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 AMD Ryzen, AM4 / AM5 Platform

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cstkl1
post Jan 18 2021, 01:23 PM

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QUOTE(Bonchi @ Jan 18 2021, 01:15 PM)
it at stock tho.. hmm I shall bump up the SoC voltage to some high value first and monitor. Then gotta have a learn at LLC with ryzen... kinda unknown territory to me because since its already giving problems at stock, i didnt touch overclocking.
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hmm it should not be soc

those are not part of vrm loadline. theres no vid request.
i would go higher loadline. enable full cstate btw. test fft112 avx/avx2 disabled fft in place. at fixed frequency starting from say your spec idle frequency to all core load. vcore auto ya. make sure sll vid request option are enabled to allow cpu to control vid request from vrm.

also
i am not sure ryzen shows this
but hwinfo (not sensor)
under the cpu.. info .. if you scroll down you should be able to see the loadline in mohm.
hopefully it shows.





cstkl1
post Jan 18 2021, 02:29 PM

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QUOTE(yimingwuzere @ Jan 18 2021, 02:25 PM)
No chance of a 2021 launch. Apple has apparently booked out almost all 5nm capacity at TSMC, and once you factor in Zen releases tend to be systematic to every 5 quarters...

Q1 2017 Zen
Q2 2018 Zen+
Q3 2019 Zen2
Q4 2020 Zen3
Q1 2022 is the most probable release date for 5nm Zen4.
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and focus atm afaik is notebook on highend and workstation cpu

they probably be attacking the ultrabooks

bonchi
from notebook cpu wafers its very apparent
they know they screwed up the desktop binning
rams here are running 3200-3733 afaik
cstkl1
post Jan 20 2021, 03:33 PM

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QUOTE(SSJBen @ Jan 20 2021, 01:17 PM)
Keep an eye on your event viewer at least for a week to spot any event errors. You may not get a bsod or random reboot, but there may be other errors cropping up that you aren't aware of.
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oooi.
dont spoil da zen experience.


cstkl1
post Jan 20 2021, 08:04 PM

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QUOTE(Bonchi @ Jan 20 2021, 05:08 PM)
intel just lansi wanna stick to their own fabs jer.. imagine if they throw to tsmc to do... sure gg. Infact the upcoming future power horse might be apple’s workstation CPU.
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its not fab issue. tsmc cant help.
they cannot get the clock speed high enough to beat cmtlake/rkt

i mean look it took zen 3 chiplet 7nm ..(imc higher fab) 15x the cache, not working cstate, weird pbo, not at all at thermal spec, unknown voltage ranges, ram 3200

to beat a 14nm tech.


cstkl1
post Jan 20 2021, 08:58 PM

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QUOTE(Bonchi @ Jan 20 2021, 08:28 PM)
zen 3 cannot clock so high is their design problem i suppose.. tsmc is just technically a "wafer printer". So far we've not seen tsmc make products that clocks very high but we can see from the same fab, they've made very different chips for very different clients with very different characteristics.
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Afaik fab only just small part. Its always down to design first.

Rklk is seriously diff than cmlk. Alderlake even more. Hint two mc on it. Fivr on secondary rail. Pseudo support with ddr4 kindda nerfs the cpu.
cstkl1
post Jan 22 2021, 01:30 AM

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QUOTE(SSJBen @ Jan 21 2021, 11:05 PM)
Hitman 3 eat up cores like a pig that hasn't been fed for a week. Amazing multi threaded usage.
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errr no it doesnt..

cstkl1
post Jan 22 2021, 04:13 PM

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QUOTE(SSJBen @ Jan 22 2021, 03:07 PM)
user posted image

It does tho.

Look at that workload spread out to all the threads. Hitman 2 wasn't anywhere near this and that game used CPU threads fairly well for its time.
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so u didnt run it or buy the game..

here dartmoor .. like full on physics gunshots/explosions/breaking stuff etc... because of all the physics on a 8core/16 with framerate limit at 144..

