hi, i might be wrong but izzit 4G93 is the 1.6 version? assuming i'm not wrong, then which 1 is better?
coz my friend corolla SE swap new engine n he claim it is 'initial d' engine n i assume it is 4A-GE like in the AE86 rite?
n how much total cost for swapping my wira with 4G93 with workmanship?

4G93 .. 1.8 version of mitsu engines
4G92 .. 1.6 version
4G91 .. 1.5

dunno much about the DOHC 4G93 .. 4G93T turbo version is around 6k nowadays .. for manual .. halfcut along..

watz ur location? different location different price... although the differences may not be very "big"...

my wira 1.3 max can go 1.6 only.. so considering 4g92 only
do u noe how much to add 4g92 (prefer DOHC) + installation + auto gearbox? any mechanic to recommend?

my location is KL.. u noe any friend?
i juz need the price of 4g92 (prefer DOHC) + installation + auto gearbox

*not nescessary DOHC if not available heh..

another initial-d fan boy? hehe..

ops, i'm not initial d fanboy.. HE is initial d fanboi (corolla SE on 4A-GE)
if u were to follow up my thread, i did complain that my engine consume its own engine oil which is very trouble some to me so thinkin to change engine.. stupid 4G15

I aint too sure about mitsubishi engines, soo cant advice over here.

But what ur friend claimed could be the engine caled 4AGE 20v, is the engine that powers the levin model at the mid 90ist. It was actually the similiar engine with the one where takumi uses it on 2nd stage on the initial d anime, but do mind that one is a racing spec, and its way different than a normal 4AGE 20V.

The 4AGE 20v from initial d that takumi is using has 240BHP, while the normal one has 160 for the silvertop and 165 for the blacktop one.

Switching engine + worksmanship will cost roughy 10K, but dont forget to upgrade ur brakes and suspension as well.

This post has been edited by travis_ckf: May 26 2006, 09:38 AM

If he were to transplant a racing engine inside the car, dunno wether JPJ will allow or not XD

Anyway, for 1.6, why not get the 1.6 MIVEC 175BHP on crank Actually normal 4G92 SOHC also enough already

Back to topic, 4AGE vs 4G93, if the normal 4AGE which is about 130BHP will definitely lose to a 1.8 4G93 engine. if its the silvertop and blacktop version, it will win the 4G93 NA unless you compare it with the 1.6 4G92 MIVEC

If compare 1.8 GSR 4G93T which is around 195-205BHP, have to compare with the 4AGE 20V racing spec already

This post has been edited by shinjite: May 26 2006, 10:15 AM

I would take 4G92 DOHC MIVEC lor, but seems like mivec half-cut is more pricey than GSR1.8 turbo halfcut...

yeap .. if u have the money .. why not go for the 4G92 DOHC Mivec version .. half cut should be around 5.5k .. but the fuel efficiency isnt that good for this version because of its short gear .. for high RPM ..

4G92 Mivec claim to be around 175 bhp .. for a 1.6
4AGE 16v DOHC .. around 130bhp
4AGE 20v DOHC . around 160bhp

those are juz figures... cannot proof anything unless tested..

but if are comparing a 4G93 (1.8) .. 4G93 DOHC produce only 140bhp .. but the torque is high.. damn nice to drive...

yaya.. no one talk engines together with initial d ma. keke

my uncle 4G15 around 10 years still in good condition. Dunno how come i always come across people with 4G13 and 4G15 makan minyak kuat. hmm.. did not service regularly? Coz i'm a previous 4G13 Iswara (M) user and one full tank can go up to 500-600km.

