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 The Official Lowyat.NET Sintua Thread, A thread on Chinese folk religion.

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SUSredisthcan
post Mar 3 2015, 09:23 PM

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QUOTE(Joey Christensen @ Mar 3 2015, 09:16 PM)
The more I read the more associations I make with the Heaven and Hell being closely resembling what's happening in Earth.

Anyway, who is the most feared Hell deity? laugh.gif
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Who is the most feared Hell deity?

This guy, of course. smile.gif

QUOTE(nachtsider @ Jan 5 2015, 07:15 PM)
Who is the King of Ghosts?

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Da Shi Ye/大士爷, the Venerable Great Lord, also known as the King of Ghosts (大士鬼王), is one of the most fearsome Hell deities, if not THE most fearsome. Originally a vicious demon king who was the holy terror of the spiritual realm, Da Shi Ye was subdued by Guan Yin, the Goddess of Mercy, subsequently converting to the cause of good and becoming her disciple. This did not entirely quell his ferocious nature, however, and Guan Yin found him a job that would allow him to exercise this characteristic in a constructive manner - she found him a job as the commander of Hell's soldiers, including beings such as the Black and White Brothers and other ghostly troops.

Worship of Da Shi Ye becomes very widespread during the Seventh Month - the Hungry Ghost Festival. It is during this period that the souls serving penance in Hell are temporarily set free for a month's reprieve, and Da Shi Ye keeps his glinting eye on these prisoners, ensuring that they do not harm human beings or escape. In accordance with this belief, large paper effigies of him are erected in temple grounds, cemeteries and other strategic areas where the wandering spirits are said to frequent.

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Da Shi Ye's fierceness is legendary. Any and all who offend against him or defy him are sure to be destroyed. Even his own followers fear him, as well as some of his superiors. There is only one individual who can quell his savage temper, and this is, of course, Guan Yin. Take a close look at a statue of Da Shi Ye, and you will see a small figurine of Guan Yin sitting or standing upon his head - she is there to quell his excesses and ensure that he does not go overboard.

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SUSredisthcan
post Mar 5 2015, 03:55 AM

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QUOTE(figuremeout @ Mar 4 2015, 09:58 PM)
Just out of curiosity...the holder looks like a coffin. Does it symbolizes somtg?  hmm.gif
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If you are familiar with how a Chinese coffin looks, you'll realise that it doesn't really resemble one, lol.
SUSredisthcan
post Mar 7 2015, 06:33 AM

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QUOTE(EnergyAnalyst @ Mar 5 2015, 07:03 AM)
Another deities that we have neglected would be door gods
http://www.chinaculture.org/gb/en_chinaway...ntent_47393.htm

How do one pray to them?
Who are the Door Gods?

There exist numerous deities, some named and famous, some anonymous, who serve as the guardians of temple doorways, regulating spiritual ingress/egress to such establishments. They can take different forms, mostly depending on the nature of the temples they protect. For instance, a temple to martial deities like Lord Guan or Na Zha may feature warrior-type door gods, a temple where a goddess such as Ma Zu is enshrined may feature handmaidens or ladies-in-waiting as door gods, and a Hell-associated temple may feature ghostly/undead soldiers as door gods.

That being said, the most well-known pair of Door Gods, whom most people refer to when Door Gods are being discussed, are named Qin Qiong/秦琼...

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... and Wei Chi Gong/尉迟恭.

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You can tell them apart by their complexions. Qin is fair-skinned; Wei is swarthy.

They were a pair of Tang Dynasty noblemen, esteemed generals in the service of Emperor Taizong. When hauntings occurred in the palace, disturbing Taizong's sleep and leaving him seriously ill, the two dukes stood guard every night outside his bedroom door in full armour and wielding their weapons. This put a lid on the haunting. The pair were therefore deified as dispellers of evil spirits thereafter, and their images hung to either side of home doors for this very purpose.

You can pray to the door gods by pasting consecrated pictures of them on the door of your home, and making regular offerings to them; a small incense urn placed near the doorstep will suffice for this.
SUSredisthcan
post Mar 7 2015, 06:36 AM

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QUOTE(EnergyAnalyst @ Mar 5 2015, 07:03 AM)
Another would be Taishan shi-gan-dang(泰山石敢当)
http://traditions.cultural-china.com/en/21...itions11956.htm

How do one pray to them?
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The Tai Shan Shi Gan Dang I would not really classify as 'deities'; rather, they are warding devices.

