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TSphoenixxx
post Aug 1 2016, 10:55 AM

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Started a bit of piping works, and the steel wire for the foundation / support pillar at the back.

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kukeanthong
post Aug 1 2016, 08:02 PM

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QUOTE(phoenixxx @ Aug 1 2016, 10:55 AM)
Started a bit of piping works, and the steel wire for the foundation / support pillar at the back.

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Hi Phoenix..can u please give me ur contractor contact cos i intend to renovate my house too..if this contractor workmanship is good?tq

TSphoenixxx
post Aug 2 2016, 09:33 AM

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QUOTE(kukeanthong @ Aug 1 2016, 08:02 PM)
Hi Phoenix..can u please give me ur contractor contact cos i intend to renovate my house too..if this contractor workmanship is good?tq
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As of now, cannot see his workmanship yet. Slow progress.
sonerin
post Aug 2 2016, 09:51 AM

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Slow progress is not a good sign.
TSphoenixxx
post Aug 2 2016, 10:17 AM

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QUOTE(sonerin @ Aug 2 2016, 09:51 AM)
Slow progress is not a good sign.
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Ya, been chasing him... said he will add workers. Nvm lah, worse come to worst cannot shift in by this year. As long as the final product is good...

He still insist that the job can finish by October. Check a few times with him already. Despite spending 2 months+ mainly hacking. I think he has too many other projects and not enough manpower.
sonerin
post Aug 2 2016, 11:01 AM

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Is also risky with low manpower and trying to complete project. Is over stretching.
kukeanthong
post Aug 5 2016, 12:24 AM

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QUOTE(phoenixxx @ Aug 2 2016, 09:33 AM)
As of now, cannot see his workmanship yet. Slow progress.
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Phoenix..is ok i just need his hp ctc cos i not rushing for renovation.mainly i like ur contractor's bcos his prc is reasonable..tq
TSphoenixxx
post Mar 28 2017, 10:53 AM

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After over a year, my the construction of my house is almost complete. It hasn't been a smooth journey and there were many delays and problems throughout.

As of now, the headaches have not ended. My contractor has just slapped me with a "rough" estimate of additional cost of around RM30-40k. I'm not sure if it could be more. He's also telling me the prices of things have increased this year.

Over the course of the renovation, he would often do or suggest things to me in a way that made me feel he really wanted to build me my perfect dream house. Often, he would suggest, very subtly, that I should add this, or do that a different way. Always reminding me that he wants the best for me and that he's actually putting in extra effort and going the extra mile for me. He even told me he will absorb the cost.

My mistake was believing him that he's really doing all this out of the kindness of his heart. I have not seen the additional bill yet, but all of this will be counted in and "more". Worst still, he has started to count in additional things that he "forgot" to quote previously.

Example, new autogate - forgot to quote armor cable. Washrooms, forgot to quote the countertops. Things like that are too obvious to be left out for an experienced contractor and only now am I realizing that this is his way to squeeze more out of us.

Also, the "more" part is the fact that I would not have agreed to do certain things had I known he will charge me. For example, I would not have changed my old wooden doors who are still in excellent condition only to have him tell me now that the same quality doors now will cost me a bomb. The worst thing is, he took all my old stuff away - wooden doors, my auto gate, the motor, old roof tiles ... everything that had value even when I told him not to.

A lot of these things, had I known the price upfront, I may have opted not to do or change them at all.

Right now, I've paid him 90% and he's already in the safe zone even if he were to stop and leave right now. He has always told me how tight he was and his workers were often unpaid or delayed. Recently, I went through the quote again and calculated all the things that he still has not delivered. Only then I realized that what he has delivered so far is much less than what I have paid him. In other words, I am very much ahead in terms of payments.

And I'm stuck - since now 100% payment is no longer the originally agreed sum, but including the additional things which I haven't seen yet. And what's stopping him from asking more if I continue to pay him? As long as the house is not complete, I will be at his mercy.