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «


thats like the worst scenario gunfight.. which is totally against being a "hitman" "stealth"

its not heavy on da cpu...

core 0/1 is the favoured cored btw.

on 10 core/20 the spread became uneven.. will post that later...
afaik i can tell this game is optimized for 8core. with console in mind.

This post has been edited by cstkl1: Jan 22 2021, 04:15 PM
cstkl1
post Jan 22 2021, 04:16 PM

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QUOTE(SSJBen @ Jan 22 2021, 04:15 PM)
No I haven't bought it yet, doing so tonight.

I'm not saying it's heavy on the CPU, I'm saying that it spreads out workload very nicely on all cores.
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its not bro.. its more of a 8/16.

i tested it on 10/20.. the spread becomes uneven.


cstkl1
post Jan 22 2021, 05:11 PM

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QUOTE(SSJBen @ Jan 22 2021, 05:01 PM)
Your screenshot shows about 36% as the average for all the other cores after core 0 and 2 though? That's not bad considering in Hitman 2 they were barely managing 20% with DX12. That was one of the letdowns of that game when Hitman 1 GOTY was doing much higher than that.
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this on darthmoor benchmark where cpu physics was alot.
dubai benchmark more realistic to actual gameplay

its spread evenly but hardly like darthmoor usage.

also this game is optimized with intel. so could be some bias.
cstkl1
post Jan 23 2021, 06:38 PM

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QUOTE(Cold|Drawn @ Jan 23 2021, 03:55 PM)
depends on how you view things, some of us just like to play around to squeeze more performance out of it.
just like intel, if you OC, you'll definitely run into instability. It's part of the deal.

sometimes, we post here just to see if there's anyone with similar experience so others might share their experience to aid others.

Same goes to intel even in OCN, people share their experience or difficulty and see if there are pros to help them OC better. Bet that's what CST does in OCN to help others too.

Problem is when people see this sort of posts then witch hunt it like some sort of plague.
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intel has nutters also.
if u talk about whea cpu internal paririty error
all act like doesnt happen to them

then u see them posting 1-2 years later saying warzone bsod. they see the error in hwinfo.

reddit, ocn. all same. will not admit its a flaw.
user dude falkentyne that found this issue a inherent flaw on skylake when oced the cache. seems to have happen after all the security patches

i solved it recently with turnaround timings and switching frequency. even i dont dare to say its 100% cause u might get crashes without whea event. alot of ppl been blaming games for crashes..

two games .. thats easy to see this
easiest is ghostrunner with rt enable. on hwinfo and just watch. especially level "climb"
warzone.. crashes.

then ppl go tell Jedi to oc cache. its totally not needed as he has tight turnaround.. cache boost only like 2-3% at this point..

but amd guys in ocn/reddit are fanatics.
ocn i got almost every week rep point deducted warning
reddit just today..
see this
https://www.reddit.com/r/overclocking/comme...utm_name=iossmf

they think its great

rocketlake does 5600 hci stable, 6ghz benching on air. i just leaked that.

all the hate i got was because amd retards.

This post has been edited by cstkl1: Jan 23 2021, 06:43 PM
cstkl1
post Jan 23 2021, 07:55 PM

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QUOTE(yimingwuzere @ Jan 23 2021, 06:56 PM)
TBH 99% of people who post comments like yours usually are fanboys blowing air on their products and actually don't know anyone behind the scenes. If your sources are right, you can link back to that and say "told you so" once the news actually comes out lol.

DDR4-6000 on air sounds great nonetheless. revE or B-die though?

At any rate that poster on 4650G and the RAM LN2 pot shows one huge advantage monolithic has over chiplet design - RAM speeds can go higher on Zen2/3 APUs vs the Zen2/3 7nm + 12nm IO die design. I'm struggling to get my 5800X + Asrock B550 Phantom Gaming ITX + Ballistix 3200C16 dual rank to 3800 in coupled mode. The RAM does 3800 easily when decoupled from IF, I can boot IF on 3800 and pass TM5 anta777 config with my RAM kit on XMP timings too, but can't seem to do both together. Not sure if it's down to CPU, or BIOS at this point.
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Hynix djr...

these dual ranks somemore...

all 80k+ aida read/write..



