 PM

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QUOTE(Yggdrasil @ Jul 10 2019, 01:17 PM)
Next economic crisis unlikely to be banks. Banks already learnt their lesson.
Last time anyone can simply get a loan. Now there is stringent background checks and improved accounting standards to provide better financial reporting.
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I am not too convinced yet about the bolded above. Goldman S learned the lesson with its involvement in the 1MDB post 2008?

Nonetheless just to clarify in this context I am just point the coincidental parallel between Lehman Bro and Deutsche Bank and the catalysts to recession could be multifaceted.

This post has been edited by markedestiny: Jul 10 2019, 02:34 PM

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