Continuation from Version 1 which was quite a hot topic with 2646 posts and 135,824 views since 15 Nov 2013:

https://forum.lowyat.net/topic/3031756


The collapse of the US housing market bubble emphasizes how important it is to figure out what property is really worth, from a fundamental perspective. Make sure you’re not over-paying!

There are 4 yardsticks to avoid buying in bubble markets:

•Price to Rent Ratio (or Yield)
•Relative Prices
•Affordability
•Price of new builds


VALUATION TOOL 1: THE PRICE TO RENT RATIO

The gross rental yield) is the housing parallel to the price/earnings ratio. Here is a set of rules of thumb for the housing market:

VALUATION YARDSTICKS FOR THE HOUSING MARKET

PRICE/RENT RATIO GROSS RENTAL YIELD (%)
5 20 Very undervalued
6.7 15 Very undervalued
8.3 12 Undervalued
10 10 Undervalued
12.5 8 Borderline undervalued
14.2 7 Fairly priced
16.7 6 Fairly priced
20 5 Borderline overvalued
25 4 Overvalued
33.3 3 Overvalued
40 2.5 Very overvalued
50 2 Very overvalued

But there are exceptions to this. When strong future growth in value is expected e.g in areas where transport infrastructure is being upgraded then relatively weak present earnings can be acceptable.

There are several good reasons why people should pay attention to the 'valuation parameters':

Higher rental yields push the housing market higher

If rental yield levels are high, this will tend to mean that the interest cost of buying a house is low, compared to the cost of renting a house:

•Potential buyers will pay less to borrow from the bank (in order to buy) than they pay when renting a house. Many will move from being renters to buyers.
•Entrepreneurs will find it makes sense to buy houses to make money, i.e., buy in order to rent them out.

Both these factors put upward pressure on house prices.

Lower rental yields put downward pressure house prices

If rental yield levels are low, this will tend to mean that the interest cost of buying a house is high, compared to the cost of renting a house:

•Potential buyers will find that to buy a house involves paying much more to the bank, than it costs to rent a house. Buyers, especially first-time buyers, may have difficulty financing housing. Banks will be worried about over-lending at loan-to-income ratios which mean that a slight increase in interest rates will mean financial crisis for the borrower.
•Entrepreneurs will find that buying-to-let won't pay.

The house price can be viewed as a kind of circle, with houses prices moving from yields of (say) 4% to 11%

•Yields shifting down to 4% would represent danger.
•Yields rising to 11% would signal opportunity.


VALUATION TOOL 2: RELATIVE PRICES

People tend to actively look for cheaper and better alternatives. Where houses are very highly priced, people will seek more affordable alternatives. So if you’re buying property that’s amazingly expensive on a sqaure foot basis compared to its surrounding developments – BEWARE!


VALUATION TOOL 3: AFFORDABILITY

If house prices are so high that few people can actually afford to buy them, then their value will likely fall in future. A reasonable measure of value is a country’s GDP per capita. In a country where the ratio of house prices to GDP/capita is high, it’s a fair bet that houses are overvalued.

Relative to GDP/Capita levels:
•House prices in Luxembourg, Belgium, Norway, Denmark and Austria seem cheap.
•House prices in the UK, Italy, France and the Netherlands seem comparatively expensive.


VALUATION TOOL 4: PRICE OF NEW BUILDS

If house prices are much higher than the cost of building (construction costs), developers are motivated to put up buildings. So when you see a rush by developers to build, that’s a danger sign. As new supply comes into the housing market, that tends to put pressure on prices. So when house prices are far greater than new-build costs, it's a very clear signal that prices are likely to come down.

Bros Cybermaster98 signature thread kena hijacked already. .lol

http://beta.malaysiakini.com/biz/251794

Hey3 look like the situation is worst then our prediction, Stagnation may turn ugly. .hehe

What u mean? i dont understand

Slowdown in property launches in M'sia

by angie ng

PETALING JAYA: Property launches and sales will soften this year, as the market gravitates towards the actual impact of the 2014 budgetary measures, property consultants concur.

Managing director of property consultancy VPC Alliance Malaysia Sdn Bhd James Wong said with the cooling measures in Budget 2014, sales volumes would drop and the property market would soften, particularly the sales of condominium prices ranging from RM750,000 to RM1mil, which are targeted at foreigners.

He said property launches were expected to slow down compared with 2013 and some launches might even be delayed or scaled down, if effective demand was not there.

Wong expected more affordable homes to be introduced this year, with properties near the proposed mass rapid transit and light rail transit extension lines set to be popular.

“Although the landed residential sector is expected to be resilient with stable growth, especially property within gated and guarded enclaves, sales of residential properties to foreigners would be slow as a result of the budget measures. Transactions in condominiums would slow down, with a possible price correction.

