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 The Official Lowyat.NET Sintua Thread, A thread on Chinese folk religion.

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SUSredisthcan
post Feb 21 2015, 09:39 PM

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QUOTE(yeeck @ Feb 21 2015, 06:57 PM)
At 2:40, is that the Filial Son but done by a female?
Sharp eyes. The female medium is, indeed, channelling the Filial Son. rclxms.gif

This temple, the Hall of Sevenfold Jade/七玉殿 is right in my neck of the woods, by the way. It is one of the few temples in Klang dedicated exclusively to the Hell deities, boasting Ksitigarbha Bodhisattva in the main hall, and a special air-conditioned, cave-like basement room where the Black and White Brothers and other lesser Hell beings reside.

You can visit them at 4, Jalan Cox, 41300 Klang; they hold consults on Saturday nights at 9:30 p.m or thereabouts. The temple is admittedly somewhat difficult to find, being off the beaten track; it is located down by the river bank near the Fairy Park funeral parlour, close to Wisma TLT and the old Pawagam Sri Intan.

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SUSredisthcan
post Feb 24 2015, 03:19 PM

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QUOTE(awwman @ Feb 24 2015, 03:01 PM)
Are these real? I've no idea
That depends on whom you ask. wink.gif
SUSredisthcan
post Feb 24 2015, 08:48 PM

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QUOTE(awwman @ Feb 24 2015, 08:39 PM)
I think are real
Wonder what happened within the span of five hours to make you change your mind. tongue.gif
SUSredisthcan
post Feb 25 2015, 03:46 PM

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QUOTE(arubin @ Feb 25 2015, 03:34 PM)
I actually try to look for more information on Google and well...seems that information is either sparse or not really available in English.

In fact, the top result when one types "Sintua religion" is this thread. sweat.gif

Is it known by another name in English? If not, perhaps you might want to start a wiki entry?

Or does one of the entries here accurately describe your beliefs? If so, which one?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_folk_religion
Chinese folk religion/Shenism is exactly what it is.

'Sintua' (this is a Hokkien phrase; it is 'shen tan'/神坛 in Mandarin) is the term for the shrine-based worship commonly associated with the faith.
SUSredisthcan
post Feb 27 2015, 01:42 PM

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What are the rituals performed on the eighth night and ninth day of Chinese New Year?

Once upon a time, medieval-era Hokkiens, fleeing persecution (the persecutors are variously described as Mongols, Manchus, Japanese pirates or simply local bandits), prayed to the Heavenly Emperor (this is either the Jade Emperor or his boss, depending on whom you ask) for deliverance. He guided the fugitives into a vast field of sugar cane, where they securely hid. Their pursuers got hopelessly lost in their attempt to explore the field and gave up the search, thus allowing the Hokkiens to escape unharmed. This event took place over the eighth night and the ninth day of Chinese New Year.

From then on, people of Hokkien descent perform thanksgiving rituals to the Heavenly Emperor each New Year on the abovementioned dates. Sugar cane is an item prominently featured during these rites.

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SUSredisthcan
post Feb 27 2015, 07:45 PM

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QUOTE(dp82 @ Feb 27 2015, 07:41 PM)
Just about to ask this praying ritual since its CNY.

Which is the specific god that v r praying instead of just saying Tien Gong?
Try reading my post again.
SUSredisthcan
post Feb 28 2015, 03:43 AM

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QUOTE(JunJun04035 @ Feb 28 2015, 03:33 AM)
LOL

the Jade Emperor is the Great Emperor of Jade 玉皇上帝 or aka Heavenly Grandfather 天公

However, the Ninth Emperor 九皇大帝/九皇爷/九王爷 is a totally different person.

Jade Emperor is the supreme leader of Heaven.

Ninth Emperor is the Emperor of the ninth star at northern sky (7s of Northern Big Dipper + 2 other star)
贪狼巨门禄存文曲廉贞武曲破军 + 左辅右弼
*
The Jade Emperor is not the supreme leader, lol.

He is the CEO.

There are others whom he answers to - the board of directors.
SUSredisthcan
post Feb 28 2015, 08:18 AM

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QUOTE(EnergyAnalyst @ Feb 28 2015, 07:31 AM)
Who are on the board of directors then?
The board of directors comprise the San Qing/三清, the Three Pure Ones.

They comprise the Great Primordial aka Yuan Shi Tian Jun/元始天尊, who created Heaven and Earth, the Lord of the Sacred Treasure aka Ling Bao Tian Jun/灵宝天尊, who created time, and Lord Lao Zi aka Tai Shang Lao Jun/太上老君, who expounded the Way to the people.