These stones are fragments of the bedrock of Mount Tai, which is regarded as a sacred mountain.

The stones are placed at strategic or accident-prone areas to ward off evil and prevent mishaps or even natural disasters.

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SUSredisthcan
post Mar 7 2015, 06:39 AM

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QUOTE(JunJun04035 @ Mar 5 2015, 11:43 AM)
Lord of Door is mostly seen on the door of temple around Malaysia.

First there were the YuYu 郁垒 and Shen Shu神荼 (dated back to Han dynasty). They were the immortal general appointed by Jade Emperor to guard the the Gate of Hell 鬼门 by the Blossom Tree 桃木 at Du Shuo Mountain 度朔山。They also depicted in two looking alike general, one pale(Shen Shu) one dark (Yu Yu) with similar weapon.

Most of the time, if you saw a pair of general (Either drawing or statue) they are: Qin Shubao秦琼(aka 秦叔宝) and Yuchi Jingde尉迟恭 (aka 尉迟敬德) from Tang Dynasty.
General Qin is the one with pale skin with calm face, General Yuchi is the one with dark skin with scary face. Most of the time, General Qin wields a sword while General Yuchi wields baton. They also often depict wielding mace, axe, Jian (a type of Chinese steel baton) etc.

Also, most other deities will also take up the job as Lord of the Door by many temple, palace and houses.

For Buddhist Temple,you will find Four Heavenly Kings, Skanda & Galan 伽藍护法, Heng Ha Generals哼哈二将 etc

For Taoist Temple, you will find 王天君/马天君, 孟章神君/监兵神君 and other deities

Some even have Lord of Door depicted by Zhong Kui the Ghost Banisher.
They is lot's of folklore and stories behind each Lord of Doors, where, when and why they become Lord of Doors. Most of the time, they are depicted as the guardian of the owner of the building, to protect them from the harm of evil spirits, devil beings and other denatured forms of soul wandering around earth.

Since most Sintua Temple is related with Hell and most of them uses creatures from hell to do erands, Sintua Temple do not necessarily have Lord of Doors.
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Skanda, the Four Heavenly Kings and so on are overall temple guardians/protectors, and not specifically in charge of regulating ingress/egress via the temple's doorways. They are security personnel, not dedicated doormen. I would therefore not classify them as 'Door Gods'.

As for 'most sintuas being related with Hell', this is not true at all. Heaven-associated sintuas outnumber Hell-associated ones by a considerable margin.

This post has been edited by nachtsider: Mar 7 2015, 06:39 AM
SUSredisthcan
post Mar 7 2015, 04:36 PM

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QUOTE(thoseeyes @ Mar 5 2015, 10:57 AM)
Hi Nacht,

Thank you very much for opening this thread. Took me few days to finish reading up todate and it is really worth the time. The explanation is truly informative in a non biased context. I read minimal chinese so reading all this is English has increase my understanding and clarify some questions that always makes me wonder why.

You have mentioned that viewers of the show "Guai Tan" should take it with a pinch of salt and I couldn't agree more. I used to follow the show in the beginning where they showed a lot of "documentaries" about the supernatural world locally and more interestingly around Asia. The best materials were from Thailand in my opinion. But soon when ran out of ideas and going less abroad but started showing more on "staged" ghost visiting activities...i stopped watching them. And yes, I personally feel that sifu Szeto is most of the time "questionable". If only the show stay true to their objective which is to share what is happening around rather than making them up.

Anyway...please keep this thread going on... smile.gif
Not a problem, my friend. It is important to know the whys and wherefores, lest prayer and worship de-evolve into 'monkey see, monkey do', and lest the rich heritage of Chinese folk religion go completely down the drain. smile.gif

What made me write Szeto off completely was the episode where he challenged a Thai occultist to a magical duel. Instead of facing the Thai occultist directly, Szeto used the show's host, Rachel, as his proxy - a human shield, really. It was a cowardly, foolish and unethical thing to do. She could have come to serious harm, or even died.
SUSredisthcan
post Mar 8 2015, 05:27 AM

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Who is Zhong Kui?

Zhong Kui/钟馗 was once a handsome and brilliant scholar. A demon by the name of Gan Shu Hao was jealous of him, and disfigured his face after befriending Zhong Kui while disguised as a human and getting him drunk.