“The abolition of the developer interest-bearing scheme (DIBS) and other freebies is expected to reduce the volume and value of the transactions in the primary market, and new property launches may be affected, as without the DIBS, many potential housebuyers may not be qualified to purchase houses. Overall, the housing market would moderate, with a reduction in property transactions and prices,” Wong said.

According to CB Richard Ellis Malaysia executive director Paul Khong, the minimum RM1mil limit for foreigners would affect the mid-range residential sector, and potential buyers would tend to defer their decision to buy. The imposition of the full real property gains tax will have a blanket effect on curbing speculation across all sectors and impact the take-up rate.

“It has been a quiet start this year and most developers are deferring their launches till the later part. With the Chinese New Year coming up end-January, it is traditionally a quiet period for the property sector. More project launches are expected to come through in or after the second quarter,” Khong observed.

After a relatively quiet first-half and the market finding its equilibrium, he said more action was expected in the second half of the year.

He pointed out that developers would have to work harder this year to attract sales, and many might consider marketing their projects overseas and incorporating innovative and lifestyle concepts into their projects.

“Good and innovative packages plus value-for-money features in property projects would go far in 2014,” Khong conceded.

He said one of the property hotspots would be Medini@Iskandar where new projects like I Medini Walk (by Singapore’s Tang Group of Companies) and Avira (Eastern & Oriental Bhd) both near Legoland would be entering the market soon.

Many developers will be looking at the Medini area, as it is a special international zone with various taxes/benefits, including an exemption of the RM1mil minimum price limit imposed on foreigners.

Read it all here:
http://www.thestar.com.my/Business/Busines...dget-this-year/

AT LAST VERSION TWO ALREADY

And here:

http://www.thestar.com.my/Business/Busines...14-to-be-tough/


Cautiously optimistic outlook with property developers in Iskandar expecting tough 2014

by zazali musa


JOHOR BARU: The “feel-good” factor that was prevalent in 2012 and 2013 for the property market in Iskander Malaysia is unlikely to continue this year following property cooling measures introduced by the Government in the last quarter of last year.

Property developers are rather cautiously optimistic on the market outlook for 2014 and are anticipating it to be a tough year for many.

Johor Real Estate and Housing Developers Association (Rehda) branch chairman Koh Moo Hing said the Year of the Horse would be more challenging and that developers must be well-prepared to face the worst.

“I assume that many of our members will adopt the wait-and-see approach in the first-quarter of 2014, to see the real impact from the (property cooling) measures,’’ Koh told StarBiz.

He said the measures were not something new as other countries would also resort to similar measures to ensure locals were not sidelined and denied from owning houses.

Koh said 2013 was the best year for 30 odd members of Johor Rehda who participated in the Malaysian Property Exposition (Mapex) held here in May and November.

He said these members raked in a combined RM3bil in sales over a one-month period.

“It would an achievement if they could repeat the sales figure again for this year’s events,” he added.

The 30-day period starting from the first day of Mapex is the benchmark used by Rehda to determine the value of sales by participating developers.

“Johor Mapex to be held in April will give a clearer picture on the Iskandar property outlook and how developers are coping with the uncertainties and challenges,’’ said Koh.

He said developers would be ready to face the tough year ahead and adapt well as they had experienced the ups and downs in the industry over the years and emerged stronger. Koh said that speculators would be phased out gradually from the property market with the implementation of the measures with owner-occupier buyers dominating the market. “This year’s launches will see between 100 and 200 units with more developers opting for landed houses as demand for them is still strong in Iskandar,’’ he said.

KGV International Property Consultants (M) Sdn Bhd director Samuel Tan Wee Cheng concurred with Koh that the market would see more serious buyers.

But he said buyers would be more cautious on the new policies – the real property gains tax (RPGT) and the hike in ceiling price from RM500,000 to RM1mil for foreign property buyers.

“Prices of houses will continue to go up this year, determined by the policies and escalating costs of labour and building materials,’’ said Tan.

He said it was matter of time buyers especially first-time house owners decided whether to continue waiting or make the kill before the prices move up north.

Tan said if the prices continued to go up, more buyers would go for the secondary market where prices were between 20% and 30% cheaper compared with new launches.

“For instance, the average selling price for a new double-storey link house in Iskandar is RM800,000 per unit, but if you look around in the secondary market, you’ll be paying RM600,000 for it,’’ he said.

Tan said landed houses in the secondary market came with generous land size and bigger floor area plus ready amenities and facilities within the neighbourhood or the development.

He said if this could prompt developers to lower the selling prices of their new launches to attract potential buyers and also offer no-frills houses to cut costs.