Their involvement with the world is now minimal, as they have largely relegated its management to the Jade Emperor and the other deities.

When some people refer to the Heavenly Emperor/天公, they mean the Great Primordial rather than the Jade Emperor.

Pictured below are (from left to right) Lord Lao Zi, the Great Primordial and the Lord of the Sacred Treasure.

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SUSredisthcan
post Feb 28 2015, 09:37 AM

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QUOTE(teamjoker @ Feb 28 2015, 09:29 AM)
These board of directors, are they still in the samsara cycle or already achieve arhathood in the buddhist  concept?
Most of the gods are considered far beyond the cycle of death and rebirth.
SUSredisthcan
post Feb 28 2015, 09:52 AM

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QUOTE(teamjoker @ Feb 28 2015, 09:45 AM)
Well, I believe some Gods can live up to millions and billions of years old but in Buddhist concept, if the Gods did not liberate themselves, they will still fall into the samsara cycle when the time comes. Earth is appprox 4 billion years old. The board of directors could be hundreds of billion years old. but somehow, I believe, given their enlightment stage, they  probably achieved arhathood by now.
Absolutely.

As far as the universe goes, the Earth is one of its youngest components.

Time did not begin with the creation of the Earth, nor will it end with the Earth's destruction.
SUSredisthcan
post Mar 1 2015, 04:00 AM

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QUOTE(yeeck @ Mar 1 2015, 01:21 AM)
According to Wikipedia:

His predecessor and successor[edit]
The Jade Emperor was originally the assistant of the Divine Master of the Heavenly Origin, Yuanshi Tianzun. Yuanshi Tianzun is said to be the supreme beginning, the limitless and eternal creator of Heaven and Earth, who picked Yu-huang, or the Jade Emperor, as his personal successor. The Jade Emperor will eventually be succeeded by the Heavenly Master of the Dawn of Jade of the Golden Door (金闕玉晨天尊).[1] The characters for both are stamped on the front of the arms of his throne. In two folk automatic writing texts in 1925 and 1972, Guan Yu became the 18th Jade Emperor in about 1840 AD;[2][3][4] however, some have disagreed that Guan Yu has succeeded, and thus the Jade Emperor and Guan Yu are often worshiped separately.[5] In Tienti teachings, the current jade emperor has 55 predecessors.[6]
There are people who believe that Lord Guan has become the Jade Emperor and depict him in statue form as such, yes.

However, these people are merely a small subset of die-hard Lord Guan devotees.

I don't subscribe to this belief, either, because if Lord Guan were Jade Emperor, there would be a lot less going wrong with the world. tongue.gif

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SUSredisthcan
post Mar 1 2015, 07:39 PM

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QUOTE(figuremeout @ Mar 1 2015, 12:25 PM)
Hi everyone. Great sharing & info we have here. Excellent job by TS & other forumers as well.
Im a christian & i find interest in expending my personal knowledge about others. Grew up watching chinese movies & dramas which are highly influenced by the topic.
On top of that, I apologized on behalf of other christians which purposely came here to judge or criticize our fellow brothers beliefs.
Keep on sharing & ignore them👍
I don't care if they judge or criticise. I can dish out as good as I can take. And any attention/publicity is good attention/publicity.

Thanks for the kind words, everyone. biggrin.gif
SUSredisthcan
post Mar 1 2015, 08:37 PM

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QUOTE(figuremeout @ Mar 1 2015, 07:48 PM)
Welcome.
I have one question. Do mediums have the ability to know whats going on in the other realm? I mean, the everyday routine of the deities/Gods. I always think that they live just like us. E.g: the Emperor gets angry & call everyone for a meeting etc...& mediums get the news & share it with us.

I think you know what i mean bro.
Not necessarily.

A medium can sometimes be privy to more information than the average person, but their 'security clearances' have limits; there remain a lot of goings-on in the unseen realm that they are not privy to.

Hell, there are a lot of goings-on in the unseen realm that even certain GODS are not privy to, as they vary in rank, clearance and even spheres of influence.

For example, one of the resident Hell deities at my teacher's temple stated that he had never been to Heaven before, much less met the Jade Emperor, and did not expect this state of affairs to change anytime soon.
SUSredisthcan
post Mar 2 2015, 02:24 PM

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QUOTE(EnergyAnalyst @ Mar 2 2015, 09:57 AM)
Hi Nacht, I remember when I was growing up, there are two deities that my dad and mom were praying to and they are situated at the edge of our beds and one above side of stove/cooking area respectively.

