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 TAMIYA Mini4WD Le V15, Lets remp-it and loncat loncat!

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soulfly
post Mar 4 2015, 06:34 PM

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QUOTE(moron88 @ Mar 4 2015, 02:51 PM)
Can I ask what is the Difference between 19mm and other smaller roller for front roller? Cornering speed and straight lane speed differences ?
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If the overall width between the left & right front rollers and the left & right rear rollers are the same

- different roller sizes allows you to use different type of attachments depending on whatever you currently have (different stabilizer sizes/styles, hole attachment options on your multi-roller stay plates, etc.)
- effect on roller angle adjustments (bigger roller usually needs lesser angle compared to smaller roller because it cuts corner more)

The whole 'cornering speed vs straight lane speed' is actually an outdated guide, only applies if you have wider roller setting at the front compared to the back. Nowadays we usually set up our rollers parallel because we have multiple roller attachments, unlike back then.
soulfly
post Mar 5 2015, 10:00 AM

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QUOTE(Cim~ @ Mar 4 2015, 09:38 PM)
Hello again,

On my last week race, our champ had a freaking 16 sec best time on the high speed track. My cars' best time was 21+ sec. sad.gif

I ran out of options / ideas on what to do on my current resources:
MA and AR chassis
both in 3.5 gear ratio
both in super large hard tires
Mach Dash for MA
Ultra for AR
Both in rear sliding damper
Both DA 12-13mm in front
Both 19 mm at back (single roller)

Currently, I applied counter gears using small diameter washers. I think it improved performance since I did not charge my battery since the race (Sunday) and it was still able to get 21 secs.

My MS lightweight project is still on hold due to budget.

What I noticed is that every try I spray McKenic Contact Cleaner on the gears and motor, the results were erratic. Sometimes it gets 21, then 22, then 23 secs and go back to 21. I think it's time to use motor oils and grease. Up to now, I only used McKenice Contact Cleaner (orange) as the lubricant of gears and motor. Any advise on what to purchase and what to mix (magic formulas) for the oil? Does use of grease and motor oil make a very big advantage compared to McKenic / RP7?

PS: What does AKD mean?
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with such limited options (and your racing style is way different than most of us here do), I suggest that you pay attention on your battery and motor

1. Get a digital battery volt checker. I assume that organizers only check your battery, but does not measure the battery voltage? You can pump your battery to the fullest by using only a normal fast charger. Charge your battery to its fullest, then take it off the charger to cool down. Check the voltage. Then, just before your turn to race, put the battery back in and let it sit on charge for about 10~30 secs. Then check the voltage again and see if the reading is higher than before. If the reading is satisfactory, then go race. ALWAYS use fully charged battery for each run, otherwise you wont get the best time.

2. Your motor probably needs a good break-in, or it's probably dirty already. Personally I only use very little Singer oil for break-in, and only clean my motor using the green tin McKenic CC, but only after so many runs or whenever I think the motor gets weaker or sound sloppy. I would never ever use the orange tin or blue tin ones. I know some prefer those, but they're too greasy for my liking. For me it's always the green McKenic for cleaning, and Singer oil for lubrication. No special formula for me.


soulfly
post Mar 6 2015, 01:15 AM

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QUOTE(Cim~ @ Mar 6 2015, 12:10 AM)
I have hard tires from the Super Large Tires. As the locals here saw my car run, they advised me to trim it since it is still bouncing on jumps.
I do monitor the battery. My Eneloop 1900 battery volt reading is 1.47 to 1.48. I charged it the night before and let it charge again before the race.

Do u think using McKenic (WD40 the like) both cleaning and and lubrication is not enough? Should I use a slightly thick oil for lubricating both gears and motor?
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McKenic green - contact cleaner
McKenic orange - contact cleaner + lubricant
McKenic blue - contact cleaner + lubricant + other stuff

I personally do not like using 2-in-1 stuffs because I do not have control the amount or ratio of the liquid used.
I use 'dry break-in' method, and I will only apply very little Singer oil through the hole on the motor cap after I run-in the motor to satisfactory. I almost never re-apply oil again after that unless I feel like re-tuning my motor.
And I will only use McKenic green (contact cleaner only) if I think my motor needs re-tuning. But these days, I rarely even touch contact cleaner because motors which already break-in nicely doesn't last very long.

Use thinnest possible oil you can find for mini4wd use. Never use thick oils. You could use tiny amount of grease for chassis where it touches moving parts.

