I put in United Asian HY Bond Dist SGD. My favourite fund.

Recommended funds by FSM SG :

Asian Ex Japan : First State Dividend Advantage

YTD : 5.5%
Return : 1 yr (10.26%), 2 yr (12.66%), 3 yr (12.05%)

As for me, i will change the SGD notes in Msia and pass to a friend to bank in Sg bank. Most of them come back every 2-3 month once. Can save TT charges too.

Can try OCBC

The one that you are holding, the Alianz US HY. The price as of Oct 30, 2015 is USD 8.49 per unit and the annual DPU = USD 0.06 per month per unit x 12 = USD0.72 per year.

USD 0.72 / USD 8.49 = 8.48% yield.

HOWEVER : High Yield Bonds are also known as Junk Bonds - that's what many people say. Risk of defaults ?

Or you can change with your friend who's a malaysian and work in Singapore. They need spending money when they go back hometown right? Save even the spread on money changer

Yes you are right. But most of them dont wan. even good friend. Unless you have siblings there.

Yeah i know. But thar is just a small amt in portfolio.

No pain no gain.

What funds are you having nw?

why ar? Takut u makan their money? Change at mid rate means they dont need to lose money to money changer also ma

But the interesting part is I have been carrying a Euro HY Bond Fund for eight years, and right thru the European Crisis too, and till today, the HY Bond Fund is still paying-out 4.17% of yield.

The DPU does go up and down, so does the NAV, but the yield has always been above 4%.

I heard these HY Bond Funds will have their NAVs dropping badly when the US rate hike does happen, but if the FOMC is careful enough not to raise too much, and is data-dependant to decide on when to hike, then the impact to the US-centric HY Bond Funds should be minimal.

I am just waiting to top-up on these US-centric HY Bond Funds, with the view that the US mkt should be able to do well, with the close 'nurturing' of the US Gov't. Are you waiting to top-up too ? What that truely caught my eyes about these HY Bond Funds are their monthly payout feature, with which I can get my hands on my money faster for reinvestment.

Thanks! The fund looks really good

['QUOTE(prince_mk @ Nov 3 2015, 10:52 AM)
I put in United Asian HY Bond Dist SGD. My favourite fund. '
quote=dasecret,Nov 3 2015, 04:04 PM]
Thanks! The fund looks really good

[/quote]

Hi prince and dasecret, this fund got me interested and I looked up in it. Based on the fund properties, looks like the fund was launched way back in May 13, 2013, and it only started paying monthly dividend on April 29. 2014.

https://secure.fundsupermart.com/main/fundi...olnumber=UOB046

Any idea why did it not start to pay dividend upon launching ?

Analysing the dividend payout each month from April 2015 till October 2015, the lowest payout was in July 14, amounting to SGD 0.00662159 per unit.

SGD 0.00662159 x 12 = SGD 0.079458, and SGD 0.079458 / SGD 1.175 (price for Oct 30, 2015) gives a yield of 6.76%, which is a fair yield,... yes !

The dividend does not seem to be consistent every month, unlike the Allianz HY USD Funds which give out quite a consistent dividend. What are the other factors that you guys look at which qualify this fund as being good ?

[quote=Hansel,Nov 3 2015, 05:03 PM]
['QUOTE(prince_mk @ Nov 3 2015, 10:52 AM)
I put in United Asian HY Bond Dist SGD. My favourite fund. '
quote=dasecret,Nov 3 2015, 04:04 PM]
Thanks! The fund looks really good

[/quote]

Hi prince and dasecret, this fund got me interested and I looked up in it. Based on the fund properties, looks like the fund was launched way back in May 13, 2013, and it only started paying monthly dividend on April 29. 2014.

https://secure.fundsupermart.com/main/fundi...olnumber=UOB046

Any idea why did it not start to pay dividend upon launching ?

Analysing the dividend payout each month from April 2015 till October 2015, the lowest payout was in July 14, amounting to SGD 0.00662159 per unit.

SGD 0.00662159 x 12 = SGD 0.079458, and SGD 0.079458 / SGD 1.175 (price for Oct 30, 2015) gives a yield of 6.76%, which is a fair yield,... yes !

The dividend does not seem to be consistent every month, unlike the Allianz HY USD Funds which give out quite a consistent dividend. What are the other factors that you guys look at which qualify this fund as being good ?

[/quote]

I look at fund returns in the form of IRR, and ROI to a lesser extent. Dividend yield is not a consideration for me since I prefer to reinvest and grow my investment

And which Allianz HY are you referring to?
If it is this
https://secure.fundsupermart.com/main/fundi...olnumber=ALZ198

Then the IRR does not look good at all, it's negative for 1 year and 2 year annualised

This post has been edited by dasecret: Nov 3 2015, 05:22 PM

[quote=dasecret,Nov 3 2015, 05:17 PM]
Hi prince and dasecret, this fund got me interested and I looked up in it. Based on the fund properties, looks like the fund was launched way back in May 13, 2013, and it only started paying monthly dividend on April 29. 2014.

https://secure.fundsupermart.com/main/fundi...olnumber=UOB046

Any idea why did it not start to pay dividend upon launching ?

Analysing the dividend payout each month from April 2015 till October 2015, the lowest payout was in July 14, amounting to SGD 0.00662159 per unit.