I seldom see them being prayed to in modern houses, but never quite too sure why...

Can you share with me what are their stories, their origins, etc.?

Thanks
Zao Jun/灶君, the Kitchen God, is considered the lord of the household - this is a throwback to ancient times, where the hearth, the stove, the kitchen, was considered the central feature of every home, as it was from the stove that the family's sustenance was derived. He is considered the personification of the hearth. The importance of the kitchen has obviously changed in this day and age, thus explaining why he is less worshiped in recent times. Just because you do not worship the Kitchen God in your home does not mean that he is absent, however.

It is the Kitchen God's job to oversee goings-on amongst the family inhabiting the house he resides in, and report back to the Jade Emperor and/or the local spiritual authorities. This reporting he normally does just before each New Year.

Most legends state that the Kitchen God is a singular deity, but I think the notion of multiple Kitchen Gods or at least multiple aspects/clones of one original Kitchen God, is quite an attractive possibility.

Here is a statue of the Kitchen God, plus an example of how his image is placed near the region of the stove.

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Now for the 'bed deities'.

Chuang Gong/床公 and his wife Chuang Mu/床母 are domestic deities who specialise in the protection of the home's children aged 12 and below. Their domain is the bed or beds where the children sleep.

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The couple have always been fairly obscure deities, mainly prayed to by rural and country folk, and only once a month - on the last night of the month, to be exact. But you can worship them if you are so inclined, particularly if you have young children whom would like them to watch over. It is nice to remind obscure deities that they are remembered. smile.gif

All you need for this procedure is a 'huat kueh' brown sugar steamed cake, three sticks of incense, a cup of tea, a small bowl of vegetarian food (rice and vegetables will do), two red candles and three stacks of gold incense paper.

On the night in question (8 p.m. and onwards), place the items on a large tray and put the tray on the child's bed. Light the candles and stick them into each side of the huat kueh; then light the incense sticks, kneel before the bed and make your prayer; you must specify the child's name, date and time of birth for this.

Then stick the incense into the huat kueh, between the candles, and let the offerings stand for as long as it takes for the incense and candles to burn out. In the meanwhile, remove the gold paper from the tray and burn it outdoors. Once the incense and candles have burnt out, you're done - you may take everything away.
SUSredisthcan
post Mar 2 2015, 02:26 PM

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QUOTE(teamjoker @ Mar 2 2015, 11:26 AM)
Gods statues or tablets should not be placed inside the bedrooms right?
This rule is based on decency, as the bedroom is where one changes their clothes and engages in sexual or other intimate activity.

However, this should not be taken to mean that one cannot sleep near or before an altar, nor should it be taken to mean that a former bedroom, now unused as such, cannot be converted into a prayer room.
SUSredisthcan
post Mar 3 2015, 12:54 PM

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QUOTE(EnergyAnalyst @ Mar 2 2015, 02:43 PM)
...i am wondering whether we can pray to them  say kitchen god by any other way without an altar, can teach?
Praying to the Kitchen God at home need not involve anything fancy-schmancy. A small printed picture of him, or even a piece of paper bearing his title/name, pasted on the wall near your stove, will do just fine. This will have to be blessed before installation, however.

As per the sintua tradition, ritual items related to worship of any particular god have to be blessed by the selfsame god when he manifests via a medium. A god who outranks him or is otherwise given the authority to act on his behalf can also bless the items. It is not common for Hell deities to bless items related to Heavenly gods, nor is it common for Heavenly gods to bless Hell-related items. The general rule of thumb is Heavenly deities for Heavenly items, and Hell deities for Hell items.

As the Kitchen God is not a god that mediums channel, any other Heavenly god should be able to help you bless the items that you will use to worship him. Consult whichever reputable temples or sintuas that might be present in your area.

Incense or candles, while traditional, are not an absolute must for worship. What matters more than anything else is that you possess deep faith and a virtuous heart, which will more than suffice. Simply placing offerings before the Kitchen God's picture will be fine. smile.gif
SUSredisthcan
post Mar 3 2015, 12:59 PM

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QUOTE(EnergyAnalyst @ Mar 3 2015, 11:51 AM)
hi Nacht.

I travel quite a lot on the road, i remember i read somewhere for people like me, it is advised to pray to 馬路將軍 for road safety but I can't seemed to find any info on such deity, can you please advise?

i have also tried to go back to where i found such advise, but can't trace it anymore
I have never before heard of a '马路将军'.

Ma Zhu the sea goddess (see below) is the traditional patron of travelers, although she is primarily associated with sea travel or travel across water.