Tan said foreign buyers would continue to buy properties in Medini, Nusajaya as there was no restriction to foreign ownership in the area and they were not subject to the RPGT regime.

SP Setia Bhd divisional general manager Hoe Mee Ling said many uncertainties in both global and domestic market might affect the property market in the first-half of 2014.

She said among the issues were the pressure of increasing costs as a result of skilled labour shortage, reduction in subsidies beginning with petrol last September and electricity tariff adjustment in 2014 and policy changes.

“However, challenges always come with opportunities and there are still positive factors in the Iskandar property market,’’ said Hoe.

She said the fundamental demand for properties in Iskandar would remain high and strong as long as developers could adapt to their products to suit this demand.

Hoe said the outlook was still good as properties fetched good yields and were the best hedge against inflation.

Malaysia household income and mortgage repayment ability.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=778...elevant_count=1


Attached thumbnail(s)

Good info...

As a home owner and also an engineer in the construction industry, I learned on the costs etc etc and at the same time see how the market had escalated bullishly because more and more are built for "investments" purposes instead.

I had experienced developments where the Quantity Surveyor (many don't know what they are and do despite of claiming of their interests in property and construction) that they have to submit marked up costings to banks so that those money enter their own pockets la.... Then the developers go to enjoy at nightclubs or go Genting and waste up those cash giving money on their sexbomb to gamble lo.... People say black money, but black money can come from everywhere la. Btw gosh... you guys pay a premium to enrich developers today so that they can hump your daughters and wives in the future while your bald thinking on making ends meet.

Many idiots always argue on land prices and availability and prices subjected to location and amenities like MRT/LRT etc surrounding (which is partially true) but there are many points to counter which then turn into "Don't complaint, want cheap go Kajang lah... Bukit Beruntung lah...." instead of coming out with factual arguments on why things will and should UUU BY FOLDS when the majority of Malaysians is still eating kangkongs unlike themselves; working in KLCC mah..... We understand if your buy for own stay okay, but not for flipping now.

To conclude the rise of prices in illogical manner is due to speculation la. Speculative behaviour associated with them tend to cause financial crises, which lead to lower growth, higher unemployment and higher government debt, which we are seeing in our country. But some people say Malaysia will be a banking hub ma.... See how by then lo... As if banks are the sole field that generate money for the country.

Source is 2006-2010. It may be worse today

Just to share some news..
Singapore private home sales dropped 79.6% in Dec13 compared to Nov13.
http://www.theedgemalaysia.com/business-ne...796-pct-mm.html

And the price is declining too..4 months in a row.. Although the rate is not as drastic as the transaction numbers..
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-01-02/s...n-quarters.html

Are these the signs of things to come?

SG people try to sell off their HDB house to upgrade to condo. since market price sibeh good for HDB. but when put up for sale. got price no market... no body interested...die lor... at the end stil have to stay back to HDB

This post has been edited by HELLO HELLO: Jan 15 2014, 04:02 PM

"got price no market"?

Means dreaming?

Means it is just the perceived value of the house as calculated by a certain fake formula created to put people in panic mode to BBB lor....

Syok sendiri.

good; but, not enough info.


how I interpret,
if 75.9% cannot afford rm250k house; BUT, XX% already have a RM250k house debt. that is a sign of bubble.

On the other hand, if 75.9% cannot afford rm250k house; and, they are all renting house....
this is good sign of strong support of house owner, and property market.


anyone have info, about how many people in this 75.9% group has house loan?

... you sure this one accurate or not i seem to see and hear all the time a lot of young people is buying 2 or 3 house at one shot all the time during dbis all the time ... some more not cheap one ok 500k above one leh ... 1.5 mil if 3 ... anyway already ver.2 eh ... ...

The affordability pretty much driven by interest rates rather than pricing.. 2006 to 2008 were the era when interest rate was high 6.75+1%.. post subprime era witness the lowest interest rate 5.x-2.2%.. and today 6.6-2.4%..

For the same monthly installment you pay, say RM1500 permonth for 30 years, in 2006 mayb you can only able to buy a house mayb RM250k.. today with RM1500 permonth for 30 years, you can get a RM350k house..

Its all about repayment capability.. so does the 2006-2010 data can reflect the current situation remains a question mark..

Is there such thing as a car bubble?

I think nowadays many youngster will buy expensive car of RM 250 k then buy a property.

The installment is probably equivalent to buying a house.

And yet, I see so many new BMWs and Mercedes on the road.

Car bubble? Possible?

After QE tapering, interest rate is expected to return to pre-2008 level e.g. 3% higher than current.

How many people will be trapped?

Car bubble existed in kangkong land but burst in 1997. At one period, a 6 months old potong wira could worth the same price or higher than brand new.