Get the Singer oil for lubrication purposes. They're cheap and light. Forget about those fancy expensive RC lubricants.

user posted image

And this needle tip bottle too... really handy for lubing your motor. You could find this from vape/e-ciggarette sellers.

user posted image

This post has been edited by soulfly: Mar 6 2015, 01:17 AM
soulfly
post Mar 6 2015, 11:59 AM

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QUOTE(Mikeyz @ Mar 6 2015, 08:30 AM)
I'm also in the same boat as u ,my MA was having 27.x sec when the TQ is 23.x second at my last attended race due to MA originally is heavier on weight itself .
Now I'm learning how to reduce the weight of both MA & AR to get a better speed so will potong here & there .
The battery & motor is always the key to achieve good track time . No doubt .
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AR chassis is good, you don't have to worry much about weight reduction because the sturdiness of the chassis itself is more useful especially in races where you can use Sprint Dash motor, vs those popular and fast MS chassis with Mach Dash Pro. For single shaft motor chassis, AR will have some advantage over S2 on courses with many corners. AR vs MS usually have 50-50 chance of winning on this kind of layout when sprint and mach are used. Keep the MA for something else, just not for speed.

Concentrate more on your motor tuning and battery performance.
Make sure all rollers are super smooth, and wheel bearings spin freely.

Roller position will also determine your cornering speed and stability.

Ballcaps will reduce your car speed at corners because of the soft plastic can give some braking effect. Alternatively, use some old chassis plastic bearing on top and lock it with nut.

For rear rollers, use 830 on top, 620 at the bottom. This is to reduce drag, only top rollers will guide the car at most of the time, while the bottom will help some stability during cornering and rainbow/bank corners.

Front stabilizer poles should not be too tall, or else it will scrape the wall too early at corners, causing speed loss. Make it the same height as your tyres at most.

If your race is limited to arched tyres, use superhard front so that there will be slightly less grip, but faster cornering.

Hollow shafts, floating gears, will definitely help in acceleration.
soulfly
post Mar 6 2015, 07:28 PM

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QUOTE(acam2812 @ Mar 6 2015, 03:52 PM)
found out some racer... beli mahal mahal stuff... after masuk competition few times kalah.. straight jual stuff and pencen. facepalm... i tot mini 4wd is suppose to be fun and challenging ur mind?
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mini4wd competition prize surely tempting.
even bigger than RC competition prize laugh.gif
soulfly
post Mar 7 2015, 11:06 AM

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QUOTE(Cim~ @ Mar 7 2015, 02:36 AM)
Looks like I have a malpractice. I always apply McKenic (orange) hours before and minutes before the race. People were like advising me to apply it every now and then. I thought it is a practice to put lubricants on every race / practice. Even per runs. Most of us do that practice here. 1 person told me that these contact cleaner / lubricant evaporate easily which is why, they make their own formula (use of motor oils) to lessen evaporation of the lubricant between races.

When I used the McKenic (orange), I noticed that the tamiya plastic turns white. The white thing seems to be like a residue since I can scrape it off with my finger nails. I was worried at first. Reading the directions of the Silicone spray, it's a dry lubricant. Maybe McKenic has that composition also. If not, my car's chassis is starting to deteriorate XD

Singer Oils seemed to be not so advisable here because it destroys plastic (someone conducted tests on variety of lubricants). I do noticed some still apply it.

My progress about lubricant research
Since a lot were concerned of plastic deterioration due to lubricants, I tried to look for plastic compatible oils. A lot of forums said that silicone based were the safest on plastic as they use them on airsoft.

I searched deeper about the contents of Tamiya's oil applicator and found an article that it's PAO (Polyalphaolefin) content is highly safe on plastics. Apparently, when I look at a local store of motor oils, they do not mention what composition does it have (because it's their secret formula). I researched further about motor oils and all I see is that motor oils today even fully synthetic have petroleum (esters) additives which can deteriorate plastics.

Lithium based grease on the other hand is a bit confusing. Some says it is compatible, some are not. As one article mentioned, if the label says can be used on plastics, then use it.

I just bought Silicone Spray a while ago. I'll let you know what happens.

PS: Regarding roller height... We all know that the higher the roller height, the more stable the car will be. But does anyone know the pros and cons of having same roller height for front and back? Because my setup has middle height at the front, and higher height at the back.
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As far as I'm concerned, ABS plastic which is used for Tamiya chassis can withstand chemicals better than normal toy plastic. I have never seen Singer oil user have any chassis problem, nor motor problem. At least not that I know of. Save the Singer oil for the motor, and use Tamiya own grease for chassis and gears. For bearings, you can use Singer oil too, or if you'd like to spend more, you can also use special bearing oils for RC, or just general machinery bearing oil.

And it's pointless to use motor oil for mini4wd. Too oily (heavy/thick) for such small motor to use. Not cost efficient either. Motor oil has high boiling point, and mini4wd motors will not be able to produce enough heat to make the oil reach its optimum temperature.