Your "full tank" is up to the brim one or the meter's mark full tank (~26 liters)?

my engine changed from 4G13 to 4G15 recently.. kena con haha.. no la, actually my older engine died, lookin for cheaper solution.. but now jialat.. here is what i did to my wira
8awg 11points grounding cable
zaptop gold acoustic
open pod..

what more can i add to have more hp? no major mod.. only add those chap chap stuff
n the result must be those proven 1 la.. not like those soo called compressor but did nothing

change ur exhaust system it should provide u power too
Anyway, why don't you get the 4G91 1.5 DOHC engine instead, just a suggestion

very BIG diffrence? now i'm on 4G15, do i need to go jpj for inspection again? considering both also 1.5

need JPJ if you change engine number.

once u change the engine .. yes.. uneed inspection
there is a Big difference 4G15 and 4G91 ..

4g91 DOHC is of course better in terms of overall, no need to add minor mods also the engine is powerful enough for Malaysian roads

but i heard the power come only on high rpm.. if cruising, more or less juz same as 4g15

in term of power, there is no big difference .... except that 4G91 had better peak power. that's why it had more hp.

4A-GE normal type 16V n 4A-GE performance type 20V
very big diffrence? as in? jpj approve? price? engine displacement litre?

16v = 130hp max
20v = 165hp max

both are the same engine, so displacement is identical
the difference is in the head

the standard 20V 4A-GE should be approved since it's still meant for road cars (like the Levin BZ-R)... it should be street legal. Unless you want Takumi's racing-spec 4A-GE... which I doubt is even existant here in Malaysia =D .

4AGE racing spec need to import from Japan XD because 1 thing for sure its hard to find too~~~

I think Bunta also didnt go for inspection from the police in the anime XD

thankz for the clarification

takumi's racing spec 4A-GE is what?
diffrent with normal 4A-GE?

if my friend said he brought the 'initial D 4A-GE spec n put inside his corolla SE' is total bullshit?

I didn't say your friend is bullsh1tting, just saying that it is hard to find that kind of engine here in M'sia definitely

If you wanna know, tell your friend to show you the dyno chart results and you see loh or if he hasn't, go and dyno his car
if its 240BHP (racing 1) on crank, on wheel should be around 200BHP (roughly only)

This post has been edited by shinjite: May 27 2006, 12:22 PM

er, how actualy they calculate brake horse power edi? forgotten heh..
4A-GE is orignally fit in where? Levin? corolla SEG?
corolla SE stock is what engine? what about SEG?

Actually I believe much more work goes into the 20v 165 HP engine than just the head. Lightening of various parts within the engine and better quality material used. And not to mention a completely different ECU. I believe that's how they achieved 165HP.

in general, the head is the main thing which is different. but of course the 20v get better treatment for most of the thing lah, like compression, weight and balancing etc.....

Take a B20B for instance,

A stock single cam head it produces around 115-130 bhp, but when a hybrid process such as the B20+B16A head project is being done, a much higher output gain will be achieved.

The head is one of the major components which overall effects the powerband throughoutput of an engine. But on the dark side of the turbo world, modifiying the cylinder head is usually the last thing to do. Thats why in N/A engine that is the first thing to do regardless of stock or oversized displacement.

my bad...

personally i've driven 4G13, 4G15, 4G92 (SOHC), 4G93 DOHC
never really driven a 4G91 ..
so i tot a 4G9x family should have better power compare to 4G15 ..

I didn't drive 4G13 and 4G93 b4
I wanna feel the power of 4g93....XD

I have one!
with mivec throttle body
hehe

BRO, LET ME DRIVE FOR 1 DAY XD
I pay rental XD

can anybody answer me?

bhp can't be calculate one .. they need to be tested . CORRECT me if im wrong
but u can calculate cc .

u can also change KW to bhp ... ----> kw/0.746 = bhp

This post has been edited by K3nnYkl82: May 27 2006, 07:46 PM

once u taste the power .. u will hunger for one ..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_A_engine

U take me for a ride also can liao
How much is ur 4G93 NA outputting?