Hope all of you undergoing renovations will gain something from my sharing and not repeat my mistakes.

- any "suggestions" that your contractor makes - ask upfront what it will cost you. There is no such thing as "free" or "kind" - no matter how he tries to portray it.

- make note of everything you want to keep (if renovating an old house) and make sure your contractor knows you will calculate it with him if he insist on taking them.

- your itemized, detailed quote is your best friend. Track your progress payments against what the contractor has done so far based on the quote. Over 1 year of dealing with this guy has made me lax and drop my guard.


At this stage, I am really no longer excited about my "Old house to dream house" project. I bit off more than I can chew and embarked on such a huge project and ended up with delays, police reports, syabas, majlis (really, there's more and I couldn't share all of them here) and now being held hostage by this nice guy contractor.

I had my reservations about sharing the contact of this guy to all of you who asked and I'm glad I didn't.

This post has been edited by phoenixxx: Mar 28 2017, 11:13 AM
adrianjc
post Mar 28 2017, 11:17 AM

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QUOTE(phoenixxx @ Mar 28 2017, 10:53 AM)
After over a year, my the construction of my house is almost complete. It hasn't been a smooth journey and there were many delays and problems throughout.

As of now, the headaches have not ended. My contractor has just slapped me with a "rough" estimate of additional cost of around RM30-40k. I'm not sure if it could be more.

Over the course of the renovation, he would often do or suggest things to me in a way that made me feel he really wanted to build me my perfect dream house. Often, he would suggest, very subtly, that I should add this, or do that a different way. Always reminding me that he wants the best for me and that he's actually putting in extra effort and going the extra mile for me. He even told me he will absorb the cost.

My mistake was believing him that he's really doing all this out of the kindness of his heart. I have not seen the additional bill yet, but all of this will be counted in and
"more". Worst still, he has started to count in additional things that he "forgot" to quote previously.

Example, new autogate - forgot to quote armor cable. Washrooms, forgot to quote the countertops. Things like that are too obvious to be left out for an experienced contractor and only now am I realizing that this is his way to squeeze more out of us.

Also, the "more" part is the fact that I would not have agreed to do certain things had I known he will charge me. For example, I would not have changed my old wooden doors who are still in excellent condition only to have him tell me now that the same quality doors now will cost me a bomb. The worst thing is, he took all my old stuff away - wooden doors, my auto gate, the motor, old roof tiles ... everything that had value even when I told him not to.

A lot of these things, had I known the price upfront, I may have opted not to do or change them at all.

Right now, I've paid him 90% and he's already in the safe zone even if he were to stop and leave right now. He has always told me how tight he was and his workers were often unpaid or delayed. Recently, I went through the quote again and calculated all the things that he still has not delivered. Only then I realized that what he has delivered so far is much less than what I have paid him. In other words, I am very much ahead in terms of payments.

And I'm stuck - since now 100% payment is no longer the originally agreed sum, but including the additional things which I haven't seen yet. And what's stopping him from asking more if I continue to pay him? As long as the house is not complete, I will be at his mercy.

Hope all of you undergoing renovations will gain something from my sharing and not repeat my mistakes.

- any "suggestions" that your contractor makes - ask upfront what it will cost you. There is no such thing as "free" or "kind" - no matter how he tries to portray it.

- make note of everything you want to keep (if renovating an old house) and make sure your contractor knows you will calculate it with him if he insist on taking them

- your itemized, detailed quote is your best friend. Track your progress payments against what the contractor has done so far based on the quote. Over 1 year of dealing with this guy has made lax and drop my guard.
At this stage, I am really no longer excited about my "Old house to dream house" project. I bit off more than I can chew and embarked on such a huge project and ended up with delays, police reports, syabas, majlis (really, there's more and I couldn't share all of them here) and now being held hostage by this nice guy contractor.