QUOTE(Cold|Drawn @ Jan 23 2021, 07:25 PM)
problem is problem, whether it be AMD or Intel.

It's just people who can't look at the problem objectively and solve the issue.
normally they comment without really understanding TS's issue, then just proceed to inject their experience that's not helpful at all.

in many cases, just a mock like you guys said.
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I dont get why they all feel threatened. Like defending their purchases.. if its garbage its garbage... just call it as it is..
I believe if the community had been more honest with Zen2 , Zen plus etc.. Zen 3 wouldnt been launch at this current state.
But because all were piling amd.. so they just launched something..


This post has been edited by cstkl1: Jan 23 2021, 07:57 PM
cstkl1
post Jan 23 2021, 08:21 PM

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QUOTE(SSJBen @ Jan 23 2021, 08:17 PM)
That's true. I'm sure Zen 2 would still keep selling like hotcakes even if Zen 3 wasn't released last year. AMD like die die want to release something that isn't ready yet just to get the e peen points over intel.
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they were already winning.

they could have launched a monolithic version of 5600/5800x and won the gaming part.

so far i see 5950x user the most hit. literally 50:50 can work.
cstkl1
post Jan 23 2021, 11:55 PM

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QUOTE(yimingwuzere @ Jan 23 2021, 11:46 PM)
It's just an epeen contest with high RAM speeds. Although IIRC Anandtech did review a Corsair 5000 kit that showed a small improvement over the fastest kits for Ryzen in spite of the decoupled IF/uncore to RAM clock.
Gotta hit their release cycle every 5 quarters for Zen...
All the workload dumped on a tiny 7nm CPU die, no surprise. Saw that with my 5800X on prime95 too. NH-C14S isn't too efficient at cooling it, only 3/7 heatpipes are properly utilised on that one. My old CPU (3770K) also had similar problems vs Sandy Bridge at high clockspeeds too - the smaller die led to less efficient heat transfer to the IHS even with lower power draw vs Sandy, and Intel compounded the issue by switching from solder to paste too.

Another reason monolithic is better on consumer CPUs - the IO/SOC section on the same die can help transfer heat from the cores to the IHS better.
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bro. u are confusing anand noobs with actual "5k" ram oc.

but generally for zen the architecture prefers 1:1

wait till u see rocketlake debunk this silly notion

This post has been edited by cstkl1: Jan 23 2021, 11:55 PM
cstkl1
post Jan 25 2021, 04:08 AM

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QUOTE(SSJBen @ Jan 25 2021, 01:19 AM)
Agree. Hope Rocket Lake does well too so I have a reason to go back to Intel as well.
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QUOTE(xxboxx @ Jan 25 2021, 01:35 AM)
Does Rocket Lake need to do well only will go back to Intel?
If you like the brand then it shouldn't matter what's the performance like. If performance what's matter then doesn't matter what brand it is.
If want the performance but doesn't want the brand, I don't think possible.
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QUOTE(Bonchi @ Jan 25 2021, 02:15 AM)
more like i hope rocketlake is cheap especially the B560 board. Really getting very tight on budget already... but still hoping to get off this platform. Even a 10400F or 10100F on a z490 ITX swap offer i will take without hesitation.