Zhong Kui was determined not to let this setback deter him, and sat for the Imperial examinations anyway. He made first place, but the wicked Prime Minister disqualified him on account of his looks. Heartbroken and outraged, Zhong Kui committed suicide in front of the Emperor and the entire Imperial Court.

The shocked Emperor exiled his Prime Minister and ordered that Zhong Kui be posthumously honoured as the top Imperial Scholar. The second-placed Imperial Scholar would perform the duties that Zhong Kui would have performed - becoming a personal adviser to the Emperor. The second-placed scholar happened to be Gan Shu Hao in disguise. This was his plan all along - to gain access to the Emperor and assassinate him.

Gan haunted the Emperor night after night, causing him to fall seriously ill. On the night that the Emperor would have finally succumbed to the haunting, Gan found himself faced by none other than Zhong Kui, who had been assigned the post of Hell's Chief Exorcist and Demon-Hunter by the Ten Judges, masterfully trained in the art of exorcism and dispatched to Earth to rescue the Emperor and exact his revenge. Zhong Kui destroyed Gan after an epic fight, and saved the Emperor's life.

The grateful Emperor decreed that Zhong Kui be worshipped on a widespread basis. He continues to be worshipped to this day as a dispeller of evil.

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SUSredisthcan
post Mar 8 2015, 06:49 AM

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Why is bamboo often associated with Hell deities?

One often sees Hell deities wearing garments with bamboo or bamboo leaf motifs; you can see similar imagery decorating the Hell sections of temples and sintuas, too.

Bamboo is a plant that, according to myth, has evil-dispelling properties. Other myths associate it with death, on account of how the bamboo plant's massive root systems impoverish the soil and prevent anything else from growing nearby.

So there you go - associated with death, and capable of warding evil. Sounds like a pretty apt plant for the Hell deities, don't you think?

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SUSredisthcan
post Mar 9 2015, 07:07 AM

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QUOTE(yeeck @ Mar 8 2015, 11:10 PM)
But I thought bamboo is also associated with Guan Yin and many Buddhist temples also have bamboo plants within their compound.
Within the Buddhist context, which is different from the Hellish context that I've outlined above, the bamboo symbolises perseverance and the ability to withstand tribulations - good qualities for a monk or nun.

At any rate, however, the plant classically associated with Guan Yin is not the bamboo, but the lotus - a bloom that represents purity.

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This post has been edited by nachtsider: Mar 9 2015, 08:04 AM
SUSredisthcan
post Mar 9 2015, 10:36 AM

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QUOTE(yeeck @ Mar 9 2015, 10:29 AM)
I think the lotus is commonly used by all Buddhist deities/bodhisatvas as it symbolises purity, not just specific to Guan Yin alone. If you noticed, she's also usually holding a stalk of bamboo.
That's supposed to be a willow branch, lol.
SUSredisthcan
post Mar 11 2015, 04:07 AM

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QUOTE(Alert_RaZO @ Mar 11 2015, 03:41 AM)
Hi Natch, i have experienced and happened alot of things for the past year ago. A lot of things remain question unanswerable due to i have shallow knowledge and no one to ask. One more thing is i'm a christian.

I hope you can guide me becoz i have too much questions. Is not happen to me but is about my friend. I can't vomit out all the question in one posting. Maybe some q need to PM you.
Let me start with this 1st.

Izzit true that one cannot simply pray to white tiger?
If my memory serve me right, this is where the unlucky chapter start after praying the tiger.

One of my friend always seeking advise from a sifu. So after cny, sifu advise my friend to pray tiger at nearby temple. Went to the genting klang that one. I remember bought the pork and rub the meat on the tiger mouth 3 times. So interesting. After finish praying then sun bian ask god loh, a guy duno possessed by what god. There is a man beside the god which i believe is an assistant/translator told my fren  doesn't look well and by chance comeby another day where they will held the tiger ceremony.

That tiger ceremony i remember only a few people came which i believe only selected/advised to come.
I remember a guy possessed by the god tiger, walking on the ground and act like a tiger. Then he grab the snake head pointing here and there and do the whipping. Lastly, a chop at the back shirt.
Months after month passed by a lot of unlucky event happened. Sifu took a sword point here and there at my friend. Then confiscate the shirt which got the chop to burn i guess. 

After that, luck still bad and worsen.
The sifu asked your friend to go and pray to the tiger, then decided to get rid of what the tiger did for your friend.