This post has been edited by icemanfx: Jan 15 2014, 08:16 PM

Plenty of these in KL and Selangor.

i think u r missing the point.. BLR may fluctuate, yes.. but pre-subprime era was BLR+1% n now BLR-2.4%..

even if BLR shoot up to 9%, effective rate is 9-2.4%, and if BLR was 9% in 2006, it will be 9+1%.. wat i m saying is there is already a 3% delta given any BLR fluctuation.. that is why I m comparing today BLR 6.6% vs BLR 6.75% in 2006 still pretty comparable, but the difference in effective rate by 3% can change the monthly commitment by hundred and for some thousand permonth..

I m not good or dont wanna predict QE or looking at crystal ball like you guys la.. just questioning, does pre-subprime affordability still comparable than now given rates difference that is regardless of BLR..

Car where got bubble 1? Modern ppl will always think that, live as if there's no tomorrow

Gud one cybermaster.. we shall brain storm for better ideas ok...

More and more DDD news surfacing...


Property market to cool down: MIEA

Jan 15, 2014 - PropertyGuru.com.my

Malaysia’s real estate sector is expected to rebound in 2016, but it will need at least two years to get accustomed to the various cooling measures that took effect in January, according to the Malaysian Institute of Estate Agents President Siva Shanker.

“The market ground to a standstill after Budget 2014. There was a knee-jerk reaction in sales. It will probably stay in the doldrums for the first half of 2014. The second half may be better,” said Shanker, who is also CEO of real estate consultancy PPC International Sdn Bhd.

Nevertheless, he believes that the new property curbs have effectively curtailed rampant speculation.

“The days of 20 to 40 percent appreciation in property prices after only a few years are over. It is no more a joy to speculate.”

Another positive thing he noticed is that the secondary market is making a comeback due to its more affordable prices. For example, units at a newly-launched project in Bangsar is selling for RM1,500 psf, while the price range of an existing home is just RM800 to RM1,00 psf.

Meanwhile, CIMB Research is more optimistic. It believes that demand for houses will gradually return in 2H 2013, when buyers realise that a correction is unlikely due to prevailing market forces. Instead of price drops, the subsidy cuts and the inflationary pressure of the upcoming goods and services tax will result in higher property values.

“As these macro prudential and policy measures are meant to curb speculation and not restrain genuine demand, the impact (though negative in the short term) should be positive over the longer run because they should help to remove froth from some segments of the market.”

“Also, affordability remains close to its highest ever. Robust sales by developers should provide impetus for a re-rating of property stocks,” added CIMB.

Read it all here:
http://www.propertyguru.com.my/en/property...m_content=links

Everybody in Norway a theoretical millionaire from 8 January

Can any oil producing country in the world make all her citizens millionaires via prudent management and savings? Norway achieved that on Jan 8 2014, 45 years after striking oil in the North Sea in 1969. But it only set up its oil sovereign wealth fund (SWF) in 1990, meaning it took the Norwegians only 24 years to be millionaires. The fund is called the Government Pension Fund Global.

According to a Reuters report, everyone in Norway became a theoretical crown millionaire on Jan 8 in a milestone for the world’s biggest sovereign wealth fund that has ballooned thanks to high oil and gas prices. The fund owns one per cent of the world’s stocks, bonds and real estate from London to Boston, making the Nordic nation an exception when others are struggling under a mountain of debts.

A preliminary counter on the website of the central bank, which manages the fund, rose to 5.11 trillion kroner (US$828.66 billion or RM2.7 trillion), fractionally more than a million times Norway’s most recent official population estimate of 5,096,300. It was the first time it reached the equivalent of a million crowns each, central bank spokesman Thomas Sevang said.

Not that Norwegians will be able to access or spend the money, squirreled away for a rainy day for them and future generations. Norway has resisted the temptation to splurge all the windfall since its oil strike. But what it does it ensure that the citizens of Norway will never experience an economic slowdown if the fund is managed well.

Finance Minister Siv Jensen told Reuters the fund had helped iron out big, unpredictable swings in oil and gas prices. Norway is the world's number seven oil exporter.

“Many countries have found that temporary large revenues from natural resource exploitation produce relatively short-lived booms that are followed by difficult adjustments,” she said in an email.

The fund, equivalent to 183 per cent of 2013 GDP, is expected to peak at 220 per cent around 2030 which ensures good times ahead for citizens of Norway.

“The fund is a success in the sense that Norwegian Government has managed to put aside money for the future. There are many examples of countries that have failed to manage that,” said Oeystein Doerum, chief economist at DNB Markets.

In Malaysia, only the Prime Minister has access to national oil producer Petronas’ funds and accounts not Parliament which ensures that oil returns from Petronas can be spent by the PM without having to get Parliament approval.