This “AMD experience” has blown my budget. it was originally meant to be a super low budget ITX build under RM4K which ends up literally causing me to buy parts enough to build 2 rigs and sell 1 to solve some issues... costing over RM2K in losses due to depreciation on selling all those used parts... And the random crashing issue is still not solved. bangwall.gif
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what u wanna know about rkt.
actual benchmarks?
whats the metric??

i can tell u.
cstkl1
post Jan 25 2021, 09:15 AM

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QUOTE(xxboxx @ Jan 25 2021, 08:54 AM)
Actual benchmark would be nice. i7 vs 5800X
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stock cpu mce on
3866c14@1.5v
horizon zero dawn favour performance 212fps @1080p
timespy extreme cpu score 6k+
cb20/23 beats 5800x
cb15 about the same.
fc5, new dawn.. err it beats everything
sottr has a bug.
vermintide 2.. this cpu pushing fps > 10900k@5.3
rkt has no bug on whea etc. no LO, etc etc
it either works or bsod.
only 8x pcie 4.0 16x no meaningful diff.

theres a nea mrc code refresh. so nothing been finalized

This post has been edited by cstkl1: Jan 25 2021, 09:18 AM
cstkl1
post Jan 25 2021, 10:11 AM

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QUOTE(terradrive @ Jan 25 2021, 09:47 AM)
What's the real difference between 11700k and 11900k if user manual overclock on Z boards?
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vid binning

same thing as 10850k vs 10900k

intel requirement is highest vid is @1.52
so 11700k-52@ 1.52, 11900k-53@1.52
(dont talk about silicon lottery)

why this a problem

i cant go into specifics for rkt but i can give u
cmtlake as example

typical
4.8 -5.1 .. diff between vid is arnd 120mv.
pretty linear almost 40mv each clock 49,50 etc
but for 5.2.. the jump can be 100mv

so u can gauge how bad 10850k are. how stupid anandtech etc article 10850k=10900k. idiots are talking about
10900k 5.1 vid 1.35-1.36 vs 10850k 1.42-1.44v

so same case with rocket lake but more severe.

This post has been edited by cstkl1: Jan 25 2021, 10:14 AM
cstkl1
post Jan 25 2021, 11:02 AM

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QUOTE(terradrive @ Jan 25 2021, 10:57 AM)
So it depends on the user if they want to save some bucks on lower 100-200mhz overclocks like that right?
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i personally wouldnt bother ocing a 11900k
stock 4.8 equivalent of running 10900k@5.3ghz gaming performance

second for the other part i cant disclose about the vid difference but doubt the noobs of anandtech/gn etc will even notice this since they are so stupid about cmtlake.

This post has been edited by cstkl1: Jan 25 2021, 11:38 AM
cstkl1
post Jan 25 2021, 01:32 PM

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QUOTE(oldKyoo @ Jan 25 2021, 01:15 PM)
Would you be upgrading to the 11900k or sticking with the 10900k? I'm unsure if i want to move to the 11900k if performance is not warranted.
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too early. new mrc code everything changed on ram




cstkl1
post Jan 25 2021, 06:22 PM

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QUOTE(xxboxx @ Jan 25 2021, 03:39 PM)
What GPU used for testing?
All the beats, is by how much? what's the score vs score?
The reality of Intel. But TBH that time 9900KS is the fastest CPU. Got to pay HT tax with Intel.
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rtx 3080
arnd 5% mostly.
a 5900x/5950x with pbo + 3800mhz ram trade blows with it.

its not da K that value.
its the non 7 + b560. they havent finalize the boost clock on it yet.

This post has been edited by cstkl1: Jan 25 2021, 06:24 PM
cstkl1
post Jan 25 2021, 08:15 PM

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QUOTE(Bonchi @ Jan 25 2021, 07:41 PM)
B560 lately confirmed to be memory unlocked but cpu multiplier still locked. That’s why ctskl kept hinting... 11700 non K with a 3800mhz ram will be the best value option at pumping out fps

10400F is quite wasted in terms of potential due to memory lock on B460. It could perform very well with a z490 but the value ratio is off which is like getting an x570 for 3600.
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rkt .. 3866/4000 for gear 1., the cost is sa/io, gain latency
gear 2.. you loose around 10% latency but bandwidth easy 20-40%..

few things
odd ram ratio doesnt work anymore
gear 1 only 100:133
gear 2 you can choose either

before buying anything see how much work has been done on bios. alderlake has just started aib testing. the fae all split.

This post has been edited by cstkl1: Jan 25 2021, 08:21 PM

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