I had my reservations about sharing the contact of this guy to all of you who asked and I'm glad I didn't.
*
Sorry to hear about your experience. The "missed out costs" I would consider deliberate in some instances but in most cases things like armour cable is easily missed out from adding to project cost if contractor's inundated with work.

Have heard over the years of contractors proposing cheap renovation cost only to have the bills run up when changes are made or added to the original plan. When this happens and the renovation is already underway, you're more or less stuck with these guys.

It's not that they are crooks but these are the tricks of the trade learnt in order to create profit after committing to a lower original cost. So always be dead sure of what you want done before you appoint a contractor, it's not so straight forward but try to minimize changes as much as possible.

If the contractor is purchasing things on your behalf, always insist for the original receipt to be provided to you. It is your right after all. It may be a negligible request but it may avoid unreasonable price bumps in items purchased and always ask for receipt of the place purchased from. Never the contractors own receipt.

This post has been edited by adrianjc: Mar 28 2017, 11:19 AM
TSphoenixxx
post Mar 28 2017, 11:40 AM

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QUOTE(adrianjc @ Mar 28 2017, 11:17 AM)
Sorry to hear about your experience. The "missed out costs" I would consider deliberate in some instances but in most cases things like armour cable is easily missed out from adding to project cost if contractor's inundated with work.

Have heard over the years of contractors proposing cheap renovation cost only to have the bills run up when changes are made or added to the original plan. When this happens and the renovation is already underway, you're more or less stuck with these guys.

It's not that they are crooks but these are the tricks of the trade learnt in order to create profit after committing to a lower original cost. So always be dead sure of what you want done before you appoint a contractor, it's not so straight forward but try to minimize changes as much as possible.

If the contractor is purchasing things on your behalf, always insist for the original receipt to be provided to you. It is your right after all. It may be a negligible request but it may avoid unreasonable price bumps in items purchased and always ask for receipt of the place purchased from. Never the contractors own receipt.
*
Thanks Adrian- it has really been quite the experience.

I went in with a very sure and solid plan (or so I thought) after a lot of research. But sometimes, no amount of research or reading will trump actual work experience. A lot of problems emerged on site and I had to make the do or don't decision relying on the contractor's advice. Those advice don't always come in my best interests and there's where my lack of experience shows. This is my first project and it may very well be my last as I don't want to go through this ever again.

I did my due diligence and interviewed a large number of contractors, including several from this forum and other websites who in hindsight, may have done a better job in a shorter duration. But you know what they say about hindsight.

I fully echo your sentiment to be dead sure on what you want before starting a renovation. I went in with this mindset, but still ended up with changes throughout.

Friends and family who have not embarked on such a project before wonder why I don't just cut him loose. But you seem to understand that it's not that straightforward unless the case is really an extreme case.

I have not asked him for any receipt and at this stage, I don't think he will. Even if he does provide them, I can no longer have the assurance that they are not fake or altered receipts showing inflated numbers.
adrianjc
post Mar 28 2017, 01:03 PM

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QUOTE(phoenixxx @ Mar 28 2017, 11:40 AM)
Thanks Adrian- it has really been quite the experience.

I went in with a very sure and solid plan (or so I thought) after a lot of research. But sometimes, no amount of research or reading will trump actual work experience. A lot of problems emerged on site and I had to make the do or don't decision relying on the contractor's advice. Those advice don't always come in my best interests and there's where my lack of experience shows. This is my first project and it may very well be my last as I don't want to go through this ever again.

I did my due diligence and interviewed a large number of contractors, including several from this forum and other websites who in hindsight, may have done a better job in a shorter duration. But you know what they say about hindsight.

I fully echo your sentiment to be dead sure on what you want before starting a renovation. I went in with this mindset, but still ended up with changes throughout.

Friends and family who have not embarked on such a project before wonder why I don't just cut him loose. But you seem to understand that it's not that straightforward unless the case is really an extreme case.