I know some people likes to be scientific with all the stuffs, but most of the time it's impractical. What matters is track proven formula laugh.gif

Old timers like iOnine who had been racing for years, could explain better I think.
soulfly
post Mar 7 2015, 11:58 PM

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QUOTE(Cim~ @ Mar 7 2015, 06:23 PM)

Not only that, Tamiya Speedtech Race seems to be dead for abouth a month now, no race event held as there is no existing racing center here in our area. Unless we go to Manila (100 KM distance) I dunno why people are hoarding but there is no race nearby.
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Which region in the Ph still play tech race using those very simple setup (9mm front, 19mm mid, rubber brakes rear)? All of them have identical setup, isn't it a tad boring like that? hmm.gif
soulfly
post Mar 8 2015, 12:03 AM

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QUOTE(AF21 @ Mar 7 2015, 02:32 PM)
you know what, it may be weird me saying this. but I actually am enjoying the fact that the M4WD scene is going down or at least not at its peak as it should be. speaking on behalf of a racer cum cosmetic builder

to begin with, it gives space for experienced racers like me to approach newer setups instead of the typical S2 Long Jump setup that we all know off.
slowly started picking up VS for semi. MS & MA for speed. might approach Italian AR  nod.gif  I see potential in that chassis
-it's not just me. I see Jai of SpeedHouz developing his own style of racing that sorta looks like Nippon cars. he began with that FRP short car. then the small dia tyres (you get from SX kits), and recently, another new setup with him using the 2mm popsicle stick at rear that manage him to score TQ at TU's January Semi Speed Race.

for beginners on the other hand, they can come down to the track for practice and consult us seniors with more ease (since the crowd isn't as hot as it used to be). last time we couldn't keep up with the amount of newbies coming in the scene. at the end, we got bad mouthed like "senior sombong" or as we all have heard before in early 2014 "racer TU poyo" HAHAHAHAHA. lol. it's okay. what's past is passed.

and lastly, with the scene not at its peak, genuine racers like us are once again able to obtain parts that we want/need for upcoming race(s). boy we all remember that period of time when the FRP popsicle stick and basic tune up was a rare item. lmfao!

if new approach, new setups, more space for beginners, and ease of obtaining parts are the bright side of the scene dying, I am totes cool with it!
racers come and go. people change. (unexpected) commitments come. (expected) commitments go. they do what they have to. we do what we have to  smile.gif

sincerely,
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I'm really tired of 'long jump' races.
Everyone seems to be using S2 with almost very similar setup. laugh.gif

Extremely long season of 1 type of race is probably one of the reason some people stopped playing because there is no fun anymore when no one is willing to try new stuffs. Everybody sticks to the very same thing. No variation.
Lucky enough in my hometown semi technical and speed technical are taking turns each week. We also do rumble races instead of the usual time-attack qualifying round.
soulfly
post Mar 8 2015, 08:06 PM

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QUOTE(moron88 @ Mar 8 2015, 07:58 PM)
Put lower clearance for brakes let it slow it even more ?
Stabilisers ?
Hmm what other reasons still left out ?
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The height of the brake clearance will determine the height of the jump. If you want to make it slower, you'll need to use brake pads.

This is what I have been told:

1. Rear brakes lower than front - jump with nose up (ideal condition most of the time) **
2. Rear brakes higher than front - jump with nose down
3. Shorter or longer jumps - use different brake materials - bare FRP, sponge, or rubber

** Might depend on the car weight balance too. Front/Rear/Mid motors may have different jumping behavior.
soulfly
post Mar 8 2015, 08:13 PM

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QUOTE(AF21 @ Mar 8 2015, 03:49 PM)
Front roller angle : 4.5˚
HD3
All super hard
3.5 gear

My VS still can't clear LC. Hahahahhaa.
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user posted image

this is my current VS, just made recently. will try out some LC tomorrow... but last time i had almost similar setup on S2, HD2 at LC with full battery (not boosted) was okay. but the layout was more like semi-tech.
but S2 had different front clearance, which is much lower than VS, so that might be a bit different.

total length is exactly fits our Tamiya standard check box (just at around 164mm)
soulfly
post Mar 8 2015, 11:30 PM

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QUOTE(AF21 @ Mar 8 2015, 11:13 PM)
Your front side ex looks like it's got different holes  hmm.gif
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it's based on the original recipe. (as they say)
using the normal front multi-roller stay, cut in half and trimmed, and flipped terbalik. biggrin.gif

user posted image

user posted image
soulfly
post Mar 13 2015, 09:58 PM

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Anyone joining the Racetech tournament next month?

One of my team mate, along with other friends from Miri is going to participate.