Alternatively, you may install in your vehicle a statue of whichever deity you regard as your special patron, as a protective item. A talisman issued by them will also do just fine.

QUOTE(nachtsider @ Jan 14 2015, 05:09 PM)
Who is Lady Ma Zu?

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Once upon a time, on the island of Mei Zhou, there lived a fishing family by the name of Lin/林, whose only daughter, Mo Niang/默娘, was a superb swimmer and diver. She was renowned for single-handedly saving many luckless people, including young children and shipwrecked sailors, from drowning, and often stood out on rocks in the middle of the ocean, dressed in bright garments and holding a torch, to guide ships safely to shore through stormy weather. As a reward for her selfless bravery, the plucky girl was deified, receiving the title Saintly Queen of Heaven/天后圣母, although she is most commonly known as Ma Zu/妈祖 or Ancestral Mother.

Ma Zu is a sea goddess, possessing the power to control the wind and the waves. She is the patron saint of travellers, particularly those who are travelling over or across the sea. In days gone by, immigrants from China who journeyed by boat to far-off lands (such as the Malay Archipelago) prayed to Ma Zu for safe journeys, and erected temples to her in the places that they settled as a form of thanksgiving.

Often depicted accompanying Ma Zu are two imp-like creatures; the green-skinned Qian Li Yan/千里眼 or Thousand-League Eye, and the red-skinned Shun Feng Er/顺风耳 or Down-the-Wind Ears. These elemental beings, formerly a mischievous pair of troublemakers who wreaked havoc by flippantly altering the weather, were subdued by Ma Zu and subsequently became her loyal attendants. Capable of seeing great distances and hearing the tiniest noises, respectively, as well as flying swiftly, they serve as lookouts, information-gatherers and couriers.

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SUSredisthcan
post Mar 3 2015, 08:14 PM

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QUOTE(JunJun04035 @ Mar 3 2015, 05:56 PM)
That is the five ghost 五鬼
They are often depicts as the muscle for Zhong Kui 钟馗天师。

At the same time, in Feng Shui Theology, Wu Gui is also a direction, which worshipped properly, can help boost extra income (often from gamble/luck related偏财)

Also, in Chinese Star Astrology 紫微斗数, there is 五鬼官府,where sees as bad luck. Same theory also exist in 八字
Oh, no.

Oh, no, no, no, no.

These are not the Five Ghosts, JunJun. Not at all.

The Wu Lu Cai Shen/五路财神 or Five Directional Gods of Wealth ('路' in this context refers to 'direction' or 'path', not a literal 'road' or 'highway') are a five-man Wealth God team, who correspond to the five cardinal directions, in a manner similar to the Five Camp Commanders. Their leader is Marshal Zhao the Military Wealth God, who is the Northern Commander of the Five Camp Commanders - I have spoken about him earlier in this thread.

Below is a picture of the Five Directional Gods of Wealth, with Marshal Zhao at the top right holding his sword aloft.

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The Wu Gui/五鬼 or Five Ghosties, whom I very briefly touched upon earlier, are a group of impish undead creatures who, although commonly associated with Zhong Kui the Demon-Stalker, serve as errand boys and runners for most Hell deities who are senior in rank to them, including the Black and White Brothers, Ox-Head and Horse-Face. There are multiple squads of Five Ghosts, thus creating a massive army to do Hell's bidding.

The Five Ghosts can be found in two varieties; the warrior type (first picture below) and the worker/civilian type (second picture below). They are correspondingly geared towards different types of duties, military and civil.

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SUSredisthcan
post Mar 3 2015, 08:34 PM

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QUOTE(yeeck @ Mar 3 2015, 01:03 PM)
Why is it the 2 imp-like creatures have the same headband like Monkey King? Is it also used to subdue them the same way Guan Yin subdues Monkey King?
Sharp eyes. rclxms.gif

The golden headband is not a tool unique to Guan Yin subduing the Monkey King, no. Similar binding items can be found throughout myths and legends in which the gods subdued formerly evil or chaotic creatures, and converted them to the cause of good.
SUSredisthcan
post Mar 3 2015, 09:04 PM

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QUOTE(Joey Christensen @ Mar 3 2015, 08:54 PM)
Could I say that they are are somehow like assistants for the higher ranked Heaven or Hell deities? Segregated into different fields;namely; military and administration?
The Five Ghosts serve the Hell deities alone, Joey. They have zero involvement with the Heavenly side of things. Heavenly gods have their own, non-undead/non-ghostly helpers.

That being said, you have the right idea; they are assistants both soldierly and clerical, who also do things like shine their masters' shoes and make their tea. tongue.gif

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