Malaysia is the 27th largest oil producer in the world, rolling out 693,700 barrels/day. Only 114 countries were listed as at 2009 and 2010.

Norway rolls out 2,350,000 bbl/day or 4 times more than Malaysia but what’s the financial position of Malaysia? A federal debt of up to RM700 billion! (as revealed by then Deputy International Trade and Industry Minister Datuk Seri Mukhriz Mahathir at end of 2012).

The Prime Minister’s Department also revealed that 16,306 people, or an average of 60 Malaysians daily, had been declared bankrupt in the first nine months of 2013. Standard & Poor also revealed in its report that Malaysia has one of the highest ratios of household debt to disposable income in the world, with its current level of 140% outstripping even that of the US (123%).

And what has Malaysia done with its oil money? Has the Malaysian Government set up a special fund to guarantee the future of Malaysia? Yes it has. According to a written reply in Parliament by Prime Minister Datuk Seri Najib Razak, Petronas had contributed RM3 billion to the National Trust Fund (or Kwan, the acronym for Kumpulan Wang Amanah Negara which was set up in 1990) as at June 2011. He also said the money had been invested in various financial instruments and that Kwan’s fund currently stood at RM5.43 billion.

If Norway has a fund size of RM 2.7 trillion with its 4X more oil production, then a simple calculation should put Malaysia’s fund at RM 675 billion and yet we only have RM 5.43 billion?

Where have the remaining funds disappeared? Mind you this fund we are referring to here is solely for the purpose of safeguarding the future of Malaysians not to be used for general over-spending on a day to day basis. That money should come from other revenues. But in Malaysia’s case, its oil money has been siphoned off into ludicrous projects and over spending rife with corruption thus leaving very little for the rakyat.

The Malaysian PM said Kwan was set up to ensure that revenue from dwindling natural resources would benefit future generations. How is RM 5.43 billion going to ensure the future of Malaysians when our Government debt has reached astronomical levels of RM 700 billion?

Now, let’s take a more detailed look at how other oil producing countries are managing their oil revenue:

Kuwait (10th at 2,494,000 bbl/day), Libya (17th at 1,790,000 bbl/day), Kazakhstan (18th at 1,540,000 bbl/day), Algeria (15th at 2,125,000 bbl/day), South Korea (64th at 48,180 bbl/day) and Singapore (82nd at 10,910 bbl/day).

Malaysia’s non-commodity Khazanah Nasional, founded in 1993, is ranked 23rd with only US$34 billion in assets

The world’s largest, Norway’s Pension Fund Global, was in 2009 registered with assets worth US$664.3 billion

UAE-Abu Dhabi’s oil-based Abu Dhabi Investment Authority, established in 1976, is ranked second with US$627 billion

At third spot, China’s non-commodity SAFE Investment Company, which was founded in 1997, now manages assets worth US$567.9 billion

Singapore’s 2 investment arms, Investment Corporation & Temasek Holdins established in 1981 & 1974 respectively have combined assets worth US$405 billion despite not having much natural resources.

Even countries like Kuwait, which was severely damaged by Iraq’s bombing and brief occupation, Libya, Kazakhstan, Algeria and South Korea, which were far poorer than Malaysia in the 80s, are all managing their country’s wealth better than Malaysia.

Isnt Malaysia’s economic and financial standing truly shocking? In light of this, can we be sure that the property market can continue to sustain itself in future or are we heading for a collapse the likes of Greece?

Just a thought!

This post has been edited by cybermaster98: Jan 16 2014, 09:41 AM

House prices in Hong Kong are overvalued by an estimated 30-40% - one of the highest overvaluations in the world. Based on the IMF estimate of the price-to-rent ratio, it's 33 times more expensive to buy a property in the city than to rent.

When the last bubble burst in 1997 during the Asian financial crisis, Hong Kong's property prices fell by more than 60% and continued to decline for six years. Now, house prices are 13 times the average salary - higher than even during the last bubble.

The trouble with bubbly markets is that once interest rates rise - which is starting to happen with the US Fed reining back on its cheap cash injections as of this month - so does the risk of the bubble bursting.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-25742539

Land in HK is more limited than kv.

Price to rent ratio of 33 is equivalent to rent is 3% of property value.

Scandinavian Debt Crisis Waiting to Happen Puzzles Krugman

Scandinavia, which attracted investors during Europe’s sovereign debt crisis, is now coming under international scrutiny on concern that record household debt levels from Denmark to Sweden aren’t sustainable.

“You wonder if that’s a crisis waiting to happen,” Nobel Laureate Paul Krugman said in a Jan. 9 interview in Copenhagen. “I’m not sure, but it’s nervous-making.”