I have not asked him for any receipt and at this stage, I don't think he will. Even if he does provide them, I can no longer have the assurance that they are not fake or altered receipts showing inflated numbers.
*
Totally understand. 1st time never the easiest, a lot of things we would not know. My first house renovation was an eye opener for me too. More so because it was my first time purchasing a place and also because many unforseen issues cropped up after getting the keys.

Limited available funds at the time to address issues, ended up having to manage own renovation and got in debt to get issues rectified. Made mistakes along the way of course bangwall.gif but learnt a great deal from the experience and guidance from a friend. Second time was a little better but also make some mistakes here and there.

It's a continuous learning process, I just like the process of bringing what was initially a concept and seeing it come to life. I'm not an ID or in a related industry by the way, just enjoy looking at homes under renovation and the final result. wink.gif
TSphoenixxx
post Sep 27 2017, 10:59 AM

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After almost 2 years, my house is done (well, almost).... the contractor ended up running away, and left me with a big mess:
- unfinished wiring and networking cables, and for those done... a huge spider web of mess in my ceilings
- terrible painting and plastering job - had to hire another painter and practically repainted the entire house
- leaky plumbing and sink traps, leaky awning, leaky walls (when raining)
- lots of dirt / stains / paint / rust everywhere
- all upstairs air conditioning practically unusable - 3x rooms ALL leaking, 1x in the living hall with outlet blocked by cement - my guess is unintentional, since i noticed he moved my toilet drainage hole - and didn't inform me / his workers so they must have patched up the air con outlet accidentally. The air con outlets are connected to the toilet drainage. I will have to redo all 4 air cons upstairs...
- the air cons on the ground floor seems OK... but maybe their problems are masked by virtue of them not being on an upper floor... who knows
- couldn't even get my house keys from him - had to cut and change all my locks
- slanting pillars, slanting walls, etc - very apparent when cabinets are in
- tripping fuse boxes
- two very disgruntled, angry neighbors.... seems like I can't have my happy neighborhood as I envisaged.... I don't blame them... seeing as they had to endure this unreasonably long process with no proper site covering, damage to their property etc and hungry workers asking them for food + host of other problems.

There are so many other problems that I can't even finish listing them... basically this whole project was a big Murphy's Law.

I don't know if posting personal details / pictures is allowed, here's his company name... ELEGANCE DESIGN CONCEPT (EDC) Website... last I checked, the website is already down. Anyway, he owns a few others Sdn Bhd's ...

The logo looks like this:

Attached Image

Anyway, after a lot of rectification works I am one step closer towards my new home...

This post has been edited by phoenixxx: Sep 27 2017, 11:06 AM
adrianjc
post Sep 27 2017, 11:11 AM

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QUOTE(phoenixxx @ Sep 27 2017, 10:59 AM)
After almost 2 years, my house is done (well, almost).... the contractor ended up running away, and left me with a big mess:
- unfinished wiring and networking cables, and for those done... a huge spider web of mess in my ceilings
- terrible painting and plastering job - had to hire another painter and practically repainted the entire house
- leaky plumbing and sink traps, leaky awning, leaky walls (when raining)
- lots of dirt / stains / paint / rust everywhere
- all upstairs air conditioning practically unusable - 3x rooms ALL leaking, 1x in the living hall with outlet blocked by cement - my guess is unintentional, since i noticed he moved my toilet drainage hole - and didn't inform me / his workers so they must have patched up the air con outlet accidentally. The air con outlets are connected to the toilet drainage. I will have to redo all 4 air cons upstairs...
- the air cons on the ground floor seems OK... but maybe their problems are masked by virtue of them not being on an upper floor... who knows
- couldn't even get my house keys from him - had to cut and change all my locks
- slanting pillars, slanting walls, etc - very apparent when cabinets are in
- tripping fuse boxes
- two very disgruntled, angry neighbors.... seems like I can't have my happy neighborhood as I envisaged.... I don't blame them... seeing as they had to endure this unreasonably long process with no proper site covering, damage to their property etc and hungry workers asking them for food + host of other problems.