If I have enough transport and accomodation budget I will go as well, but small chance for now. LOL.
soulfly
post Mar 15 2015, 05:23 PM

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QUOTE(AF21 @ Mar 15 2015, 10:51 AM)
15th right? definitely not going LOL
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26th april.... the RM3k race.

user posted image

This post has been edited by soulfly: Mar 15 2015, 05:25 PM
soulfly
post Mar 20 2015, 03:59 AM

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QUOTE(Mikeyz @ Mar 19 2015, 11:45 PM)
Hi guys, I just painted my Raikiri cowl with Pactra color spray & the outcome was rough & unrefined.
What can I use to remove the paint and not damaging the default black color from the plastic Raikiri cowl?
I should have bought Tamiya TS color spray can in the 1st place, geez!
Who here is into plastic cowl spraying pls share some insight & tips. TQ
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try submerging in original plain dettol disinfectant and leave it overnight.
after that it should be able to scrub it lightly with some old toothbrush or something.
soulfly
post Mar 23 2015, 06:13 PM

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boring boring dengan byk barang lebihan... buat kereta baru biggrin.gif

user posted image
soulfly
post Mar 30 2015, 11:38 AM

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QUOTE(AF21 @ Mar 29 2015, 04:12 PM)
for can spraying, buy those PS-coded Tamiya brands. other brands also can like Duratrax. but Tamiya is cheaper and easier to obtain in my books. avoid being an ignorant prick like that person in Tamiya Black Tuna whom sprayed TS on his clear poly cowls
black tuna are mostly ricers.
they don't even race.
well they do, but super rare. laugh.gif


dude, teach me about spray paint layering.
if i want those 'anodized effect' ... should i spray clear type color, then layer with silver or something?

This post has been edited by soulfly: Mar 30 2015, 11:40 AM
soulfly
post Mar 30 2015, 11:46 PM

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QUOTE(AF21 @ Mar 30 2015, 01:10 PM)
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «


anodized effect on hard cowl or clear poly cowl bro?
Like this one? (poly cowl)

[attachmentid=4391819]
[attachmentid=4391821]
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poly cowl.
i assume if i want anodized blue effect, i need to spray some blue or clear blue paint first, then finish with silver paint.


QUOTE(AF21 @ Mar 30 2015, 01:17 PM)
and ffs, black tuna only play with mono colour. as a cosmetic builder, I say that is a fail. shows lack of creativity. 0 point for colour coordination. auto show contest don't give you marks on how expensive your parts are, lulz. so bij pliz *flicks hair*

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

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black tuna only layan people who 'they think' has reputation like those who could supply rare parts, or those who they think skilled enough with cosmetic building.

otherwise they definitely won't layan you. i did PM them via facebook in the past a few times asking about stuffs, but was never entertained.

QUOTE(sonic_cd @ Mar 30 2015, 09:53 PM)
and liquid masking tape ..very useful when on curved surface
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even with normal masking tape i'm still very noob, how to use liquid masking tape already? rclxub.gif

This post has been edited by soulfly: Mar 30 2015, 11:48 PM
soulfly
post Mar 31 2015, 07:15 PM

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QUOTE(blaze_spirit @ Mar 31 2015, 04:26 PM)
sifu sifu plz enlight me abt roller: Im looking for a pai of 19mm front roller, which type is more prefered? (normal aluminium roller / roller with plastic ring / roller with rubber o-ring) TQ =)
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For front, always use the ringless type for better durability.
If you use plastic ring type roller in the front, the plastic ring will easily break or wear out because of more force at the front.
Rubber ring type roller can be used for rear rollers, but never for front. It's too sticky and if your car is very fast, after some time the rubber will get loosen and will come off during race. It also makes corner approaches a bit slower.


soulfly
post Apr 1 2015, 01:51 AM

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QUOTE(AF21 @ Mar 31 2015, 09:57 PM)
Damn! Really ah. I am re tuning my belanja car. Replacing the front 830's with 19mm's. But I only have plastic rings. Never knew the force would be so strong that it will break it. Damn...
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830 should be strong enough eh. It's all steel.
But among all 19mm rollers, the ringless type should be used for front. Because blaze was asking about 19mms

QUOTE(blaze_spirit @ Mar 31 2015, 10:07 PM)
noted. smile.gif

anyone weighted HG 19mm normal vs. the lightweight (6 holes) and compare them before? I curious to know how much weight difference between these 2 hmm.gif
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the lightweight one weights roughly almost the same as 5 spokes type

This post has been edited by soulfly: Apr 1 2015, 01:52 AM
soulfly
post Apr 8 2015, 11:07 AM

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Italian setup is pretty much the solution for high speed LC using fast motors like ultra dash or plasma dash

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