In Denmark, consumers owe their creditors 321 percent of disposable incomes, a world record that the Paris-based OECD said in November demands a policy response. In Sweden, debt by that measure is close to 180 percent, a level the government and central bank say can’t be allowed to rise. Norway’s central bank has struggled to find a policy mix that addresses its 200 percent private debt burden.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-01-13/n...sing-debts.html

Isnt Norway's debt at 28.80% of GDP at in 2012?

boss, why use khazanah nasional instead of EPF?
is khazanah trusted with managing income derived from oil and gas?

Hmm wat are you trying to say..? That we still should BBB? And prop is affordable or sth else???

Private debt here is probably referring to household debt, whereas the 28.8% refers to public (government) debt to GDP.

I think the ratios in Malaysia are around 55% public debt (excluding contingent liabilities) to GDP and 84% household debt to GDP.

How on earth did you derive to this conclusion basing on the question I posed?

Today, we have revised our 2014 sales (res) down with 22% compare with our last year.

For Commercial. We have stop 2014 launching. Delay it to 2015.

Who are we in this sentence

I tell you the truth, when real estate crashes 90% of you will not have the balls to buy. When bubbles burst it usually comes hand in hand with, stock market crash, currency crash, job market crash, high interest rate, etc.

The good news is I'm in the 10%, which means the rich will always get richer!

some may just brush off yr statement. i don't.

it's f'ing miserable for me to cut revenues yoy by even 5%.

22% - that says it all. well, it's not 32%, yet.

thanks for comment, appreciate it.

This post has been edited by AVFAN: Jan 16 2014, 08:33 PM

Good for you man

Try to 'Be Fearful When Others Are Greedy and Greedy When Others Are Fearful', and you can one day be like me. Do the opposite, you will one day be like my poor father. Save money and wait for 'winter is coming' like they say in Game of Thrones ...

This post has been edited by value_investor: Jan 16 2014, 08:58 PM

The only risk for you will be "bear trap"!

If you know what you're doing, there is nothing can trap you. Just do your research and buy assets with good fundamentals. Bear trap is for speculative investments.

Still want to scavange from the poor.. actually.. 10% have how much money and asset? 10 million cash and prop?

If you know what you are doing... very well... but buying studios 2 room for 380k in iskandar hoping to flip too 500k.. .outskirt 2 mega project claiming 45 minutes and 40 minutes drive to kl... without the trafffic.. hmm telling partial truth. Some just purchase on the first day of registration.. and went there the first time.. are most investors really know what they are doing...

and in this climate.. government cooling measures.. affordability... high inflation.. u sure u knoe what you are doing???....

The secret to riches is a bunch of cliches. Mind-blown.

I posted the bullets for UUU/DDD in the poll thread. No one wants to comment. Can't gauge the response !

Since we r all among 1 out of 29 millions Malaysian paying income tax so we r all top 3% of the country. .Lol

Top 10% have no time to be wasted here lah, just let the fellow shiok sendiri, judging by the rubbish he posted here already doesn't seem like smart enough to be in the elite category. .lol

The top one become developer not those holding a few property already consider themselves multi millionaires base on paper gain..lol
Buy 1 million property hutang bank few millions but thought themselves already millionaire. .rofl

For me ahh .. elite class like minimum 20million above lehh.. these ppl too up their imiginary fortune by the prop they bought couple with thier flipped priced dat wat make them feel milionares.. damm..

the ppl who own multiple properties is better than ppl who still stay at mirhaja lowcost flat which bought by their parents...

No personal attack please (even through he deserved it), educate him instead

so big oledy how to educate....let him continue stay at mirhaja flat and cursing la...hope one day got a buyer will sell binjai KLCC condo to him at 200k...i hope he can afford 200k la...

This post has been edited by doomdoom: Jan 17 2014, 02:35 PM

I really hate to boast.. I think in many ways I think i need not to be educated as I di up there lehh.. confirm one agent... ppl who are genuine buyers wont much effect.. ppl flipping ah very fast can see coz they agitated.. healthy forums as well we owayls needed some form of entertainment..

ya, i like u, bring lots of entertainment to the forum...

I m only targeting KV megatownships with flippers... potentially those areas I dun fancy and I dun expect them to drop to 200k.. you are planning to stay in echo hill dats y..

And brought some reality and facts.. removing the mask placed ontop of your home stayer theme..

fuiyooo....so i think maybe i am ur target too since u assume me is flipper too...come, let's target me,,see whether i will flip one of my properties to u lower than market price or not..hahah...

share with us so far how successful with ur property collection from the flippers who desperate to sell u in very low price....

come come...ur mirhaja flat u bought how much?

and also bring some reality that there are some losers who own nothing but always bring the fault to those who successfully grab the opportunity to earn from investment...

Ppl know u flipping liao.. lose cool liao.. ok lah I poor lehh cant afford.. only rent only...