Okay. rclxub.gif

I can think of several possibilities as to what might be happening:

1. The ritual was not properly conducted, possibly due to the medium being questionable (if the temple is an old and established place with a good reputation, this is unlikely).
2. Your friend did not adhere properly to whatever instructions the tiger gave him.
3. Your friend is being punished for making a frivolous request of the tiger.
4. The tiger is revoking whatever help he gave your friend, or otherwise punishing your friend, due to your friend being no angel.

Why did you not go to the temple and ask for an explanation instead of coming here? Or ask the sifu for an explanation, for that matter?
SUSredisthcan
post Mar 11 2015, 09:12 PM

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Alright already. Let's not turn this into a Guai Tan discussion thread. tongue.gif
SUSredisthcan
post Mar 12 2015, 12:45 AM

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QUOTE(Alert_RaZO @ Mar 11 2015, 10:59 PM)
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

It was happened last year so since i saw this thread, try to ask maybe can give clearer picture/knowledge?
The master did explain same to your point no.1, hence the sword thing. Then never dare to go the temple again.
We did ask our friend nearby in Setapak about the temple, is a long established temple and the people there are very helpful, patiently explain and make things right .

I was thinking that time maybe my friend pray the wrong way? Because 1st time. Pray too many deities? or maybe people curse black magic?

Sorry to infiltrate your thread ask this thing.  sad.gif
Another possibility worth considering is that this 'master' is not as reputable as your friend thinks he is.

Those who associate with disreputable people can often suffer ill effects if they encounter a righteous deity.

But all this is speculation, really.
SUSredisthcan
post Mar 12 2015, 10:24 AM

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QUOTE(bereev @ Mar 12 2015, 08:28 AM)
Nacht can tell story about 四大金钢 the one carry music instrument are they the door guard 门神  ?
Well, it looks like Junjun's beaten me to the punch, lol.

I'll just add that they are not Door Gods, and that their items have magic powers.

Vaisravana's umbrella is a trapping device akin to the ghost trap from Ghostbusters, sucking evil beings into its depths when opened - it can also instigate storms and earthquakes.

Virudhaka's sword is capable of multiplying into a virtual typhoon of flying blades that he can fully control.

The music from Dhrtarastra's pipa has a mind control effect.

Virupaksa's pearl permits him control of the many magical beasts he rears as pets, which include his serpent (which can transform into a magic whip, much like Lord Zhang's cobra) plus a creature often referred to as a flying elephant that he uses as a mount, but seems more gryphon-like in some accounts.
SUSredisthcan
post Mar 12 2015, 11:50 AM

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QUOTE(thoseeyes @ Mar 12 2015, 10:32 AM)
so actually they are CHinese Gods or Indian?
They have Hindu-Buddhist roots.

This applies to quite a number of Chinese gods, actually.
SUSredisthcan
post Mar 12 2015, 12:05 PM

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QUOTE(thoseeyes @ Mar 12 2015, 12:02 PM)
if i'm not wrong...Four Face Buddha is one of them right?
The 'Four-Faced Buddha' is in fact not a Buddha at all, but the Hindu god Brahma given a Thai interpretation.
SUSredisthcan
post Mar 12 2015, 06:09 PM

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Who is Ji Gong?

Li Xiu Yuan/李修元 was born with a silver spoon in his mouth during the Southern Song Dynasty, the only son of a prominent statesman. Seemingly destined for a life of luxury, all that changed when his parents were killed in a terrible fire that also destroyed the family homestead and fortune. The kindly abbot of a nearby monastery took the tragically orphaned boy under his wing and cared for him. Xiu Yuan eventually took his monk's vows under the abbot's tutelage.

Maybe it was the traumatic experience of seeing his parents die that left him mentally unbalanced. Maybe it was something else. But the fact is that Xiu Yuan was prone to wildly eccentric behaviour, which included eating meat and drinking wine, telling raucous jokes, meditating while doing headstands, loudly singing nonsensical songs, neglecting his personal hygiene, playing pranks on the other monks and so on. The monastery's occupants could not stand him; it was only thanks to the abbot's influence that he was allowed to stay at the monastery. Perhaps the abbot saw potential hidden beneath the madness, as we shall see, for despite his behaviour, even Xiu Yuan's disgruntled fellow monks were begrudgingly unable to deny that he had an immensely kind heart and was always willing to help those in need, especially the wronged and downtrodden.