Dunno . not tested! hahaha..

long story lar... something wrong with my original TB .. so i go Halfcut shop buy another one ... damn lucky to get a Mivec one.. yet cheap... installed d ... 1 word .. wah lau eh .... even the intake magnifoid not bore yet .. but can feel the difference d... if got money i go bore ! .. more power .. lolz..

but i dun wan it to drink too much fuel .. tats why dun wan mod too much ..

currently enuf for my daily driving .. not too fuel consuming .. very happy with it..
fresh graduate le.. no money .. no job yet .. haha

This post has been edited by K3nnYkl82: May 28 2006, 04:37 AM

Fresh graduate but you got 4G93 liao, I want that engine also cannot afford leh
Me only 4G92 SOHC, planning to go MIVEC 1

you cant calculate hp , there is just too many factor involve that is not incldue in calculation that might cause or increase hp

corolla se and seg local malaysia I belive stoack is 4e-fe or 4afe
so for plug and play you can decide for 4efte if you want to play turbo
4age if you want to play na
4agze if you want to play supercharge

4age come from levin trueno ...uhh does it even amtter

There are formulas to calculate BHP

There is a simple formula to calculate BHP:
BHP = 2 times pi times torque times revolutions; all this divided by 550.
Pi is 3.1416 and torque is in pounds-feet, and revolutions are revs per second.

Here's another version:
P = 2 time pi times torque times rpm times 1.34 times 10 to minus third power. Divide the results by 60.
For this formula P is in horsepower and torque is in Nm

Formula is taken from : http://pweb.jps.net/~snowbum/hpcalc.htm

uhh ... does the formula include friction , heat , air mass , fuel injected , air fuel ratio and ton of other thing that can cause loss in hp ?

well if there is no contributing lost to hp , then yes the formula is right

anyway , no need to strain your brain or whatever lah , just go dyno machine easiest , lol

Of course Dyno is the 1 but here is the algorithm ofrmula to it so yes, there are formulas to calculate HP so your post saying that there is no calculation for HP is total wrong

if you add friction lah, heat lah, air mass lah, fuel injected lah.....that 1 is not formula already.....thats more towards test and trial

This post has been edited by shinjite: May 28 2006, 04:06 PM

got the car from my part time work saving ..
hardwork ler... hehe

there is lil bit i dun understand
is changing throtle body = changing engine?
coz u said u r using 4G93 but in the quote above, u wrote u buy TB? lil bit confused here
n what is bore?

Throttle body is juz a small part of the intake magnifoid lar.. the actual size of my car TB is 54mm .. i change to 60mm one .. so it has better fuel intake .. thus better fuel response.. so when u pedal little it will be more sensitive .. thus it will reverb higher easier .. coz the engine breath easier.. nothing to do with the engine itself.

Bore is the diameter for the Piston .. and stroke is the distance it travel from highest point to the lowest point.

u said u using 4G93? or previously u already changed?

ouch ..

4G93 is the engine ...
TB is the throttle body ...

im still using 4G93 ... previously also 4G93 ..
wat i change is the intake throttle body .. i didnt touch the engine..

oh, means ur engine stock is already 4G93.. omg, wrong concept haha
thankz anyway

Lets clear things up a bit .
Thats what i have change...
nothing to do with my engine.

*Red color valve cover just cosmetic look .. wont increase speed

His car is a Putra, which already uses 4G93P

k3nnykl82: Wow, your engine bay still looks very clean, if you were to see mine, dust like crap XD

This post has been edited by shinjite: May 29 2006, 01:31 PM

to me its quite dirty d.... lots of dust covering the brake pump .. the alarm siren .. battery ... dare not take to those engine wash .. later got wet susah..

last year dyno 4G93 i got 104.5 whp..
done it at links....


agreed wit antonio the engine do play a vital role to the engine...
either u can chose torque or hp......chose wisely

This post has been edited by malyadayada: May 30 2006, 11:48 AM

initial d is just a movie and anime thingy...not real life folks...so drive safely...

Yours at 104.5BHP, so mine dynoed should be around 90BHP or less

so low ?
was the car maintain well ? any modification?