Bro, learn to be forgiveful can boh? If he is smart like you then he should already become your neighbour now...

bearbear, now you have 2 threads to reply. Double enjoyment

no la..in his mindset..i am just a poor pity flipper who buy outskirt area and will fail badly..he is a successfully guy stay at mirhaja flat and one day he can hunt down all flippers and sapu the properties in very cheap price...

Ya larr these 2 megatownship.. threads busy lehh.. but the more unconstructive comments posted ppl are seeing... like prosperity burger double happiness..

This post has been edited by bearbearwong: Jan 17 2014, 02:58 PM

yalo, hope one day u can get something from these 2 megatownships, or maybe KLCC at 150k price...or maybe 150k still consider not a fair price...ok la,,tell us ur target price la...let's say for binjai condo klcc...how much u think is worth to buy? 100k?

after buy binjai, so u can move out from mirhaja flat...the environment mirhaja there not good la...u rent there or own there?

why not think about other place? slightly expensive a little bit only mah, u r professional worker,right?

should be got decent pay to move to better place...

This post has been edited by doomdoom: Jan 17 2014, 03:04 PM

Your flipping neighbourhood... I cant afford.. second phase 600k.. the adjacent neighbourhoods asking price climbing to 700k.. DSL.. i m not hunting outskirt to stay in those areas for stay.. the government intention cooling measures. affordability... location wise( which malaysian have not depart from this including you) .. the flipped price.. has come to this conclusion.

dont you rationally rationalize these points?

I cant afford lehh.. hmm if rent othet place help flippers service d loan lehh.. no good

Few millions.. but outskirt DSL 750k.. u say got this price bo.. honestly.. you want to buy? 750k outskirt even DSL.. to stay and caught in the havoc jamms..

flipping.. really different ting

drive a round or take a public bus around those 3 years ago so call outskirt area like sungai long, kota kemuning, rawang lo...the population there are growing at the rate u could not belive...the <5 years DSL there nothing cheaper than 500k lo....maybe u will say many auction house la, nobody stay la...but the truth is the population there is growing...

auction units everywhere also got la...mirhaja flat also got auction units, what?

but from the bottom of my heart, i really hope u can get something u afford from the market la..no matter outskirt or prime location, at least better living place compare to mirhaja flat.....so u can live healthy and think positive....

Wat is the reasonable price in ur mind?

flip at 750k, is ur own digit o......i never say outskirt can immediatelly from 400k to 750k in 1 -2 years time...but is doable...give some time to make it mature...maybe u dun knw what is happening outside la...

everyday talk about traffic jam...klang valley almost everywhere traffic jam during working hours, but why ppl still moving in...kl is one of the highest urbanization city in the world...maybe u more suitable go back to some slow pace place like kelatan, perlis..the traffic there is good, and properties also at reasonable price(a.k.a low price)...better living environment compare to mirhaja...


that's the cruel fact for city la...

if u can play ur earning strategy well in city, the city welcome u.

if u cant play it well, and blame on the other who play well than u, then automatic the city will slowly kick u out...

This post has been edited by doomdoom: Jan 17 2014, 03:14 PM

U see u owayls tell partial truth di.. the place and surtounding ut investment prop u also no recommend.. srmenyih.. those sold but vacant high rise and landed lehh kajang.. u know.. u should drive along.. from echo hill during peak office hours.. before investing.. I reli cant stamd traffic jams dat y I choose mihaja.. you can stand mehh.. be honest lahh..

Pretty much we have pessimistic friends around us who always use "who will buy". last 25 years bangsar was a craphole who would buy? merely talking to your peers who only earn <5k a month of coz 24/7 talk coc sing song who will buy la omg. Taking out our national median household salary of 5k that includes kampung population 80% also who will buy? Last 10 years when it was so cheap and average population also say who will buy la.

dat y everywhere jam in KL.. why still want need more time.. to echo hill lehh.. worst isnt..

u really think government cooling measures is a joke mehh.. the sold units and vacant.. is not real..

okok la, hope u can buy more units at mirhaja flat la....good luck ah...

u dun have to worry about me can stand on traffic jam or not..

i am planning my own business in next 3 years time....

luckily i got earn some from the property market previously, while some of my friends still complaint why this place so far also u wan to buy...now i earn some money through invest in those so call outskirt area like u mention and start to do some business la...



anyway...wish u all the best in mirhaja flat purchasing...

Then.. is it really healthy to invest now? 5 k average median... u joking ahh government sector itsrlf will proove u wrong.. u name ptivate sector dishing out 5k... the many of your kind already become invrrstors like you..

if low yat forum created since 20 years ago, this bearbear bro maybe will complaint start 20 years ago until now...

he will complaint who will buy bangsar? who will buy mont kiara? who will buy petaling jaya? who will buy kota damansara?...haha..

anyway...he likes mirhaja flat, his own preference...good luck to him la...