There are so many other problems that I can't even finish listing them... basically this whole project was a big Murphy's Law.

I don't know if posting personal details / pictures is allowed, here's his company name... ELEGANCE DESIGN CONCEPT (EDC) Website... last I checked, the website is already down. Anyway, he owns a few others Sdn Bhd's ...

The logo looks like this:

Attached Image

Anyway, after a lot of rectification works I am one step closer towards my new home...
*
Shit... sorry to hear that dude... if you need someone to help you out to finish up the place do let me know and i'll do some introductions.

Would suggest to get someone to properly look through the house before you move in coz its a major hassle to do any rectification work once you're already living in the house. Just my advice based on previous experience.

TSphoenixxx
post Sep 27 2017, 11:14 AM

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Had a contractor climb up my water tank slab recently as I noticed water marks on the toilet ceiling beneath when raining... water outlets not done properly, slab was not slanted right and there were cracks and mess all over. He couldn't do much except to just silicone over wherever he could.

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adrianjc
post Sep 27 2017, 11:17 AM

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QUOTE(phoenixxx @ Sep 27 2017, 11:14 AM)
Had a contractor climb up my water tank slab recently as I noticed water marks on the toilet ceiling beneath when raining... water outlets not done properly, slab was not slanted right and there were cracks and mess all over. He couldn't do much except to just silicone over wherever he could.

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*
yikes!
TSphoenixxx
post Sep 27 2017, 11:21 AM

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And this is his trademark slanting pillars (and walls too).

Attached Image


Thanks adrian, but I have already moved in... nothing much could be done until the next major rectification... for now the leaking seems to have stopped. Maybe in a few years I will have to majorly repair this Palace of Shitstorms...
halcyon27
post Sep 27 2017, 11:34 AM

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QUOTE(phoenixxx @ Sep 27 2017, 11:14 AM)
Had a contractor climb up my water tank slab recently as I noticed water marks on the toilet ceiling beneath when raining... water outlets not done properly, slab was not slanted right and there were cracks and mess all over. He couldn't do much except to just silicone over wherever he could.

Attached Image Attached Image
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Sorry to hear that bro. Sika would do a good job covering the slab from weathering and leaks. Is there a drain trap to prevent ponding during rain? The rectangular piece is left over roof tile?
adrianjc
post Sep 27 2017, 11:34 AM

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QUOTE(phoenixxx @ Sep 27 2017, 11:21 AM)
And this is his trademark slanting pillars (and walls too).

Attached Image
Thanks adrian, but I have already moved in... nothing much could be done until the next major rectification... for now the leaking seems to have stopped. Maybe in a few years I will have to majorly repair this Palace of Shitstorms...
*
If leaking reoccurs, try to find those swimming pool / pond type water proofing, it's like a layer of rubberized compound. Just needs to be applied to the entire concrete roof. Not hard to get done, but best to pick a hot day so it cures properly.
TSphoenixxx
post Sep 27 2017, 11:41 AM

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QUOTE(adrianjc @ Sep 27 2017, 11:34 AM)
If leaking reoccurs, try to find those swimming pool / pond type water proofing, it's like a layer of rubberized compound. Just needs to be applied to the entire concrete roof. Not hard to get done, but best to pick a hot day so it cures properly.
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Thanks for the tip... the plan is to empty the water tank and move it out of the way, then do layers of waterproofing (will find out more about your swimming pool type as well).

The square hole at the side is the outlet that leads directly to the back gutter.

The rectangular thing is an additional piece of concrete for the water tank to sit on... supposedly for more strength / anti-leaking

This post has been edited by phoenixxx: Sep 27 2017, 11:42 AM
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post Sep 27 2017, 11:46 AM

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Check piping also due to age.... later when move in every leak then damn troublesome


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