I expect 4G93 at least 120BHP on wheel

Flywheel about 130+hp, so after about 20% loss should be almost 120+hp like that at max.

tat is wat i expect too ..for its spec is 138bhp on flywheel
on the wheel i do expect around 120bhp

Is everything at 90-100% condition? Sometimes power loss happens if it's not at 90-100% condition, or that something is not calibrated properly.

Disregard this if everything's OK.

A lot of factors too that causes power loss, thats why need to maintain all the time

dude, spamming? i dont c ur post is helping here.. what i wanted to confessed is the 4A-GE engine compare to the anime type, not the driffing or anything
what do u mean by drive safety then?

hurm the exhaust was a standard 1.5....
minor tuning....
no modss

now now now, the exhaust is the main problem for the low bhp .. no wonder.. hehe
air is restricted ler dude..

kekekkee...but lovely response though just decarbonize the car n it's runnin well.... need to replace the hydraulic lifters n walah no more 'mesin jahit' sound kekekkeke

dude, those hydraulic lifters are darn expensive lar.. around RM40++ each .. u have 16 of those .. makes up to RM700 ~ 800 .. not include installation yet ..
my mech told me, it is okie if got mesin jahit sound .. juz annoying but it wont hurt .. not worth to change .. thats what he told me lar.. my hydraulic lifter sometimes got sound ..

change ur exhaust to a suitable one .. then u will feel better bhp .. throttle to mivec one .. u'll love it !>. heheh

Use thicker grade oil may reduce the hydraulic lifter noise

as for your friend corolla SE.. it is possible to put in a 4A-GE engine.. but with your wira.. it is not possible.. because it doesn't fit except u do body cutting then it should be ok..

nah.. in east malaysia u can find these engines everywhere in half-cut shop.. but i'm not sure about west malaysia..

4A-GE 1.6cc

nope.. it is possible to put inside the corolla.. the most suitable to put inside it are corolla KE70 and TE71..

This post has been edited by Sim (2): May 30 2006, 07:10 PM

If in wirs, I dunno wether JPJ will approve or not

Oh I totally forgot about east Malaysia, I meant mostly in peninsular

im frm sabah, as i know, many fellas modify their car dun register one.. hahaha
coz i got a fren wo did so .. with his bunch of frens.. they says.. keep low profile .. no kacau one .. lolz

btw, my fren 4AG-ZE into his 120Y .. then mod this that this that .. i also donno d lar
haha

I have not seen 4A-GE inside Wira so far.... but I have seen 4A-GZE inside a Saga

4A-GE 16v are rear wheel drive engines, except for the ones which came from AW11 MR-2

4A-GE 20v and 4A-GZE 16v are front wheel drive engines (there are also 4A-GZE 16v came from AW11 MR-2)

Takumi's AE86 was using 4A-GE 20v formula atlantic engine (according to the story). It is sure bullshit if someone said he has 'Initial-D spec' 4A-GE in his car.

We should go check the car out as well as dyno it to see wether it is the true formula atlantic version

all these times.. i haven't saw anyone put a 4A-GE in a saga nor wira.. because usually jpj will not approve them..

LOL.. i'm sure everybody will LOL when someone said he has what so call "Initial-D spec" in his car.. that guy must be a newbie to modifying cars..

usually they won't approve it..

i'm sure u are not talking about my friends because i have some friends who did that and they have a full register on their own cars.. usually they put 4A-GE on corolla and AE86.. some old cars does approve..

This post has been edited by Sim (2): May 30 2006, 11:03 PM

Keep low profile, everyday drive like normal XD

im sure not talking bout ur fren .. its my fren .. hehe
his car engine mods are too much .. to extensive .. his father is a JayPeeJay officer have quite a rank in my hometown also can't approve his car ..

Last time also got one famous B16A in Saga. Must be still around somewhere.