Good luck to you..3 years time..

Cry for not fair everyday mayb 1 day government will really come out a plan to build more and more houses to make the supply exceed demand become a fact. Cooling measure only effective in temporary slowdown the over heated market, only people start realize the price wont come down, the rally start again.. other than the US tapering, also got to bear in mind this happen together with the world economy recovering.. the net impact might be very surprise..

u need more luck than me..seriously...haha...

But I never complaint those wor.. but some township really died off like bukit beruntung lehh.. now vacant units draws crime.. u dare to stay ahh..

if I really purchase many miharja.. my yields good lehh .. u ask your agent see.. u be shock.. the yeilds beats your investment..

Pls be reminded that the stamp duty of property transaction is one of the main income for government.
U r right government try to cooling down the property n is not a joke but pls study the figure of government income from property stamp duty.
How to cool down the property market but still can maintain the income from stamp duty is the main reason of the government to change policy.

Temporarily.. you tink this us still time to buy? Maybe suggest to us.. we really want to know what will happen to sold and vacant units.. money is locked down.. srrving bank loans for 35 years if unsold.. usa still owing china so much money.. our beloved malaysia too lehh .. u see indonesia maa..

u never complaint because those townships successful oledy ma...

if this thread created 20 years ago before bangsar/mont kiara/PJ/damansara come out. successful..i am sure u will curse these places too la....ur cursing style is very wellknown at low yat forum oledy lo...

To be frank, ppl buy the house 408k with free MOT, free SPA, free stamp duty and DIBS( pls correct me if wrong). Only downpayment 40k.
If they can sell the house at 500k instead of 750k after VP.Actly, is consider good enough ROI for them.

no la...ourskirt area 500k also nobody buy....


ppl prefer mirhaja flat nowadays with 1.2 hours jam to kl only...

[quote=Rabel,Jan 17 2014, 03:29 PM]
Pls be reminded that the stamp duty of property transaction is one of the main income for government.
U r right government try to cooling down the property n is not a joke but pls study the figure of government income from property stamp duty.
How to cool down the property market but still can maintain the income from stamp duty is the main reason of the government to change policy.

[/quote

Ooo another echo hill owner..

2 of the cooling measures vs 1 RPGT 30%... 1 of them bars foreigners like singaporean to buy.. less transaction less stamp duties lehh.. dat RPGT increase cannot compensated for non transaction.. right.. the removal of DIBS surely many low end players cant buy for malaysian citizens .. the rich will go on and sapu..

2 measures cut revenues instantly lehh . Dat RPGT increase can never compensate this wat.. if you trying to say it push up the prop to 1 million.. singapirean buy to stay or invest? if they buy 1 million and hoping malaysians to buy back... malaysian really many cant afford our own price wat more singaporean flipped price.. your bringing this to another level lehh

[quote=bearbearwong,Jan 17 2014, 03:40 PM]
[quote=Rabel,Jan 17 2014, 03:29 PM]
Pls be reminded that the stamp duty of property transaction is one of the main income for government.
U r right government try to cooling down the property n is not a joke but pls study the figure of government income from property stamp duty.
How to cool down the property market but still can maintain the income from stamp duty is the main reason of the government to change policy.

[/quote

Ooo another echo hill owner..

2 of the cooling measures vs 1 RPGT 30%... 1 of them bars foreigners like singaporean to buy.. less transaction less stamp duties lehh.. dat RPGT increase cannot compensated for non transaction.. right.. the removal of DIBS surely many low end players cant buy for malaysian citizens .. the rich will go on and sapu..

2 measures cut revenues instantly lehh . Dat RPGT increase can never compensate this wat.. if you trying to say it push up the prop to 1 million.. singapirean buy to stay or invest? if they buy 1 million and hoping malaysians to buy back... malaysian really many cant afford our own price wat more singaporean flipped price.. your bringing this to another level lehh

[/quote]


why until today u still not buy mirhaja flat? i think is quite cheap..about 200k only..maybe nego nego can get below 200k...dun tell me u cant afford the down payment.....

I think higher that freebies tipu one all factored into the loan... u dunno mehh nth is free in the world especially malaysia
If they selling 500k.. iff.. kajang TTDI DSL 760K.. many wor .. prison area wor.. u guys prop world class developer wor.. sure letting go at 500k???.. but semi-d in taman tasik semenyih 550k..

then if 500k.. I can say it is safe.. but lets see the yellow tags put forward in echo hill upon vp... shall we..

Subang Jaya was "ulu" once

I not going to stay forever.. hmm 20k ahh... hmm u say leh I got or not..