Things came to a head when the abbot died; his replacement was not as tolerant and expelled Xiu Yuan from the monastery. Out into the world he ventured, owning nothing but the tattered monk's outfit on his back. Wandering from village to village and town to town, Xiu Yuan more than managed to survive - it was during his travels that he discovered his ability to work miracles, particularly healing the sick, and he received ample support from the numerous people who owed him their lives. Xiu Yuan became known as Ji Gong/济公, 'Our Lord Who Aids and Relieves', as well as Huo Fo/活佛, 'Living Buddha'. His outwardly fatuous exterior belying his considerable street-smarts and cunning, Ji Gong often comes up with simple yet insightful solutions to problems of all kinds, and has overcome many an evil threat through his use of trickery.

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SUSredisthcan
post Mar 13 2015, 04:17 AM

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QUOTE(bereev @ Mar 12 2015, 06:53 PM)
oh so they are not folk religion god they are belong to Buddhist, thanks for clarification.
Folk religion subscribes to them, too. But not as commonly as Buddhism does.

QUOTE(bereev @ Mar 12 2015, 06:53 PM)
then the door god is who ?

I already spoke about the Door Gods here:

QUOTE(nachtsider @ Mar 7 2015, 06:33 AM)
Who are the Door Gods?

There exist numerous deities, some named and famous, some anonymous, who serve as the guardians of temple doorways, regulating spiritual ingress/egress to such establishments. They can take different forms, mostly depending on the nature of the temples they protect. For instance, a temple to martial deities like Lord Guan or Na Zha may feature warrior-type door gods, a temple where a goddess such as Ma Zu is enshrined may feature handmaidens or ladies-in-waiting as door gods, and a Hell-associated temple may feature ghostly/undead soldiers as door gods.

That being said, the most well-known pair of Door Gods, whom most people refer to when Door Gods are being discussed, are named Qin Qiong/秦琼...

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... and Wei Chi Gong/尉迟恭.

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You can tell them apart by their complexions. Qin is fair-skinned; Wei is swarthy.

They were a pair of Tang Dynasty noblemen, esteemed generals in the service of Emperor Taizong. When hauntings occurred in the palace, disturbing Taizong's sleep and leaving him seriously ill, the two dukes stood guard every night outside his bedroom door in full armour and wielding their weapons. This put a lid on the haunting. The pair were therefore deified as dispellers of evil spirits thereafter, and their images hung to either side of home doors for this very purpose.

You can pray to the door gods by pasting consecrated pictures of them on the door of your home, and making regular offerings to them; a small incense urn placed near the doorstep will suffice for this.
*
SUSredisthcan
post Mar 13 2015, 02:11 PM

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Who are Shan Cai and Yu Nu?

Guan Yin is often shown accompanied by two children, a boy and a girl. These are her faithful attendants/disciples, Shan Cai/善才 (Sudhana in Sanskrit) and Yu Nu/玉女, the Jade Maiden (sometimes also known as Long Nu/龙女 or Dragon Maiden). They are as congenial and loving as brother and sister, despite hailing from very different backgrounds, and regard Guan Yin not merely as their teacher, but almost as a mother, too.

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Shan Cai was a crippled young lad from India who became one of the very first Buddhists. Despite being lame in one leg, he travelled single-handedly, over land and sea, from India to the east, where Guan Yin resided, in order to learn the Dharma from her. Guan Yin, touched by his dedication, healed his disability and appointed him as her pageboy.

Shan Cai is often depicted in a 'standing-on-one-leg' pose. This is a reference to his penchant for performing sacred dances, and his former disability.

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Yu Nu/Long Nu is not human, contrary to outward appearances. She is in fact a dragon, as her name suggests - the daughter of the Dragon King of the Eastern Sea, who, after witnessing Guan Yin rescue a shoal of sea creatures (her and her father's subjects) that were beached after a storm, was so touched and impressed by by Guan Yin's compassion, that she pleaded with her father for permission to take Buddhist vows and become Guan Yin's disciple. The Dragon King gave her his blessing, and Yu Nu now serves as Guan Yin's handmaiden.

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SUSredisthcan
post Mar 13 2015, 04:59 PM

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QUOTE(JorgePereira @ Mar 13 2015, 04:11 PM)
Hello

Can i ask for chinese translation here?hehe
What do you need Chinese translations for?

I have already provided translations for all the Chinese words and names that I have posted here.

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