Anyway just to clear things up here are some dyno'd figures at the wheel:

Stock MMC GTi 4G93DOHC : ~112hp
Satria R3 St1 : ~122hp
Satria R3 St2 : ~136hp
4G93 MIVEC rojak : ~155hp
GSR 4G93T : ~180hp

Formula Atlantic versions of the 4A-GE goes for at least 5 to 6 figures.

bout the exhaust part i prefer the 1.5 bcoz it is so damn quiet ... silence is golden....kekeke ... the throttle body from my research the perdana SEi has the biggest diameter bout 62mm...quite hard to find though anyhow need to replace my brake pads it givin me sound.....


yurp agreed wit gonna try it out on my next service....thanx

4G93 MIVEC?? Hybrid 1.8 1 izzit?
For MIVEC get 155 BHP on wheel consider ok liao loh
GSR 4G93T 180BHP on wheel, expected, tune some more can go >=200BHP

Last time my friend did ask something which is possible if a lot of cash $$$$ but all can't afford XD
His Wira's engine is 4G93P NA, already modded with high cams and other stuffs and he plans to bring that engine to the golden 200BHP mark ._." On crank to get 200BHP for it also money fly like hell liao, if on wheel, can go rob a bank

how come honda stil made the best engine? even the 1.6 SOHC Vtec (D16Y8)is better than 4G93 & slightly better than R3 with 127hp. Mitshi DOHC suppose to produce much hp right? If compare with Honda B-series this all NA kena smoke badly.

eventhough Mitsu rated higher hp, but it loses to Honda in term of acceleration because of the gear ratio

only if you could find it

there is no way you can find such engine in halfcuts .... Formula Atlantic aren't cars

Anyway.... old cars such as KE-70 or TE-series or Datsun, 4A-GE 16v swap usually easy to get JPJ approval.

heck.... I have seen PUSPAKOM give pass to KE-71 liftback with SR20DET

This post has been edited by soulfly: May 31 2006, 12:47 PM

im not too sure bout the SEi throttle body as ppl told me mivec one only
im currently using the mivec throttle .. the response all i can say, damn good.

my car, originally 1.8 .. the exhaust system aint noisy at all la.. its damn quiet too!.. hehe .. i dun like noisy exhaust too .. thats why i still keep the original muffer as well, twin pipe they call it ..

anybody can tell me what with this formula atlantis? totally imposibble to get this engine? then i can 'cha' my friend edi -.-
'4A-GE, 4A-GE la, apa initial d spec'

This post has been edited by imperialrealcs: May 31 2006, 07:25 PM

i think they are trying to say that the engine is specially made for racing/rally use kind of engine .. its really quite impossible to get it .. even if its possible u get the engine along only .. u still need the ECU this and that .. they dun come from halfcuts..

I've saw someone posting proton engine 1.6 SOHC (4G92 SOHC) .. specially made in australia .. which could crank a 210bhp on wheel .. (posted in zero to hundred) .. They are selling juz the Engine for RM55k ...

imagine if u fren says he got one of those racing spec one .. how much would it cost .? how much for other stuff .. ECU wiring .. everything??

btw, those engine are mostly HAND assemble .. fully balance .. everything .. tats why its so darn expensive.

This post has been edited by K3nnYkl82: May 31 2006, 07:41 PM

yup.. that's right u can get approve easily when u put those engines into old skool cars..

haha.. that's normal in east malaysia.. i also can't believe it..

anyway i just have a conversation with my friends who own 4A-GE engine.. he said his fuel can last until 7 days with just rm30 running in 80km/h..

This post has been edited by Sim (2): May 31 2006, 09:44 PM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Formula_Atlantic
http://www.champcaratlantic.com/FrontPage.asp

Formula Atlantic are not car racing... they're formula karts.

Nobody sells karts halfcut...lol!

This post has been edited by soulfly: May 31 2006, 09:48 PM

karts on halfcut?! i would like to see that happen one day..

u mean tappet noise?
try to adjust the valve clearance within the spec

if u have connection with the racing world as well as loads of money then the 4AGE racing spoec you can get it XD