SGD 0.00662159 x 12 = SGD 0.079458, and SGD 0.079458 / SGD 1.175 (price for Oct 30, 2015) gives a yield of 6.76%, which is a fair yield,... yes !

The dividend does not seem to be consistent every month, unlike the Allianz HY USD Funds which give out quite a consistent dividend. What are the other factors that you guys look at which qualify this fund as being good ?

[/quote]

I look at fund returns in the form of IRR, and ROI to a lesser extent. Dividend yield is not a consideration for me since I prefer to reinvest and grow my investment

[/quote]

Thank you, dasecret,... if you're of that view, then wouldn't a fund that does not pay out dividends at all, not to mention monthly dividends some more, provide you better IRR (hence, leading to ROI too) than this fund ? A fund that keeps all its earnings for would be able to increase its NAV better and faster, right ?

Do you look at its holdings, and the safety of the fund's holdings, since we are dealing with High Yield bonds being the holdings of the funds here ?

I observed that the IRR, or the nav movement started to trend down when the FOMC announced the tapering event last year, followed by the 'threat' of the rate hike this year. Previously, the nav movement was either increasing and remained stable.

I believed that the nav will recover after the FOMC has actually performed the rate hike. But if course, this is left to be seen,... I am waiting for the rate hike.

Why do they have 2 types of fund performance readings - the Offer to Bid and the Bid-to Bid Returns ?

[quote=Hansel,Nov 3 2015, 05:22 PM]
I look at fund returns in the form of IRR, and ROI to a lesser extent. Dividend yield is not a consideration for me since I prefer to reinvest and grow my investment

[/quote]

Thank you, dasecret,... if you're of that view, then wouldn't a fund that does not pay out dividends at all, not to mention monthly dividends some more, provide you better IRR (hence, leading to ROI too) than this fund ? A fund that keeps all its earnings for would be able to increase its NAV better and faster, right ?

Do you look at its holdings, and the safety of the fund's holdings, since we are dealing with High Yield bonds being the holdings of the funds here ?

[/quote]

Sorry.... I'm quite lost here

Have you been following the distribution discussion on FSM MY thread? Basically in the case of reinvested distribution, the dividends have no bearings in your IRR.

I always look at BID TO BID RETURNS
"The performance figures in the table above are calculated using bid-to-bid prices, with any income or dividends reinvested. Performance figures of over 1 year are annualised.(Eg. A 33.1% gain in 3 years works out to a 10% gain per year when annualised.)"

You could be paid monthly dividends, but if it is out of your capital, what is the point? The total return is at a loss actually

Some guides frm FSM Msia V12

Put it simply, dividend is just "left hand go right hand"; there is ZERO IMPACT to the investor's value of holdings.

- Fund XYZ has 100,000 units issued, initially issued at RM1.00
- Current NAV price is RM1.02
- XYZ declares a "10% dividend" of 10 sen a unit
- After the dividend, the NAV will go down to RM0.92

For sake of illustration, we assume that dividends are paid out in cash (not reinvested), and no tax on the distribution.

Ali says: "Eh XYZ very good, gave me 10% returns..."
Answer:
WRONG! The 10% is expressed by reference to the Initial Offer Price of RM1.00 (RM1.00 x 10% = 10 sen). It does not mean that the fund made a profit of 10% for investors. In this scenario, the fund actually only made a return of 2% (RM1.00 + 2% = RM1.02) during the period.

Simply said, just imagine you pass me RM100 to invest in a trolley cart. 1 year later the trolley cart become worth RM92, and I collected rental income of RM10 on your behalf. The value of your investment is now RM102. I then decide to return 10% i.e. RM10 to you. So now u have a RM92 trolley cart and RM10 in cash on hand. The "dividend" that I decided to give you has ZERO IMPACT on the net worth of your investment, which remain at RM102.

Here's another variation to the scenario above; your RM100 investment could actually have incurred a loss, and I could still decide to "reward" you with a 10% "dividend". Let's say a wheel on your trolley was damaged, now your trolley is only worth RM60. The value of your investment is now RM60 + RM10 (rental income received in cash) = RM70. But I could still proudly say that I'm declaring a 10% "dividend" to reward you brows.gif

Key Lesson Point
A unit trust fund can declare dividend even when it has actually made its investors@unitholders poorer. By regulation, a unti trust fund can only declare dividend out of its REALISED INCOMES (interest income, dividend income, net proceed from sale of investments, rental income etc). Gains from market price fluctuations are not realised, i.e. they're "paper gain/(loss)". So, you could be having
(a) Fund A got realised incomes from which to declare dividends, even though during the same period it has huge paper losses.
(b) Fund B made lots of paper gains from market price movements, but it cannot/decided not to declare dividend to unitholders because of insufficient realised incomes. Bear in mind, some funds actually have a "no dividend" policy, and they are great performers. wink.gif

Offer to bid is after deducting standard sales charge; which is higher than FSM's
Bid to bid is without deducting sales charge; that's the number I look at

one should just simply ignore the divident/distribution effect in UT.

What is Offer to Bid Returns (%) & Bid to Bid Returns (%)?
This is on the subject of investment returns of Unit Trusts.

Best Answer
The easiest way to translate this is bid to bid (BB) means before charges (such as broker fees) and offer to bid (OB) means after charges. So a return on a Unit trust that is calculated OB is the return after all of the charges have been taken into account.